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BondGamer
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:27:00 - [271]
 

If someone purchases an extravagant Fur Coat for say, 50 million Isk, would I be able to purchase a can of green spray paint and attack them with it in a station?

Of course this would only be possible in nulsec.

Silpher
Jita Trade Services
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:28:00 - [272]
 

Edited by: Silpher on 27/05/2011 16:30:30
I was always a fan of Incarna, but people always said it would ruin the game. I couldn't understand why they thought that... now I see.

Your ****ing us, CCP. It's that simple. I played this game not just because it's the only decent Sci-fi MMO on the market, but because CCP was like the Google of MMO development. You were actually trying to advance the MMO genre. You actually presented us with new content to the game in expansions, not just a new game that required us to buy the previous 3 expansions, first.

CCP used to sit on the side of it's player base and understand why we hated World of Warcraft and Star Wars Galaxies and every company that followed trying to develop the next big money maker.

CCP, you have lost your perspective. You are not the company that began Eve Online, but you have obviously become the company to end it. This is wrong, and if you can't understand why that is, you do not deserve my monthly subscription.

Edit: Too add, I take this personally. For the past year I have continued both of my subscriptions despite ever really logging much play time. Why? Because I supported CCP. Because CCP didn't have this nonsense and I wanted to continue contributing to the development of the game, because CCP was good. If you don't believe me, check your logs. Or is this another something that can't be proven there?

pmchem
Minmatar
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:29:00 - [273]
 

Aurum is an elegant solution by CCP to two problems:
1. there are too many unredeemed PLEX in the universe (accountants complain)
2. there is too much stockpiled ISK (economist complains)

Making Aurum only available from PLEX directly addresses problem #1.

Problem #2 means that if new Incarna items were sold through fixed price NPC sell orders (think POS fuel before Tyrannis), the universe would quickly be flooded with them, devaluing Incarna. Selling them for fixed prices in Aurum means that the items' prices FLOAT in isk, since that exchange rate will vary with PLEX pricing. The greater the rush to buy Incarna items, the more expensive they become. So stockpiled isk has a lesser effect on Incarna items than it would otherwise.

The immediate side effect of making PLEX more expensive also means that buying isk via RMT is less competitive with buying isk legitimately via GTC sales. I'm sure this was a 'total accident', right CCP? :)

Well done.

Could we get a comment from CCP as to the Eve economist's thoughts on Aurum? It is a new currency, after all.

Vladimir Ilych
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:30:00 - [274]
 

The more I think about this micro transaction "feature" more uneasy I become. I would be happier personally if CCP just increased the subs in line with inflation (assuming increased income is the objective).

Dzil
Caldari
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
The Fourth District
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:30:00 - [275]
 

Originally by: CCP GingerDude
Originally by: Versuvius Marii
I'd say why not just make these items buyable with isk, but we all know you're pushing people to spend RL isk on PLEX. And thus, microtransactions finally make it to Eve.



You'll be able to buy these items on the regular market with ISK, provided someone is willing to sell it to you.


Right... but what if I don't want to buy it, what if I want to build it? Incarna had the opportunity to bring an entire new front to the industrial side of the game, instead this clearly sets the stage that vanity items will be microtransactioned for maximum profit.

So much for free expansions.

Largo Coronet
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:31:00 - [276]
 

Lots of hurf, derf, & blurf here. I'll try to make short points:

-Vanity items are the only thing these microtransactions should be used for, so that much is correct. So long as what is bought/traded has no effect on gameplay, then it should have no effect where it counts. Except...

-Tying the currency for these transactions to in-game currency, even indirectly, can have an inflationary effect on said currency. The increase in PLEX now is speculative. But I believe that a more permanent increase is on the horizon. I think Aurum should be a separate purchase and not capable of being shifted around in game.

-"IT RUINS IMMERSION!" A vast, galaxy-wide system with huge industrial resources, and yet all pilots wear only one set of clothing like they're homeless people. Yeah, that's immersive.

-"80% of the forums hate it!" Cool. 80% of a small, vocal, 'spergy fraction of the player base that EVE makes almost nothing off of don't like it. For this reason alone I'm applauding CCP for getting their priorities straight.

-Destructability. Logical, but a key reason most PvP types won't use this. "Can't join the fleet right now, I'm in my monocle clone!"

