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Shaera Taam
Minmatar
Minmatar Death Squad
Broken Chains Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.17 15:15:00 - [1591]
 

Edited by: Shaera Taam on 17/06/2011 15:57:43
lol at flames... im beginning to understand why players find tears are so delicious!

no, i dont think MT for vanity items are going to kill eve... if they start busting out RFWDs in the MT store, yeah, that'll be worrysome. but vanity items only? please! and the omfgragequit of players that would rather stand in the way of progress will only make eve stronger... this is my main fellas, feel free to contract me your stuff...

my only question for ccp is this: why a separate currency? if isk can be exchanged for aurum, and vice versa, then why even have it? im no economist, but seems unnecessary...

EDIT: didnt understand 'why' of second currency... i do now. kinda. comments on contracting of stuff still stands. Wink

Aeglos2 Karden
Posted - 2011.06.17 17:29:00 - [1592]
 

this is CRAP

Noillia Durmot
Thundercats
B O R G
Posted - 2011.06.17 17:57:00 - [1593]
 

I started to write an eloquent post about how this would be devisive and against most of what Eve stands for in a greedy aimless industry. Unfortunatly I broke down in tears half way through and had to go for a lie down.

I thought CCP started off with the perfect business and gaming model but obviously I was wrong and we need to learn from Club Penguin.

Royston Townhead
Posted - 2011.06.17 17:59:00 - [1594]
 

And you know what will ahppen after that?

They will start putting damage on everything you buy, so in time it fades, get broken , ect ect, until you either repair it, or buy a new 1. This hapeens in another MMO ( Entropia Universe ), but the currency in the game is linked to the $, so 1 $ is 10 PED.

Is it me, or is EVE going the same way, that game is free to play, but you gotta keep pumping cash into the game to make it enjoyable as it will swallow cash. Can you imagine anybody spending $30 on ammo?? That looks like its the road we have taking a turn into ughConfused

Tyana Oro
Akashwani
Posted - 2011.06.17 18:19:00 - [1595]
 

Originally by: Shaera Taam
Edited by: Shaera Taam on 17/06/2011 15:57:43
lol at flames... im beginning to understand why players find tears are so delicious!

no, i dont think MT for vanity items are going to kill eve... if they start busting out RFWDs in the MT store, yeah, that'll be worrysome. but vanity items only? please! and the omfgragequit of players that would rather stand in the way of progress will only make eve stronger... this is my main fellas, feel free to contract me your stuff...

my only question for ccp is this: why a separate currency? if isk can be exchanged for aurum, and vice versa, then why even have it? im no economist, but seems unnecessary...

EDIT: didnt understand 'why' of second currency... i do now. kinda. comments on contracting of stuff still stands. Wink


I have no problem with true vanity items.

The problem is that this vanity ship is created out of nothing, and just magically appears with no player action (other than paying). This is 100% against what the EVE in game economy has always stood for.

If it stays this way, or god forbid they add more bought ships/mods, I have no problem voting with my wallet.

@ can I have your stuff: Why would you need it when you can just buy better stuff from the new cash market?

Josef Huffenpuff
Caldari
Posted - 2011.06.18 09:45:00 - [1596]
 

I don't have an issue with Vanity Items.

I think its smart you have a separate currency so you can track it properly

I probably wont buy vanity items, but that's no reason not to have them in game

But ....

You really really really should NOT be creating in game items like ships out of nothing - and CCP you know this perfectly well. C'mon guys - delay the release of this feature until you've got the requirement to supply the base item working properly. It wont hurt your income at all but it will prevent you from breaking the player driven economy.

Maat Jeamus
Posted - 2011.06.18 11:32:00 - [1597]
 

I have no beef with vanity items or Aurum. As long as they offer no advantage other than pure bragging rights, I see no reason why not? Acctually, will they not be like the item "Exotic dancers"; ie pretty useless? If people want to pay for them, they can go ahead and do it.

Vandrion
Gallente
The Collective
B O R G
Posted - 2011.06.19 03:12:00 - [1598]
 

Originally by: Maat Jeamus
I have no beef with vanity items or Aurum. As long as they offer no advantage other than pure bragging rights, I see no reason why not? Acctually, will they not be like the item "Exotic dancers"; ie pretty useless? If people want to pay for them, they can go ahead and do it.


Even Vanity Item MT crosses the line CCP has stayed behind all these years. CCP has always held the stance that our subscription fees pay for the content. Having any type of $$$ for item scheme puts content (even vanity items are content of a type) behind a pay wall. To make it worse they have set the system up to cost a massive amount of RL $$ for what is essentially useless. This is a given point:

Plex comes from GTC which comes from RL $$$.

Here is how CCP gets you:

GTC costs $34.95 and gets you 2 Plex.
You convert said Plex into however many Aurum it is.
Congrats! You now spent $34.95 on clothing content....... That is in addition to your normal Subscription fee!

Now you could always sell one Plex for some ISK however CCP still wins because you spent $34.95 to get a Plex to buy some clothes!

