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Akuma Gouki
Amarr
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:20:00 - [121]
 

EVE Fortress 2. :(

Mashie Saldana
Minmatar
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:22:00 - [122]
 

Originally by: Wilhelm Riley
Originally by: Ruby Khann
So you're putting content behind a paywall, exactly like you said you wouldn't do.



All you have to do is buy a plex ingame with ISK and then convert it to Aurum. Confused

This, but apparently it is rocket science for most people to grasp the concept that you can buy PLEX for ISK.

Now the question is, can you sell Aurum directly for isk, that would make an interesting dynamic.

Blazde
4S Corporation
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:23:00 - [123]
 

The number of people wanting to trade ISK for RL$-items will increase (people wanting to buy monocles for ISK)
The number of people wanting to trade $ for ISK presumably won't be significantly affected

Result is yes PLEX prices will go up. The mechanics in between of different currencies, set conversion and all the "monitoring extremely closely" in the world won't change that


It's probably a good thing though. Aside from strongly disagreeing with the legitimised RMT route that PLEX brought in the first place... one of the stated aims was to squeeze out the illegal RMT, which clearly hasn't happened (perception at least is it's worse than ever). Increased PLEX prices will divert more trade to the legitimate route

Kaminari Lunari
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:24:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel


The free clothing and accessories in the character creator are for choosing your character's default appearance. If you get podded, your new clone will awaken with this outfit. We don't intend to keep offering the full free clothing line each time you step into the character creator. Eventually you will see just the one free set and whatever clothing you have acquired..


This is the largest issue ive seen with this so far. The addition of the vanity items, dosent bother me,though i have doubts it wont adversly affect the plex prices. thats a whole nother issue. things like the above though is what makes me hate games going to micro trans systems.

The removal of already acessable features, and sets of items avalable to replace those choies/abilitys behind some sort of pay wall is disturbing. why take away choics we already have, limited as they are. shure add more new stuff, by all means add it to your new vanity shop. but why remove what limited wardrobes people that have no intrest in vanity items, or there cost, have to chose from should they want to change thee look.

removale of features, to be replaced with pay versions is a bad thing in my book

Katrishar
Minmatar
Rayn Enterprises
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:24:00 - [125]
 

Again, I think this system sounds awesome. Quick question though.... When we go down to just having 1 "noob ship" style default outfit after being podded, will there be the other character customization screen outfit choices available for "cheap?" In general will you have cheap and expensive clothes? I vote for this.

Abdiel Kavash
Caldari
Paladin Order
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:24:00 - [126]
 

Will AUR be tradeable via contracts, or even on the market somehow? I.e. could I eventually buy AUR for ISK or buy ships for AUR in a secure way (provided someone else is willing to sell of course)?

Joe Skellington
Minmatar
Matari Legion Holding
Matari Legion
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:25:00 - [127]
 

Originally by: Evelgrivion
I'm fine with microtransactions for vanity items like these. They're an acceptable way to improve revenues, since it makes people feel better about what they've got without compromising the integrity of the game and its economy. However, because this is important, it cannot be stressed enough:

If Mictro-transactions become a requirement for non-vanity items in any way, shape, or form, you're ramming every ounce of credibility you have through the shredder. Don't go back on your promise not to introduce them.

Originally by: CCP at the October meetings with CSM5
CCP is open to diversifying its business model, and exploring virtual goods is neither evil nor bad. However the idea of oly the rich kids being the best does not sit well with CCP and that situation will be prevented through any means necessary.


CSM5 and CSM6 have voiced strong and consistent disapproval of non-vanity, game affecting micro-transactions in each meeting they were discussed. The vocal consensus of people who play eve today do not look to approve the idea of microtransactions buying a tangible advantage in game.


Yep, this would be a CEM (Career Ending Maneuver) with me for EVE. I'm already ****ed about not being able to see player faction standings with other players.

Holy One
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:25:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: Blazde
The number of people wanting to trade ISK for RL$-items will increase (people wanting to buy monocles for ISK)
The number of people wanting to trade $ for ISK presumably won't be significantly affected

Result is yes PLEX prices will go up. The mechanics in between of different currencies, set conversion and all the "monitoring extremely closely" in the world won't change that


It's probably a good thing though. Aside from strongly disagreeing with the legitimised RMT route that PLEX brought in the first place... one of the stated aims was to squeeze out the illegal RMT, which clearly hasn't happened (perception at least is it's worse than ever). Increased PLEX prices will divert more trade to the legitimate route


Increasing plex prices will just make people quit. They're already nudging 400m. Few people who don't sit here all day grinding are gonna be able/willing to soend 3/4's of a bill a month on two accounts game time.

