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Marconus Orion
D00M.
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2011.03.29 11:51:00 - [1381]
 

Originally by: CCP Greyscale
You're seeing this first because it was an obvious target that's relatively easy to implement. We're conducting an ongoing review of nullsec issues at the moment, with items on the agenda including force projection tweaks, conquest mechanic adjustments and improvements to the nullsec industrial landscape.


As you can see, it is not like other issues are not being looked at. So stop QQing all over the place and be try to give feedback that is more than, "FU CCP! I quit!"

Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:05:00 - [1382]
 

The moment CCP rebalances moons, guns and all the other glaring problems with EVE is when I'll shut up. Months ago CCP said they were looking at these problems, 6 months+ later and a lot has changed...


You're new to EVE, stay a while and you'll see the incompetence that is CCP.

Arnakoz
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:05:00 - [1383]
 

this is such a bad idea. i can't believe CCP still insists on going thru with it. ..

to those who think this will be just like pre-dominion - maybe, but only if the insurance goes back up. otherwise, how will people afford living in null? before the loss was minor, now they have anoms to make up for the loss after some number of hours grinding... what will be the recourse after this change? go run missions in hisec? sounds GREAT for null alliances. ...

to those who think people will still live there regardless - have you looked at lowsec lately? these area of null will become as used as those areas. it wont create the desired effect of smaller alliances getting a chance in null. because why do you figure they and their members will bother with the costs of sov/upgrades/outposts if the members are earning the same as they would running level 3's in hisec?

IF the earnings for individuals in null are any less than level 4's people just wont be attracted. its simply not worth the cost/loss/risk.

and to the guy who responded that null livers are all oh so safe in their "sanctums" .... 1. it IS playing smarter, because they do what they can to maximize profits while having to defend their space. this is how it will be no matter what you do tot he game, because those with the deepest pockets tend to win. 2. i suppose that depends on where you live. but being someone who lost everything i owned when PL popped my POS in atlas space, then moving to pure blind with constant griefers/hotdrops... my experience has been that things aren't all quite and safe in null. and if i can't make a good amount of isk for having to deal with this risk/losses + CTAs then i don;t see much of a point in being there. granted i enjoy my alliance mates, so i'll probably stick with them no matter what they decide, just not likely to enjoy the game itself so much anymore. the end result would likely me eventually becoming uninterested.

all in all i think this will change will result in less nullsec activity, less pvp, making it impossible for smaller alliances to ever get a hold of titans etc. and less activity in the game over all.

Horrendous Haddock
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:06:00 - [1384]
 

Originally by: Marconus Orion
As you can see, it is not like other issues are not being looked at. So stop QQing all over the place and be try to give feedback that is more than, "FU CCP! I quit!"


Once again, a request to be quiet while we are ****d. Clearly you have no idea how much planning, effort and investment these changes simply sweep aside like it was meaningless. There is pretty much no need for feedback, these changes have been scheduled.

There never was any time for constructive discussion on the matter, it's done and dusted already. Do you not see how this issue has been flown in under the radar? Is the timing not at all suspicious to you? Are you going to condone that sort of behaviour?

Lenthall Scorpus
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:15:00 - [1385]
 

I've been wondering would posting a petition against this actually make a difference to CCP and make them think before simply implementing this?

Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:24:00 - [1386]
 

A large part of my support comes from an assumption that Greyscale is operating under a similar train of thought to my own, and the strong support I have for this idea comes with the string that it's part of a package deal.

Greyscale, what are your trains of thought on the issues in 0.0? I don't think the sanctum change will do much good if it's implemented on its own. If I'm right about the gameplay that you're pushing the game to evolve into, this change will likely not have the desired effect in and of itself. Your viewpoints and analysis would be much appreciated. Cool

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:28:00 - [1387]
 

Edited by: Cyrus Doul on 29/03/2011 12:44:23
Edited by: Cyrus Doul on 29/03/2011 12:28:27
Originally by: Antihrist Pripravnik
Edited by: Antihrist Pripravnik on 29/03/2011 08:01:15
Originally by: Darth Gustav
Originally by: Antihrist Pripravnik
Don't know who's the moron who claimed that he can get 100M/h from sanctums. Perfect Nighthawk pilot here, 10-12 mil per wallet flash minus corp tax (30-36M/h). I don't believe that you can get three times much, even with a carrier.


I can't remember who it was, but he claimed he used three accounts to achieve this. Carrier/Logi/Salvage combo.

