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jason hill
Caldari
Clan Shadow Wolf
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2011.04.03 13:49:00 - [181]
 

Originally by: Aineko Macx
For the record: Apparently also no dev went to the golden circle tour like stated. At least I didn't spot one nor did I hear from anyone who was with one.



sorry ...i have to correct you on that one .I spent most of my time talking to ccp Helgimar who is head of HR for ccp there also was another dev on our bus but i dont recall his name. So YOUR WRONG ON THIS ONE plenty of others on our bus can confirm this .

Dogo Duma
Posted - 2011.04.03 14:44:00 - [182]
 

Originally by: jason hill
Originally by: Aineko Macx
For the record: Apparently also no dev went to the golden circle tour like stated. At least I didn't spot one nor did I hear from anyone who was with one.



sorry ...i have to correct you on that one .I spent most of my time talking to ccp Helgimar who is head of HR for ccp there also was another dev on our bus but i dont recall his name. So YOUR WRONG ON THIS ONE plenty of others on our bus can confirm this .


Afaik that guy works at HR but the place is ran by a French lady formerly from EA since a few months. Helgi often pops up on twitter posting about job positions.


CCP Manifest


C C P
Posted - 2011.04.03 17:36:00 - [183]
 

Originally by: ITTigerClawIK
Edited by: ITTigerClawIK on 02/04/2011 11:08:54
Originally by: Marconus Orion
Maybe a live dev blog where players can ask questions and stuff could be scheduled to make up for this? Make a good portion of it about faction warfare? This mistake can easily be redeemed.


Brilliant idea i would like to second this


I already brought up the idea of a live dev blog about FW as an analagous replacement for the FW session missed at Fanfest. We all agreed that in terms of content, breadth, manpower required etc, it would actually be better for everyone to get things down "on paper" first instead of via a live format--especially since most current questions about FW are pretty much the same that have persisted for months if not years. Perhaps later on we could then reserve a portion of a live dev blog about FW.

CCP Manifest


C C P
Posted - 2011.04.03 17:37:00 - [184]
 

Originally by: Dogo Duma
Originally by: jason hill
Originally by: Aineko Macx
For the record: Apparently also no dev went to the golden circle tour like stated. At least I didn't spot one nor did I hear from anyone who was with one.



sorry ...i have to correct you on that one .I spent most of my time talking to ccp Helgimar who is head of HR for ccp there also was another dev on our bus but i dont recall his name. So YOUR WRONG ON THIS ONE plenty of others on our bus can confirm this .


Afaik that guy works at HR but the place is ran by a French lady formerly from EA since a few months. Helgi often pops up on twitter posting about job positions.




Yep, that's right. Helgi's part of the recruiting team and we've nabbed a top notch HR person, Sophie (who is French), to head up the whole department as we've increased in size.

CCP Manifest


C C P
Posted - 2011.04.03 17:38:00 - [185]
 

Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
My Grand Vision, posted all those moons ago.

The overall vision hasn't changed although one could add features from Incursion and include PI efficiency in rewards - maybe even let PI output increase the amount of work the enemy has to do to flip system back.


Thanks for reposting this.

Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2011.04.04 00:40:00 - [186]
 

Originally by: CCP Manifest
Originally by: ITTigerClawIK
Edited by: ITTigerClawIK on 02/04/2011 11:08:54
Originally by: Marconus Orion
Maybe a live dev blog where players can ask questions and stuff could be scheduled to make up for this? Make a good portion of it about faction warfare? This mistake can easily be redeemed.


Brilliant idea i would like to second this


I already brought up the idea of a live dev blog about FW as an analagous replacement for the FW session missed at Fanfest. We all agreed that in terms of content, breadth, manpower required etc, it would actually be better for everyone to get things down "on paper" first instead of via a live format--especially since most current questions about FW are pretty much the same that have persisted for months if not years. Perhaps later on we could then reserve a portion of a live dev blog about FW.