I'm certainly not gonna spend a bill or more if they hit 500m. Sod that. Razz

Kaena Stark
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:26:00 - [129]
 

Not bothered about shiny clothes, what would be nice to see is a set date for remaps every year depending on the character creation so they accumulate; all this use your final remap and THEN wait a year is just bad game mechanics...

Il Reverendo
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:27:00 - [130]
 

I for one would love to see some nice PLEX inflation/price impact projections alongside a reasoned explanation, maybe some details about prospective conversion rates and their respective possible impacts, rather than just an empty assurance that you'll be "monitoring things closely". Let's face it...there was a lot of that kind of thing posted in response to peoples' worries over the moon min rebalance pre-deployment that resulted in the technetium fiasco we have at the moment (and t3 ship/comp prices, initial wh profitability etc).

Ive been paying for this game with isk-bought gtc's since it was possible and am constantly dismayed at the horrific inflation I'm forced to put up with as I hand over ever increasing amounts of isk every other month. Most of this seems senseless. Now that there's actually gonna be a new and real factor affecting their prices I'm somewhat concerned and am eager to see exactly what impact you think this'll have, what your assumptions are and how wildly inaccurate they'll prove to be.

Mitchello
B O R G
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:28:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Blazde
The number of people wanting to trade ISK for RL$-items will increase (people wanting to buy monocles for ISK)
The number of people wanting to trade $ for ISK presumably won't be significantly affected

Result is yes PLEX prices will go up. The mechanics in between of different currencies, set conversion and all the "monitoring extremely closely" in the world won't change that


It's probably a good thing though. Aside from strongly disagreeing with the legitimised RMT route that PLEX brought in the first place... one of the stated aims was to squeeze out the illegal RMT, which clearly hasn't happened (perception at least is it's worse than ever). Increased PLEX prices will divert more trade to the legitimate route


Add to this the potential for a) attracting more people inclined towards or actively seeking such gameplay angles of entry and b) CCP catering to those for capitalising on that as a commercial opportunity.

That can be a good thing, but with extreme caution. It can also be a bad thing, at least in terms of maintaining design principles of the dynamic across environments within it for the future.

Morar Santee
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:28:00 - [132]
 

So let me get this straight:

Months ago, a vast majority (going on 80%) of forum users voiced their dislike for microtransactions.

What you took away from this is that microtransactions are a brilliant idea. You ignored every suggestion to make vanity items an ISK sink by giving players the design tools to create their own clothes and custom paintjobs for an ISK charge. So instead of an implementation that helps in-game economy and does not break immersion, we get this crap, complete with a second currency to fuel it. A currency that is directly bought with Real Life money.

And in the meantime, you break working game features with every patch. So much so that people just give up coming to the forums to ask what the f u c k is wrong with you people.
Personally, I've been waiting for five patches to have the "stack all" option fixed. Instead you decide to break player / NPC corp standings (yes, break - because you can not even see factions' relations towards each other anymore), broadcasts, build quotes and only Jesus knows what else..

But hey! Microtransactions are coming along fine!! Good ****ing job fellas.

Lidia Prince
Caldari
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:31:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: Morar Santee
So let me get this straight:

Months ago, a vast majority (going on 80%) of forum users voiced their dislike for microtransactions.

What you took away from this is that microtransactions are a brilliant idea. You ignored every suggestion to make vanity items an ISK sink by giving players the design tools to create their own clothes and custom paintjobs for an ISK charge. So instead of an implementation that helps in-game economy and does not break immersion, we get this crap, complete with a second currency to fuel it. A currency that is directly bought with Real Life money.

And in the meantime, you break working game features with every patch. So much so that people just give up coming to the forums to ask what the f u c k is wrong with you people.
Personally, I've been waiting for five patches to have the "stack all" option fixed. Instead you decide to break player / NPC corp standings (yes, break - because you can not even see factions' relations towards each other anymore), broadcasts, build quotes and only Jesus knows what else..

But hey! Microtransactions are coming along fine!! Good ****ing job fellas.

Now this is getting interesting. Would like to see CCP's answer on this one.

CCP Hammer

Posted - 2011.05.27 14:32:00 - [134]
 

Originally by: Mitchello
Originally by: CCP Hammer
Originally by: Sigvald Gottschalk
Cool, a bunch of immersion breaking, money grubbing bull**** that has nothing to do with spaceships. Thanks for the hard work, CCP.
I'm willing to concede your opinion that avatars in stations is sci-fi rather than purely spaceships and I would even agree that CCP is a for profit business. What I strongly disagree with and would like more explanation on is why this is immersion breaking in your opinion.