- "EVE FORTRESS 2!" Hey, let's all remind CCP that this is the sort of idea that makes Gabe Newel at Valve enough money daily to buy Zimbabwe and swim in cash like Uncle Scrooge. Yeah, THAT'LL make 'em think twice! Rolling Eyes

- Pony logos, HELL YES! *brohoof*

- As long as you're doing this, any thought to adopting an idea from Second Life and allowing players to upload their own custom designs for shirts and ship paintjobs? Charge Aurum as a non-refundable fee and have submitted designs vetted for appropriateness, and if your design is purchased at the store you get a small portion of the proceeds? (Yes, 80% of forums sperglords, I know what this leads to. And I want that to happen. Deal.)

-"Can I use my exotic dancers on my stripper pole?" Answer yes to this one, CCP, and you'll see PLEX prices quadruple overnight. Twisted Evil

Gogela
Freeport Exploration
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:31:00 - [277]
 

I think this is a really good idea for the game. We all knew micro-transactions were coming. This is a really good implementation... and here's why: Now, more than ever, CCP will have a strong monetary incentive to improve the game and keep it awesome. These vanity items do not impact game play other than to add richer and sweeter tears to the gave on the part of the people who buy this stuff. There may be new valuable loot in cargo holds. That's the only gameplay effect. The only downside is the potential hyperinflation of PLEX prices... which does suck because I use it to pay for game time... but oh well.

Nishachara
True Enlightenment
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:31:00 - [278]
 

Originally by: Sister Megarea
There isn't any example where I am told "I'm sorry, but you can't use dollars, no matter how you convert it, to buy this. You MUST use Quatloos. And to get Quatloos, you have to use Proxima Centauri Credits, obtainable only at your local Proxima Centauri branch, conveniently located in the Proxima Centauri system, 4.2 light years from Earth. We look forward to doing business with you".



The Hitchikers guide to galaxy is also sci-fi Laughing

But yes i see the point...
..that immersion breaking is what also worries me a bit...

When i am playing the game i dont want to think about $$ or any other currency...
...only currency i am interested in is ISK and PLEX (which i see as a kind of a "drivers licence" that is issued by concord)
When i see mentioning of Rl world currencies and money ingame i will be on very good way to quit...

Liu Ellens
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:32:00 - [279]
 

That's nice and all - But I've got a more pressing topic to be covered:

How do you pronounce that? Espececially the short form? Can you say it like a word or are letters needed (ay-you-arr)?

Dr Sodius
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:33:00 - [280]
 

yeah, another way to increase PLEX prices as well as reduce the amount of ISK ingame...



"buy your new expansion parts with aurum" Soon (TM)

great ...ugh




Jax Altruse
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:34:00 - [281]
 

So I have read pretty much all 10 pages and can see that about 90% of the players think this is a BAD idea... lets see if they listen or if they just go and do it anyway.

Remember now CCP, **** off players = they leave your game = you lose money.

Now tell us, is it really worth it to turn a great game into one of those cheasy F2P games you download off the internet and buy items with real money for so you can better your character? Imagine all the players that will simply leave.

I came back finally because I could afford the $15 per month, currently. Doing this is going to make it so players with lots of real life money can look cool, get rich in game selling PLEX for ISK, and get rich in game buying items with real money (PLEX) and then turning around and selling them and making a fortune. Then they will simply raise the prices of items on the market due to inflation. What that does is screws over the players like myself who cant afford to buy PEX and trade them in for ISK and cant afford to buy PLRX with ISK to pay for their gaming.

BAD idea. If this happens, EVE will become worse than WoW imo.

I'thari
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:38:00 - [282]
 

Originally by: Alemana Hockeystick
A couple of observations:

1. Selling of goods result in either removal of ISK from the game (ISK -> PLEX -> AUR -> vanity goods)...
False, isk payed for PLEX go to player who sells it (so isk stays in game, only PLEX vanishes, increasing it's comsumption and, hence, price), unless CCP will monopolize ingame PLEX market to keep prices at bay... I'd like to see what will happen in that case Rolling Eyes


Originally by: Sister Megarea
5 million ISK for a monocle - Seriously, guys ?
10 million ISK for a top hat ?
20 million ISK for a pair of ripped jean shorts ?
And what do you think was the real reason that dude was killed in "future vision" vid? Twisted Evil

TheLostPenguin
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:39:00 - [283]
 

Originally by: Liu Ellens
That's nice and all - But I've got a more pressing topic to be covered:

How do you pronounce that? Espececially the short form? Can you say it like a word or are letters needed (ay-you-arr)?