Income per account involved would therefore be more like 33M/h.



hmm... that's still one dps ship. I know that Guristas space have bad loot and salvage, but never thought it was that bad.



If you are talking about my three guys it was 2 carriers with sentry drone damage augmentator rigs, Highs had 3 dcus a piece. Pretty maxxed drone skills. I was dropping 26 t2 sentries (i.e More then a supercarrier) as they do better then fighters as fighters are slow when the bs orbit you and they have to fly back and forth before applying damage where the sentrys just kill and switch instantly. Then the third guy was buzzing around in a Cormorant with a pair of capital shield transfers repping him just in case the rats wanted to be smart and shoot something they could actually kill. the sanctums had a payout of approx 25-30 mil per and the Angel Salvage is insane. You could get along the lines of 12 to 16 million per site with good skills due to trit bar / armour plate drops. With the carriers in the site with me I had a 20k m3 box to store regular loot in too. That adds up too but no where near as much as the salvage. The blood ones in Period basis do a lot better then NC ones too as they dont drop the trit bars as much but you get a lot of armour plates Gurista sanctums suck compared to those.

Also the wallet updates every 20 minutes. And I didnt have to compete for sanctums as I was pretty much the only member on at the time. So warp in. clear, warpout, hit scan and right back in.

If you want to carebear most effectively at this point join mother Russia.

The TradeDude
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:54:00 - [1388]
 

So like 50%++ more of null sec will be empty and without value now...nice!

Jons Laroque
Posted - 2011.03.29 12:57:00 - [1389]
 

This better be a joke, Otherwise my two accounts will be terminated Post patch.... nuff said. Fail More CCP....

TOTALHELLD3ATH
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:04:00 - [1390]
 

I disagree with this change because it assumes the ultimate goal in Eve is to own "the best" space. What about smaller corps that just want a system or 2 and want to fund small roaming gangs. My corp has no aspiration to take over the world, we pvp just for the sake of pvp not to take space. The current system we have allows us to fund that without spending huge amounts of time killing red "+"'s. Now if we stay we have to grind longer to pay sov bills and pay for the pvp ships.

So options seem to be...

1) suck it up and grind more - pew pew less
2) go back to empire and run L4's and pew pew in low sec
3) join blob warfare alliance
4) trade in the PVE ships for Hulks and do the industry upgrade thing (ick)

Anyone have a better idea?

Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:04:00 - [1391]
 

Originally by: Jons Laroque
This better be a joke, Otherwise my two accounts will be terminated Post patch.... nuff said. Fail More CCP....


What game are you here to play?

EVE used to lean pretty hard to the right in this chart, and the level of fun really showed in third party content, comics, flash animations and other things created by that hardcore fanaticism and word of mouth.

I miss the days when Eve felt like it was a hard game. Eve Online is no longer a hard game, and that saddens me. The sanctum nerf has reignited hope that CCP is getting tired of easy mode as well.

Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:07:00 - [1392]
 

Originally by: Cyrus Doul
If you are talking about my three guys it was 2 carriers with sentry drone damage augmentator rigs, Highs had 3 dcus a piece. Pretty maxxed drone skills. I was dropping 26 t2 sentries (i.e More then a supercarrier) as they do better then fighters as fighters are slow when the bs orbit you and they have to fly back and forth before applying damage where the sentrys just kill and switch instantly. Then the third guy was buzzing around in a Cormorant with a pair of capital shield transfers repping him just in case the rats wanted to be smart and shoot something they could actually kill. the sanctums had a payout of approx 25-30 mil per and the Angel Salvage is insane. You could get along the lines of 12 to 16 million per site with good skills due to trit bar / armour plate drops. With the carriers in the site with me I had a 20k m3 box to store regular loot in too. That adds up too but no where near as much as the salvage. The blood ones in Period basis do a lot better then NC ones too as they dont drop the trit bars as much but you get a lot of armour plates Gurista sanctums suck compared to those.

Also the wallet updates every 20 minutes. And I didnt have to compete for sanctums as I was pretty much the only member on at the time. So warp in. clear, warpout, hit scan and right back in.

If you want to carebear most effectively at this point join mother Russia.


100/3=33

Someone could put 10 miners in a belt then claim he's making 300m/hour. He's still only making 30m/account.

Armaos
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:13:00 - [1393]
 

Originally by: Evelgrivion
Originally by: Jons Laroque
This better be a joke, Otherwise my two accounts will be terminated Post patch.... nuff said. Fail More CCP....


What game are you here to play?

