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Hamish Grayson
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Posted - 2011.04.17 00:16:00 - [1]
 

In honor of the upcoming novel 'Templar One' by TonyG, I thought I'd provide some fun facts from the Empyrean Age. Hopeful Templar One will live up to the same level of awesomeness brought to us in his last work of pure awesomeness.

Did you know...

...Federation society is close to Utopia. (Page 174, of The Empyrean Age.)

...the Minmatar republic is incompetent and corrupt. (Page 165, of The Empyrean Age.)

...that the Federation Navy holds training sessions with the Republic because they need to be taught to be self-sufficient. However, even pilots as elite as the Federation Navy are unable to help the crumbling moral of the Republic military. (page 96, of The Empyrean Age)

...in Minmatar tribal culture, ancient gods are worshiped at scared night clubs known as Raafa-kon. (Page 184, of The Empyrean Age)

...zero-G sex is sacred to the Minmatar. (Page 185, of The Empyrean Age)

...it is a fact that not one Gallentean citizen is unemployed. (Page 176, of The Empyrean Age)

...that the Caldari-Gallente war started simply because the Caldari were loath to create opportunities for any race other than themselves? (page 40, of The Empyrean Age)

...that the Caldari killed half a million people at at Nouvelle Rouvenor because the Gallentean's free-spirted nature and eagerness for trade grated on their nerves? (page 40, of The Empyrean Age)

...that in the Caldari State there is a huge gap between the rich and the poor because they refuse to trade with the other empires? (page 40, of The Empyrean Age)

...that Ishukone is the second largest corporation in the Caldari State but only has 300 Million employees? (page 131, of The Empyrean Age)

...that Ishukone was so poorly managed that even after the Jovian gift of the Hydrostatic-capsule saved the corporation once, it still nearly failed a second time but was saved by the acquisition of the Raven blue print by Orto Gariushi. Later, Gariushi brought the company to the brink of collapse a third time by embezzling investment funds to pay employee wages. (page 132, of The Empyrean Age)

...The traditional image of a Caldari CEO is manicured and overweight. (page 139, of The Empyrean Age)

...during Heth's rebellion, starving children were beaten to within an inch of their lives by the Caldari elite (page 140, of The Empyrean Age)

...the overnight Caldari rebellion, while inspired by the heroism of Heth, took place without any guidance, organization or coordination among the rebels. (page 140, of The Empyrean Age)

...that while it is the second largest Caldari megacorp, the 300 million employees of Ishukone only make up 00.03% of the total population of the caldari State. (page 131 and 152, of The Empyrean Age)

...the best and brightest of the Minimatar republic migrate to the Gallente Federation. (page 164, of The Empyrean Age)

...the Gallente Federation's Economy is so robust the building of Paradise worlds is a common and easy task for the Federation. (Page 165, of The Empyrean Age.)

...every Gallentean citizen is provided free education and medical care. (Page 176, of The Empyrean Age)

...the Federation Government would have secretly saved the failing Caldari economy, out of charity, if the Caldari hadn't invaded Caldari prime. (Page 178, of The Empyrean Age.)

...all Caldari cities are utterly indistinguishable from each other. (Page 238, of The Empyrean Age)

...the supposed Gallenteans committing hate crimes against ethnic Caldari during May of YC110 were actually disguised Caldari. The Gallenteans were completely innocent. (Page 240, of The Empyrean Age)

Shaalira D'arc
Posted - 2011.04.17 00:57:00 - [2]
 

I haven't read the novel so I do want to clarify by asking:

Are these facts given by a narrative author, meant to be taken as reliable world-building? Or are they things stated by characters or character-based narration, who might be biased and unreliable?

Hamish Grayson
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Posted - 2011.04.17 01:12:00 - [3]
 

Narrative author, meant to be taken as reliable world-building.

Shaalira D'arc
Posted - 2011.04.17 01:15:00 - [4]
 

Thanks for the answer. Taking the facts at face-value, that does seem like rather heavy-handed and one-sided treatment of the nations involved.

Silver Night
Caldari
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2011.04.17 01:37:00 - [5]
 

It could be worse. You could be Amarr. Rolling Eyes

Teranul
Posted - 2011.04.17 03:18:00 - [6]
 

Hmmm. That is kinda heavy-handed... I am now curious. Perhaps I'll give it a read myself when I've got the time.