Immersion is a subjective and individually determined experience which people buy, within limits affected by social dynamics.

So I presume he is coming at it from the angle of "the gameplay that I am sold on is that of FiS" where - normal human behaviour this - any potential of that primary experience being affected by (in this case the introduction of) a secondary angle of gameplay can very easily be seen as a threat to the experience.

Think of topics like hardware requirements (aside of the commercial aspects of that debate), performance measurements, UI access to mechanisms, etc. Or even just the emotional "fear" of CCP perhaps forgetting about or not taking care of the FiS foundation of EVE. It's got a lot less to do with facts, than it has to do with emotion. It remains relevant however, since it's the emotional connection that sells and keeps (<3 Greg & Beta at FF).

I wouldn't worry though. He's probably just a bitter vet still telling his kids at night of the good old days of nano. Good communication and consistant clarity can deal with that, and I'm seeing a good amount of that in this thread. Regardless of some discrepancies such as storylines vs clothes in pod.

I'm still sofar missing kittens in Incarna though. Maybe there will be a petshop. I vaguely remember something now, hm ....

Anyway, kittens!


Cool



Nice post, I'll quote it. We've been doing all this work to put avatars in the game because many many people told us they weren't immersed without an avatar. I just found it strange that this would be considered immersion breaking.

Lina Thamaris
Caldari
Angry Elks
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:32:00 - [135]
 

We all knew this was going to happen, and I am very happy that it's happening. This is IMHO the best way to introduce microtransactions without making any important balancing changes. Way to go, CCP!

Dr Stantz
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:33:00 - [136]
 

Originally by: Morar Santee
So let me get this straight:

Months ago, a vast majority (going on 80%) of forum users voiced their dislike for microtransactions.

What you took away from this is that microtransactions are a brilliant idea. You ignored every suggestion to make vanity items an ISK sink by giving players the design tools to create their own clothes and custom paintjobs for an ISK charge. So instead of an implementation that helps in-game economy and does not break immersion, we get this crap, complete with a second currency to fuel it. A currency that is directly bought with Real Life money.

And in the meantime, you break working game features with every patch. So much so that people just give up coming to the forums to ask what the f u c k is wrong with you people.
Personally, I've been waiting for five patches to have the "stack all" option fixed. Instead you decide to break player / NPC corp standings (yes, break - because you can not even see factions' relations towards each other anymore), broadcasts, build quotes and only Jesus knows what else..

But hey! Microtransactions are coming along fine!! Good ****ing job fellas.


well said fella

ProContractor
Caldari
Viagra Lovers
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:33:00 - [137]
 

So incarna is a DLC for eve.. how cool is that :|
as a previous poster did say about 80% of us did not want microtransactins and still you " we do it anyway because we like it "
CCP is on the road called " is going downhill" well it was a matter of time before ccp implemented the above crap
how about you start listening to your paying customers ?


Shepard Book
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:33:00 - [138]
 

Originally by: CCP Hammer
Originally by: Makko Gray
Don't like the new currency name but like the idea of being able to buy these sort of visual customisations. Would be interested to know how it will work in practice.

Would I have to purchase a new paint job for each ship? Which could get very expensive. Or will we have effectively unlocked a paint job which we can apply to any ship we own?
We haven't decided exactly what we will charge for paint jobs or what the exact mechanics will be. One thing is for sure if it's too expensive no one will buy it so it has to be priced fairly. My main concern is that we keep the "perpetual machine" intact. By that I mean you should still have to obtain materials and build your ship and use that to claim better space with better materials to build better ships. So while I can't say with certainty if you will purchase an unlimited "license" for a certain paint job or if you will purchase consumable "nano paint" I can say that we're going to do everything we can to make the pricing fair and keep gameplay intact.


I hope it would be consumable "nano paint". IMO, it would make losing the ship mean even more and good for market growth. I hope the paint jobs keep true to Eve ATM and do not turn this into a different game. I would be disappointed then. Looking good so far CCP, keep it up.

Acetane
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:36:00 - [139]
 

wtb corporate or alliance branded ships. if they let peeps put decals on ships why can't manufacturer's put theirs on the ones they sell/srp?

too much cool stuff is enabled by cosmetic microtransactions. just hope ccp maxes this to the mostest.

J Kunjeh
Gallente
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:37:00 - [140]
 

Edited by: J Kunjeh on 27/05/2011 14:42:08
Originally by: Morar Santee
So let me get this straight:

Months ago, a vast majority (going on 80%) of forum users voiced their dislike for microtransactions.



