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Bhattran
Posted - 2011.03.28 15:51:00 - [121]
 

Congratulations to the winners, here's hoping the good work built upon will continue to proceed further with CCP's support in taking player concerns seriously and making good use of the CSM.

Also I hope new members will make use of older members knowledge and advice, both those with prior CSM experience on this CSM and those who served in the past. I'm sure most of the former CSM members over the years would be happy to offer advice if asked.

Manofwarr
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:21:00 - [122]
 

Originally by: Sader Rykane
Why does it feel like the Republicans won?


Because things will start to get fixed.

De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Norse'Storm Battle Group
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:25:00 - [123]
 

Originally by: EnderCapitalG
Originally by: Jane Bennet
I'M TAKING MY BALL AND GOING HOME



Or, to quote Eric Cartman, "Screw you guys, I'm outta here."

In all due seriousness, I dislike the Goons, including the cutely named "Mittens", because I find their humor sophomoric and very much "Animal House", which I am not a fan of. It's not personal - I can't honestly say I even know anyone who is a Goon (or will admit it).

Honestly, I think the next year is going to be one of very little to no improvement in Eve due to the makeup of the CSM and the stigma that some of the players behind the characters carry with the player base.

That said, I hope I'm wrong. I hope this CSM moves the game forward - but I can't help being reminded of the last time we wound up with a self acknowledged troll on the council. (Larkonisgate anyone?)

At any rate, good luck to the CSM - and if you're an alternate, please, for the love of God, keep your passport current. You might need it.

De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Norse'Storm Battle Group
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:27:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Manofwarr
Originally by: Sader Rykane
Why does it feel like the Republicans won?


Because things will start to get fixed.


Really? How's the search for those weapons of mass destruction coming?

Please - the American political system is so hopelessly broken at this point, they can't even come up with a budget to keep the government from closing. Both the Democrats and the Republicans should, frankly, be ashamed of themselves.

Manofwarr
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:29:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: Ankerr Feranniss
Congratulations to some of the elected (the ones elected by real players)!

It's quite a sad day to see the CSM so thoroughly exploited by the metagaming coalition, by the alliance who invented some of the worst things in game, and to have as a chairman one of the most devious players in the whole game.

Anyway he has always said he likes to scam and spy and to turncoat, so hats off to the (few) real players who actually voted for someone who will devote his whole time to ruin their day, and mock them while doing so Laughing


Gee I didn't know Goons did EVE programming? Goons found ways to EXPLOIT existing game mechanics before/better than others. If you don't like the way some of the mechanics work blame CCP it is their game after all.

And if you are dumb enough to fall for a scam, well not much hope for you anyway in life or EVE. Remember if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

Ntrails
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:40:00 - [126]
 

I am sickened by the fact that 0.0 alliances - the only coherent and decently organised powerblocs - had failed for the previous CSMs to act according to their weight of numbers.


Democracy is defined by the people who vote. In exchange for his leadership, we got the mittani some free trips to iceland with his buddies. If you have a problem with that, simply get 2000 in game accounts to vote for you, if that is hard for you then I guess you need to re assess your position in the game.

Cannig Tol
Minmatar
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:41:00 - [127]
 

Heh. I personally bought 3 months of game time for each of my 8 accounts through the buddy-plex system. 32 votes for my guy at no extra cost to myself - since I would have spent that isk on game time in the long run.

(time value of isk not withstanding)

You too, can game the system. This time - we won.

Manofwarr
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:50:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: Jane Bennet
It's interesting the number of votes cast is split into a "30-250 day" age bracket. Why can't we see a "30-60 day" age bracket, to show how many PLEX were spent on buying votes? (buddy program + PLEX = 51-day old voters, normal free trial + PLEX = 44 day old voters).

Anyway, gz to Goons, you won EVE. My three accounts have been unsubscribed ("OMG HOW CAN YOU STILL POAST??!!?!" Well the paid subscription time hasn't run out yet), and probably won't open again. I paid to play EVE, not to play GOONs, to paraphrase an old Goon battlecry.


The most delicious of tears.....