EVE used to lean pretty hard to the right in this chart, and the level of fun really showed in third party content, comics, flash animations and other things created by that hardcore fanaticism and word of mouth.

I miss the days when Eve felt like it was a hard game. Eve Online is no longer a hard game, and that saddens me. The sanctum nerf has reignited hope that CCP is getting tired of easy mode as well.


I know what we can do !!! Let's drop the warp to 0 and force everyone to slowboat to the next gate ! Then we will make JF's and JB's go away and people will have a great time escorting freighters in deep 0.0 !!!!

Seriously now, these changes are not making the game harder, they are making accessing the fun part of the game *PvP* harder for the casual gamer.

Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:17:00 - [1394]
 

Edited by: Evelgrivion on 29/03/2011 13:18:56
Originally by: Armaos
Originally by: Evelgrivion
What game are you here to play?

EVE used to lean pretty hard to the right in this chart, and the level of fun really showed in third party content, comics, flash animations and other things created by that hardcore fanaticism and word of mouth.

I miss the days when Eve felt like it was a hard game. Eve Online is no longer a hard game, and that saddens me. The sanctum nerf has reignited hope that CCP is getting tired of easy mode as well.


I know what we can do !!! Let's drop the warp to 0 and force everyone to slowboat to the next gate ! Then we will make JF's and JB's go away and people will have a great time escorting freighters in deep 0.0 !!!!

Seriously now, these changes are not making the game harder, they are making accessing the fun part of the game *PvP* harder for the casual gamer.


That isn't true; making it harder to make money makes it more difficult for casual gamers to use the biggest equipment available. It does not preclude the possibility of PVP.

Frankly, with the slide the game's been going through, I'm not entirely sure I'm against dropping warp to zero, forcing slowboating, and getting rid of freighters and jump freighters anymore.

Arnakoz
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:21:00 - [1395]
 

Originally by: Evelgrivion
Originally by: Jons Laroque
This better be a joke, Otherwise my two accounts will be terminated Post patch.... nuff said. Fail More CCP....


What game are you here to play?

EVE used to lean pretty hard to the right in this chart, and the level of fun really showed in third party content, comics, flash animations and other things created by that hardcore fanaticism and word of mouth.

I miss the days when Eve felt like it was a hard game. Eve Online is no longer a hard game, and that saddens me. The sanctum nerf has reignited hope that CCP is getting tired of easy mode as well.


eh, they wanted more PVP. they wanted the market to be more active. they did it. now they are ruining that.

yes, it will be harder. though, people like you could have always went into W-Space. but apparently you would rather this game be ONLY for hardcore gamers, who will be thus forced to grind much more to continue their pew. not sure how you think this to be good. so, get rid of the casual gamers, and make the game less enjoyable for the hardcore. yup... great idea

Evelgrivion
Gunpoint Diplomacy
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:25:00 - [1396]
 

Edited by: Evelgrivion on 29/03/2011 13:25:27
Originally by: Arnakoz
eh, they wanted more PVP. they wanted the market to be more active. they did it. now they are ruining that.

yes, it will be harder. though, people like you could have always went into W-Space. but apparently you would rather this game be ONLY for hardcore gamers, who will be thus forced to grind much more to continue their pew. not sure how you think this to be good. so, get rid of the casual gamers, and make the game less enjoyable for the hardcore. yup... great idea


Wormhole space is not hardcore. It's very easy to control entry and exit, and traffic through wormhole space in general is extremely low. Once you're entrenched, you're essentially irremovable without an extremely concerted effort.

Combined with probes on overview, low penalty cloaking devices and starbases, and it's very, very difficult to do anything but gank the unwary.

Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:26:00 - [1397]
 

Originally by: Hermosa Diosas
Really? You dont think 39 pages of negativity, warrants a rethink? Nice one..

When it's all crap from people who are desperate to keep their income and alliance alive, then no, it doesn't deserve a rethink.

I personally am looking forward to the conflict when former BFF start arguing over who gets to rat in the good systems, in addition to the reemergence of Providence'esque regions.

