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Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2011.04.06 21:12:00 - [91]
 

Google is releasing an app for Android phones that lets users stream their music collection. As 3G costs get cheaper this concept will really take off. What would be nice is 3G smartphones that can stream internet radio stations. I listen to AH.FM and it would be good if I could listen to that when I am out and about.

Ademaro Imre
Caldari
Posted - 2011.04.06 23:41:00 - [92]
 

Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 07/04/2011 00:00:21
Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 06/04/2011 23:43:38
Originally by: Alpheias
People buy Apple products invent all kinds of moronic reasoning like "the UI is better", "it just works", "for the build quality" or for the completely absurd reason "I am a artist that need it for my art".


My brother is a professional graphics artist, and chances are, you have seen his handywork in a number of different Fortune 500 and multi-national corporation websites. ( I know because he put me into his firm's test marketing focus groups)

He is using Apple, because, Apple got into universitys with a better UI system long before PC's were even ready to. He went to school, with his professors using apple, his instructers and classes using apple, And Apple is what he knows. That also translates into the work environment, and professionals have along been initially trained on Apple products in the graphics industry. That said, for years, Adobe preferred Mac's for Photoshop for quite some time. Mac's either were inherently better for Photoshop, or Adobe just took the time to make PS run well on Mac's. Only in the last 5-6 years or so has there been an equality between PS on a Mac or PC. Its like Xbox vs. Playstation. Xbox wins because developers optimize for the cpu structure and need an extra budget to do it on the Playstation.

Even still, where my brother works, everyone has a Mac. So he bought one, bought one for home, so there would never be any issues of transferring files, even though that shouldn't be a problem. And it will stay this way across the industry until some large firm decides to save money and buy pc's, maybe some already have.

I think his opinion changed on Apple, and suddenly to, because - he likes to play the Xbox while his wife surfs the internet. It became utterly impossible to use the router, from Apple, to wireless connect his computers, and to run a line from the router to his Xbox. He returned two of them, finally threw the third one into a wall, and bought the crappiest Belkin wireless router and it works flawlessly. And, over the holidays, he wanted to borrow my computer to make some design changes for some freelancing he does, and his work process was 1.5-2 faster on my 2 old computer than his brand new latest Mac at his work ,mostly because cpu speed is just far cheaper on a PC, my budget PC ranks with the best of the Mac's)

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.04.07 00:35:00 - [93]
 

Marketing... HCI and UI design is now huge in software dev. Microsoft now designs UI with the programming simultaneously. Furthermore people don't know much about PC hardware and see a number thats larger than another, but fail to realize what it's actually doing. Basically apple sold a Carolla that looks like a Porsche, and the OS is reliable.

Jackie Flackette
Posted - 2011.04.07 01:11:00 - [94]
 

One word:

Pretentious


Astenion
Gallente
Spiritus Draconis
Posted - 2011.04.07 02:13:00 - [95]
 

Don't forget the hipsters! But don't worry; now that Apple has become mainstream for nearly everyone in the last few years, they'll probably start using an abacus because it will be "underground".

TraderJade
Caldari
Secure Production Research and Trading
Posted - 2011.04.07 09:07:00 - [96]
 

Originally by: NightmareX
Because we Android users are trying to explain to you iOS users that iOS is years behind in development in comparstion to other mobile OS'es today. Those who already have bought an Android phone and those who are happy with Android will 99.9% for sure never go to any iOS devices if iOS doesn't have ANYTHING intresting in iOS over Android. That's the problem for Apple atm. So if Apple really want to get bigger, they better develop iOS so it actually can compare with Android.

Has it ever occurred to you that quite frankly... I don't care if the OS is years behind, or years ahead. I buy the phone because I like it, it does what I want and while android users will never understand since they'd never so much as look at an iDevice but I also like the way certain things are implemented.
Why does anyone buy a brand new BMW when a basic ford will still get you from A to B?
Originally by: NightmareX
And you guys are saying, yeah, the reason Android is selling so much is because the different companies are making Android phones. But let me ask, why do you think those companies are making Android phones?
Let me explain, yes it's simply because a big majority of the world are asking to get good mobile phones like Android phones. Those companies wouldn't make Android phones like crazy if there haven't been any demand for it.

Obviously nothing to do with iOS being restricted to iDevices, or that windows mobile requires a licence when android is 'free'
Originally by: NightmareX

Even the old Windows Mobile 6.5 can do tons more than any iPhone's can do. Ofc now iOS is much faster / smoother and the multitouch technology used in the screen on the iOS devices are great in comparstion to what you can get on a Symbian and Windows Mobile phone. And ofc, you have access to ALOT more apps on iOS than you have over Symbian and Windows Mobile. So that's basicly all.
Except for that, then iOS just get stomped over in functionality and options that others mobile phones that use Android for example can do.

