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blankseplocked [Petition] Make entry into CQ and Incarna optional and not mandatory.
 
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Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 20:56:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Soden Rah on 04/06/2011 19:57:30
The new and long awaited feature of incarna is finally about to drip, drip its way onto TQ, and into a PR disaster.

Under the current plan, CQ, the first stage of incarna will not be optional.
Every time you dock you will no-longer be in your hanger looking at your ship,
you will instead load your Captains Quarters as a fully dressed and pressed avatar.

There are posts and threads abounding with people detailing why this is bad.
Here I simply want to get a head count for those who, for whatever reason,
believe that CQ should be Optional, upon docking.
This is not a referendum on if it should exist at all, or if it will be any good... ect.

simply a show of hands for those who want to chose when, if at all, they use it.

Hopefully if there is enough support it can be made optional before it hits TQ,
not tacked on 6~18 month later.

Given that those who want to use CQ will under this proposal still be able to do so,
without any penalties. It seems to be a no-brainer that those who don't want to use
it all the time also have that choice.

Soden Rah



EDIT: OK so CCP have added (on the SiSi test build) an option to not load the CQ environment.
This is good, But not what I was asking for, this helps those who have performance issues with the in station environment, not those who had RP/immersion issues. Please Keep supporting for having a regular hanger view on docking (ship spinning and all) with a neocom button to enable us to disembark to enter CQ when we want.

Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:03:00 - [2]
 

Check out the new dev blog. all the station buttons will still be available. If you dont hit your arrow keys u wont even have to deal with it. Im logging into my FB now to pull the dev blog for you.

Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:06:00 - [3]
 

Incarna Dev Blog

As you will notice with the imbedded video all station buttons are still available to use and make for quick item/ship swapping etc.

If the duality server says anything, which I doubt it does, having all ur settings on low and unchecked the textures for CQ dont even load. I wouldnt count on this however.

Are you worried about CPU reqs? My laptop cant even handle Incarna in its current state sO i doubt I will be using it either. Either way, its circumventable.

LordElfa
Gallente
Golden Lyon Warriors
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:09:00 - [4]
 

^^This.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:10:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Tyme Xandr
Check out the new dev blog. all the station buttons will still be available. If you dont hit your arrow keys u wont even have to deal with it. Im logging into my FB now to pull the dev blog for you.



read the blogs, been on duality, chatted to the devs on duality, read the forum posts, posted some of the forum posts. and STILL for a whole host of reasons think this should be optional... know a lot of others feel the same, so created this thread.


Now please stop assuming you know more about what's going on than me and that I have reached my opinion based on incomplete or inaccurate information.
I LIKE the idea of CQ, I JUST want it to be optional.
if it is optional, then it hurts those who like/want it not at all.
if it isn't optional then it ****es off those that don't want it or don't want it all the time.
Why not make it optional.

Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:21:00 - [6]
 

But im asking why bother making an option if it doesnt matter? Im not inferring I know more then you, im simply pointing out a reason of 'Who cares?'.

Chill out guy, maybe you can start listing your (and the millions of other peoples) reasons for why its such a big deal to make it optional when the idea of Incarna is to make the EVE Universe more realistic.

I just dont see why a step towards an immersive environment is so bad when you can still function like before.

Sorry for not seeing your 'superior wisdom'.

Hows that for for an ignorant post? Better?

Solo Player
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:21:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Solo Player on 25/05/2011 21:25:33
I got stuck within five minutes of testing on Duality last week and still am. Sure, I dared to hit the "leave station" button after my CQ view went dark and non-responsive, but still. If you add another layer to something already very complex, don't expect either to run as smooth as it would by itself. There will be problems.

It is a fact that many players are unhappy and skeptical of Incarna, and even more about the apparent removal of a choice to leave your pod or not. Hell, I'm pretty awed by Incarna myself and will probably not stay outside of stations any longer than I need to, yet I am totally flabberghasted by this appartent inconsideration.

There are a lot of good reasons to keep Incarna optional.
There is not a single good one not to.

Alternatively: make us see the light, CCP and respond to this with stunning wisdom.

Edit in answer to above:
Because it is not more realistic to just stand there in your clothes seconds after your ship started to dock?
Because it is not more immersive to be forced to get out of your ship/pod just to convo with an agent/drop off some small cargo/refit/hide in the station, ready to undock at the first chance to get elsewhere safely?

Cyberus
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:24:00 - [8]
 

Well there is plenty things in this game changed what lots of us do like and others not.

The game evolve and will continue to evolve in the future, so you have only 2 options;

a) accept it
b) or leave it.

There is also plenty of those guys who whine about they poor laptops cant run this/cant run that.

Well did those who complain even ever read what syster requirment EVE need to run?

