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Gladni Jura
Posted - 2011.05.16 17:28:00 - [121]
 

Edited by: Gladni Jura on 16/05/2011 17:33:47
Edited by: Gladni Jura on 16/05/2011 17:31:48
WTF, Onboard scanner 64AU, what is next, mag, ladar, grav snd radar site on onboard scanner. ughughugh

Eve is going to be NOOB game, like WOW.Evil or Very MadEvil or Very Mad

There goes my scanning skills in wind.

What are you doing CCP, this is not game for kids from 1-3Y old.Twisted Evil

Better do some serious work and fix bugs in game. Very HappyVery Happy

PS: EVE need to be more complex game, not the other way

Hyperforce99
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2011.05.16 17:33:00 - [122]
 

Edited by: Hyperforce99 on 16/05/2011 18:11:31

I still think it would be better to change the jump bridges to use a similar mechanic as wormholes use to limit what can pass through them instead of a flat limitations which can't be tweaked.

Lets have a look what the current proposed changes are trying to achieve:

  • Remove the ability to safely transport large fleets across vast distances.
  • Remove the ability for capital ships to easily cross distances without using their jump drives.
  • Making refueling jump bridges less of a hassle.
  • Not actually removing jump bridges from the game suggests that they should still be usable for small fleets.

However the current changes will bluntly remove a lot of the features jump bridges are used for and make them a hassle to use.
Especially the change that only allows 1 jump bridge per system is a very un-elegant solution.

------------------------------------- The elegant alternative --------------------------------------

Someone else suggested before that jump-bridges should have a "Mass Capacitor" instead of the current fuel bay.
The capacitor depletes as mass (ships) jump through the array. If the capacitor is depleted or if not enough mass is available for a certain ship type it renders the jump bridge unusable.
The capacitor would slowly recharge passively by itself, but recharge substantially faster if supplied with fuel.

  • The Mass Capacitor's maximum limit and the recharge speeds can easily be tweaked to adjust the types of ships and the amount of ships that can use them. Unlike the proposed flat limitations that are being integrated right now.


This alternative would achieve most if not all of the same goals the current proposed change to jump bridges is trying to achieve but in a much more efficient, elegant and easier to tweak manner.

This change would create a system where:

  • Large fleets or capitals would rapidly deplete the mass reserves in the jump bridge's capacitor rendering the jump bridge useless.
  • Using jump bridges for smaller fleets like Home Defense would still be viable.
  • Normal capital ships could this way still move into cyno jammed systems, just not in the massive quantities that todays system allows.
  • The changed fuel mechanic would remove a lot of the hassle revolving around jump bridge refueling, as lesser used routes would no longer require refueling. Often used routes however still benefit from being fueled making the mechanic much more user friendly.
  • Travel times and 0.0 Accessibility would not be effected.
  • This change would effect all alliances the same way! Unlike the current proposed change which will hit the smaller alliances hardest as developing the additional space needed for a jump bridge network is relativly much harder for them.
  • If an alliances space comes under attack by an invading fleet, the initial response would quickly deplete the defenders jump bridges. Once they are depleted, the defenders would be forced to use regular jump gates and jump drives until the jump bridge's capacitors are recharged.


This way it should still be possible to keep 2 jump bridges in one solar system while still forcing large fleets and capitals to take other routes. By making the mass capacitors of jump bridges deplete when they are off-lined, you prevent players from abusing this mechanic, as well as allow enemy fleets from further disabling jump bridge capabilities by knocking the POS into reinforced mode. (as once the POS comes out of reinforced mode the jump bridge would still have to recharge its capacitor.)


I suggest CCP takes another close look at their jump bridge change, as I personally don't like if it features are nerfed with flat limitations. I'd much rather see a scalable and elegant solution such as this.

SYNAPSYNA KINESYN
Posted - 2011.05.16 17:34:00 - [123]
 

Edited by: SYNAPSYNA KINESYN on 16/05/2011 17:37:10

"Ships with jumpdrives are now unable to use jump bridges with the exception of ships belonging to the Black Ops ship category."