Yes and windows mobile was oh soooo friendly to use... and that stylus made it so touch friendly.
Originally by: NightmareX
My Sony Ericsson XPERIA X10 can do hell of a lot more than an iPhone 4 can do. I can customize my home launcher in every possible ways and get it exactly like i want the home launcher to be. I can customize the UI and use different themes and change on the icon themes. I can also change the way the whole OS basicly can look. And i'm free to use whatever i would like to use on my Android phone.

That makes an Android phone better over iOS or Symbian. I haven't tried Windows Phone 7 yet, so i can't speak for that yet.

Why is it whenever people try to justify android the first thing is... OMG, i can customise the home screens with themes!
I couldn't care less if my phone has themes or not. I like the clean look, but then the only thing I dislike about the iPhone is appointments don't show on the lock screen but I’m certainly not going to buy some phone I'm not interested in for that.
Like I said, if your happy with android then good for you... but this whole obsession about iOS and iDevices is going to give you an early heart attack ;)

Anyway, I'm bored of it all so I'm not going to bother replying any more!

Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.07 14:13:00 - [97]
 

Originally by: TraderJade
Originally by: NightmareX
Because we Android users are trying to explain to you iOS users that iOS is years behind in development in comparstion to other mobile OS'es today. Those who already have bought an Android phone and those who are happy with Android will 99.9% for sure never go to any iOS devices if iOS doesn't have ANYTHING intresting in iOS over Android. That's the problem for Apple atm. So if Apple really want to get bigger, they better develop iOS so it actually can compare with Android.

Has it ever occurred to you that quite frankly... I don't care if the OS is years behind, or years ahead. I buy the phone because I like it, it does what I want and while android users will never understand since they'd never so much as look at an iDevice but I also like the way certain things are implemented.
Why does anyone buy a brand new BMW when a basic ford will still get you from A to B?



Mareting made them think it is actually better. Its funny what you can do when you know how to mess with the minds of people. You can even make people think they are happy.

Toshiro GreyHawk
Posted - 2011.04.10 08:54:00 - [98]
 

Eh ...

Before I retired from my job as a Sys Admin ... I had to work with and support all kinds of stuff. Main Frames ... Mini Computers , Micro's ... radios ... routers ... and lots of stuff over 20 years that I'm sure I've forgotten about. To me, they've all just been bits of technology.

I've done most of my work with DOS/Windows compatible systems because ... that was what most of the people at work used and it was my job to help them do it.

I thought several times about buying an Apple System. Each time it came down to price/performance. I could always get more bang for my buck buying a DOS/Windows system and just couldn't justify the extra price points for the Apple.

Now ... this was back when there were IBM's that cost as much as an Apple - but then you didn't have to buy an IBM to run the same software it would - thanks to Microsoft.

Microsoft - more than any other company - has created the environment we have today.

I can remember when just about everything was proprietary. 8" Single Sided, Single Density - was the ONLY common disk format in the CP/M world ... I actually had a program (which ironically ran on a Tandy Compatible OS named LDOS) which would translate one 5.25" disk format to another (including MSDOS) ... This is to say that - the different manufacturers computers couldn't even read each others disks.

Apple is the last surviving company from those bad old days of incompatibility and proprietary applications.

Now ... I still can't say that I would never buy an Apple product ... if I had a reason to - I would - just as with any other bit of technology. But it hasn't happened yet - and the reason was - they cost more than they were worth to me. If someone else wanted to pay that extra amount of money for their system - fine - it's their money they can use whatever they want. I don't care. Just don't tell me that Apples products don't break ... cause I've had to deal with that too ...

And their software hasn't always been "better" either. At one point in time ... you had to hold down the mouse button as you scrolled down through a drop down menu - or the menu would disappear ... Now that was ****ing stupid.

Mostly - what Apple has benefited from - is that they built the hardware - and they built the OS. With the same people building the basic software and hardware for the system - they would have a damn poor excuse for any problems it did have. With Microsoft - they build the OS - but thousands of other vendors build the hardware. So ... yes ... you're going to have more compatibility problems if you have thousands of more vendors ... but then there are advantages to having thousands of more vendors to choose from.

The publishing world has gradually had more and more choice in the systems they could use. Photoshop has run for years on Windows systems for one thing. But - I'd not be surprised to find that there are companies that are still wholly Mac. If it's been working for them for years and they don't want to go through a transition ... why should they?