Stop crying this game is already hold it back witt grafic's and such to try everyone be happy but CCP simply cant to not move forward with rest of the world or they simply will ruin they own business.

If you want to play this game for long period of time you have to accept the changes and you have to upgrade your systems at some period of time, thats atleast what you do when you buy other games, dont you?

Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:28:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Cyberus
Well there is plenty things in this game changed what lots of us do like and others not.

The game evolve and will continue to evolve in the future, so you have only 2 options;

a) accept it
b) or leave it.

There is also plenty of those guys who whine about they poor laptops cant run this/cant run that.

Well did those who complain even ever read what syster requirment EVE need to run?

Stop crying this game is already hold it back witt grafic's and such to try everyone be happy but CCP simply cant to not move forward with rest of the world or they simply will ruin they own business.

If you want to play this game for long period of time you have to accept the changes and you have to upgrade your systems at some period of time, thats atleast what you do when you buy other games, dont you?


No, I just deal with using low graphic settings. Do I win?

Solo Player
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:29:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Solo Player on 25/05/2011 21:29:04
@cyber:
If that's your opinion, WTF are you doing in the Assembly Hall? If you believe that everything is out of our hands and rightly so, this makes no sense at all!

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:39:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Tyme Xandr
But im asking why bother making an option if it doesnt matter? Im not inferring I know more then you, im simply pointing out a reason of 'Who cares?'.

Chill out guy, maybe you can start listing your (and the millions of other peoples) reasons for why its such a big deal to make it optional when the idea of Incarna is to make the EVE Universe more realistic.

I just dont see why a step towards an immersive environment is so bad when you can still function like before.

Sorry for not seeing your 'superior wisdom'.

Hows that for for an ignorant post? Better?


I am not claiming 'superior wisdom'. I was objecting to you dissing my post on the assumption I hadn't read the dev blog or tested out the feature on duality.

And I am all for a more immersive environment. This won't help.
Not because the feature itself is bad, but because it makes no sense that when you dock you instantly appear fully clothed and without any pod goo in your hair in your captains quarters.
If you dock up for a quick ammo reload or to switch out hardeners, you wouldn't get out your pod, shower, put some clean clothes on, then switch your hardeners out, by push button now your no-longer in your pod, then undress, get back in your pod, get back in your ship and go.

There are many reasons for wanting an option to enter CQ rather than it being mandatory, but I didn't create this thread to discuss them, there are a host of threads on the forums already doing that. This thread was created simply for a show of hands for those who want it to be optional, and wish the CSM and CCP to take that into consideration. If you want to debate the reasons why I can point you in the direction of several threads where it is being actively argued.
but I can end with one. There are a number (I never said millions) of people who vocally don't want incarna at all, and/or want it to be optional.
Given making it optional doesn't hurt those that do want it or don't care why give yourself (as CCP) the agro of annoying those who want the option.

This issue has been raised in EVERY thread on the new CQ feature.


Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:44:00 - [12]
 

This is the future. People are warping instantly all over the place. Whos to say there isnt a transportation beam that takes you out of the pod, and this beam also cleans you, the clothing is threaded over you or transported on you, all in the matter of a moment.

And im not 'dissing' your thread. You made a public thread and I responded in it. My initial post had no 'disses' in it, 'yo'. I 'aint dissin yo **** bra'.

However, since your a ****, now I am ****ing with you.

If you are so ****ed about Incarna making your day so much more difficult by doing the same thing that happened before but with a different look then you got more problems then just incarna coming out.

They are pandering to you guys who are mad that you have a Spaceman Doll by keeping all the functional buttons and windows intact. Just ignore the ****ing guy in the middle of the screen and theres no issues.

Your making it an issue by saying "I am upset that the dock screen looks different now." That's just ridiculous.

Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:47:00 - [13]
 

Come into my thread, by clicking here, and 'diss my **** yo' if it'll make you feel better. Its obvious that you need a commotion.

boseo
Gallente
Azure Horizon
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:48:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: boseo on 25/05/2011 23:36:19
Edited by: boseo on 25/05/2011 21:50:13
Well I think that This topic Which the devs have looked at (even posted in a dev blog), showed a good way to go.
I like the idea of having both the CQ, and Hangar.

makes sense more in an RP way it you look at it as the following:
every time you go to you CQ you have to drain your pod wash and get dressed, now would you really want to do that if you were only picking up one item?

I mean in RL when I'm picking someone up in the car, I don't always pullover and park, turn off the engine, get out greet the person then get back in. so why would I in a space ship?

maybe having the hangar as a quick stop, where items can be moved,ships changed, and refitting, and CQ for everything else, which would take more time.

Edit:
Also want cool little cut scenes, like suggested on video to add more immersion. better than a loading bar.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:48:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Cyberus
Well there is plenty things in this game changed what lots of us do like and others not.