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:35:00 - [1398]
 

Originally by: Super Whopper
Originally by: Cyrus Doul
If you are talking about my three guys it was 2 carriers with sentry drone damage augmentator rigs, Highs had 3 dcus a piece. Pretty maxxed drone skills. I was dropping 26 t2 sentries (i.e More then a supercarrier) as they do better then fighters as fighters are slow when the bs orbit you and they have to fly back and forth before applying damage where the sentrys just kill and switch instantly. Then the third guy was buzzing around in a Cormorant with a pair of capital shield transfers repping him just in case the rats wanted to be smart and shoot something they could actually kill. the sanctums had a payout of approx 25-30 mil per and the Angel Salvage is insane. You could get along the lines of 12 to 16 million per site with good skills due to trit bar / armour plate drops. With the carriers in the site with me I had a 20k m3 box to store regular loot in too. That adds up too but no where near as much as the salvage. The blood ones in Period basis do a lot better then NC ones too as they dont drop the trit bars as much but you get a lot of armour plates Gurista sanctums suck compared to those.

Also the wallet updates every 20 minutes. And I didnt have to compete for sanctums as I was pretty much the only member on at the time. So warp in. clear, warpout, hit scan and right back in.

If you want to carebear most effectively at this point join mother Russia.


100/3=33

Someone could put 10 miners in a belt then claim he's making 300m/hour. He's still only making 30m/account.


It takes me 45 minutes to clear a sanctum with 1 carrier and another 15 to salvage. so if we want to divide it like that im still looking at 37-46 million per hour so your 33 is still low. IIRC my original response was how did I make isk in 0.0 pre and post Dominion so the answer is still valid. Plus I only use the guy I am posting with here (My main) to pvp and the 33 mil per hour out of the 100 mil per hour that the other two make just gets funneled to him. I know more people that do this then dont do this in all the corps I have been in, weither low sec, null sec, or high sec so I assume a lot of the game does the same thing.

To be fair the second account was created to haul for the first pre Domi, and the third account was created to salvage for the first two post domi. Now all nine heads have the ability to make t2 ammo and do pi. so between making scorch and running 35 planets out of 45 possible I don't even bother ratting.


Veshta Yoshida
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:35:00 - [1399]
 

Originally by: Armaos
... Seriously now, these changes are not making the game harder, they are making accessing the fun part of the game *PvP* harder for the casual gamer.

Just how much ISK do you need to PvP?

I have lost (according to killboard) 14B since FW started but my wallet is only 1B lighter than at start.
I ran missions for an hour a day the first two weeks but other than that between loot and the odd belt my wallet is fairly stable.

Granted, it is mostly HAC and down and not leet null Drakes Smile, but then I haven't insured a ship in over four years so I reckon it evens out.
That is at market prices, I do not have a big daddy alliance to make my stuff at cost .. perhaps the real issue is with your wholesaler being greedy.

Makumba Aki
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:40:00 - [1400]
 

Originally by: CCP Greyscale
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
Hey everyone,

It'd be pretty difficult not to notice the fairly strong negative reaction this blog's getting so far, and any time this sort of reaction occurs it's pretty common policy for us to take a pause and do another evaluation pass on the design, taking into account the arguments raised by players. Obviously we're in the middle of fanfest right now so everything takes a little longer than usual, but I'm going to talk to some people tomorrow, get some other perspectives, and figure out whether or not we're still happy with both the direction and the details here.

We are starting to take another serious look at a range of nullsec issues right now, with an eye to fixing structural issues with the current design. Be aware that fixing the problems we're facing is very likely going to involve disrupting the current status quo, and in at least some cases I'm expecting us to push through changes we're confident in despite (expected) negative feedback. We have to consider the long-term big picture, and that priority may sometimes conflict with the immediate interests of some elements of the playerbase. That said, this may or may not be one of those occasions - watch this space.

Have a nice weekend everybody, and I'll try and get back to you with more info next week
-Greyscale


Hi again,

Update on the above post: we've looked at the concerns brought up here, and done another evaluation pass as mentioned above. The outcome of this is that, while we understand and appreciate that these changes will negatively impact residents in some areas of space in the short term, we feel that on balance they are still likely to result in a noticeably positive overall outcome in the long run. This decision is mainly predicated on the fact that we still have a sufficient degree of confidence in our models of nullsec causality.

We understand that many players have alternate models that predict negative outcomes; we will of course be monitoring developments post-deployment to confirm whether or not things are developing in the way we are predicting, with an eye to modifying the proposed system if we see unexpected negative outcomes occurring, but we don't believe that the arguments raised by players in this thread weaken our model sufficiently to justify changing our plans at this stage.

We appreciate that this decision is not going to be regarded as a positive one by most participants of this thread, and we of course respect your right to continue to express your previously-noted disapproval here in a civil manner.

That's all for today,
-Greyscale


Would you at least be so kind to explain us your model of null sec?

