open All Channels
seplocked EVE Alliance Tournament Discussion
blankseplocked ECM team is unbeatable
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Author Topic

gazarsgo
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:26:00 - [1]
 

Nerf ECM, it is invincible

Glonn
Amarr
APEX ARDENT COALITION
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:27:00 - [2]
 

Bombs.

BOMBS.

BOMBSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

Randal Eirikr
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:28:00 - [3]
 

Its only invincible as long as people continue to ignore it -_-

kloma
Red Federation
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:32:00 - [4]
 

babylon 5 fielded ECCM vs our jamming fleet, which was part of the reason we lost the rooks. the other being ending up within 30 of 3 faction BS with neuts :D

Mutnin
Amarr
Mutineers
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:33:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Randal Eirikr
Its only invincible as long as people continue to ignore it -_-


..because we all know how well ECCM works. Rolling Eyes



Naomi Wildfire
Amarr
Spricer
Raiden.
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:35:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Naomi Wildfire on 12/06/2011 18:36:39
It's not unbeatable but seriously OP, at least in small scale warfare.

there's a non module countermeasure for every other EW.
And even ECCM is pretty ****ty, especially on small stuff where damps for example are less effective than on bigger targets. ECM is mmore effective on smaller targets than on bigger.

Glonn
Amarr
APEX ARDENT COALITION
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2011.06.12 18:38:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Glonn
Bombs.

BOMBS.

BOMBSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

Diamaht Nevain
Gallente
Avatar Union
Posted - 2011.06.12 21:08:00 - [8]
 

Those fights get boring to watch also. Maybe it would be better if it just caused ships to break their lock instead of denying their ability to fight at all.

Lilith Velkor
Minmatar
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2011.06.12 21:12:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Mutnin
Originally by: Randal Eirikr
Its only invincible as long as people continue to ignore it -_-


..because we all know how well ECCM works. Rolling Eyes



I know it sounds crazy, but simply destroying the jamming ships did work rather well for us.

We would have tried other things, but most of our pilots are simpletons bordering on mentally handicapped, so we resorted to the obvious solution.

Cletus Graeme
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.06.12 21:12:00 - [10]
 

Why not just prohibit it's use in the tournament. I think they did that in a previous tourney - I can't remember which.

Still, the tedium of seeing an ECM setup win is almost made up for by the tears of the losers crying about it afterwards Laughing

Tyrrax Thorrk
Amarr
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.06.12 21:14:00 - [11]
 

think at least the first three tourneys banned ecm
but ecm's fine in 10v10 imo

Tobiaz
Spacerats
Posted - 2011.06.12 21:20:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Tobiaz on 12/06/2011 21:23:07
Originally by: Mutnin
Originally by: Randal Eirikr
Its only invincible as long as people continue to ignore it -_-


..because we all know how well ECCM works. Rolling Eyes





You would, if you actually tried it. Tt takes very few unjammed windows to ruin a ECM-pilot's day and ECCM provides just that.

A problem though is that it can be a bit boring to watch. Adding icons for the active effects on the various ships to the tournament UI would be a big improvement.

Jaigar
Mom 'n' Pop Ammo Shoppe
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2011.06.12 21:54:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Jaigar on 12/06/2011 21:57:35
Originally by: Naomi Wildfire
Edited by: Naomi Wildfire on 12/06/2011 18:36:39
It's not unbeatable but seriously OP, at least in small scale warfare.

there's a non module countermeasure for every other EW.
And even ECCM is pretty ****ty, especially on small stuff where damps for example are less effective than on bigger targets. ECM is mmore effective on smaller targets than on bigger.


Hit the nail right on the head. Damps: move closer. Webs: generally you are in range to neut them off (save for huginn or loki). Tracking disruptors: use webs and sit right on top IE dont orbit. ECM? Fit ECCM modules.

I think ECM is breaking the tournament in its current format. With the other forms of eWAR you can conpensate by adjusting your piloting. But with ECM you have to gimp yourself with ECCM. Also smaller ships have a harder time sacrificing tackle or their own offensive eWAR for a slightly less chance to get jammed. So teams are left to A: Fit ECCM which completely gimp them vs. a non-ECM team or B: Fit little or no ECM and be boned by an ECM team. Effectively this turns it into a paper-rock-scissors game.

I think it would be interesting if ships counteracted ECM after so many cycles so you would get an opportunity to shoot, effectively making it impossible to permajam but not making ECM useless.


Marcus Grisbius
Gallente
Mom 'n' Pop Ammo Shoppe
Posted - 2011.06.12 22:48:00 - [14]
 

If eccm is the only counter to an ecm fleet you can think of then there hasn't been a lot of thinking about it. Besides eccm can be very effective when used right. By that same reasoning, using armor hardeners is gimping a setup because you can't fit more dmg mods. I will say the reason many ecm fleets do well is because they only have to prepare for minmatar and Caldari. While racial jams work well, trying to jam off racial is very tough. Mix it up.