Manofwarr
Posted - 2011.03.28 17:53:00 - [129]
 

Originally by: EnderCapitalG
Originally by: Ponder Stuff
Simple answer.... Bring Down NC and the Goons with them......


Please? I'd like a good war right about now.


Absolutely. We haven't had much to do since kicking Evoke around and bringing down BOB II or IT or whatever they called themselves.

I fleet of horribly fit, ramshackle low/high sec pilots blundering their way around nullsec would be worth every isk I have just to watch....

Jane Bennet
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:07:00 - [130]
 

Originally by: Manofwarr
The most delicious of tears.....


It's not tears, simply acknowledgement of Goon victory. Grow up.

Cannig Tol
Minmatar
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:17:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Jane Bennet

Grow up.



From the person cancelling their game accounts because an irrelevant player elected body was not dominated by people you like.

:irony:

Jane Bennet
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:22:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: Cannig Tol
From the person cancelling their game accounts because an irrelevant player elected body was not dominated by people you like.

That's not why I canceled my account. Next contestant!

Kno Bodeesbitch
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:26:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: Sader Rykane
Why does it feel like the Republicans won?


Ummmm...cuz you live under a rock? Rolling Eyes

The Mittani is a socialist....

Cannig Tol
Minmatar
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:28:00 - [134]
 

Originally by: Jane Bennet

Anyway, gz to Goons, you won EVE. My three accounts have been unsubscribed ("OMG HOW CAN YOU STILL POAST??!!?!" Well the paid subscription time hasn't run out yet), and probably won't open again. I paid to play EVE, not to play GOONs, to paraphrase an old Goon battlecry.

.
.
.
Originally by: Jane Bennet
Originally by: Cannig Tol
From the person cancelling their game accounts because an irrelevant player elected body was not dominated by people you like.

That's not why I canceled my account. Next contestant!



heh

EnderCapitalG
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:34:00 - [135]
 

Originally by: Jane Bennet
Originally by: Cannig Tol
From the person cancelling their game accounts because an irrelevant player elected body was not dominated by people you like.

That's not why I canceled my account. Next contestant!


Why did you mention and put such emphasis on it?

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:38:00 - [136]
 

Originally by: Cannig Tol
This time - we won.


What exactly do you think you've won? I'm not sure it has as much value as you think it has.

C.

Tollo Arfran
Posted - 2011.03.28 18:49:00 - [137]
 

CSM controlled by Mittani and the NC..... Crying or Very sad

Randem Salvo
Wraith.Wing
Wildly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2011.03.28 22:12:00 - [138]
 

TEH GOONS SI BOOGEYMAN! HIDE UNDER UR BEDZ!

WOE IS MEEEEEEEEE.

Skyrnor
Minmatar
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.28 23:43:00 - [139]
 

SOMETHING AWFUL DOT COM

Cannig Tol
Minmatar
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.28 23:47:00 - [140]
 

Originally by: Cailais
Originally by: Cannig Tol
This time - we won.


What exactly do you think you've won? I'm not sure it has as much value as you think it has.

C.



We won an election? Sorry, was that unclear?

The election is of minimal value beyond letting 8 friends have a free trip to iceland to have a good time. I fear the people placing great value on the CSM seats are those running for the hills about the goon attack.

It was minimal hassle for us to vote as directed, and achieved something more important than the CSM seat - outrage and angryposting.


Kno Bodeesbitch
Posted - 2011.03.29 04:45:00 - [141]
 

Originally by: Cannig Tol
We won an election? Sorry, was that unclear?

The election is of minimal value beyond letting 8 friends have a free trip to iceland to have a good time. I fear the people placing great value on the CSM seats are those running for the hills about the goon attack.

It was minimal hassle for us to vote as directed, and achieved something more important than the CSM seat - outrage and angryposting.




The thing I respect about the the "New Goons" is that they very often tell the truth. Starting with The Mittani informing the voters they were a "bunch of suckers". By voting him in you show you are.

