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Di Mulle
Posted - 2011.06.16 11:29:00 - [121]

Originally by: Macsadbro

Or unsubscribe. I'll be happy either way.

All fine, except that my reason for being in EVE is not exactly you being happy.

Diomedes Calypso
Aetolian Armada
Posted - 2011.06.17 00:11:00 - [122]

Even if only running 1 client people might still be running many other applications on their computers.

The inability to stay docked up while using little computer resources will make staying logged in much less attractive.. which will ultimately lead to less game activity coming from monitoring corporate chat etc.

Even with a fairly robust modern computer you're going to have limitations at some point editting videos or even with multiple Adobe photoshop and illustrator projects up. Certainly other games on different monitors are demanding

I'll play other games and leave one or two eve clients open.

Of course you're going to balance improving content with computer requirment needs


You have an option to not have that cost you users who prefer a light content. Do not ever require them to load incarna station enviorments.

What a silly thing for a business to do to do something to discourage customer visits with an avoidable option.

StarFleet Enterprises
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2011.06.17 03:47:00 - [123]

So, here's a question: In the absence of a "Disable CQ" option, which gets better performance? A trade alt sitting in Jita 4-4, or a trade alt sitting outside 4-4? If the latter, it should be interesting to see what the server thinks of 200 Ibises orbiting the station at 50m.

Xander Hunt
Dead Rats Tell No Tales
Posted - 2011.06.17 04:54:00 - [124]

Originally by: Rasz Lin
Originally by: Macsadbro

If your computer is a peice of crap, then use a different computer. Or you know, UPGRADE. And dont start pulling 'where poor' crap.

nvidia 9800, 4GB ram, 4GHz dual core, computers are NOT the problem, CCPs crappy unoptimized SINGLE THREAD INTERPRETED coding is

like i said earier, for example every time you scroll local game tries to save and read at the same time hundreds of 2KB files on your hard drive, this makes fps go down, even SSD wont help you because SSDs have poor performance when dealing with small files. CCP just halfasses all the code, checks if it works on top of the line systems and ships it to live server :/

I'll have to disagree with the poor performance on the 2k files via SSD. Yes, performance is decreased when it comes to the physical read of the file, however, the time is made up when it comes to actually locating the physical file. And since the game isn't hitting 2k files millions of times a second, performance degredation would be hit by maybe 1/100th of a frame. Insignificant.

SSDs are superior in all respects when it comes to platter drives. One would have to get into raid-0 with raptor 10k drives in order to start to come close to a single SSD drive. Considering most desktop PCs for the average user is 7200 rpm drives in single drive mode, SSDs are, again, superior.

.. now.. cost per gig.. WHOLE different story.

The single-threaded thing is kind of interesting as well. Pulling market data shouldn't have to be a single threaded aspect. however, since most of the game play is based on a single-threaded minded language, not much we can do about it.

Galactic Kingdom
Posted - 2011.06.18 21:38:00 - [125]


Thanks for enabling us to NOT load the station environment!!!
Please make it permanent.

Would have preferred the
"dock" and spin ship in hangar -> Select "Leave Ship" -> Captain's Quarters way but this works for me as well.

There is apparently a misconception about why I(we?) want this.
*) I, for one, run at least 2 or 3 clients from the same system 'Optimized for performance' in windows mode. Even though my 2 video cards can easily handle all of them running with max settings it is a lot less strain on them this way. So they are idling with barely audible fans cooling them and my energy bill is lower as a bonus.
So its not outdated hardware which is on the low end of your 'system requirements'.
*) I really dislike the CQ iteration as it currently is on the test server.
Not having to deal with it is great.

Hurfinliauna Doeu Rrufaoue
Posted - 2011.06.19 02:21:00 - [126]


Posted - 2011.06.19 12:57:00 - [127]

So the only place we really ran into trouble was with low-end machines and then only when running multiple clients in an Incarna environment. We still marched on and tried to squeeze all we could out of the graphics engine without making everything look like an 8-bit brick. However weve unfortunately hit a bit of a wall when it comes to running multiple clients on low-end machines while docked. For the sake of a smooth transition we therefore decided to temporarily add the option to not load the Incarna interiors while stilll retaining full access to all options and menus. This allows us to accomodate users with old and gnarly hardware, a group weve been proud to be able to serve in the past, while for some limited time also develop for those with top-of-the-line gaming computers.

Then I'd say your design and coding need to be looked at. We are talking about a single room at the moment in a static environment.

I'll add that it seems like if there is a technical fix that ISN'T making CQ completely optional ala a DISEMBARK button from the old hangar or a 'new' old hangar type view with us not leaving the ship/pod, you shouldn't be releasing CQ yet.