@ccp dev:

I think CCP doing bad stuff with last updates and patch, after choising to make more worst 0.0 space for try to remove the rent of the big alli, hoping that will lead to less big capital ship ingame.

But CCP leave russian pay with money, plex and maybe buying money on china farmer, the large capital fleet and tengus of PL...

After that update i read"the 0.0 and empire are balanced? we will work on it", i m a little disapointed about the CCP last updates politics, before they kill 0.0 space and leave high sec player farm, and after ask if the high sec and 0.0 are balance.

Now the cap fleet cant use a JB, and after that put only a JB for each system, that i really dont understant why this thing but its ok, i understand it only another time for penalize large cap fleet of big allis.

=> conclusion, if u dont want big alli, cheers dev of CCP, DISBAND THEM YOURSELF INSTEAD UPDATING WITH NONSENSE NEW RULES...

A really disapointed player that hope EVE will not become a high sec carebear game. Evil or Very Mad

TwiKnight
Posted - 2011.05.16 17:43:00 - [124]
 

Edited by: TwiKnight on 16/05/2011 17:44:07
64 au ship scan is fning re tarded!!!!!
yea lets be able to scan as far as combats for anoms in 10 secs without launching probes. it shouldnt be anymore then 8 au's with your ship scanner.
boooo ccp way to skrew up stuff that isnt broke instead of fixing stuff that is.

Marvel Emerald
Gallente
Free Space Tech
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.05.16 17:58:00 - [125]
 

Edited by: Marvel Emerald on 16/05/2011 18:00:14
Edited by: Marvel Emerald on 16/05/2011 17:59:47
Edited by: Marvel Emerald on 16/05/2011 17:59:06
Edited by: Marvel Emerald on 16/05/2011 17:58:04
Here i created lvl4 combat agent list in 0.5 systems.

http://ourden.org/agents.html

Top hub now is Torrinos with 3 lvl4 agents

Lieutenant Brooker
Gallente
THE DARK KNIGHT'S WARRIOR'S
Something Posing As Meat
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:05:00 - [126]
 

Originally by: scheve
Ships with jumpdrives are now unable to use jump bridges with the exception of ships belonging to the Black Ops ship category.

oke oke.
why the hell do you remove the option to jump trough jump bridges?


and ehm when is ccp actually thinking to put some more systems in the game?
its getting full.
we want grow bigger also.
and still the remove of the learning skills its pretty crazy already and now with the connections skills. this will be no eve what eve was eay more it looks slowly to get a children friendly game.

i hoop you guys start to listen to the players more before just trowing in.



This, agree.

Cornwalace
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:07:00 - [127]
 

Dear CCP,

Why are you making Eve easier to play? I don't understand why you want people to easily figure out where they need to mission. We don't need new players! You guys already have enough money!

I'm Kidding.

Thank you for these changes, CCP.

Fly Safe.



PS: I'm one of those WoW players that grew out of it and found Eve. I'm sure I'm the type of player you (as in CCP) are trying to bring in.

ivar R'dhak
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:07:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: Marvel Emerald
Here i created lvl4 combat agent list in 0.5 systems.

http://ourden.org/agents.html

Top hub now is Torrinos with 3 lvl4 agents
Nicely shows what I fear.
The usual high sec mission hubs will simply be replaced by 0.5/0.6 sec hubs. Confused

ROCK MELTER
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:08:00 - [129]
 

ok another question then. What about the "DED Connections" skillbook?

Skill at dealing with Concord Department and negotiating bounties
Bonus fee of 1,500 isk per pirate head per level of the skill

I read in the thread that the "Criminal Connections" skillbook should not be affected, what about this skillbook AND when is this going to be in the loyalty point store?

SilverDollar
Caldari
Amphysvena
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:08:00 - [130]
 

Some good changes here: that dumb fleeting process is now fixed, new icons for BPs, some interface issues fixed as well. So far, so good.
Now, why CCP start messing with things that aren't broken?. I would love to see more patches fixing the small things, but please keep your hands off the big right stuff. If you're trying to appeal to a dumber type of player, just say so and we'll all leave "en masse", to make room for your new customers.