What do we need to do to assist you with this? You have seen that there are a number of people who are interested in this and therefore it is safe to assume that some of them want to assit CCP with improving FW.
To me, the first thing to tackle are some of the bugs like the spawn mechanics and the NPC balance. Longer term, changes to mechanics and new features could then be looked at. I would love to see Soundwave's team look at some of this - the work they have been doing lately has been awesome.
<tl;dr>
Acknowledgement of the fanfest snafu is great - how do we go to the next stage?

Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
Posted - 2011.04.04 03:29:00 - [187]
 

Edited by: Dr BattleSmith on 04/04/2011 03:29:46

This might help.... Given that the mechanics work only for a few hours a day the people who understand them are limited.

Here is a list of some I know who understand in some detail how the broken mechanics "work".

Eran Mintor
Lost Incognito
sasawong
Bdericks
S5family
Condor Amarr
boris thebutcher
Braitai

Would be a good idea to talk to these people at length before deciding on redesigns.

Raise your hand if you've PvP plexed within 3h of downtime enough to "get it".





Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2011.04.04 04:46:00 - [188]
 

Originally by: Dr BattleSmith
Edited by: Dr BattleSmith on 04/04/2011 03:29:46

This might help.... Given that the mechanics work only for a few hours a day the people who understand them are limited.

Here is a list of some I know who understand in some detail how the broken mechanics "work".

Eran Mintor
Lost Incognito
sasawong
Bdericks
S5family
Condor Amarr
boris thebutcher
Braitai

Would be a good idea to talk to these people at length before deciding on redesigns.

Raise your hand if you've PvP plexed within 3h of downtime enough to "get it".



These are all good people - many from my corp/militia or the opposition militia and would form a sound starting point.

Bdericks has left FW along with a number of other "senior" FW members due to the current state of FW. One can only hope that CCP responds quickly to this as I am seeing many long time Amarr militia pilots leaving for better PvP opportunities.

Shaalira D'arc
Posted - 2011.04.04 04:54:00 - [189]
 

Originally by: Dr BattleSmith

Raise your hand if you've PvP plexed within 3h of downtime enough to "get it".



On the Gallente end of things, the players to consult would be:

Val Erian
Dopified
Ranger B

There are probably others I'm forgetting as well.

Lord Meriak
Amarr
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2011.04.04 06:31:00 - [190]
 

What alot of fw would like to see is :

Unable to cloak up inside a mission.

System to mean something, Get rid of the bunker and have Conquerable Station's, When the station is taken the agent is then offline.Making some systems key systems because of the agent inside.

The station should only let that faction dock.

We also like If a member of the miltia member is attacked they get small standing hit to that faction.All fw member taking hits to the factions we attack but neutral can hunt fw then go and park in ie: jita / amarr, making neutral rp allince's and not just say we pick a side.

This would be hard on the codes writer's but when this game started everyone said it could not be done the game was a trailer & not game play, we want that ccp back.

Veshta Yoshida
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.04 06:51:00 - [191]
 

Originally by: Dr BattleSmith
This might help....

You mention my arch nemesis Sasawong but not me? *sniff*

Would be pretty awesome if a handful from all militias got a chance to sit down and talk it through with a Dev, you know like the roundtable that never was Smile
Perhaps even invite reps from EM, CVA, U'K, CAIN etc. to get input on how RP/Alliances can interact with the whole thing in a meaningful way.
Originally by: Lord Meriak
Unable to cloak up inside a mission.

Band-aid for a severed limb will not save the patient Smile

Read the link quoted in #185 to see what I thought would save FW back in late 2009. Two or three other threads around the same time that were packed with ideas worth digging up.

durka dreckly
Posted - 2011.04.04 08:03:00 - [192]
 

Just fix it or kill it.

Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
Posted - 2011.04.04 08:05:00 - [193]
 

Edited by: Dr BattleSmith on 04/04/2011 08:10:22

Originally by: Veshta Yoshida
Originally by: Dr BattleSmith
This might help....

You mention my arch nemesis Sasawong but not me? *sniff*



lol ^^ him too.

I actually just went to an old after-DT Arzad fight and right in the first battle report were most of the people who have actually played the FW mechanic and seen it working. :-)

edit: The mechanic only works a few hours a night, this is why so few people understand the issue.
This may be confusing for CCP as some of the complaints are from people who have never actually seen the FW mechanic function.