Now ... another issue is snobbery. There aren't so much Mac Haters as Snob Haters. Any hate directed Apples way - it (and it's users) have brought on themselves. There are just some people who really enjoy feeling superior to other people - so they'll buy a Beamer - not because it's a better machine (which mostly they are) - but because they want to look down on all those people who bought Chevy's and Fords because ... a Beamer isn't that much better a machine for hauling children to day care or getting up before dawn and coming home from work after dark ...

Of course there're various forms of snobbery. There's the "I'm not a nerd so I bought the computer for the rest of us ... " and then there's the "I am the Ultimate Nerd. I use UNIX because I can reprogram the Operating System - myself!" ... which is why ... there is no such thing as "UNIX" ...

Thus giving us the ultimate Snobs OS - Mac OSX ...

.

Tirixie
Caldari
Posted - 2011.04.10 09:42:00 - [99]
 

Originally by: Mens Desire
Why is it people buy Apple products?

They are overpriced in comparison to other things that have better specs and these other things dont all look EXACTLY THE SAME.




Why do you care?

simocast
Minmatar
Razorback Industrial
Posted - 2011.04.10 11:40:00 - [100]
 

Used to be the only good smartphone around at the time, but as of lately its just ****.

Android as soon as plan weens off fo sho

AlleyKat
Gallente
The Unwanted.
Posted - 2011.04.10 12:24:00 - [101]
 

Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk

Now ... another issue is snobbery. There aren't so much Mac Haters as Snob Haters. Any hate directed Apples way - it (and it's users) have brought on themselves. There are just some people who really enjoy feeling superior to other people - so they'll buy a Beamer - not because it's a better machine (which mostly they are) - but because they want to look down on all those people who bought Chevy's and Fords because ... a Beamer isn't that much better a machine for hauling children to day care or getting up before dawn and coming home from work after dark ...

Of course there are various forms of snobbery. There's the "I'm not a nerd so I bought the computer for the rest of us ... " and then there's the "I am the Ultimate Nerd. I use UNIX because I can reprogram the Operating System - myself!" ... which is why ... there is no such thing as "UNIX" ...

Thus giving us the ultimate Snobs OS - Mac


And then there is reverse snobbery - hating people for choosing something which opposes your choice, and just because the cost (not the value) is higher, you look down on them and call them names, but the truth you have admitted to is that you would buy these things if you had the money to do so.

Very similar to blue collar workers putting down millionaires, but they still want expensive televisions, satellite/cable, broadband, two cars, two holidays, gold earings and a microwave oven.

That is the mentality which confuses me - they put down people with money, and yet they do everything in their power to go head-first into debt to keep up with the Joneses.

Why?

Who cares if you have expensive clothes, cars, houses, education? Should any of that matter? Well, apparently so - because if you ask someone who does not have any money what they would do if they won a lot of money, it would be something akin to; Fast Car, Big House, Big TV, Expensive Clothes, Expensive Jewellery etc.

Why?

How utterly depressing is that? To openly admit that you are so self-centered and self-absorbed and have no value on yourself whatsoever that you would immediately spend ridiculous amounts of money on useless crap, that would not have any true value at all.

I'm kinda agreeing with you here, believe it or not.

You have a few opinions here in this thread;

Those that do not buy Apple 'because they are overpriced' = 'cannot afford so I put it down and the people who bought them'.
Those that do not buy Apple 'because I doesn't do what I want it to do' = 'I will not listen to any else's opinion and put it and the people who brought them down'.
Those that are tech forum browsers (that never actually buy anything) that do not buy Apple, because it 'doesn't work with an upcoming technology that another manufacturer might release in conjunction with a third party software company that is releasing a plug-in for another device which will not work if the sun aligns with the moon on particular day of the month in Brazil...and I might go to Brazil at some point on the future if I can find the right Air plane to fly on' = 'indecisive and will never be happy with any purchase, and therefore will put down people who are able to make decisions and at the moment are happy'.

If people want to feel superior to 'everyone else' then maybe they should not listen to the opinions of others and actually test stuff out for a while, try it on for size, see how it feels and make an informed decision. Then buy it - job done, have a coke and a smile.

It's a little like finding marriage material...you go out on some dates, you explore how the relationship will unfold, extensively try the I/O for compatibility with your devices and finally you hook it up to your home network for long-term communications and potential apps that you can program together.

People that listen to the advice of friends too much or browse the market looking for 'perfection' will be very unhappy people inside.

AK

Miso Hawnee
Posted - 2011.04.10 13:17:00 - [102]
 

Amiga > All

/thread

Toshiro GreyHawk
Posted - 2011.04.10 13:59:00 - [103]
 

@AlleyKat

Well ... it's like this ...

Your response was the typical, knee jerk, defensive Mac-ophile response - of an elitist prig.