I read it as something like "oar-room" in terms of sound myselfVery Happy

Mooney92
Minmatar
nul-li-fy
B O R G
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:40:00 - [284]
 

First of all, whoever thought of the name, needs to promptly take a gun, a bullet, and their mouth; combine it together and pull the trigger. Secondly, at first glance this could work, and raise funds, coolio. It also would increase plex supply, which typically means prices will go down through competition, however with that increase in supply, the demand would also rise, so overall we'll have to wait and see. And finally, this is great and all, but I don't like cash shops. Paying 15bucks a month on a subscription game is the point of not having a cash shop. Sure its magical pixie dust and paint jobs today, and tomorrow its superduper probes that scan cloaked ships. It sets a bad habit and that habit is a cash shop. So to conclude, I am completely for this idea, provided nothing ever gets added to this cash shop that has any type of actual use, outside of looking pretty.
PS: Inter-Stellar-Crossdressing = ISC or Inter-Stellar-Euro = ISE, any ****ing name besides auroro or whatever the **** you got would be better. Use the IS something format as this is an interstellar currency.


Rune Star
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:41:00 - [285]
 

Edited by: Rune Star on 27/05/2011 16:42:59
I think this is a good idea for another source of revenue for CCP to generate. They also didn't make it suck and just put in some hat store with amazing DEALS! YEAH!

Like someone had mentioned pages & pages back, we live in an increasingly expensive world, yet the subscription price for Eve hasn't changed (thank you CCP). I believe CCP is a fair company so they aren't whipping their employees and paying them rock bottom wages, so inevitably they're going to need to pay their bills and grow and expand etc.

I think this is a well thought out solution that fits within the current context of Eve and its market place. If you look at this holistically rather than narrowly, you'll see that it's not some grand scheme for CCP to screw us over, but it's something for the benefit of all, so chill the f out.

Salpad
Caldari
Carebears with Attitude
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:43:00 - [286]
 

Originally by: J Kunjeh
It's funny to me that people who play a game that's hyper-capitalistic have issues with new currencies and new things to buy in said game.


The problem is that the new currency is not needed.

Everything would work exactly the same if CCP sold vanity items for ISK, instead of for Aurum which are bought with PLEX (or which you can get indirectly by purchasing vanity items for ISK that other players bought with their Aurem they bought with PLEX bought with ISK).

Grady Eltoren
Minmatar
Aviation Professionals for EVE
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:44:00 - [287]
 

A few possible idea questions for the artists we will be "paying" with this new system:

With the new system (which sounds AWESOME) can we get?

1) Custom corp logos?
2) Custom character designs (i.e. I want my guy to look like XYZ - make it happen) (custom skins?)
3) Probably been discussed but if your ship is blown up or you are podded - do you lose the item or is the only way to get rid of it is through trashing or selling?

CCP Zinfandel

Posted - 2011.05.27 16:44:00 - [288]
 

Originally by: Razin
Will the custom paint job be listed in the killmail?


In effect, we trade your original ship for a new one. Yes, it is functionally identical, but it will have a new name, new descriptive text, a new item ID, a new market ID, and a new appearance.

So, yes.

And if you go to sell it in the marketplace, it will show up in the system under a different listing.

I'thari
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:44:00 - [289]
 

Originally by: Mooney92

PS: Inter-Stellar-Crossdressing = ISC or Inter-Stellar-Euro = ISE, any ****ing name besides auroro or whatever the **** you got would be better. Use the IS something format as this is an interstellar currency.


All hail Inter-Stellar-Aurum! Laughing

Ifly Uwalk
Caldari
Concentrated Evil
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:44:00 - [290]
 

Originally by: Liu Ellens
That's nice and all - But I've got a more pressing topic to be covered:

How do you pronounce that? Espececially the short form? Can you say it like a word or are letters needed (ay-you-arr)?


It's pronounced "Gold." Both long and short forms. Wink

Trocent
Amarr
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:46:00 - [291]
 

Originally by: CCP Incognito
Originally by: Bienator II
The main question here is:
will i be able to take your monocle if i pod you? :)


No, clothing is destroyed when you get podded, but if you had a stack on monocle's in your cargo hold they will drop like normal.


We are naked in Pods. If we buy the stuff, it should never get destroyed since we dont bring it with us. Read your Lore.

This is getting dangerously close to microtransations. I'm very unhappy about this. I'd rather not have the special items in the game then something bringing us twards microtransactions

Junko Sideswipe
Broski Enterprises
Elite Space Guild
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:46:00 - [292]
 

Edited by: Junko Sideswipe on 27/05/2011 16:46:33
Originally by: CCP Sisyphus

The current functionality is - the new "store clothing" assets are items. The best behavior to liken them to is implants that happen to be removable.

If you take of your expensive clothes, they appear in your hangar (in Jita for example).
If you fly to pator, well, those clothes are still in Jita.
If you want to have a spare set, you (or someone) needs to transport the clothes the old fashioned way.