I'd much rather have the option to not leave my pod and therefore enter CQ at all IF I so choose.

Goldnut Sachs
Posted - 2011.06.20 03:15:00 - [128]

guys it is ccp's secret plan to ruin RMT by significantly increasing their initial pc hardware costs?

Posted - 2011.06.20 12:22:00 - [129]

Originally by: Cire XIII
I would strongly support the ability to permanently be able to avoid walking in stations after docking unless I clicked a button to get off my ship.

Docking up with station environments turned off heats up my graphics card more than fleet flights or any other game I've played. Captains quarters just turn it into an unnecessary space heater.

Please delete the word "temporary" from this blog. Thank you.

So many people have asked for this, for once CCP, can you please LISTEN !!

Debbie Hakomairos
Posted - 2011.06.21 06:49:00 - [130]

Maybe I'm just looking at this from the perspective of someone who hopes that EVE will turn into a multi levelled SCIFI MMO, but has anyone considered that the CQ feature and the "barbie's" that come with it are a precurser to player interaction on stations and possible multi-game and multi platform compatability (i.e. Dust 514).

Personally myself and my brother think that the CQ will be awesome, and if it leads to player interaction on stations and/or planets in the future I think its worth the complaints of those using outdated hardware.

Xander Hunt
Dead Rats Tell No Tales
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:28:00 - [131]

That is the intent of CQ to bring another layer on top of EVE as a space ship game. The thing is, there hasn't been any mention of how directly interactive the two games are going to be, and how the two different worlds are going to interact. I've seen some pre-release videos from CCP in regards to what goes beyond that locked door in CQ, and what is supposed to happen there so to speak, however, unless I have intention to actually GO and do the stuff beyond that door, I don't need to wait the extra 15 seconds (With my SSD, 6gig of 1066mhz memory, and a 768meg 8800gtx video card) to perform the action of unloading my cargo hold and launching back into space. If I wanted to run any sort of interaction such as going to the local pub, or, anything worth while when in CQ, then OK. Realizing that this initial release of CQ is just a stepping stone, I still would rather not use it until its more ... refined and useful and when I need it.

Eve Heroes
Posted - 2011.06.22 09:33:00 - [132]

If we're forced to load up incarna:

Fewer war targets will be willing to remain docked. w00t. PEWPEW.

I foresee the amount of subscribed alt-accounts will drop a tad.

So yeah, keep the loading station environment option optional.

Steven internet
Posted - 2011.06.22 10:36:00 - [133]

For the sake of a smooth transition we therefore decided to temporarily add the option to not load the Incarna interiors while stilll retaining full access to all options and menus.

This is a spaceship game, I wanna fly in space and shoot people in space flying spaceships.
There is enough mmorpg games where you can walk or even run, if I would want to do that I would play some of those games.

Please keep this temporary option permanent.

Posted - 2011.06.22 12:14:00 - [134]

I have so far not been able to test performance off my machine due to the fact that I have not been home since patchday.
Running more then 2 clients on this laptop with the full QC on results in lag only seen in Jita and 3000+ toon fights

Posted - 2011.06.22 12:26:00 - [135]

so Im running Windows 7
Dual core E3400 @2.60Hz
NVIDIA GeGorce 210, 510mb
and 4G RAM.

And when running 2 clients un-docked I can only manage 14-20 FPS !!! with all the settings turned low.

Can someone suggest what CPU, RAM and Graphics card you need to enable me to run my 3 toons again at 34-52 FPS ????

Xia Long
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
Posted - 2011.06.22 12:30:00 - [136]

ok my machine:
I7-2600 @3.40GHz
Geforce GTX460

Don't think my spec r at the bottom of the line, i know for sure they r not at the top, i simply can't afford better ones

So with 1 account and all settings on, CQ is laggy uses lots of memory and tends to heat up my GPU
with 2 accounts...well unplayable, thou i can cook some egss on the case Cool

please, if you can't find a solution (doesn't look like i'm the only one having this kind of issues), leave at least the CQ/Incarna aspect of the game as FULLY optional

Sevena Black
Posted - 2011.06.22 12:37:00 - [137]

I understand a large group of people wanted "walking in station". Thats great, cos its here now. I personally don't give a damn about avatars. I don't even care about mine. If I want to walk around, I'll play the Witcher and stuff. Simply put: GIVE ME BACK MY DOCKED SPACESHIP !!