Sorry dude - but that's exactly what it was. No - seriously - that is what it was ... not just me calling you names. That is what your post was. Reread it with that in mind and maybe you'll see how bad it is. *shrug*



No - I did not say I would buy a Mac if I had the money - (I did have the money) - I said I couldn't justify spending the money on a Mac when I got a better price/performance value out of a DOS/Windows system. That's NOT the same thing.

I also did say - that I would in the future possibly buy a Mac - if I had a reason to. BUT. I hadn't done so in the past because the extra cost just wasn't worth it to ME. That's not the same thing as not having the money. I do have the money. *I* just do not have a reason sufficient enough to buy something that over priced - for the performance I would get from it.

Now - see - I do not have a BMW ... but I do have a '69 Camaro and a '76 280Z. I like my cars and they give me the enjoyment of having a fast, sporty car. Yeah ... the beamer would probably be a better car ... but ... not better enough to justify me spending that kind of money on one. I've had a '69 Camaro since 1970. That one got wrecked and - I went out and bought another one. I like that that car.

I did also say that I didn't care if someone else wanted to buy a Mac.

But you are so sensitive to being a Mac user - that you - knee jerk reaction - react as if you had been attacked - when my post was not directed at YOU in particular (though this one is).

Unfortunately for the sake of good communications - these forums have a limited number of characters I can use. Thus - I couldn't put a qualifier in front of my comment on snobbery saying that not all Mac Users are snobs (though here - I do believe that you are).

I would have made a comment about your analogy to the Ritz and MacDonalds but there wasn't room for that. This would have been (as it is here) directed specifically at you. That comment would be that I've mostly found the pseudo-intellectuals I knew to be silly people who were all wrapped up in all the little books they read and the food and wine they consumed and in how this made them "better" than other people. Maybe if I had known some smarter intellectuals, I would have been more impressed but while I actually do know - a lot - of really smart people, none of them are really classic intellectuals, they're ... pretty much nerds like I am. The problem I have here isn't that you prefer to eat such extravagantly cooked food but that you care so much about it but ... that's OK ... if you want to spend your time even thinking such thoughts, while I find that a little silly myself, you're free to do whatever you want. However, the idea that eating at a fancy restaurant is somehow "better" than eating at McDonalds is - just stupid.

Now - do you see the distinction being made in the above paragraph?

It's OK for you to like it and spend YOUR money on it if that's what you want to do - it is NOT OK for you to put down something else based on what you like to do. Doing THAT is what makes YOU a snob.

I have eaten in fancy restaurants but I prefer a burger and a beer.

And OBTW, the analogy was BS.

Now - you'll also see - that as I said with Mac's (not Big Mac's) - I don't care what you do. It's just not what I would do. That isn't snobbery, nor envy (what you referred to as hypocritical reverse snobbery) - it is indifference.

Anyway - your post is the kind of elitist Mac Crap that alienates people. It's not the Macs (they're just machinery) - it's YOU.

Oh and I've known a number of rich people too and I don't really give a **** about that. The ones I knew - were rich because they were smart and, while they had the arrogance of a lot of smart people, they weren't impressed by money. Money is a tool - not something that makes you "better".

.

AlleyKat
Gallente
The Unwanted.
Posted - 2011.04.10 14:37:00 - [104]
 

Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
response


My analogies are legendary - I'm hurt.

I do not use a Mac, I use an iPhone.

AK

Toshiro GreyHawk
Posted - 2011.04.10 20:26:00 - [105]
 

Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 11/04/2011 12:06:44
Originally by: AlleyKat
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
response


My analogies are legendary - I'm hurt.

I do not use a Mac, I use an iPhone.

AK


The title of the thread was Apple Products ... and I know something about Mac's and Mac Users.

I know nothing about "i" products or their users so I'll not venture a comment there. Whether there is a correlation between the attitudes of some of the owners of Apple Computer Products and the owners of other Apple products ... I don't know.

My reflections on your personality were drawn entirely from your posts however - and those remind me a great deal of some of the Mac owners I've known - so that would be one indication of a correlation.

I've got a digital phone I use to make outgoing calls while away from my land line - which is all I need.

*shrug*

As to my analogies ... eh ... I'm not objective enough to be able to grade them. But then that is the type of thing Intellectuals do and ... I swore off being an Intellectual (I was one once upon a time) ... long ... long ago. I found I preferred nerds and since war gaming already had me solidly in their ranks - I fit right in.

.

Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2011.04.10 20:44:00 - [106]
 

Originally by: Miso Hawnee
Amiga > All

/thread


When I was a kid I used to drool at the Amiga A500 that cost £399 in the late 80's. My parents got an Amiga A600 in 1992 for £199. But the A600 was just a slimine A500. The UK Commodore MD called the A600 'complete and utter screw-up'. Last year I got an Amiga A1200 and pimped it with aacceleration card and a 4GB flash card - hard disk. Amiga's were based on the Motorola 68xxx series which were superior to Intel's x86. But the PC won out from office use and vast economies of scale. The original IBM PC was a naff design. And typical of a lot of computer company's that have died out such as Commodore, Digital, etc is that their product placement and evolution was off the mark. The Amiga 1200 was not a ground breaker like the A500 was in terms of CPU power and the emerging PC VGA graphics system was superior to the Amiga 1200 AGA graphics. I play the odd game on the A1200. I got Amiga Doom to work on itugh Tried Amiga Quake but my accelerator card only has 8MB and not the 16MB minimum for it.

I mentioned earlier in the thread why not use a smartphone like hardware platform for a web tv. In the USA there are some products for this such as the Roku box that streams Netflix, NBA, UFC and other internet TV streaming services. Samsung is looking into web tv's and Google is looking to adopt its Android OS for web tv. The biggest problem with TV is trying to get TV and other media corporations on board that are worried about their advertising delivery being nerfed. Roku is offering targeted advertising. But when Tivo boxes recording can skip advertising the genie is already out of the bottle. Though the internet is a two way street. US TV media company's have captive markets outside the USA. I would be interested in purchasing some US TV products.
Problem with web tv's is that users will be on the upgrade treadmill like they are with PC's. But I suppose it would be less of a problem if the web tv box is separate from the TV.

I am rambling on about web tv's as its the next big area of innovation in a thread about Apple, the supposed innovator, who don't innovate tech but do good product placement of existing tech.


Toshiro GreyHawk
Posted - 2011.04.10 23:51:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: Vogue
Originally by: Miso Hawnee
Amiga > All

/thread


When I was a kid I used to drool at the Amiga A500 that cost £399 in the late 80's. My parents got an Amiga A600 in 1992 for £199. But the A600 was just a slimine A500. The UK Commodore MD called the A600 'complete and utter screw-up'. Last year I got an Amiga A1200 and pimped it with aacceleration card and a 4GB flash card - hard disk. Amiga's were based on the Motorola 68xxx series which were superior to Intel's x86. But the PC won out from office use and vast economies of scale. The original IBM PC was a naff design. And typical of a lot of computer company's that have died out such as Commodore, Digital, etc is that their product placement and evolution was off the mark. The Amiga 1200 was not a ground breaker like the A500 was in terms of CPU power and the emerging PC VGA graphics system was superior to the Amiga 1200 AGA graphics. I play the odd game on the A1200. I got Amiga Doom to work on itugh Tried Amiga Quake but my accelerator card only has 8MB and not the 16MB minimum for it.

...





Yeah, at one time I was very seriously considering buying an Amiga but because of work - I had to have that IBM emulator they were supposed to come up with ... and finally gave up waiting. It finally came out but by then I'd given up on them.

That was the problem with most other systems. Most people got introduced to computers through work and work fell into the IBM camp. They may not have used IBM's but they used IBM compatibles. That pretty much doomed all the other platforms to either death or niche status. Gradually, all the special things that made these other platforms ... special ... migrated to the clones and there really wasn't a need for people to use them.

The thing that most people just don't get who were in love with these systems - was that a single common OS that could be used by everybody - was what really counted. That was Gate's realization and the reason for his success. Most people only needed a few basic functions - and these worked fine on generic systems but the fact that everyone could use them - that you could just walk into a computer store and buy software off the shelf - and expect it to run right out of the box - counted for more than anything else.

Yeah ... the Amiga had a beautiful OS as I remember it ... but *sigh* ... so did my Lobo Max 80 - Z80B running LDOS ... and that didn't matter either.

I always thought that the biggest problem the Amiga had was Commodore. They just didn't know what to do with it.


One of the things that people forget about Mac's was that the only reason they survived - was because of Microsoft Word and the other MS products developed for them. If the Amiga had had Word (I don't think it did) ... maybe it would have survived but ... there really wasn't that much room for little niche computers and Apple pretty much took it all up, dooming the Amiga and Atari systems.

*shrug*

.

Speedy Spooke
Posted - 2011.04.11 00:06:00 - [108]
 

Apple products are fashion accessories, i like my iphone 4, and its the only apple product i ever owned other than ipod nano ca use of its small size.

i like the iphone cause it was free with my 30 euro a month tarrif.
cant whine when people pay 100 euros for a 45 euro tarrif.

anyways, iam happy with it, and it does a lot that other phones cant.