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:42:00 - [1401]
 

Originally by: Evelgrivion
Edited by: Evelgrivion on 29/03/2011 13:25:27
Originally by: Arnakoz
eh, they wanted more PVP. they wanted the market to be more active. they did it. now they are ruining that.

yes, it will be harder. though, people like you could have always went into W-Space. but apparently you would rather this game be ONLY for hardcore gamers, who will be thus forced to grind much more to continue their pew. not sure how you think this to be good. so, get rid of the casual gamers, and make the game less enjoyable for the hardcore. yup... great idea


Wormhole space is not hardcore. It's very easy to control entry and exit, and traffic through wormhole space in general is extremely low. Once you're entrenched, you're essentially irremovable without an extremely concerted effort.

Combined with probes on overview, low penalty cloaking devices and starbases, and it's very, very difficult to do anything but gank the unwary.


Actually agreeing with Evel for once. Maybe media coverage has just dropped off to a point where no one knows of anything happening there any more. But it used to be the only times you heard of someone getting kicked from w-space was overwhelming numbers as I had happen when my 30 man corp got booted by Rionnang Alba when they were at 250 members, or Apeture Harmonics exploiting and when ccp stopped that you suddenly stopped hearing anywhere near as much about how awesome they are.

WH space is decidedly less dangerous then even npc 0.0 kspace

Commander Hold
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:43:00 - [1402]
 

Yes I am sure the only ones that are happy are the old holders of provi. Once again they will be able to claim their useless space back with out contest. Its the only way they can get it back is when its useless and no one wants it.

Killin Kittens
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:52:00 - [1403]
 

Rakshasa, most of the conflict you're wondering about will go like this...
Our Corp "our space sucks and we can't afford the rent you've imposed on us for use of this area."
SOV Holder "so?"
Our Corp "we would like (x) system because that will give us close to a break even where we were at"
SOV Holder "that's 3x the rent you were paying... it's occupied already BTW and there is a waiting list of 9 other corps that have all been screwed out of the upgrades they worked so hard to install... the upside is most are leaving for level 4's... so just sit and hang out for a bit and maybe the 5 that are left can share it... lest we remind you any action against an alliance member will be acted upon by the whole of the alliance."
Our Corp "well that sucks"
SOV Holder "we could titan drop you if you don't like waiting..."
Individual corp members now make arrangements to go back to Level 4's in high sec.
Other corp members simply say FU CCP, and find the Cancel Subscription button.

True story. Happening as we speak.

I guess the in fighting CCP was hoping for isn't going to happen in this case as the corps holding SOV over the good areas they do want to rent out are bigger than any corp they're renting too... even if we band together... get 51% more DPS than the SOV holder battle it out and secure a system (somehow)... how are the 51% expected to recoup losses to hold that position with ONE descent system?

Oh... and the SOV holder... with the other 5 good systems, moogoo production and solid income rebuilds and spanks us all into dust. We go to high sec and see if we can chisel out a win from empty worthless 0.0 space again later.

Or... we just keep what we've obtained and go to high sec now. Less losses. Maybe CCP will grow a brain and figure out people won't stay in 0.0 for all the danger but none of the income to support the losses. 0.0 will become vacant again.

In comes CCP's "lets populate 0.0 space" plan #2
The CCP says... huh... it stabilized again... bring in the "screw them over" plan #2, maybe they'll fight more...

Lather rinse repeat.

I'm not going to pay for that BS of being toyed with.

Jayne Khamsi
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:52:00 - [1404]
 

Edited by: Jayne Khamsi on 29/03/2011 13:52:21
'Im betting this is to get people to buy more PLEX cards... Greedy b*stards! Nerfed Income = More money for CCP... Have fun I'm on to newer better games!

Green Cobra
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:53:00 - [1405]
 

If CCP realy do execute these changes is it will more or less be unpossible for many null players to stay in null and fund any pvp fun without an alt in empire grinding lvl4 missions. How the hell does that benefit anyone if null goes to that?

For me personaly I can't stay in null if there's not a way to me ends meed with a few hours total game time day. Some that don't have work and familys might be able to sit and grind for half a day with any problems but we vets that have been in the game a long time can't. Mad

So why are CCP giving us the short stick? Either they don't give a rats ass about us wets and want nubs crawling all over null in friggs and crusers fighting or they just want all to move south wich won't do matters any better. Then you will end up with a new BOB type of aliance... Wich none want. ugh

So I sugest CCP take a LOOOOOONGH time to think this over. It's not like CCP will have easy time to replace us vets if we deside that eve have gone down the drain and quit all together.