Saint Lazarus
Pwn 'N Play
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.12 23:06:00 - [15]
 

Cant wait till someone copies PL's ECM team....again, and gets rolled

Rastigan
Caldari
Ars ex Discordia
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.12 23:19:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: gazarsgo
Nerf ECM, it is invincible

Especially since you guys already know what ships you are going up against.

Lady Spank
Amarr
In Praise Of Shadows
Posted - 2011.06.12 23:43:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Rastigan
Originally by: gazarsgo
Nerf ECM, it is invincible

Especially since you guys already know what ships you are going up against.


Nerf incompetent security in AT testing teams.

Jaigar
Mom 'n' Pop Ammo Shoppe
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2011.06.12 23:51:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Jaigar on 13/06/2011 00:05:32
Originally by: Marcus Grisbius
If eccm is the only counter to an ecm fleet you can think of then there hasn't been a lot of thinking about it. Besides eccm can be very effective when used right. By that same reasoning, using armor hardeners is gimping a setup because you can't fit more dmg mods. I will say the reason many ecm fleets do well is because they only have to prepare for minmatar and Caldari. While racial jams work well, trying to jam off racial is very tough. Mix it up.


I do know of a couple ways to counter ECM without ECCM, but they are not the easiest. For example, breaking outside their optimal range. But this isnt viable with a close range team. There is another method which Mom 'n' Pop has shown me which can be effective, but I'm not going to say here.

Comparing the ECCM to armor hardeners though is fallicious. ECM doesn't directly kill your ship, and there are more multiple sources of dmg compared the ECCM.

Kavu
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.06.13 01:10:00 - [19]
 

I KNOW YOUR SEKRET WAY, FOF MISSILE DRAKE FLEET!

DHB WildCat
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.06.13 18:42:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: DHB WildCat on 13/06/2011 18:42:44
Im going to make this as easy as I can if you really think ecm is overpowered.

Missile ships have these things called "fof missiles", which the hydra guy above me has already stated, What they do is fire "even if jammed" at the nearest ship doing anything to your ship. So if a rook is jamming you load fof get in close and let your missiles hit the rook 8).

Or you could put an eccm on a command ship and then roll them when they miss a cycle. Many, many ways to kill a weak ecm team.

MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2011.06.13 18:55:00 - [21]
 

FoF missles... duh

I mean the counter to FoF missle fleets is drones, but no one uses those for some reason.


Seriously will someone PLEASE field a FoF smart bomb triple raven fleet please.

Millie Clode
Amarr
Insert Cool Name Here
Posted - 2011.06.13 19:15:00 - [22]
 

Yeah I wish CCP would add drones or bombs or something to the game. There's LITERALLY no counter to ECM at all at the moment.

>.<

Lady Spank
Amarr
In Praise Of Shadows
Posted - 2011.06.13 19:39:00 - [23]
 

supers etc

DeadNite
Caldari
Detrimental Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.14 12:37:00 - [24]
 

Anything that is fielded without a counter will seem OP. Rock will always loose to paper and win against scissors. Thatís how it works. There is a reason you don't take a knife to a gun fight...etc

PL is the only team that has had massive success with this ECM composition. Anyone who faces them next will have a serious decision to make. Do you counter their ECM and get blown to hell by another composition or do you ignore the ECM build and fall victim to it again.

While I agree that ECMs make for rather boring spectator sport, I canít imagine anyone joining a tournament without the intention to win.

Gobbins
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2011.06.14 13:24:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: DHB WildCat
Edited by: DHB WildCat on 13/06/2011 18:42:44
Im going to make this as easy as I can if you really think ecm is overpowered.

Missile ships have these things called "fof missiles", which the hydra guy above me has already stated, What they do is fire "even if jammed" at the nearest ship doing anything to your ship. So if a rook is jamming you load fof get in close and let your missiles hit the rook 8).

Or you could put an eccm on a command ship and then roll them when they miss a cycle. Many, many ways to kill a weak ecm team.


confirming this

the counter to ecm is FOF missiles




btw the solution to ECM in at is removing racial jammers, alternatively customize points cost of rooks and kitsunes

DeadNite
Caldari
Detrimental Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.14 13:39:00 - [26]
 

Another step with dealing with the possibility of an ECM team is using a "pure" team with a single race. Keep in mind the ECM team will likely know what ships you generally prefer to fly looking at kill boards and whatnot so choose wisely.

Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2011.06.15 10:21:00 - [27]
 

Nerf DPS, it is invincible


 

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only