As for the ipad, i got to agree.
I knew froms tart they could ve had a camera on ipad 1. simply cycle economics. build somehting slightly better to out date another, than technology existed to release ipad 1 with 20 mpgx camera if they wanted to.


Apple knows what people want, and that is to look cool regardless of spces. ....

Erichk Knaar
Caldari
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
Posted - 2011.04.11 04:32:00 - [109]
 

Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk


Of course there're various forms of snobbery. There's the "I'm not a nerd so I bought the computer for the rest of us ... " and then there's the "I am the Ultimate Nerd. I use UNIX because I can reprogram the Operating System - myself!" ... which is why ... there is no such thing as "UNIX" ...

Thus giving us the ultimate Snobs OS - Mac OSX...



wat?

I happen to be proficient in several derivatives of UNIX.

NightmareX
Nomads
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.04.11 06:57:00 - [110]
 

Originally by: Speedy Spooke
anyways, iam happy with it, and it does a lot that other phones cant.

If we are talking about dirt cheap Symbian phones, then sure, but try to put the iPhone 4 up against my Sony Ericsson XPERIA X10 or a HTC Desire HD.

The iPhone 4 gets stomped all over it by those 2 phones.

Even my old Sony Ericsson XPERIA X1 with Windows Mobile 6.5 can do alot more than an iPhone 4 can do. But i'm not saying it's better than the iPhone 4 though. I'm just pointing out that the old Windows Mobile phones actually can do alot more than an iPhone 4 can do today.

Toshiro GreyHawk
Posted - 2011.04.11 11:14:00 - [111]
 

Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 11/04/2011 12:05:18

Originally by: Erichk Knaar
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk


Of course there're various forms of snobbery. There's the "I'm not a nerd so I bought the computer for the rest of us ... " and then there's the "I am the Ultimate Nerd. I use UNIX because I can reprogram the Operating System - myself!" ... which is why ... there is no such thing as "UNIX" ...

Thus giving us the ultimate Snobs OS - Mac OSX...



wat?

I happen to be proficient in several derivatives of UNIX.


Precisely. That is all there are - derivatives of Unix. There is no such thing as "UNIX" - only Unix derivatives.

One of the great things about Unix ... if you're a Unix Systems Programmer - is that you can reprogram the operating system itself. One of the really horrible things about Unix - is that everybody and their brother has ... Thus there is no single Unix community with software that is compatible across all it's platforms. If there was ... then Unix would be a contender as a mass market OS ... but ... because the community is so fragmented and "compatibility" means that you can recompile the source code ... to get it to run on different versions of the OS ... it's just a mess for anyone who isn't a Unix Systems Programmer.

It's kind of like ... the Unix geeks created this wonderful programming environment that was so customizable by themselves - that ... they ruined it for anyone else.

*shrug*


As to Ultimate Snobbery ... some - not all - but some of the Unix guys I worked with were kind of the Uber Snobs of the programming world ... in that they were Unix Systems Programmers ... who tended to look down on all lesser mortals. But - the biggest snobs - were the Unix System Programmers who could use the underlying Unix Operating System - that Mac OSX was based on. A combination of Apple Snob and Unix Snob - Ha! Ha!

Now ... don't get me wrong - I have two specific individuals in mind here and I liked the guys ... but when it came to Geek Snobbery one was the king. The other guy would at least use a Widows system but this guy wouldn't condescend to use one (like everyone else) unless he had absolutely no choice. He got himself a Mac and he ran all his windows applications under an interpreter on it. I forget if those were still Power Books ... or if they had some other name ... (I supported Mac's but wasn't a Mac Guy and ... have been away from them since I retired - so I just don't remember). But this guy was soooo happy when that system came in and he didn't have to use a Windows System any more. Ha! Ha!

The thing was ... I had to help this guy get all his stuff working on that system and it wasn't always easy ... But he was a smart guy and I liked working with him. We were contemplating moving over to Linux and he and I were testing out various Linux flavors but it never happened before I retired.

*shrug*

.

Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.11 11:37:00 - [112]
 

Originally by: AlleyKat

Those that do not buy Apple 'because they are overpriced' = 'cannot afford so I put it down and the people who bought them'.


What a stupid statement. Rolling Eyes

'cannot afford' and 'don't wanna waste' is two very different concepts that you apparently struggle with. Most folk who buy smartphones can afford iPhones, becuse the price difference in not all that much between e.g. a superior HTC Desire. But why pay more then you have to to get junk? Would you buy junk simply becuase it costs more then non-junk?

AlleyKat
Gallente
The Unwanted.
Posted - 2011.04.11 12:31:00 - [113]
 

Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: AlleyKat

Those that do not buy Apple 'because they are overpriced' = 'cannot afford so I put it down and the people who bought them'.