Why not be happy that for once casual gaming in nullsec is possible for the most of the null sec playerbase?

Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2011.03.29 13:57:00 - [1406]
 

Originally by: Commander Hold
Yes I am sure the only ones that are happy are the old holders of provi. Once again they will be able to claim their useless space back with out contest. Its the only way they can get it back is when its useless and no one wants it.

That is a contradiction... If no one is interested in the space, then no one is willing to claim it.

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2011.03.29 14:06:00 - [1407]
 

Edited by: Cyrus Doul on 29/03/2011 14:08:55
Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab
Originally by: Commander Hold
Yes I am sure the only ones that are happy are the old holders of provi. Once again they will be able to claim their useless space back with out contest. Its the only way they can get it back is when its useless and no one wants it.

That is a contradiction... If no one is interested in the space, then no one is willing to claim it.


starburst is a contradiction too! CVA would retake provi in a heart beat. It's their mother land and i doubt they care about 5 billion a month in so fees plus whatever they put in strat mod wise. When we rolled it originally every other system had a CSAA tower in there. The ones paying the bills were definately not doing it with ratting...
Did the math. To cyno gen, CSAA and JB all 84 systems cost 37 billion, thats 1 titan worth of profit per month. 7 or so for motherships. and we all know that those things sell like hotcakes.

Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2011.03.29 14:13:00 - [1408]
 

Originally by: Killin Kittens
Rakshasa, most of the conflict you're wondering about will go like this...
Our Corp "our space sucks and we can't afford the rent you've imposed on us for use of this area."
SOV Holder "so?"
Our Corp "we would like (x) system because that will give us close to a break even where we were at"
SOV Holder "that's 3x the rent you were paying... it's occupied already BTW and there is a waiting list of 9 other corps that have all been screwed out of the upgrades they worked so hard to install... the upside is most are leaving for level 4's... so just sit and hang out for a bit and maybe the 5 that are left can share it... lest we remind you any action against an alliance member will be acted upon by the whole of the alliance."
Our Corp "well that sucks"
SOV Holder "we could titan drop you if you don't like waiting..."
Individual corp members now make arrangements to go back to Level 4's in high sec.
Other corp members simply say FU CCP, and find the Cancel Subscription button.

With the bot-nerfs coming, I can quite easily see how the rents can be quite hard to achieve.

BTW, the past 3 years my corp has been in many 0.0 regions living on scraps if needed. But those were always non-renting relationships, and through those times we've been on the receiving end of a more powerful entity swinging its **** around. Yet not only did we survive, we prospered.

This change makes me happy because it nerfs renter-heaven, but boosts the hardy independents out to make their mark. The kind of corp we were back then.

If the above conversation represents reality, I say; GOOD. Get ****ed, have the renter paradise collapse, go back to high-sec and run those new dynamic effective quality agents. Leaving room for one, just one more corp of new but dedicated and resourceful players the chance of living in a backwaters system, gradually building their skill, ISK and connections as they climb up the foodchain...

It is quite frankly worth more than 10 carebear corps renting space from big alliance.

It is... What EVE is supposed to be.

Sannye
Posted - 2011.03.29 14:17:00 - [1409]
 

Greyscale, dont think for a second that EVE is the only game on the market.

The way this change is beeing pushed through (in the middle of a CSM election) really tells us players that you really dont give a damn about our "feedback".

You messed up with dominion, and now your are removing one of the 2 items that actually worked in that fail of an update. The other thing that DOES work, is the fleetfinder - everyting else has been, and is, utterly fail.

Remove it - and remove EVERYTHING in the dominion patch. No ISK in upkeep pr system claimed SOV in. No upgrades to your system AT ALL!
POS will deciede who has sov.

If you remove one item, remove the lot. If not, then leave it alone.

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2011.03.29 14:52:00 - [1410]
 

Originally by: Sannye
Greyscale, dont think for a second that EVE is the only game on the market.

The way this change is beeing pushed through (in the middle of a CSM election) really tells us players that you really dont give a damn about our "feedback".

You messed up with dominion, and now your are removing one of the 2 items that actually worked in that fail of an update. The other thing that DOES work, is the fleetfinder - everyting else has been, and is, utterly fail.

Remove it - and remove EVERYTHING in the dominion patch. No ISK in upkeep pr system claimed SOV in. No upgrades to your system AT ALL!
POS will deciede who has sov.

If you remove one item, remove the lot. If not, then leave it alone.


Rollback to apoc.


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