Here is another Goon telling you straight up that they are here to cheapen your Eve experience. Congrats to the Goons on another "Winning Eve" moment.
By appealing to the lowest common denominator you have risen to the top of the food chain. Genious.

Elzon1
Caldari
Shadow Boys Corp
Bloodbound.
Posted - 2011.03.29 06:00:00 - [142]
 

Originally by: Meissa Anunthiel
Congratulations to the winners, and thanks to everyone who ran!

This is certainly going to be an interesting CSM...

Meissa, CSM 2, 3, 4, 5... and 6! \o/


Congrats Meissa Anunthiel, seems people like a balanced representative. I am glad to be one of the 2,086 who voted for you.

Aside from the congratulations, what are your thoughts on this blog: Linkage

Do you think they will accomplish the stated goals?

What is the basis for your answer?

Do you generally think this is a positive or negative move in terms of nullsec?

Do you think such a change is balanced?

What do you think of the playerbase's reaction to the blog?

Is there anything you would like to add to such changes?

Dalketh
Posted - 2011.03.29 06:30:00 - [143]
 

This is exactly what the problem is with the new CSM... Goons 'directed' to vote.... ordered in other words. Sorry I understand people winning by number of votes, but when a faction has thousands of votes to 'direct', it is not representative of eve as a whole. No - not crying or giving tears, but it is a sad thing. It makes it a farce. I supported the last CSM and thought they did well. This one is growing pains that CCP should take a lesson from at the best.

Originally by: Cannig Tol

It was minimal hassle for us to vote as directed


Kireiina
Posted - 2011.03.29 07:06:00 - [144]
 

Edited by: Kireiina on 29/03/2011 07:07:14
You have a serious misunderstanding if you think an "executive order" will have goons acting in lockstep or against their own interests. If they voted for Mittani / Vile Rat (I did) it's because they believe that those are capable people.

If you think they're going to turn the game into some "goon playground" then you have a critical misunderstanding in how limited the power of the CSM is. Go and read the Mittani's election thread where he *tells* you this.

Dibble Dabble
Posted - 2011.03.29 11:18:00 - [145]
 

Once again the alliances win Eve. The CSM is a joke voted for by lemmings and a wealth of new accounts only a month old, paid for by the very same alliances. How odd.

Thankfully this CSM will achieve as much as the other CSM's. F**K ALL.

Until CCP open up and show details of voting profiles (age of account v who they voted for) then most will simply view the election as "rigged" and it will continue to lack any form of credabilty. CCP simply dont have the b**ls to create an open election as they have the alliances firmly in their pocket.




Fuujin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.29 14:51:00 - [146]
 

Edited by: Fuujin on 29/03/2011 14:52:06
Originally by: Dibble Dabble
Once again the alliances win Eve. The CSM is a joke voted for by lemmings and a wealth of new accounts only a month old, paid for by the very same alliances. How odd.

Thankfully this CSM will achieve as much as the other CSM's. F**K ALL.

Until CCP open up and show details of voting profiles (age of account v who they voted for) then most will simply view the election as "rigged" and it will continue to lack any form of credabilty. CCP simply dont have the b**ls to create an open election as they have the alliances firmly in their pocket.



I'll humor you and run with your paranoid delusion that nulsec alliances sunk trillions into PLEX to create a few thousand voting accounts. Yet even if this is true, if even a tenth of the other 300,000 accounts had actually bothered to vote those trillions would have gone to waste. People even got prompted to do so on the login splash screen, in the "newsbar" to the right of the character selection, and on the eve website itself--ignorance of the election is not a credible excuse.

Your claims of overpowering nulsec votes frankly fall flat. If there is an overpowering force in the CSM elections it's voter apathy and laziness.

Cannig Tol
Minmatar
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.29 15:31:00 - [147]
 

Originally by: Dalketh
This is exactly what the problem is with the new CSM... Goons 'directed' to vote.... ordered in other words. Sorry I understand people winning by number of votes, but when a faction has thousands of votes to 'direct', it is not representative of eve as a whole.