What a stupid statement. Rolling Eyes

'cannot afford' and 'don't wanna waste' is two very different concepts that you apparently struggle with. Most folk who buy smartphones can afford iPhones, becuse the price difference in not all that much between e.g. a superior HTC Desire. But why pay more then you have to to get junk? Would you buy junk simply becuase it costs more then non-junk?


I was speaking in general terms about my perception when someone states they think Apple products are overpriced and that is the only justification they give for not owning or buying one, and use that to attack on a personal level someone who does own an Apple Product.

Perhaps I should rephrase that comment slightly by saying ‘I do not have the kind of disposable income to purchase a luxury, non-essential lifestyle product that Apple provide in general terms’.

Is that better?

AK

Katie Tanaka
Posted - 2011.04.11 12:55:00 - [114]
 

Apple products are awesome because you can make people angry with them whilst simultaneously enjoying a superior user experience. It's like telling the truth in a forum post whilst simultaneously deploying an fantastically high-powered troll ray. Satisfying, hmm-hmm.

Amaroq Dricaldari
Amarr
Vengeance Industrial Militia
Posted - 2011.04.11 13:18:00 - [115]
 

Capitalism, guys. It is always capitalism. Capitalism, war, and even explicit media have been around since the very start of human civilization. You give large crowds something they want, they love you. You don't, they hate you. You show them a Billing Contract, they try to kill you. As for War, it is part of natural human behavior, as well as the behavior of all living things, except maybe plants. As long as there are at least 2 living creatures left in existence, one of them is going to want another one to die.

War and Capitalism have always been around, and they will always be around. You cannot get rid of them without destroying all of humanity.

Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.11 13:52:00 - [116]
 

Originally by: AlleyKat
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: AlleyKat

Those that do not buy Apple 'because they are overpriced' = 'cannot afford so I put it down and the people who bought them'.


What a stupid statement. Rolling Eyes

'cannot afford' and 'don't wanna waste' is two very different concepts that you apparently struggle with. Most folk who buy smartphones can afford iPhones, becuse the price difference in not all that much between e.g. a superior HTC Desire. But why pay more then you have to to get junk? Would you buy junk simply becuase it costs more then non-junk?


I was speaking in general terms about my perception when someone states they think Apple products are overpriced and that is the only justification they give for not owning or buying one, and use that to attack on a personal level someone who does own an Apple Product.

Perhaps I should rephrase that comment slightly by saying ‘I do not have the kind of disposable income to purchase a luxury, non-essential lifestyle product that Apple provide in general terms’.

Is that better?

AK



No, its even worse. Same garbage, prettier words. Like trying to dress up a turd.

You fail to realize that Apple is not actually a better product, despite what teh marketing is telling you, or what price is set. And you equate it to a lifestyle. You are indeed Apples favorite kind of guy. Gullible and a self apponited "crusader for apple".

I bet you think you are better then others by just owning an apple product, or think you are richer?

One thing I will hand to Apple, they know how to get folk to buy their ****.

Erichk Knaar
Caldari
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
Posted - 2011.04.11 16:24:00 - [117]
 

Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk

Precisely. That is all there are - derivatives of Unix. There is no such thing as "UNIX" - only Unix derivatives.

One of the great things about Unix ... if you're a Unix Systems Programmer - is that you can reprogram the operating system itself. One of the really horrible things about Unix - is that everybody and their brother has ... Thus there is no single Unix community with software that is compatible across all it's platforms. If there was ... then Unix would be a contender as a mass market OS ... but ... because the community is so fragmented and "compatibility" means that you can recompile the source code ... to get it to run on different versions of the OS ... it's just a mess for anyone who isn't a Unix Systems Programmer.

It's kind of like ... the Unix geeks created this wonderful programming environment that was so customizable by themselves - that ... they ruined it for anyone else.

*shrug*


As to Ultimate Snobbery ... some - not all - but some of the Unix guys I worked with were kind of the Uber Snobs of the programming world ... in that they were Unix Systems Programmers ... who tended to look down on all lesser mortals. But - the biggest snobs - were the Unix System Programmers who could use the underlying Unix Operating System - that Mac OSX was based on. A combination of Apple Snob and Unix Snob - Ha! Ha!

Now ... don't get me wrong - I have two specific individuals in mind here and I liked the guys ... but when it came to Geek Snobbery one was the king. The other guy would at least use a Widows system but this guy wouldn't condescend to use one (like everyone else) unless he had absolutely no choice. He got himself a Mac and he ran all his windows applications under an interpreter on it. I forget if those were still Power Books ... or if they had some other name ... (I supported Mac's but wasn't a Mac Guy and ... have been away from them since I retired - so I just don't remember). But this guy was soooo happy when that system came in and he didn't have to use a Windows System any more. Ha! Ha!