The game evolve and will continue to evolve in the future, so you have only 2 options;

a) accept it
b) or leave it.

There is also plenty of those guys who whine about they poor laptops cant run this/cant run that.

Well did those who complain even ever read what syster requirment EVE need to run?

Stop crying this game is already hold it back witt grafic's and such to try everyone be happy but CCP simply cant to not move forward with rest of the world or they simply will ruin they own business.

If you want to play this game for long period of time you have to accept the changes and you have to upgrade your systems at some period of time, thats atleast what you do when you buy other games, dont you?


My PC runs the beta version of CQ dual screen at full res, max settings, AA the works, at over 30 fps. I am not complaining because I won't be able to run eve on the new settings. CCP are actively asking for opinions of the players as to what they think of eve, and the new features under development in particular.
My feedback, includes, the opinion that CQ should be optional, for a variety of reasons.
I therefore totally reject the premise of your post.
Those are not the only options, and those are not the reasons I am complaining about this issue.

I am not about to emo-rage quit. You can't have my stuff. And I will keep expressing my opinion (that ccp has asked for) on the game I enjoy.

You are right on one thing... there are plenty of features liked by some and not by others... this will be one of them... so in the interests of keeping the customer satisfied, why force people to use this one?

Diamaht Nevain
Gallente
Avatar Union
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:50:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Diamaht Nevain on 25/05/2011 21:54:32
Can't really say supported. If all the same features are there, and everything takes the same amount of time, why have them complicate matters by having 2 sets of code just for docking. Just seems like we are asking for things to be way more complicated for CCP than they need to be.

Edit: To the OP, I guess it would help if you gave a couple reasons why a change like this would be needed at all. It just sounds like extra work and more time in development for basically nothing.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:50:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Tyme Xandr
Come into my thread, by clicking here, and 'diss my **** yo' if it'll make you feel better. Its obvious that you need a commotion.


I really don't.

Ailyn Ischt
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:58:00 - [18]
 

I'm just wondering if ship spinning is this important to you?

Cyberus
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.05.25 21:58:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Soden Rah
Originally by: Cyberus
Well there is plenty things in this game changed what lots of us do like and others not.

The game evolve and will continue to evolve in the future, so you have only 2 options;

a) accept it
b) or leave it.

There is also plenty of those guys who whine about they poor laptops cant run this/cant run that.

Well did those who complain even ever read what syster requirment EVE need to run?

Stop crying this game is already hold it back witt grafic's and such to try everyone be happy but CCP simply cant to not move forward with rest of the world or they simply will ruin they own business.

If you want to play this game for long period of time you have to accept the changes and you have to upgrade your systems at some period of time, thats atleast what you do when you buy other games, dont you?




You are right on one thing... there are plenty of features liked by some and not by others... this will be one of them... so in the interests of keeping the customer satisfied, why force people to use this one?



Meaby because it will become part of the game they make?

As you have stated above, some do like something in game while the others do completely dislike though the others do like what the first one do not so they both have to deal with it.

This case will not any difrent, while i will remain netral on this new feauture of they game there will be still lots of ppl who likes it and who not.

I'm sure that there is enough some things in game that you totaly would like to be removed, so i do my things, but the true is it wont happence and we ( you/me and others) have to deal with.




Cyberus
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:03:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Solo Player
Edited by: Solo Player on 25/05/2011 21:29:04
@cyber:
If that's your opinion, WTF are you doing in the Assembly Hall? If you believe that everything is out of our hands and rightly so, this makes no sense at all!


And you beleave that you can dictate how CCP make they own game? get real.

Yes they listning to desires of the customers ( atleast if they smart enough to do so) but at the end..... its them who make the FINAL desigion and FINAL content, how THEY think it should be, not the player base.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:09:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Ailyn Ischt
I'm just wondering if ship spinning is this important to you?


Assuming it was me you were asking...

nope, although it does apparently have quite a large following.
They are planning (allegedly) to add a ship spinning feature to CQ at a later date.
But that doesn't bother me one way or another...

Corina's Bodyguard
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:12:00 - [22]
 

It is optional. Just tell Windows not to allow the file that contains the CQ textures to load. No CQ.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:18:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Diamaht Nevain
Edited by: Diamaht Nevain on 25/05/2011 21:54:32
Can't really say supported. If all the same features are there, and everything takes the same amount of time, why have them complicate matters by having 2 sets of code just for docking. Just seems like we are asking for things to be way more complicated for CCP than they need to be.