0.0 playerbase as a group puts by far the most effort and energy into this game, in the form of diplomacy and logistics, and in the form of assets at risk, metagaming and newsworthy events. Given that, it is inevitable that the immense communication structures, in and out of game, will be put to use in this and all future CSM elections.

Nothing stops you from mobilizing thousands of empire dwellers, beyond their insular communities and disinterest in the CSM. Many of those don't read these forums, or the devblogs. Rather than worry about our ability to block vote, focus on communication with the people who would gain a lot by being involved in eve outside of the actual game itself. Who knows, maybe eve would benefit too?



El'Niaga
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.03.29 16:52:00 - [148]
 

Originally by: Manofwarr
Originally by: Sader Rykane
Why does it feel like the Republicans won?


Because things will start to get fixed.


Yeah like they ran those anom changes across the CSM.....hmm no reports of them in any of their notes.....


Nothing will be fixed, or at least nothing the player's want fixed. The CSM is just a PR move and always was, they have no say in the game, pretty blogs to the contrary don't make it true.

Its the same as it was in SWG, The Senate was told one thing, heck half the devs were kept in the dark about certain projects and then they just did whatever they wanted. It is why it died, and CCP would do well to learn from the past before they repeat it.

Meissa Anunthiel
Redshift Industrial
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2011.03.29 17:32:00 - [149]
 

Originally by: Elzon1
Originally by: Meissa Anunthiel
Congratulations to the winners, and thanks to everyone who ran!

This is certainly going to be an interesting CSM...

Meissa, CSM 2, 3, 4, 5... and 6! \o/


Congrats Meissa Anunthiel, seems people like a balanced representative. I am glad to be one of the 2,086 who voted for you.

Aside from the congratulations, what are your thoughts on this blog: Linkage

Do you think they will accomplish the stated goals?

What is the basis for your answer?

Do you generally think this is a positive or negative move in terms of nullsec?

Do you think such a change is balanced?

What do you think of the playerbase's reaction to the blog?

Is there anything you would like to add to such changes?


I think the underlying objectives of that proposed change go in the desired direction.
Namely, after the implementation of sov upgrades, all systems became "equal" except for ease of logistic and, to a degree, moon value (this still being the one and only deciding factor for alliance placement, as opposed to player placement). Wanting the "good stuff" is one of the conflict drivers. Obviously the downsides is that some systems are therefore worse off...

Making the systems have different intrinsic values gives people something to fight over, but I would have preferred something that wasn't tied to a system's truesec however, mostly because that system has been the basis of people settling this way or that for a long long time, it being the basis for rat value and ore availability already and there's going to be little "new conflicts" generated over this, just a continuation of the old ones. Especially considering the income value from rats & ore is insignificant for an alliance.
In addition to which, the potential for revenue of some regions (providence, syndicate, etc.) who have less "good" truesec systems than others (delve) got seriously nerfed.

The change fails to recognize one thing though, ratting and mining are means of income for individuals, not alliances. So other things have to change to accomplish the desired effect.

I disagree with 2 assertions made in the devblog:
Originally by: devblog

# Newer alliances will have an easier time getting a foothold in nullsec
# Alliances will have to choose more carefully what space they develop, where their staging systems are, and so on (low truesec systems generally tend to be in strategically inconvenient places)


The major downsides to newer alliances settling in 0.0 is not system unavailability, it's that conflicts tend to escalate in size systematically, that there is little needs for "coverage" by small alliances around bigger ones (before moving was as easy as it is now, it was useful to have smaller entities guarding your entrances, so to speak), and strong logistic needs to settling in 0.0 (production in 0.0 is difficult, so equipment has to be ferried from empire) and gathering resources locally is a pain.

The 2nd point (lower truesec being inconveniently placed) is not an issue at all with the current movement abilities at all. For that to become a factor, mobility has to change.

Still, despite the downsides, I believe this change is for the better in its general direction.
If you had asked me, I'd have gone with "comet farming" or some new form of active revenue streams to differentiate the systems.

EnderCapitalG
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.29 18:18:00 - [150]
 

Other than our differing opinions on how "easy" it is to move in 0.0, that was a good post.

Carry on.


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