I just don't want to play along with ppl dumber than me, that's it. I want to draw a line here: no one dumber than me should be allowed to play EVE. That would be a little too much, even for me!


REiiGN15
Caldari
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:17:00 - [131]
 

All I basically got out of this was that CCP is really trying to emphasize PvP gameplay.

I have zero clue about the jumpbridge QQing going on.

The mission stuff is just so it won't be a hassle for players grinding it out at places where its heavy in ninja salvagers so they get more isk, hence, work on PvP. If I do missions, its not because I enjoy them, I'm working for that isk to fund PvP. I surf WHs though.

They should completely get rid of Social skills. I guess someone has their reasons for them.


Usagi Tsukino
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:24:00 - [132]
 

Edited by: Usagi Tsukino on 16/05/2011 18:26:07
Originally by: Better Than You
What the hell is this?! Another nerf to us? First the anomaly nerf, then the jump bridge nerf and now this?? WHY DON'T YOU JUST CUT OFF MY BALLS AND PUT THEM IN A JELLY JAR AND GIVE THEM TO MY ENEMIES!!!!!!!!! WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE!!!

You complete me.
Originally by: Gladni Jura
There goes my scanning skills in wind.

You realize you can only scan anoms, not sigs with the on board, right? If you were wasting your 'scanning skills' on those... Welp... vOv

Hiram Alexander
Caldari
Capital Enrichment Services
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:26:00 - [133]
 

I'm loving the Blueprint change, but can you confirm if a clearer distinction will be made for killmail purposes? My Battleclinic scores (such as they are) are totally douched, courtesy of one particular Badger kill..... :(

And what's the official word on T3 Subsystem switching in POS's? That's the only thing I was looking forward to.

As for the 64AU on-board scanner... I'm undecided. The stalker in me rejoices, but my wallet's getting pretty nervous... ;)


--HA

Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
Posted - 2011.05.16 18:31:00 - [134]
 

Very unhappy about the Caldari getting a SOE agent upgraded to all combat (in a lower sec system) while the one in Gallente space is nerfed to courier only. Upgrade the one in Gicodel to all combat, too. Gallente and Minmatar FW members can't access the new SOE combat agent in Caldari space. Boo hiss.

Detria
Omega Wing
Snatch Victory
Posted - 2011.05.16 19:03:00 - [135]
 

Edited by: Detria on 16/05/2011 19:07:39
I agree that the removal of the public access to other player's NPC relationships blows from my standpoint as a merc. However, does it really make since that I should have access to that information in the first place? Personally I don't think so.

I'm a bit meh on this change. Yes, it will make my job a tad bit more difficult, but not so much and an extra locate or two won't fix.

From a server side I would be interested to know how much this change reduces the footprint of data that is requested / transmitted when a Show Info on a player is made. Which I surmise is the real reason behind this change. My guess is that someone noticed in profiler that getting rid of a few joins on that query had a nice effect.

Navira Rel'kan
Posted - 2011.05.16 19:23:00 - [136]
 

OK, really? i'm sorry, i havent played this game very long, but i HAVE played alot of MMO's and i can tell you RIHT NOW, dumbing this down is BAD. alot of MMO's have tried in order to make it easier to accesss fro the vast majority of, lets face it, less than intelligent players. all this leads to is a crapload of WoW players camping around spamming how 1337 they think they are and making any attempts at strategy utterly useless to the "leeroy approach" (note taht its not that bad yet, but your heading down a dangerous road CCP that many others have traveled, and they all end the same). now its only my 2 cents, but really, i have yet to see a game that lasted more then 3 years before it goes to crap. i started palying eve because of both its necessary and needless complexity, EVE's learning curve is one fo it's defining features, one you rarely find in MMO's.
Please rethink at least some fo these updates in the future, because i really dont want to see EVE die.

Shen Rajinto
InterSun Freelance
Posted - 2011.05.16 19:45:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: "CCP"
Information on a pilot's standings towards NPC corporations is no longer visible from 'Show Info'. You now see the standings information between you and the other pilot and the factions you each belong to.