Taoi Khan
Empire of Collateral Damage
Posted - 2011.06.22 12:50:00 - [138]

I am used to running 4 toons on my Desktop.
Took around 10 min to log them on last night. Walking in stations was not usable when they finally loaded.
Found the station bull**** checkbox, unchecked 4 boxes on my toons.
Relogged the toons.
Able to do stuff in station. Was able to undock and fly around.

meh new patch and I played 25 minutes??? lots of CCP programming time for little reward.
Guess I will turn down all effects, set to low graphics and see if I can play Eve tonight...

Posted - 2011.06.22 19:48:00 - [139]

so fantastic responce to our isses who use multible clients..

Well done CCP

Xia Long
Two Brothers Mining Corp.
Posted - 2011.06.22 22:12:00 - [140]

ok i understand y u don't answer our rage posts in general chat,but
you won't answer us also in here? Sad

Dealth Striker
Striker Ltd
Posted - 2011.06.23 04:00:00 - [141]

After Incarna release - faster access to market while being undocked.

Posted - 2011.06.23 06:58:00 - [142]

Yesterday I was able to run 3 clients with all setting to high, this was on my regular machine.
With some chop lag on the first 2 and moderate lag on 3th.
CPU and memory were unchanged since before incarna, although usage is still quite heavy compared to other games.
GPU was at 90C so that I found a bit alarming.

Adding a 4th crashed the machine.

Putting the setting to best performance
Ran 4 clients no lag, GPU at 80C.

So atm I'm only worried about card overheating, but according to the gage its at its midpoint.

Maxx Davaham
Posted - 2011.06.23 09:10:00 - [143]

Originally by: Conrad Peet
Edited by: Conrad Peet on 15/06/2011 02:01:21
Originally by: Doublewhopper
Edited by: Doublewhopper on 14/06/2011 16:06:23
Edited by: Doublewhopper on 14/06/2011 16:05:20
This allows us to accomodate users with old and gnarly hardware, a group weve been proud to be able to serve in the past

A joke, right? This can't be serious?

Yeah well...let us recap what has been dropped over the years...

Windows 98
Windows ME
Windows 2000
The Classic Client
Shader Model 1.0
SSE CPUs (Celerons and older)
The Official Linux Client (still running on wine)
SSE2 CPUs (Pentium III and older)
Shader Model 2.0 by March, 2011

And the future:

Windows Vista Home by April 12, 2012
Windows XP by April 8, 2014
Shader Model 3.0 around 2015
Windows Vista Business and Enterprise by April 11, 2017

If you're still using windows 98 then you don't deserve to play this game. If you're willingly using Windows ME then you don't deserve to own a computer.

As for those processors, do you people seriously think this game should run on crap hardware like that? If you can't afford to buy a modern computer and meet the minimum requirements of this game then maybe you shouldn't be dropping 15/30/45 bucks a month that you clearly need for other things. Buying a $100 video card shouldn't break your budget or you need to train up your financial management and personal budgeting skills because you have done something wrong in life. If you're on antiquated hardware then spend less time flying internet spaceships and more time looking for a better job so you can plunk down 300 bucks on a barebones Dell that'll run this game without breaking a sweat.

And those of you complaining about not being able to play from your work computers, maybe you don't deserve that job. Perhaps it should go to someone that doesn't waste company time on a video game.

You people are a bunch of whiny ****ing children sometimes.

I really love these post, those listing what has been dropped through the ages, and especially Conrads rant here, and I find 2-3 thing alarming here.

1. This is a Dev Blog Comment thread, yet I find no dev response??? I don't like.

2. Old crappy hardware doesn't work anymore.... This means I won't be logging in to do a simply skillchange anymore from whatever local system is around. Actually my boss encouraged me to install the client on my work PC, but I refused, and have since used the "no longer fit for actual work test pc's". I need them running for testing purposes anyway, good for tracking malware and stuff.
But this practice of installing the client on any machine has with incarna ended. Yes I saw the sign with Classic/premium client. but it is a sad day for me anyway. I will now appearntly need dedicated iron to deal with Eve-Online, that'll cut back on the quick and easy access. Sad but workable.

3. I accendently just upgraded my gaming system from laptops (75% of which can't run the client anymore as they are not Shader 3.0). Which I'd say lucky me then. I can at least hopefully log in on that, I've got it last month. I need this rig to last me some 5 years. I fear that won't happen. Meaning I'll need to make a replacement plan.

I can barely afford my game subscribtion plus I get Eon ships in, and that is basicly where my excess money goes of mention (<5).

The cycle scheme seems to be replace every 2nd. year. Cost 500 , thus 250 annually, quick rough cals = 20 monthly. That's essentially my eve current expendures. So I need to double the cost or leave the game?
It's all about calling Prime. And Eve has been primetarget thusfar, but I'm not sure I'll be able to break this tank.