Rodj Blake
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.04 12:24:00 - [194]
 

In addition to the other excellent suggestions in this thread, could we please have a return to the days of the militias getting orders from VIPs (like here)?

It was good for immersion (for everyone, not just the RPers) and helped to focus the war onto specific systems.

Brooks Puuntai
Minmatar
Nomadic Asylum
Posted - 2011.04.04 12:37:00 - [195]
 

Edited by: Brooks Puuntai on 04/04/2011 12:37:59
Add the incursion factor into FW. Say theres a Caldari Incursion in Gallente owned FW space each faction can fight along side their NPC factions this would have special LP and/or rewards.

When a faction takes a system have it so the system slowly changes towards that faction. Stations in system will 1 by 1 start to be owned by that factions npc corps and open up reg mission and FW mission agents. Make the system dynamic so it actually is world shaping which is something that was promised when FW was released.

Hell even make it slowly rise in sec status and allow it to shift into highsec. That way the FW pilots could then continue to fight for the system w/o interference from pirates/others.

Ok Iam tired so the last idea might be stupid.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2011.04.04 13:06:00 - [196]
 

Originally by: Brooks Puuntai

Hell even make it slowly rise in sec status and allow it to shift into highsec. That way the FW pilots could then continue to fight for the system w/o interference from pirates/others.

Ok Iam tired so the last idea might be stupid.


If FW allowed true change in sovereignty along a sec status scale, then it would be truly interesting.

Eg: A system starts out as (for example) a Gallente 0.8. Successive Caldari victories could lower the sec to 0.5. At this point there would be some kind of "milestone event" - maybe something like a week-long "Caldari Incursion" where the players have to try and influence some large NPC battles at the stations or gates. Assuming a Caldari victory, have CONCORD delare the system an "escalated conflict site" or something like that, then drop sec to 0.4.

Then after 4 further normal stages, the sov flips from Gallante 0.1 to Caldari 0.1, and now the Caldari side will now be defending their sov and the Gallante side trying to attack it. Eventually the Caldari side would theoretically be able to raise the sov to Caldari 0.8

The whole process would take weeks, but it would give the FW teams a genuine reason to fight, it would make FW relevant to the rest of the game, and it would allow the players to redesign the map (albeit extremely gradually).

Steve Thomas
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2011.04.04 18:47:00 - [197]
 

Edited by: Steve Thomas on 04/04/2011 18:48:37
Originally by: Malcanis
Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players.
And this is a problem how?

and its actualy a fairly old gameing law. its sometimes called the sesame street effect

Moolti
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2011.04.04 19:06:00 - [198]
 

Speaking for myself and not The Electus Matari:

I would love to do more for FW. Right now we have to have individual corps drop alliance to join FW. I would love for Alliances to have a better way of joining FW.

I tried FW for a while, but while in FW it's all I could do. There was very little way to do anything else. In order to do other stuff, I had to leave FW. Once I left FW, it was easy to stay out of it, and hard to "go do FW for a little bit". I understand how difficult it would be to make this un-expliotable.

Lost InCogneto
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2011.04.05 02:15:00 - [199]
 

Bump

Lets keep this topic alive and keep up the support to change fw for the better.

Har Harrison
Amarrian Retribution
Posted - 2011.04.05 02:46:00 - [200]
 

Originally by: Moolti
Speaking for myself and not The Electus Matari:

I would love to do more for FW. Right now we have to have individual corps drop alliance to join FW. I would love for Alliances to have a better way of joining FW.

I tried FW for a while, but while in FW it's all I could do. There was very little way to do anything else. In order to do other stuff, I had to leave FW. Once I left FW, it was easy to stay out of it, and hard to "go do FW for a little bit". I understand how difficult it would be to make this un-expliotable.



It seems to me that the treaty mechanic that has been proposed in the past by CCP would be an excellent way of allowing FW and RP allainces to interact.
One other idea I would like to see explored is allowing a SINGLE corp from an alliance to be nominated as their FW affiliated corp (i.e. they are part of the alliance AND militia - similar to how there is an executor corp to control the alliance. The trick here is that FW standigns override all other ones. This could allow CVA or UK for example to have a larger involvement with the militia without the issues of gcc.