In the meantime...

Quote:
...that while it is the second largest Caldari megacorp, the 300 million employees of Ishukone only make up 00.03% of the total population of the caldari State. (page 131 and 152, of The Empyrean Age)

This gives me a Caldari State total population of roughly 1 trillion.

A bit smaller than I'd imagined... hmmm.

Logan LaMort
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.17 12:20:00 - [7]
 

Can't say I agree with the Empyrean Age on a lot of things.

But one of the things I really hated was that Tony had to mention that when you die in a Pod, you're really dead, and a clone is just a copy of your former self.

Okay I know that makes a lot of sense, but it's one of those things that has always been left as vague in EVE fiction, that you're either a copy of a dead man or that your conciousness is really transferred into a new empty body.

For example,

Informorph Psychology: The reality of having one's consciousness detached from one's physical form, scattered across the galaxy and then placed in a vat-grown clone can be very unsettling to the untrained mind.

And also this line from the chronicle One too many
Quote:
A man in his position had easy access to the newest technology and, as the servant helped him put on a robe, he yet again marveled at this new mind-transfer technology.


Totally ambiguous and you're able to draw your own personal conclusions on what exactly happens when you move from one body to the next.
It's like the transporters in Star Trek, technically they completely disintegrate your body, and replicate a copy of yourself in a new location, but no one questions if the people are clones or their original selves, the viewer makes their own assumptions.

TL:DR

CCP, leave what happens when you go from one body/clone to the next body/clone ambiguous, let people draw their own conclusions because opinion is widely split and no one really knows for sure. Not everything needs a full explanation.

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2011.04.17 12:55:00 - [8]
 

Thanks TonyG

Gallente 4twCool

Ghost Hunter
True Slave Foundations
Shaktipat Revelators
Posted - 2011.04.17 16:34:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Teranul
Hmmm. That is kinda heavy-handed... I am now curious. Perhaps I'll give it a read myself when I've got the time.

In the meantime...

Quote:
...that while it is the second largest Caldari megacorp, the 300 million employees of Ishukone only make up 00.03% of the total population of the caldari State. (page 131 and 152, of The Empyrean Age)

This gives me a Caldari State total population of roughly 1 trillion.

A bit smaller than I'd imagined... hmmm.


The Gallente Federation had, I believe at the time of the only in-game presidential elections, a population of 3 trillion.

Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
Posted - 2011.04.17 17:06:00 - [10]
 

Wasn't there a page about how the Concord station is split into sections for each Empire? The Jove section has been empty for years with Concord having no contact with the Jove for a long-time and keeping it secrete that the Jove have vanished/left.

Tykari
Gallente
Effective Deconstruction Initiative
Neon Equinox
Posted - 2011.04.17 22:57:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Pottsey
Wasn't there a page about how the Concord station is split into sections for each Empire? The Jove section has been empty for years with Concord having no contact with the Jove for a long-time and keeping it secrete that the Jove have vanished/left.


There is. And it's hardly a secret.

Quote:
The last arm extending apart from all the others, belonged to the Jove Empire, which had not sent a representative to an Assembly session in decades.


The other empires are fully aware that the Jove haven't been around for a long while.

Nathan Jameson
Talocan Vanguard
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.04.18 11:39:00 - [12]
 

Man we sound like ****s.

Allant Doran
Amarr
Locus Industries
Posted - 2011.04.18 11:43:00 - [13]
 

I remember reading Empyrean Age and noticing all of those Caldari/Gallente-related ones at the time.

The book basically says that Caldari are entirely in the wrong and are the cause of all the modern tensions between the two empires. The fact that the Caldari have been genuinly mislead or confused doesn't change the fact that Gallente IS innocent in the matters, right?

Ahh well, I do try and keep in-game and out-of-game fiction a little seperate in my mind but it is heavily one-sided it seems.

Seriphyn Inhonores
Gallente
Eleutherian Guard
Posted - 2011.04.18 12:23:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: Seriphyn Inhonores on 18/04/2011 12:26:25
Some of it is biased and arbitrary, yes, but stuff like the Gallenteans having free education and healthcare is barely farfetched.

Originally by: Teranul
Hmmm. That is kinda heavy-handed... I am now curious. Perhaps I'll give it a read myself when I've got the time.

In the meantime...