Sorry CCP, but please keep in mind that there's still some of the loyal backbone, "you can quit eve?" addicts that seriously want a textbase client.

Tiberius Gihren Athrun
State War Academy
Posted - 2011.06.23 09:25:00 - [144]

Said it once, will say it again
CCP needs to do a Lite Client, no CQ, lower graphics, SM 2.0
Will help the multi clienters and those who don't want to use CQ.

Saan Koo
Posted - 2011.06.23 10:18:00 - [145]

It must be a little disappointing for the developers that this upgrade has been such a flup in my corp alone over 90 % of the players have had a 10 min look at the cq feature and then disabled it is an annoyance that dont do anything for the game its just wasted effort.
We are playing this game for the space ship not for the 3rd person sims features.
How about waiting with all that stuff until you are ready to give us something that is worth doing.

Right now CCP have made a lot of unfinished things that just is annoying and dossent really add to the gameplay and at the same time have a lot of unfinised things.

PI Unfinished (another sims feature)
CQ Unfinished (another sims feature)
Corp hangars (Need a much more flexible way of setting rights)
Wallets (Need the ability to make multibel accounts fore different objectives )
Posses (need a lift so they can be used across alliance and corps)
SOV (i rest my case)

Lady Britania
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:45:00 - [146]

Edited by: Lady Britania on 23/06/2011 17:50:14
It would be nice to have the old station environment rather than the blurry one in use now. I like the ability to see ship proportions. My shuttle's wing span is the same length as the Badger II Shocked

Dealth Striker
Striker Ltd
Posted - 2011.06.23 18:50:00 - [147]

Originally by: Tiberius Gihren Athrun
Said it once, will say it again
CCP needs to do a Lite Client, no CQ, lower graphics, SM 2.0
Will help the multi clienters and those who don't want to use CQ.

Great idea!

Posted - 2011.06.23 19:25:00 - [148]

Edited by: MuppetsSlayed on 23/06/2011 19:32:30
I run four accounts simaltaniously. Before incarna without any issue I could have all four of those logged in at once, only having to reduce graphics settings for lag during large scale combat.

If I try and log in more that 3 clients with any of them docked with the incarna station enviroments I can hear my pc spinning fans much faster to try and stay alive but it fights a losing battle, the game gets laggier and laggier and my pc crashed to bios after several minuites. I always lock each client to a single CPU and GPU core (Intel Q9300, 8 gig of ram & Dual Nvidia GT9800 GT's).

If I press the checkbox saying not to load station enviroments I can log in all four toons and can play just fine again. I have read that the switch that enables me to play isnt permanent and wil be removed. WHY WOULD YOU DO THIS??????

The interface in incarna is by far worse than before whilst docked and features have disappeared. I cannot double click into space to open cargohold or right click on my ship to open drone bays without opening up the window showing all my ships - how mcuh space do you think we have on our screens with the required corp, alliance and intel channels without being force to occupy part of this with a window of ships.

There are some really random bugs. I tried to demonstrate the new features to a friend at work. i had to turn on station enviroments as they were off which gave me a message about having to restart the client. i then tried to show him the character creater. that worked, right up until you cancel changes and exit it. WHAM.. wtf just happened there, you said I needed to reboot to get in to the station enviroment :(

Since incarna I have had to make six new portraits to be able to log in alts and adjust market orders. Why is this so difficult and time consuming. it took me well over an hour to acomplish this and I was trying to pick the first possible option. Why is there no easy way to completely bypass this?

I dont even see my ship anymore just a random piece of wall when im docked. Why arent the incarna features accessible without using the silly gui that makes u walk somewhere to get it. Where is the menu / icon / option so I can access any of the info that may be of use? Why do I now have to click the ships icon or goto the fittings screen to see what ship i am flyign when I login whilst docked.

If you continue down this route you wil need to come up with a way for those of us who are unable to dock due to the hardware requirements of docking to be able to play eve.

Posted - 2011.06.23 19:38:00 - [149]

Edited by: MuppetsSlayed on 23/06/2011 19:39:27
someone asked me to sum up incarna for them.

I said, "You know how when you fall asleep with a DVD on and when you wake up in the morning it has been repeating the dvd intro or menu over and over and over. Incarna is that inside eve when you dock."

Did I mention that everyone seems to have flees. Why are the characters always scratching themselves?

Samuel Wess
Posted - 2011.06.24 01:40:00 - [150]

When 'disable station environment' will be removed so will be my accounts.

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