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blankseplocked Devs: Will unintended standings boost be reverted?
 
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Chelm Saron
Posted - 2011.05.26 10:29:00 - [1]
 

Hello there.

Quick question: after the latest patch, certain pilots took advantage of tutorial agents to gain massive amounts of standings. This was fixed shortly after as it wasn't intended design.
Now then, what happens to said pilots who made off with days' worth of standing grind within a few hours? Some have even hit 10.0 faction standing, which is weeks or even months worth of work, and that is simply ridiculous.

Normally from any other MMO company, we can expect a systematic reversion of standings meant to "correct the developers' error." Is CCP willing to openly admit a mistake and fix it, or will the lucky exploiters get away with it?

DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2011.05.26 11:20:00 - [2]
 

The exploiters will likely get away with it.
The smart guy's who seen the errors would have polished it all off with a quick run through some l4 cosmos agents, so even IF ccp un-does those standings, the players will still all be lvl5 capable.

how did those players know it wasnt an error?..
We spoke to the agent, the agent gave a job, the job gave standing.
As GM's say, It was working as intended. Perhaps the intention was fracked, but there's so much more in eve that doesnt get fixed due to no one wishing to work on the code, so this is a null issue.

To do what you ask they would need to run a check over every mission ran over the past week, parse out the buggy agents, change the standings to normal (or remove and reset the agents), then look at what other benefits those players got (cosmos blueprints), and possibly unachor a few towers, remove a few jump clones, charge extra tax on market transactions, reset players who are in the middle of multi-part missions... It would be a lot of work..
so, lemme call you a waambulance.

Chelm Saron
Posted - 2011.05.26 11:57:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: DeODokktor
The exploiters will likely get away with it.
The smart guy's who seen the errors would have polished it all off with a quick run through some l4 cosmos agents, so even IF ccp un-does those standings, the players will still all be lvl5 capable.

how did those players know it wasnt an error?..
We spoke to the agent, the agent gave a job, the job gave standing.
As GM's say, It was working as intended. Perhaps the intention was fracked, but there's so much more in eve that doesnt get fixed due to no one wishing to work on the code, so this is a null issue.

To do what you ask they would need to run a check over every mission ran over the past week, parse out the buggy agents, change the standings to normal (or remove and reset the agents), then look at what other benefits those players got (cosmos blueprints), and possibly unachor a few towers, remove a few jump clones, charge extra tax on market transactions, reset players who are in the middle of multi-part missions... It would be a lot of work..
so, lemme call you a waambulance.


If it was working as 'intended' the stealth changes would not have been made. Right?
Where is CCP's commitment to excellence if they won't go forward with tracking down each and every case, then readjusting the benefits you mentioned? Besides, they have the tools at their disposal.

DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2011.05.26 11:59:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: DeODokktor on 26/05/2011 11:59:48
They havent even admitted a change yet.
For all we know it could have been the leveling log rebuilding itself after 1 day that caused it to go down.

There's a big difference between having tools to use, and having money (manhours) to waste.

Chelm Saron
Posted - 2011.05.26 12:04:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: DeODokktor
Edited by: DeODokktor on 26/05/2011 11:59:48
They havent even admitted a change yet.
For all we know it could have been the leveling log rebuilding itself after 1 day that caused it to go down.

There's a big difference between having tools to use, and having money (manhours) to waste.


Read the title of this thread. Maybe someone wants answers.
Money to waste? According to your logic, CCP could do without a larger contingent of developers and GMs since they're a waste. Let's not go to extremes.
There is clearly a problem that needs to be addressed.

Goose99
Posted - 2011.05.26 13:49:00 - [6]
 

There won't be a "correction" because no one wants to see it happen, except a handful of whiners sore after missing the train. What's CCP's incentives there? Rolling Eyes

Hashpipe Malone
Posted - 2011.05.26 14:21:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Chelm Saron
Hello there.

Quick question: after the latest patch, certain pilots took advantage of tutorial agents to gain massive amounts of standings. This was fixed shortly after as it wasn't intended design.
Now then, what happens to said pilots who made off with days' worth of standing grind within a few hours? Some have even hit 10.0 faction standing, which is weeks or even months worth of work, and that is simply ridiculous.

Normally from any other MMO company, we can expect a systematic reversion of standings meant to "correct the developers' error." Is CCP willing to openly admit a mistake and fix it, or will the lucky exploiters get away with it?


Your just butthurt you didnt get in on the action...it shouldnt matter to you if someone has better standings. I didnt get in on it either....big deal....move onRolling Eyes

Destamon
Azure Freelancers
Posted - 2011.05.26 14:33:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Hashpipe Malone
Your just butthurt you didnt get in on the action...it shouldnt matter to you if someone has better standings. I didnt get in on it either....big deal....move onRolling Eyes


This, basically.

Hard to believe someone made a thread about this, but I've seen worse threads. Like ones with no content and no title :)

Did people getting better standings inconvenience you in some way or deprive you of something? No. Not to mention standings are private now so not even good for bragging rights. Move along, nothing to see here.

DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2011.05.26 15:09:00 - [9]
 

I do think his argument is valid.
Just that the time, effort, and hassle it would cause makes it a dead duck.

Grind up 12 characters and you know the pain, not so bad now that ccp has removed QL, but in the past it could take months and months to get good standings.

With the bug you didnt need connections, only social 4/5 and you could get standings pretty damn'd high.

I lol'd at the high gain on the test server, but that as a few hours after they had rolled on TQ, by then the agents were getting ran like mad, so a lot of people did know about it ;P.

Chelm Saron
Posted - 2011.05.26 16:11:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Goose99
There won't be a "correction" because no one wants to see it happen, except a handful of whiners sore after missing the train. What's CCP's incentives there? Rolling Eyes

CCP claims that they thrive for excellence, that EVE Online is a world-class MMO. Bold as it may be, they have set high standards and naturally one can expect such "corrections."

Originally by: Hashpipe Malone
Your just butthurt you didnt get in on the action...it shouldnt matter to you if someone has better standings. I didnt get in on it either....big deal....move onRolling Eyes

(Your is a possessive, in this case you want to use the verb: "you are/you're")
No, I do not feel any pain in my posterior, thank you. This is a matter of grave importance despite its harmless nature. Terms of Service specifically states that:
Originally by: Terms of Service
23. You may not exploit any bug in EVE Online to gain an unfair advantage over other players.

It doesn't matter whether another pilot's standing toward a corp or faction is higher than me. I don't care whether you got in it or not. However, it becomes an issue when people exploit a bug to gain unfair advantage.
It takes months of missions to reach over 9.0 faction standing, which, owing to the bug was achieved in mere hours. If you have the time, read this thread to grasp what went on. On a personal scale, one could have walked away with over one billion ISK from a two-run faction battleship BPC and other COSMOS rewards that are even more valuable, also gaining access to every single agent under one banner. On a corporate scale, anchoring a POS in a high sec system of choice becomes an unfair advantage over other corps working to build towers of their own.

It is far too convenient to accuse one of complaining, but this is a matter or principle and it would be a shame to see no one being held accountable.

Goose99
Posted - 2011.05.26 17:51:00 - [11]
 

Then stay a sore loser. People's standings have already moved in many ways in some cases. CCP isn't going to recalculate all the percentage based derivations from dt onward, from agents that people wouldn't have access to in some cases. You're crying over spilt milk. CCP wouldn't be able to restore it to original state, even if they had the inclination. This is not going to happen.Rolling Eyes

Ecks Orion
Proposition Thirteen
The Third Rail
Posted - 2011.05.26 19:37:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Goose99
Then stay a sore loser. People's standings have already moved in many ways in some cases. CCP isn't going to recalculate all the percentage based derivations from dt onward, from agents that people wouldn't have access to in some cases. You're crying over spilt milk. CCP wouldn't be able to restore it to original state, even if they had the inclination. This is not going to happen.Rolling Eyes


Of course they'd be able to change it if they wanted to. Easily, in fact.

The game already tracks every single time we gain faction standings, how much we gained, and what mission (or action) caused us to gain it. We can look at that information any time we want to ingame.

All they'd need to do was do a blanket DB query on those particular missions, and if the corresponding faction gain was the wrong figure, simply adjust it to the correct one.

Faction gains are all percentage-based, so any gains after that would just self-adjust.

DeODokktor
Caldari
Dark Templars
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2011.05.26 19:41:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Ecks Orion
Originally by: Goose99
Then stay a sore loser. People's standings have already moved in many ways in some cases. CCP isn't going to recalculate all the percentage based derivations from dt onward, from agents that people wouldn't have access to in some cases. You're crying over spilt milk. CCP wouldn't be able to restore it to original state, even if they had the inclination. This is not going to happen.Rolling Eyes


Of course they'd be able to change it if they wanted to. Easily, in fact.

The game already tracks every single time we gain faction standings, how much we gained, and what mission (or action) caused us to gain it. We can look at that information any time we want to ingame.

All they'd need to do was do a blanket DB query on those particular missions, and if the corresponding faction gain was the wrong figure, simply adjust it to the correct one.

Faction gains are all percentage-based, so any gains after that would just self-adjust.


Read above...
There's a LOT of knock-ons that would have happened due to false standings.
If the OP's moan is about everything that has happened having to un-happen then it would take CCP days to figgure out what needs to be altered.
Sure they COULD just change the standings.

I doubt the op will care about jump clones in empire, anchored pos's, relaxed broker fee's, people running specific cosmos agents to get specific loot, people starting r&d agents, people who used a few l4's afterwards to get legit standing with a corp.

So yes, they could easily change the GAIN, but that will not undo all that has been done.

Capitalist DeSandre
Posted - 2011.05.27 17:32:00 - [14]
 

This sounds like an incredible waste of time.



 

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