Edit: To the OP, I guess it would help if you gave a couple reasons why a change like this would be needed at all. It just sounds like extra work and more time in development for basically nothing.


well I usually get accused of creating walls of text (of reasoned argument, that no-one replies to). As there already seemed to be quite a large number of people already complaining about this issue I tried to make a thread simply for everyone who cared to put their had up and say yes I agree.
This may have been a bit too optimistic on my part.

however, the 'everything takes the same time' is not necessarily a given here.
and I am not asking for two different kinds of docking, I am suggesting that you dock as normal, and then enter CQ after that IF you want by clicking a neocom button. this thread might give you a taste of the arguments and this is my first post in it.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:21:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Corina's Bodyguard
It is optional. Just tell Windows not to allow the file that contains the CQ textures to load. No CQ.


yeah but I want to be Able to use it, just not be forced to use it all the time.
plus its possible your suggestion (I have seen your thread) breaks the EULA.

Tyme Xandr
Gallente
State Protectorate
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:38:00 - [25]
 

You DON'T have to use it each time tho dude ... im not sure what ur not getting here. Just because u can walk around you dont have to.

Its like changing ur desktop background, does that fundamentally change how u use your computer?

Vaju Katru
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:47:00 - [26]
 

Not supported.

Soden Rah
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.05.25 22:57:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Tyme Xandr
You DON'T have to use it each time tho dude ... im not sure what ur not getting here. Just because u can walk around you dont have to.

Its like changing ur desktop background, does that fundamentally change how u use your computer?


So have you decided I am not a whatever the asterisked word was you called me and can now be talked to?

It wont make any difference to how I play... as it stands the first iteration the 'new' 3d UI will basically be embedded buttons in the CQ environment that open the old UI windows. Which then completely cover and hide that environment.
Until that changes I wont ever see CQ under all my windows.
I will though waste CPU time loading it.
However from an aesthetic and RP standpoint the fact that I no longer in my pod looking at my ship with camera drones jars. Plus I like the hanger view, in your analogy of a wallpaper this would be where I'm being forced to have a new wallpaper I don't like instead of one I do.
Basically CCP is adding on a huge new area of the game, with lots of new coding. which can go wrong and break. If it (as originality advertised) is kept separate,
and one breaks it doesn't effect the other. if CQ breaks on launch (or after) we can no longer dock.
There is an issue for those on baseline hardware who currently use the 'don't load station environment' option. Who will now be forced to load a big new environment.
Basically there are lots of reasons to make CQ optional.
The only reason not to is 'its challenging for ccp to do'
which is manifestly not true... plus I asked, the reason atm is aesthetic.
As the only reason is aesthetic and aesthetics are personal... I say make it optional so we can chose which we want.

And on your earlier rant, your immediate response was to assume I hadn't read the devblog, and was posting not knowing what was going on. That IS dissing my post, or however you want to put it. Your starting point was to assume I didn't know what I was talking about. That irritated me, But not to the point of shouting swearing and calling you names. I just wanted this thread to be a head count, no drama at all.
If you want to continue discussing this then fine. But call me asterisks again and I'll simply ignore you. I don't need the agro.

Vhek Rikah
Posted - 2011.05.25 23:03:00 - [28]
 

His orignal post was SUPPORTING how its not an issue DUE to the fact that you can still function the docking like normal. Its not his fault that your an idiot.

If ur worried about your CPU then thats a diff issue. Keep graphic settings low. Maybe you should log back into duality and check out all the click boxes pertaining to graphic settings. U can turn most everything to low and no.

Your just *****ing for the sake of *****ing, typical EVE user.

Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron
Legion of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.05.25 23:12:00 - [29]
 

I understand that not having any choice is a religious conviction with some people, however for the rest of us an option to stay in the ship when docked would make things right.

Here's my post from the dev blog thread:

Originally by: CCP Zulu
When you dock your ship, your Captain's Quarters will replace the current hangar view

Just pointing out that this is a big mistake. You guys have been pretty insistent about the immersion-inducing nature of this EVE add-on, and this kind of space -> avatar transition is anything but immersive. There is absolutely no reason for the capsuleer to always leave the pod when docked when all the current tasks can be performed remotely from the pod.

It is especially sad to see this because all of the graphical assets required for the ship-spinning view are still in the CQ client, and the developer resources to keep this view in the game would be minimal. This feature does not even require any changes in the Incarna design.

So why not keep it? Making it optional will make a lot of your customers happy. Those who complain about performance, immersion, gameplay focus can opt out of auto-disembarking, while those that can't wait to walk can select to forgo the ship-spin view. A complete win for everyone.

And when you do actually add some content to Incarna, players will be compelled to exit their ships to experience it, even if that involves upgrading their computers.

^

Ghurthe
Posted - 2011.05.25 23:24:00 - [30]
 

In 2008's fanfest Torfi showed us a playable demo of Incarna, it had the normal station view and a button that had you leave your ship.

There's no reason we can't have that with CQ.


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