I won't argue with your assumption of 80%....but let me get this straight: so, we're talking about 5% of the player base that don't want micro's? Well then, burn down the house....WTF CCP!? Rolling Eyes

CCP Zinfandel

Posted - 2011.05.27 14:37:00 - [141]
 

Originally by: Ruby Khann
So you're putting content behind a paywall, exactly like you said you wouldn't do.



If there is something you want, you can buy it in the marketplace for ISK or in the store for Aurum. I don't think it is behind as much of a wall as you think. But this will make more sense once you see it.

The difference is that the seller in the store is an NPC but the seller in the marketplace is another character.

Mors Magne
Astral Adventure
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:39:00 - [142]
 

Originally by: Morar Santee
So let me get this straight:

Months ago, a vast majority (going on 80%) of forum users voiced their dislike for microtransactions.

What you took away from this is that microtransactions are a brilliant idea. You ignored every suggestion to make vanity items an ISK sink by giving players the design tools to create their own clothes and custom paintjobs for an ISK charge. So instead of an implementation that helps in-game economy and does not break immersion, we get this crap, complete with a second currency to fuel it. A currency that is directly bought with Real Life money.

And in the meantime, you break working game features with every patch. So much so that people just give up coming to the forums to ask what the f u c k is wrong with you people.
Personally, I've been waiting for five patches to have the "stack all" option fixed. Instead you decide to break player / NPC corp standings (yes, break - because you can not even see factions' relations towards each other anymore), broadcasts, build quotes and only Jesus knows what else..

But hey! Microtransactions are coming along fine!! Good ****ing job fellas.


CCP has answered it: the items are to raise money. That raised money could be used to develop the ideas you mention. However, I happen to think that walking in stations is a better idea, and may incorporate your suggestions anyway.

Holy One
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:39:00 - [143]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
Originally by: Ruby Khann
So you're putting content behind a paywall, exactly like you said you wouldn't do.



If there is something you want, you can buy it in the marketplace for ISK or in the store for Aurum. I don't think it is behind as much of a wall as you think. But this will make more sense once you see it.

The difference is that the seller in the store is an NPC but the seller in the marketplace is another character.



the wording of the dev blog is unfortunate in that it infers you don't view our subs as being sufficient to provide new content for eve. its like 'here's incarna! now you have to pay for all the content you want to use in it!'.


Sigvald Gottschalk
5 Guys With Internet
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:41:00 - [144]
 

Edited by: Sigvald Gottschalk on 27/05/2011 14:40:56
Originally by: Morar Santee
CCP has answered it: the items are to raise money. That raised money could be used to develop the ideas you mention. However, I happen to think that walking in stations is a better idea, and may incorporate your suggestions anyway.


The money is actually being used for their shooter and their Twilight game, not EVE.

Katrishar
Minmatar
Rayn Enterprises
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:42:00 - [145]
 

Agreed, vanity items ONLY for this!! (or like vanity spaceships you'd never bring to a fleet fight) It's bad enough many pay $15 a month for a cyno alt in addition to our main lol.

Narome Bandur
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:44:00 - [146]
 

I love Hat Fortress 2 because I can accessorize. So relieved I can do it here as well. Cool

Alchemord Kosac
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:45:00 - [147]
 

what is more for CCP: more customers with subscription(because you focus on interesting content) VS. equal to or smaller number of subscribers, who sometimes make micropayments

Lenore Leelu
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:46:00 - [148]
 

Fine, if people want to buy stuff with microtransactions thats cool. What I think is odd with us all being immortal through cloning, is that somoeone would have their empty clones already customised with scars (acne or gouges), damaged eyes, and monocle implants, ready for that day when they get podded and and then they can look all scarry again...

Mortoral
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:47:00 - [149]
 

Edited by: Mortoral on 27/05/2011 14:55:38
Cosmetic stuffs is exactly what I don't want time wasted on. And walking in stations.

Fix important things first please Rolling Eyes

Sounds like alot of pandering to people who like to dress up dolls or something.

- "The money is actually being used for their shooter and their Twilight game, not EVE."
- A TWILIGHT game!! are you kidding?? I feel sick now. CCP I can't look at u anymore



Katrishar
Minmatar
Rayn Enterprises
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.05.27 14:48:00 - [150]
 

*******Emergency plot device that works..!!!! You don't WEAR your clothes in your pod, but they are stored in the "trunk" compartment of your pod, so that when you dock you can put your clothes on. So your clothes still get destroyed when podded in the "LORE."*****


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