Some will say that you could just buy a Plex off the market with ISK and convert it to Aurum to buy clothes. Guess what?? CCP still wins because somebody originally bought a GTC for $34.95 and converted it to Plex. All of this in addition to the normal subscription fees.

Is it really worth $34.95 for a pair of pants?

Why is content going behind a pay wall? Yes it is a pay wall as the only way to get Aurum is through Plex and Plex can only be created from a RL $$$ transaction.

Why will CCP stop there? I doubt they will. I personally believe the whole WIS model will be built around MT.
You want to have a bar--- pay some Aurum.
You want to have a meeting room--- pay some Aurum.
You want to gamble--- pay some Aurum to buy in
You want to do some back room drug deals--- pay some Aurum
Want a stripper pole--- pay some Aurum

The slipery slope CCP was on has changed:

It is now a well oiled slip and slide and CCP is already half way down it!


Nilania Telshua
Amarr
Hedion University
Posted - 2011.06.19 15:37:00 - [1599]
 

Stakeholders... ?

A quick sketch about the subject of stakeholders,
that seems to be absent from this discussion.

At lot of argumentations do not differentiate
between the legal and ethical obligations of a company
and do further not to recognize that the failure to meet either can be similiar disastrous.

An example
In subscription fees alone, as a veteran I have invested probably
over $1.000 into the product "EVE". (since 2006, 3 accounts, breaks)

In time my investment is easily over thousand hours and
could be valued at least $10.000 if based on german minimum wage and
as a multiple of that if were based on my average income/hour over these years.

Even the best case of $11.000 dollars over 5 years
represents a substantial investment for the average consumer.
Eve after all is an "entertainment"-product.

Summary
The consumer belongs as well as the investor to the stakeholders of a company.
Both provide the company with the capital needed for its operation and growth,
the only difference is the quality of returns they expect from their investment.

If a company suddenly introduces fundamental changes to its product,
it is the ethical right of its stakeholders to demand a justification for this change
and the consideration of their intrests in the change.
The company is of course under no legal requirement to provide such justification.
It just has to live with the results.

If these results are the alienation of the companies stakeholders,
resulting in the withdrawal of the support needed for its continued operation,
then the failure to observe ethical requirements results in an existential crisis.

It is indeed the legal right of every company to commit suicide by public-relations.

Dogeatdog
Posted - 2011.06.19 23:46:00 - [1600]
 

Fix the game before adding meaningless bs.And hey maybe some new content.

Ksitigarbha
Posted - 2011.06.20 08:34:00 - [1601]
 

Ok CCP, here is my point of view.

I feel betrayed by your actions - all the time I was playing EVE i was bragging to my friends that their games are lame moneymakers for children, but now you do everything to turn EVE into another Maple Story. Ships have to be made by players PERIOD. What I could live with is making the skillbooks to craft those items available to be bought with AUR, but ONLY the skillbooks - the SP should be trained normally. I kind of regret reactivating my account a few days ago - maybe if I go you won't notice it much, but hey - I'll be happier.


CCP - think your actions through - maybe open a second live server for rich, full of themselves kids so they can have their THEMEPARK, and let the the rest of the EVE COMMUNITY stay on TQ - the place we started to love, and now you want us to hate.

Auvious S'canault
Posted - 2011.06.20 10:07:00 - [1602]
 

How is this going to affect patch-size? Or bandwidth?

Each of these vanity items is going to have a model, or a shader, or a texture, or a whatever that tells our client how to render them. Like ships and drones at the moment.

At some point this data is going to have to move from CCP to every machine that renders the vanity item.

Either:

It is done at patch-time, and everyone gets them and the patch is bigger by however many new items the vanity store has.

Or:

It is done on an "on-demand" system and you get a jolt of lag when you look at the guy in the bling and have to download all the models/shaders/textures.

So how does this impact on patch size? Or more importantly, how does this impact on full-download size?


Vandrion
Gallente
The Collective
B O R G
Posted - 2011.06.20 21:38:00 - [1603]
 

This needs to stay at the top.

MT is the worst thing you have done to this game to date.......

Elegal
Posted - 2011.06.20 23:08:00 - [1604]
 

Mad This whole concept for vanity SUCKS!

J Kunjeh
Gallente
Posted - 2011.06.20 23:15:00 - [1605]
 

I'm so vain I need a pair of hot-pants for my vanity. I hope they're up at the Noble Exchange soon!

Gaius Marius Audene
Gallente
Galactic Mining and Salvage
Fade 2 Black
Posted - 2011.06.20 23:53:00 - [1606]
 

My 2 cents: Many accounts are going away because of the perception of this. Why has CCP not even responded is what truely bothers me. The forums (imo) are for mostly older players and the feedback has been almost 100% negative, you would think CCP would respond.

For me; I have 3 accounts and didn't PLEX one already on purpose. Waiting to see how much worse this gets. Its sad really, what am I going to do with all the free time...

Think I'll buy a boat.

Very Happy

Cancel Align NOW
Posted - 2011.06.20 23:59:00 - [1607]
 

Give me monocles or death you say?