Veshta Yoshida
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.05 07:25:00 - [201]
 

Originally by: Moolti
Speaking for myself and not The Electus Matari:...

Off hand I think you might as well be speaking for EM and U'K and CVA and .. Smile

The announcement of FW way back when instilled hope in the RP community that CCP was once again going to make Eve more than an elaborate grind MMO .. they started out really well with VIP objectives but that tapered off and was never followed up.

Problem with alliance's in FW (A-in-FW) is the disparity in relative power, something that could be alleviated by having 'zero null holdings' as a requisite (originally suggested by a Dev if I recall).

A designated corp with no other requirements would allow for on/off participation which might be great fun but undermines the idea of it being a war and would probably result in all sorts of standings related shenanigans Very Happy
Treaty system might work, but since CCP hasn't even been able to implement it for master-pet in null I wouldn't put too much faith in that solution.

We will have to find out if the A-in-FW is of value outside the RP crowd though. If not then there is no need for actual changes as a solution could probably be found using Dev tools for the handful of alliances that are interested.

Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2011.04.05 11:12:00 - [202]
 

I have an alt in FW - just to bump standings really.

He's been in there for about 3 weeks running missions. In those 3 weeks I haven't seen a single fight or gatecamp where the people were in FW. I see sasawong from time to time, still doing what he was doing best part of 2 years ago when I first went into FW. Don't really see anyone looking for fights.

This is DT +/- 3 hours, which I appreciate is quiet but its the same time period I played in a couple of years ago. Its just wall to wall mission runners now.

To be brutally frank I see more FW people fighting in npc null than I do in Heim/Met/Devoid/Bleak Lands.

I think its probably time to end FW.

However that'd require some sort of plan regarding lowsec and CCP don't have one so might as well just accept it "as is" - it does still allow ridiculous amounts of money to be earned for doing little more than travelling a few jumps.

Bengal Bob
Royal Order of Security Specialists
Posted - 2011.04.05 11:52:00 - [203]
 

Edited by: Bengal Bob on 05/04/2011 11:55:03
Please dear gods, can this move forwards and not be forgotten.
Last night, I was seriously considering taking time out for WOT until ccp started fixing FW. Minnies v Amarr is very stale at the moment, people are simply missioning or fleeting up so large they know they won't get a fight.

Also, are the new "eyes included" portrait rules because more people are protesting at silly avatar nonsense wasting valuable resources for something that has no impact on game play?

Also, I am pretty sure I can get the camera angle nice and low so you may get a shot of a single eye looking up from a minmatar trunk of much girth.

Cearain
Caldari
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
Posted - 2011.04.05 18:51:00 - [204]
 

FW missions: pretty much fine. For some races they should be a bit harder/not soloable in a sb. But the ones for amarr a pretty well balanced.

Occuapancy plexing:
"It took less than a week to achieve the maximum faction warfare rank (Divine Commodore), Ö.111 faction warfare complexes were captured Ö I did not kill anyone in the process..Ē Ankhesentapemkah Posted - 2008.06.18 02:29:00
Itís a joke. I think there is somewhat of a split between people who want plexing to involve more red x shooting, or to make the npcs stronger etc. and those who want more pvp.

I think eve is long overdue to have some mechanic were small scale pvp is the deciding factor. That is why I support this proposal: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1329906&page=1

I would support everything makes pvp the key (e.g., letting militias know when plexes are taken) and be against everything that ruins the pvp. (eg making the npcs much tougher so its mainly a pve activity) The rats currently almost always work to prevent pvp so they are best done away with.

The rest (rp whatever) I really donít care too much about.



Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
Posted - 2011.04.06 00:42:00 - [205]
 

I believe the missions are balanced as long as plexing is active.

With 5-6 fights in the 3h after dt we'd lose as much isk as FW missions could replace.

As for plexing, really the only incentive needed is the awesome fights which can be had when the mechanic works.

Sure if that isn't enough there are some really good ideas out for how navy/stations/agents/sov/occupancy might respond.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a troubleshooter, I like to fix one thing before inventing the next problem.