Will Directors/CEOs be able to look at individuals in their corp NPC standings to see who needs to grind missions so that can launch a highsec POS? Or will we be required to ask for their API to get this info?

Reten Kip
Everset Dropbears
Posted - 2011.05.16 20:07:00 - [138]
 

Edited by: Reten Kip on 16/05/2011 20:06:50
The agent changes as a theory are fine, but damnit CCP, will you fine tune it rather than just swing the nerf sledge and see what happens?

Gallente (and Minmitar) are taking it in the shorts with their SoE agent getting shot in the face, while Caldari is getting boosted with their SoE agent becoming combat. How can you possibly justify Caldari needing a PvE boost? What could possibly make you think that Gallente need another nerf?

Abramul
Gallente
StarFleet Enterprises
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2011.05.16 20:20:00 - [139]
 

Originally by: Shen Rajinto
Originally by: "CCP"
Information on a pilot's standings towards NPC corporations is no longer visible from 'Show Info'. You now see the standings information between you and the other pilot and the factions you each belong to.


Will Directors/CEOs be able to look at individuals in their corp NPC standings to see who needs to grind missions so that can launch a highsec POS? Or will we be required to ask for their API to get this info?


I would expect they're leaving the "Show Compositions" option in.

Mashie Saldana
Minmatar
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.05.16 20:36:00 - [140]
 

Originally by: Marvel Emerald

Here i created lvl4 combat agent list in 0.5 systems.

http://ourden.org/agents.html

Top hub now is Torrinos with 3 lvl4 agents

Lol, never mind the 0.0 system next door to it, I'm sure it will be a very popular mission hub. Laughing

Internet Knight
The Kobayashi Maru
Posted - 2011.05.16 20:40:00 - [141]
 

Quote:


  • Unique icons have been created for Blueprint originals and Blueprint copies so you can visibly differentiate between them.
  • Agent Quality has been removed meaning that all Agents are now +20 in terms of payout and -20 in terms of access. Go forth, Capsuleers, and explore the world outside of Motsu and Dodixie.
  • Agent Divisions have been simplified from 20 down to just 3. The new Security, Distribution and Mining divisions now provide uniform types of missions instead of a mission type that was percentage based.
  • Accompanying the changes to Agent Divisions, seven ‘Connection’ skills will be removed. The skill books of the old connection skills will be replaced with their new equivalents which are listed below. Players who have the old skills already trained will have those skills removed and receive replacement skillbooks in the hangar of their home station and have the skillpoints reimbursed.
  • When attempting to start a Manufacturing job without all the required materials, the quote window now retains focus. A refresh button has been added so that you can add the correct amount of materials and proceed without having to restart the process.
  • The scroll position in the fleet window now retains or returns to its previous position when fleet members join, leave or move.
  • When holding down ‘alt’, your probes will scale around the center, making it easier to adjust them. A green line has added to make it more intuitive.



I love you CCP. Some of those are About F*cking Time. Seriously.

On the other hand...
Quote:
Information on a pilot's standings towards NPC corporations is no longer visible from 'Show Info'. You now see the standings information between you and the other pilot and the factions you each belong to.
This is disappointing.

Hydraka
Posted - 2011.05.16 20:46:00 - [142]
 

Originally by: Internet Knight
This is disappointing.


nuff said.

Harparian
Posted - 2011.05.16 20:54:00 - [143]
 

Thank you CCP. Eve just keeps getting better!

Backup 3
Posted - 2011.05.16 21:04:00 - [144]
 

Well guys, you still keep on creating new things, forgeting about old issues...

I mean really, really annoying Nightmare graphic issue.... When I have 4 guns fitted on it, I can see only 3 of them (on the hull and while shooting) It drives me crazy :(

Franga
NQX Innovations
Posted - 2011.05.16 21:06:00 - [145]
 

Blueprint changes well overdue. Some good stuff in there.

Vonteleon
Posted - 2011.05.16 21:18:00 - [146]
 

For high-sec industralists and missioners, (PVE) I can't think of another change more fundamental to come along in quite some time than the upcoming agent changes.