I'm all for more carebear tears, suicide podding will be wonderful when this happens. I'm all for more isk sinks, but to be perfectly honest, I can tell Incarna is a big push to attract more female gamers (lol), however I don't think many female gamers are going to be interested even undocking, much less PVPing, in a set of clothing they spent a buttload of isk or real cash for.

Judging from the feedback you're already getting, I'm thinking you'll need to change your minds and make these vanity items a bit more permanent.

So lets talk about those cat ears. CoolCoolCool

Mr LaForge
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:46:00 - [293]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel

We don't intend to keep offering the full free clothing line each time you step into the character creator. Eventually you will see just the one free set and whatever clothing you have acquired.



Originally by: CCP Hammer
Short answer is yes. This first pass is simply a tracer bullet to gauge response. The future vision is that after being podded you will wake up in a clone bay in a medical gown. Then you will get your free orange noobie overalls (or whatever we come up with) but there will be all sorts of inexpensive stuff on offer to change into or maybe you weren't wearing your favorite stuff anyway and you can just put that one.


And that right there is why I don't care to get out of the pod goo.

CCP Zinfandel

Posted - 2011.05.27 16:47:00 - [294]
 

Originally by: Liu Ellens
That's nice and all - But I've got a more pressing topic to be covered:

How do you pronounce that? Espececially the short form? Can you say it like a word or are letters needed (ay-you-arr)?



"or um"

Ager Agemo
Caldari
Care Factor
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:48:00 - [295]
 

you people are stupid, don't you notice aurum is just the latin name for gold? this is just bringing WOW into space ugh... i don't like it. i say use isk.

TheLostPenguin
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:48:00 - [296]
 

Originally by: Salpad
Originally by: J Kunjeh
It's funny to me that people who play a game that's hyper-capitalistic have issues with new currencies and new things to buy in said game.


The problem is that the new currency is not needed.

Everything would work exactly the same if CCP sold vanity items for ISK, instead of for Aurum which are bought with PLEX (or which you can get indirectly by purchasing vanity items for ISK that other players bought with their Aurem they bought with PLEX bought with ISK).



You just aren't getting it...
By having a PLEX in the loop somewhere it means CCP have made money off someone, sometime, which is basicly the whole reason for them doing this.
Make this stuff directly purchasable with ISK and it's "free" in that at no stage has CCP made any extra money in return for you getting that extrasuperawesome pair of socks.

I'thari
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:49:00 - [297]
 

Originally by: Salpad
Originally by: J Kunjeh
It's funny to me that people who play a game that's hyper-capitalistic have issues with new currencies and new things to buy in said game.


The problem is that the new currency is not needed.

Everything would work exactly the same if CCP sold vanity items for ISK, instead of for Aurum which are bought with PLEX (or which you can get indirectly by purchasing vanity items for ISK that other players bought with their Aurem they bought with PLEX bought with ISK).

Well, depends on how you want to balance it out: buy stack of 100 "+10 hello kitty online pants of trolling" for 1 plex, or get 100 AUR for 1 PLEX and use only one AUR to get one pair you wanted in the first place.

Mr LaForge
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:49:00 - [298]
 

Just saw the new image in the blog. CCP seems to have missed a critical step in the money wheel and that is have PLEX come in from an outside real life money source called Dollars/Euros/money and become a PLEX.

The wheel gives the impression that PLEX is created ingame or seeded when its not. Its made from Real Money.

Jim Luc
Caldari
Rule of Five
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:50:00 - [299]
 

I think I'm starting to understand this. I'm a little bummed, because I'd hate to lose my nice clothes that I spent lots of time making look cool.

I hope we can save configurations, that's all. So we can stockpile clothes, and create a custom ship configuration, a custom tattoo configuration, a custom outfit, that we can then bundle and sell. This can then be applied all at once, or pieced out.

Also - can we manufacture clothes and ship modifications with PI materials?

Che Biko
Humanitarian Communists
Posted - 2011.05.27 16:51:00 - [300]
 

Hmm, I'm interested to see how this goes. I hope it works, because the currently available clothes/hairstyles/accesoires are pretty limited. Therefore I would be pretty disappointed if you would eventually have only one free set of clothing available.
I am not against paying for new clothes, but I strongly feel against the removal of the limited selection of free clothes available to us now.ugh It's not like I would not want to buy new clothes because I got a few sets of free ones. I'm willing to pay so I won't have to settle for those. I can speak from experience, I've bought clothes for my avatar on PKR, even though they have a range of free stuff there as well.

QuestionBTW, will hairstyles be something that's gonna be available for AUR too? If so, will you also eventually limit our free hairstyles to just the one we choose?Sad


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