Quote:
...that while it is the second largest Caldari megacorp, the 300 million employees of Ishukone only make up 00.03% of the total population of the caldari State. (page 131 and 152, of The Empyrean Age)

This gives me a Caldari State total population of roughly 1 trillion.

A bit smaller than I'd imagined... hmmm.


I always put it at the hundreds of billions.

FeralShadow
NME1
Posted - 2011.04.18 18:36:00 - [15]
 

Yes well Heth is a Tempalis Draganaur, a well known and feared anti-gallente radical terrorist group. Just... nobody except Otro and his sister knew it, or I'm pretty sure he wouldn't come to power. Because of that, he played off of the Caldari citizen's hatred of the Gallente to overlook the olive branch extended, and with the help of the Broker (capsuleer), used the tensions to his own advantage to push his own agenda, which was to take back Caldari Prime from the Gallente. Heth never wanted peace, and it was easy enough to push the people in favor of war when the Broker flew the Nyx into the station, killing Otro and ending the peaceful delegation from the Gallente Fed as well as Otro who was accepting the olive branch.

The Caldari people aren't bad, they've been mislead by an extremist (Heth), and don't know it (at this point they may not even care.).

-Feral

Virtue Maulerant
Posted - 2011.04.24 08:16:00 - [16]
 

A lot of Gallente propaganda

Dilaro thagriin
Posted - 2011.04.25 16:26:00 - [17]
 

Hmm.. i can see where you are going with the Raafa-Kan thingy... but you have taken it too far, it merely states that they follow the rules of the Raafa-Kan, a simple rule that in certain sites you have to leave all weapons, grudges, anger and violent intent outside before entering.

Commonly used in matari history at places where tribes and clans would gather, it was a rule created to make these places 'sanctuary' from any conflict.

The rule is used at nightclubs simply to ensure that everyone has a good time, since they are places of gathering and primal celebration of life.

Kyoko Sakoda
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.04.25 16:40:00 - [18]
 

ITT: much emo about a novel written 4+ years ago.

Tsual
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.04.30 10:43:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Tsual on 30/04/2011 10:44:09
Well time to read this book and see what the thread is all about.

Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
Posted - 2011.04.30 16:38:00 - [20]
 

Trolling comment removed. Spitfire

Mirabi Tiane
Posted - 2011.04.30 18:17:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Bumblefck


Don't feed the troll. ^

I'm torn between wanting to read the pages these statements came from, and not wanting to buy Empyrean Age. Confused If the money only supported EVE and didn't contribute to any statistics about the popularity of that particular novel, I wouldn't mind buying it. I don't know what extent each of those stipulations are satisfied to...

Julianus Soter
Gallente
Moira.
Posted - 2011.05.03 09:43:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
ITT: much emo about a novel written 4+ years ago.


QFT

Hamish Grayson, do you really have so little going on with your life that you felt this was necessary? Surely there are better ways to contribute to fiction discussion than stirring up arguments.

Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
Posted - 2011.05.03 15:53:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Mirabi Tiane
Originally by: Bumblefck


Don't feed the troll. ^

I'm torn between wanting to read the pages these statements came from, and not wanting to buy Empyrean Age. Confused If the money only supported EVE and didn't contribute to any statistics about the popularity of that particular novel, I wouldn't mind buying it. I don't know what extent each of those stipulations are satisfied to...


Well I'm sorry, but I still stand by my assertions. Fan fiction is generally a really sad enterprise, producing little more than warmed-up derivatives of the game.

Trader20
Posted - 2011.05.04 01:10:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Trader20 on 04/05/2011 01:13:17

Hey man thanks for the info.

You Quoted: ...Federation society is close to Utopia. (Page 174, of The Empyrean Age.)

So Gal Federation is aiming for a communism? Lol I guess they didn't learn from "Earth's History" that communism is super fail and Capitalism (Caldari) pwns Communism.

Edit: Is there a books on tape version or video because I hate reading long books. Must be my ADHD Laughing

Hamish Grayson
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Posted - 2011.05.04 21:50:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Julianus Soter
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
ITT: much emo about a novel written 4+ years ago.


QFT

Hamish Grayson, do you really have so little going on with your life that you felt this was necessary? Surely there are better ways to contribute to fiction discussion than stirring up arguments.


Please don't spoil our celebration of the new eve novel with your bitterness.

Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2011.05.04 23:55:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Trader20
Edited by: Trader20 on 04/05/2011 01:13:17

Hey man thanks for the info.

You Quoted: ...Federation society is close to Utopia. (Page 174, of The Empyrean Age.)

So Gal Federation is aiming for a communism? Lol I guess they didn't learn from "Earth's History" that communism is super fail and Capitalism (Caldari) pwns Communism.

Edit: Is there a books on tape version or video because I hate reading long books. Must be my ADHD Laughing


Why do so many people think the Gallente are communist? Pretty much every description of them is quite contrary. Similarly, the idea that Caldari are fundemental free marketers. Corporatism does not equal liberal trade policies. It can coincide, but it doesn't need to. And from what we see of Caldari society in the fiction, it is hardly a free market oriented society. Probably merchantilist abroad, corporatist-statist at home.

Nikki Sanderson
Posted - 2011.05.06 12:03:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Logan LaMort
But one of the things I really hated was that Tony had to mention that when you die in a Pod, you're really dead, and a clone is just a copy of your former self.

Okay I know that makes a lot of sense, but it's one of those things that has always been left as vague in EVE fiction, that you're either a copy of a dead man or that your conciousness is really transferred into a new empty body.

Yet the Broker seems to treat it exactly like that, a tool to transfer your conciousness.

To me there never was any real ambiguity about this, the very description of the pod technology on EVElopedia says "Therefore, the instant the egg begins to crack, two things happen: the wire-cap on the pilotís head injects an instantly lethal nanotoxin into his bloodstream and the scanner sends its piercing light into his skull. Scarce seconds later, he begins the muddy climb towards consciousness in a new body, light years away."

Capsuleers seem to not remember the process of dying, but they still are killed and their brains fried before the transfer to another clone. I always really liked how there was no screwing around with this, it's "you just died but BAM new life because of magic tech" and it's honest about it.

Tsual
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.06 18:00:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: Tsual on 06/05/2011 18:01:07
Can't agree with everything the op posts, and some things sound different to me or I interpretate them differently.

Originally by: Trader20
Edited by: Trader20 on 04/05/2011 01:13:17

Hey man thanks for the info.

You Quoted: ...Federation society is close to Utopia. (Page 174, of The Empyrean Age.)

So Gal Federation is aiming for a communism? Lol I guess they didn't learn from "Earth's History" that communism is super fail and Capitalism (Caldari) pwns Communism.

Edit: Is there a books on tape version or video because I hate reading long books. Must be my ADHD Laughing


Not sure if utopia means communism ... utopia means no one needs to suffer, not that there is work for everyone.

Utopia has been deconstructed, even in the matrix triology they used the old deconstruction of "people were so happy it was unreal and thus they decided to commit suicide because their bliss buffers overflowed, in such a situation dieing out was the only reasonable choice of action".

Kate Yeats
Caldari
Drone Reprogramming Center
Posted - 2011.05.12 20:29:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Hamish Grayson
In honor of the upcoming novel 'Templar One' by TonyG, I thought I'd provide some fun facts from the Empyrean Age. Hopeful Templar One will live up to the same level of awesomeness brought to us in his last work of pure awesomeness.


Could be worse. Read Burning Life?

But yes, hopefully Templar one will feature more robust characters who aren't pigeon-holed into outrageously strict stereotypes from which they must never deviate and less 'hahah New Eden is pretty much run by one man and the empire leaders and all capsuleers are utterly unable to do anything but bend over and take it' would be nice too. Can we also perhaps agree to be mature enough get accept that people with strong religious beliefs aren't limited to just megalomaniacs and sexual perverts?


Originally by: Emperor Cheney
Similarly, the idea that Caldari are fundemental free marketers. Corporatism does not equal liberal trade policies.


Because, honestly, the fiction conflicts between those views. Empyrean age paints a xenophobic, nationalistic state, whereas the background around the Khanid Kingdom has the State frothing at the mouth to get any kind of access to Amarrian goods (who in this case are the xenophobic closed border guys) and willing to pour support into there in return for trade goods access.

The Antiquarian
Amarr
Posted - 2011.05.14 00:32:00 - [30]
 

I must say the Empyrean Age was an amazing piece of work. Didn't enjoy the Burning Life so much. The latter felt like an encyclopedia of everything about EVE. Looking forward to the new novel by TonyG.


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