I agree with previous posters that it is a "nerf" to some degree. Most (if not all) things in EVE are risk vs reward scenarios. Higher risk equates to higher rewards. In PVE, the highest quality agents are now usually in highly-populated systems with lots of pvp, flipping, and ninja salvaging. Players flock to them like bees. Currently, if you want to work for the highest quality agents, you really have to work for it.

With the changes all agents will now be equal quality. So what will decide the "best" agent now? Distance from hq? Closest is best? What then becomes a "good" system? From a logistical standpoint, its nice that you'll be able to keep your newer corpmates nearer hq and not have to travel 20 jumps for quality agents. Still, its odd for things to be made easier in a game known for its complexity and length.

At minimum I'm intrigued. These changes should fundamentally change high-sec in a way that hasn't occured in a while. The regional markets have to be affected by this. Players will disperse more readily throughout the universe now that there's no reason to congregate in systems with the "best" agents. How the markets change and how players adapt to such a fluid and dynamic situation should at minimum make for some fascinating CCC discourse.

It should be interesting to see how things pan out.

-Von

Usagi Tsukino
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2011.05.16 21:23:00 - [147]
 

Edited by: Usagi Tsukino on 16/05/2011 21:25:10
Originally by: Detria
Edited by: Detria on 16/05/2011 19:07:39
From a server side I would be interested to know how much this change reduces the footprint of data that is requested / transmitted when a Show Info on a player is made. Which I surmise is the real reason behind this change. My guess is that someone noticed in profiler that getting rid of a few joins on that query had a nice effect.

Seven years ago when I first started I carebeared. Then I did it more for another corp, then another, then another... Then switched from Caldari to Amarr and had to start a bit lower.

Loading my 'standings' screen annoys me. Very Happy I can't imagine what it's like for some of these yahoos who run for every corp in the god-forsaken cluster. I'd have to assume that all those DB pulls are probably not THAT big of a deal, but unnecessary in the grand scheme of things (though like you, I will miss being able to easily see where people are likely mission lady-of-the-eveninging).

Originally by: Backup 3
I mean really, really annoying Nightmare graphic issue.... When I have 4 guns fitted on it, I can see only 3 of them (on the hull and while shooting) It drives me crazy :(


Irrelevant graphics glitches are certainly more important than game play issues! Cool

WHERE IS NEW CYNO EFFECT DAMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Esiel
Renegade Serenity
Posted - 2011.05.16 21:51:00 - [148]
 

Originally by: Deedee Hakata
Originally by: Patch notes
Agents & Missions
  • Agent Quality has been removed meaning that all Agents are now +20 in terms of payout and -20 in terms of access. Go forth, Capsuleers, and explore the world outside of Motsu and Dodixie.

  • Agent Divisions have been simplified from 20 down to just 3. The new Security, Distribution and Mining divisions now provide uniform types of missions instead of a mission type that was percentage based.


This means the market hubs will also disappear, meaning more work for the market players among us. Aw shucks. Sad

First some hubs will probably disapear (dodixie or others that where convient for mission hubs) but I am fairly certain 4 of them will remain no matter what. (Jita, Rens, Amarr, Oursulaert) However what this will hurt is people that buy minerals. I know which systems to put buy orders in; mission runners will fill them as they recycle all that junk they pick up. With the loss of these hubs I won't have a place to go get it. So it means prices for minerals will fluctuate alot when this happens.

Also I guess this means the end of level 1 agents for the most part. a -20 level 2 agent isn't hard to get to with rewards from a level 1 agent quality +20. The rest of the grind to get up to a level 4 or 5 agent will be fairly consistant.

Geralden
Posted - 2011.05.16 21:56:00 - [149]
 

So... CCP change the anom's in 0.0 because space shouldn't be uniform.

Now, all agents are uniform, excactly the same.

1 step forward, 2 steps back ?

Tara Nighthawk
Gallente
Posted - 2011.05.16 22:00:00 - [150]
 

How big is the Patch please?

The last one took AGES to download on a slow connection Crying or Very sad


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