Death it seems to be.


Drakprime
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2011.06.21 00:51:00 - [1608]
 

#dislike

Aurum? what's next, /dance?

Alundil
Gallente
Galactic Salvage Inc.
Posted - 2011.06.21 05:38:00 - [1609]
 

Back to the top - was a bad idea a few days ago and is still a bad idea going on patch day/night.

Evanga
Amarr
Trust Doesn't Rust
Posted - 2011.06.21 06:26:00 - [1610]
 

So where can i buy additional stuff for my Farm? I want that golden pony, but cannot find it Sad

MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2011.06.21 06:43:00 - [1611]
 

still no prices.... the day before the shop opens...

Barf

Rob al'thor
Posted - 2011.06.21 11:46:00 - [1612]
 

I'll admit, I'm not a hardcore player. I like flying my nice little spaceship around and blowing stuff up. I quite like the idea that you could get some paint and a massive paintbrush and paint your ship to look like a dolphin. The thing I'm not so happy about is eve forcing consumers to pay real money just so I can make my abaddon look even more like a phallic symbol. Despite liking the idea I wouldn't pay real money for a fancy hat as it adds nothing to gameplay. Perhaps if that fancy hat made you more likeable to certain agents it would work? Or if a corporation could decide to copyright a certain colour scheme for their ships that could also be a cool feature.
I keep quitting and coming back to Eve because it is too damn expensive for a student to afford, why add more real cost?

Perhaps they could fund these items with not in your face in game advertising, it would be a decent alternative to making the user pay. You could have, for example, Converse All Star shoes or the latest Gucci handbag to parade around with. I know I would buy the converse and not feel like I had been advertised at.

Just some thoughts :)

V'Doss
Posted - 2011.06.21 12:24:00 - [1613]
 

I was afraid of this when I saw the info on Dust.

Sounds like CCP is getting too cozy with Sony. I left Ever Quest 1 & 2 after 11yrs due to their Station Cash. This is how it starts, cosmetic stuff.

I guess I'll see what happens here in EVE....

Nerodia Crotalus
Posted - 2011.06.21 12:35:00 - [1614]
 

Tossing in my two cents here:

"The problem with customizability, however, is the amount of time and resources needed to produce unique items and variations. Bear in mind that our HQ is a renovated fish processing plant, not the Wonka factory, and we're fresh out of Oompa Loompas to build these incredible things. So we're left with the question of how to give you the customizability and uniqueness you want without simply raising the subscription rate."

Well waaa....

The fact of the matter is you DID build these things. You already spent valuable time and resources developing these "items" with the strict intent of generating more sales of PLEX to us - your customers. Instead of generating standard in-game items that WE have asked you for, instead of addressing in-game issues that WE have brought to your intention, your response is nothing more than, "No - but here's clothing that we want you to spend real money on..."

So you give us the "Well you don't HAVE to spend real money" nonsense - the same BS line that Zynga has been feeding us for years now. Well ask Zynga how many of their games I abandoned because I was tired of the constant "encouragement" to spend my money.

I'm sorry, CCP, that you can't generate more sales of your initial product. I'm sorry that a lot of your customers quit playing EVE because they find it too hard, too frustrating, or your player base too irritating. Perhaps you should focus on those issues to generate more recurring subscriptions instead of reaching into the pockets of your already-loyal customers. Personally I have three accounts, and I can promise you that I will NEVER spend real money so that I can wear CLOTHING in fake-life... You're getting all you'll ever get from me.

Snowball this nonsense into a full-on "Mafia Wars in Space," and you'll get much, much less.

/me is very, very disappointed...

Civil Unrest
Posted - 2011.06.21 12:39:00 - [1615]
 

You know, given that it is voluntary I don't see what the fuss is about. By definition the stuff they are selling is cosmetic so it won't have an effect on gameplay. That said...

If you are listening, oh CCP gods, I'd like the ability to mount floating corpses on the outside of my ship like that scene from Serenity ;-)

(I know, I know, too much fiber in my diet)

Ch'ianna
Posted - 2011.06.21 13:08:00 - [1616]
 

What a load of crap.

No thankyou. Keep your vanity items tbh, but even they wouldn't be a problem as much as buying items and ships etc will be.

I can see me looking for a new MMO very soon Sad

Abiegnus Mons
Posted - 2011.06.21 14:15:00 - [1617]
 

hehe, the first thought that crossed my mind was a quote ... "I am Locutus... of Borg. Resistance... is futile. Your life as it has been... is over. From this time forward... you will service... us."

Haifisch Zahne
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:02:00 - [1618]
 

Well, except that players can't create the in-world items, it sounds like the game Second Life to me. *yawn*

Dimitri Zaitsev
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:31:00 - [1619]
 

It's simple.

- They want more money
- There are stupid people willing to buy virtual vanity items


Gianni Macinseed
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:11:00 - [1620]
 

if I can buy items with real money, great! I pay subs with prepaid credit cards and I always have around 10 dollars left on the card, if I can spend that money on something instead of throwing the 10 dollars away, great, if not dammit!


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