Lady Aja
Posted - 2011.04.06 08:05:00 - [206]
 

bumpitty bump bump bump!

Ropf
Posted - 2011.04.06 08:44:00 - [207]
 

I'm fairly new to EVE an especially FW and pvp as a whole but I'd like to add some of my impressions concerning this issue.

I've always been a great fan of PVP, so when I started playing EVE again this year I ofcourse wanted to get into this type of play. Now I've been told that FW was a great way to learn, now I'm not saying that this isn't the case. I must say the pvp aspect of FW hasn't quite lived up to my expectations.

Ofcourse I get some good pvp experience from time to time, but not quite as much as I've hoped for. I find myself chasing stealth bombers most of the time, mostly without succes ofcourse. Allthough this is something that atleast gives me something to do, it's far from educative and it get's boring really really fast.
I feel that the pvp aspect should be key in FW, not mission running or even plexing. After all I got into it for pvp not running missions or endlessly chasing stealth bombers.
What I'd like to see is more rewards for actually fighting the other faction.

I'm not going to get into any details about how to do this or any of that, because I feel I do not know enough about this game and it's mechanics to give any reasonable solution. Just wanted to give my two cents in the hope CCP will do something about it, as I've seen/heard alot of people who are in FW alot longer then I have share the same oppinion.


Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2011.04.06 10:16:00 - [208]
 

Originally by: Ropf
I'm fairly new to EVE an especially FW and pvp as a whole but I'd like to add some of my impressions concerning this issue.

I've always been a great fan of PVP, so when I started playing EVE again this year I ofcourse wanted to get into this type of play. Now I've been told that FW was a great way to learn, now I'm not saying that this isn't the case. I must say the pvp aspect of FW hasn't quite lived up to my expectations.

Ofcourse I get some good pvp experience from time to time, but not quite as much as I've hoped for. I find myself chasing stealth bombers most of the time, mostly without succes ofcourse. Allthough this is something that atleast gives me something to do, it's far from educative and it get's boring really really fast.
I feel that the pvp aspect should be key in FW, not mission running or even plexing. After all I got into it for pvp not running missions or endlessly chasing stealth bombers.
What I'd like to see is more rewards for actually fighting the other faction.

I'm not going to get into any details about how to do this or any of that, because I feel I do not know enough about this game and it's mechanics to give any reasonable solution. Just wanted to give my two cents in the hope CCP will do something about it, as I've seen/heard alot of people who are in FW alot longer then I have share the same oppinion.




You sound like me 18 months ago Laughing

1) Don't bother with trying to catch SBs. Unless you're very very lucky as to where they initially decloak after jump-in or they screw up then you won't catch them in low-sec;

2) Rewards for fighting are easily exploited - all you need is an alt in opposing militia (or even a friend) and you're set to make money;

3) FW plexes are where the fighting should mainly be taking place. However due to them being spawned and closed in the 2-3 hours after DT that doesn't happen much now.

The reality of FW now is that virtually nobody cares about system occupancy and most fights are simple gatecamps or station games.

I'd venture to suggest that the overwhelming majority of people who are currently in FW are there either to avoid GCC or to run missions. FW is just a free wardec really.

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2011.04.06 16:11:00 - [209]
 

Edited by: Hirana Yoshida on 06/04/2011 16:12:45
Originally by: Othran
You sound like me 18 months ago Laughing...

Aaah, those were the days. When rainbows still had colour and hope bubbled in ones heart.

They made it out of exploration and duct-tape which restricts it to the current state.
But CCP has already shown that the spawn mechanic is fixable, Incursion have that spawns can are DT independent, should be possible to modify that mechanic for FW plexes.

Why they don't have devs working on updating old code as they develop new tools/code and acquire new hardware is beyond me .. so many things from Incursions that would do very nicely indeed in FW/Low-sec.


Shaalira D'arc
Posted - 2011.04.06 21:07:00 - [210]
 

Bump.

Incidentally, the last two QEN's discussed the positive effect of PvP on the economy, as well as the dangerous trend of fewer PvP incidents per player.

If you're serious about increasing the pew pew, CCP, try a revamp of one of its most accessible forms.


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