The thing was ... I had to help this guy get all his stuff working on that system and it wasn't always easy ... But he was a smart guy and I liked working with him. We were contemplating moving over to Linux and he and I were testing out various Linux flavors but it never happened before I retired.

*shrug*

.


Fair point. UNIX did fragment, but honestly, Linux has picked up that torch and run with it pretty well. Its not "teh best", but its reliable enough to get serious jobs done with it. I still fall back to BSD and Solaris for certain things though. As far as OSX goes, well, it is a UNIX. Wouldn't you agree that that does have certain benefits to people who do know *NIX when it comes to selecting a laptop or whatever? I personally use a MBP because I couldn't be assed to fiddle. It works out of the box, and I can do all those *NIX things with it.

TBH, I only use Windows for games anymore, there are just too many silly issues that come from the years of legacy cruft that it carries. Just this weekend, I rebooted my games machine after installing a Windows update, and the entire C drive came back with all the folders flipped read only. Apparently this happens sometimes and has to do with UAC. I mean, really? You can think of this as snobbish if you want, but I don't really want to have to spend time working around a fundamentally crap design to play games. I'll do it though, because I want to play games. For other kinds of more serious work, I couldn't be bothered.

I also get to play tech support for the extended family. Now I just tell them to buy a mac, and subsidize it even, because my time in "tech support" is worth way more to me than the extra cost. Does this make me a snob, or just someone who is sick of MS shipping a crappy product that eats my time?

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.04.11 17:48:00 - [118]
 

Quote:
TBH, I only use Windows for games anymore, there are just too many silly issues that come from the years of legacy cruft that it carries. Just this weekend, I rebooted my games machine after installing a Windows update, and the entire C drive came back with all the folders flipped read only. Apparently this happens sometimes and has to do with UAC. I mean, really? You can think of this as snobbish if you want, but I don't really want to have to spend time working around a fundamentally crap design to play games. I'll do it though, because I want to play games. For other kinds of more serious work, I couldn't be bothered.


How is that any different then having to login as "root" to mess with folders or set all permissions to 777 or 775? Now on windows you have to login as "admin" to change permissions... In fact windows decided to use how unix/linux model of defualt file/os permissions and use the "modular" (base everything around the kernal) design for 7.

AlleyKat
Gallente
The Unwanted.
Posted - 2011.04.11 18:26:00 - [119]
 

Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
No, its even worse. Same garbage, prettier words. Like trying to dress up a turd.

You fail to realise that Apple is not actually a better product, despite what the marketing is telling you, or what price is set. And you equate it to a lifestyle. You are indeed Apples favourite kind of guy. Gullible and a self appointed "crusader for apple".

I bet you think you are better then others by just owning an Apple product, or think you are richer?

One thing I will hand to Apple, they know how to get folk to buy their ****.


No.

This is all about how I am perceiving the comments of those who are putting forth baseless arguments and then attacking people for having an opinion.

You are not one of those people.

There is nothing for you to feel threatened about.

My decision to buy an iPhone was made after using one, and then taking a trial for a month to weigh up its applicability to my personal usage. I found it better than the competition from a users perspective, so I took a contract.

Better products are subjective - and in answer to the original posters question; people buy Apple products because the user interface is better. Sorry.

That is an opinion, and it is an opinion which clashes with yours - that doesn't make me right and it does make you wrong.

It is an opinion.

AK

NightmareX
Nomads
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.04.11 20:09:00 - [120]
 

Edited by: NightmareX on 11/04/2011 20:50:08
Originally by: AlleyKat
and in answer to the original posters question; people buy Apple products because the user interface is better. Sorry.

HAHAHAHAHAHA, that's a pure Apple fanboy comment. Because no one would ever take this and this to be better UI than Android. iOS is a freaking rainbow heaven.

Well, you might take iOS as better UI in you're eyes, but no matter what you mean, the UI in iOS is faaaaaaaaaaar far from being as good as Android UI where you can change the UI to you're taste instead of looking at a rainbow heaven with icons splattered all over the screen all day long.

The fact is that the reason peoples says that the iOS's UI is better is because those guys haven't got out of the year 2007 yet. Sadly but true.

In 2007 when iPhone was released for the first time, THEN iPhone OS was the best UI / mobile OS you could get at that time, and it was the best for some time until Android phones started to come out.

NO ONE calls iOS for better UI that have absolutely no ways to customize the UI in any possible ways over Android where you can change / customize on everything.


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