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Extreme
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.09 14:47:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Extreme on 09/03/2011 14:58:20

If you read this Eve24news article you will understand better why you should vote for Ms PacMan.

In her platform she wants to fix the kartels/renterspace in Eve.

Let me quote some out of this Eve24news article:

Quote:
... it now appears that Iskbank.com made approximately $290,000 in sales for the 10-1/2-month period. These figures do not include any sales made through their sister site, Eveisk.ru and yes, those are US Dollars.


Quote:
Based in Chişinău, the capital of Moldova, Iskbank.com has been operating in its current incarnation since December of 2009

Quote:
They appear to also operate eveisk.ru, a Russian-language mirror of Iskbank.com.


Quote:
As of March 4, the data indicates that they had more than 2 trillion ISK and 5,540 PLEX (worth approximately 1.9 trillion ISK by current values or about $82,800 in game time value), along with relatively large stockpiles of faction ships, high-end implants and characters


Their long list of clients.


I just wished this article would had come out a little sooner as it underscribes my campaign ugh

So, if you have a character left you still can vote with, then vote for Ms PacMan

Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.09 18:42:00 - [2]
 

It's pointless to vote for other issues before fixing the iskbank issue

Gertrud ToD
Terrorists of Dimensions
Electric Monkey Overlords
Posted - 2011.03.09 18:47:00 - [3]
 

how is this related to renters?
how do you think you can fix this?

Mister Rocknrolla
Posted - 2011.03.09 19:14:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Mister Rocknrolla on 09/03/2011 19:43:29
Originally by: other thread
ALLIANCE CORPCOUNT CHARCOUNT US$

--------------------------------------------------------------
Wildly Inappropriate. 8 12 $5,050.12
Vera Cruz Alliance 3 7 $3,276.49
Cascade Associates 2 6 $2,489.38
Goonswarm Federation 6 8 $2,222.43
-Mostly Harmless- 5 11 $1,891.67
Freelancer Coalition 2 3 $1,754.85
Imperial 0rder 4 6 $1,436.72
C0NVICTED 2 5 $1,390.82
Shadow of xXDEATHXx 1 2 $1,369.98
The Devil's Warrior Alliance 1 3 $1,272.18


Candidate comments?

Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.09 20:42:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Ms PacMan on 10/03/2011 01:11:39

Originally by: Gertrud ToD
how is this related to renters?
how do you think you can fix this?


Originally by: Mister Rocknrolla
Edited by: Mister Rocknrolla on 09/03/2011 19:43:29
Originally by: other thread
ALLIANCE CORPCOUNT CHARCOUNT US$

--------------------------------------------------------------
Wildly Inappropriate. 8 12 $5,050.12
Vera Cruz Alliance 3 7 $3,276.49
Cascade Associates 2 6 $2,489.38
Goonswarm Federation 6 8 $2,222.43
-Mostly Harmless- 5 11 $1,891.67
Freelancer Coalition 2 3 $1,754.85
Imperial 0rder 4 6 $1,436.72
C0NVICTED 2 5 $1,390.82
Shadow of xXDEATHXx 1 2 $1,369.98
The Devil's Warrior Alliance 1 3 $1,272.18


Candidate comments?



These Real Money Trades RMT and the list of of who bought isk this way and how it is related to renters...


Here's my view on this:

The isk that they sell, like to the people who are listed, has to come from somewhere.
I assume they also sell PLEX for real money but then cheaper than CCP does.


This is a speculation:
They invested money, buying isk, in order to create such a power in game so they can create a powervacuum.
Next is they make 'settlements' by alliances renting space from them.
The area's they control will get so large and the isk income will get so high that they will be able to whitewash these isk's for real money and make huge profits.
How they whitewash it can be various.




Rentspace /settlements will prevent anyone to get access to nullsec any other way than renting space.
Any other way, say PVP, will be a fight like Papuans vs the Russian Army.

Part of the solution:
By replacing the current way systems are being rented out for a by CCP controlled rent-system , like in game rent-slots (and put a limit on the number of slots) and edit the EULA that any other way to rent out space to others will be a violation of the EULA, you can break open this vacuum.

Now larger numbers of corps and alliances from empire won't be 'Papuans' anymore and can actually fight their way into nullsec and obtain space.
While they obtain more space the powerblocks will lose more ways of making income (R64/R32)

More numbers of indepandants in nullsec will cause to make it harder for the powerblocks to maintain their (illegal) way of making (real) money.

A perfect example of this in real life is currently Libia and the revolt that is going on there against Kadaffi.
He controlled his 'nullsec' and made trillions of oil dollars but now the people are taking over. In a even more wider aspect it happened in Tunesia and Egypt first, with success.

What CCP has to do right now is to freeze all these people's (corp) wallets while they are being investigated (the people who are being listed buying isk in violation of the EULA).


Note that i am not accusing any alliance about the above.
I leave the answers to that to CCP

The Mittani
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.09 20:45:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Mister Rocknrolla
Edited by: Mister Rocknrolla on 09/03/2011 19:43:29
Originally by: other thread
ALLIANCE CORPCOUNT CHARCOUNT US$

--------------------------------------------------------------
Wildly Inappropriate. 8 12 $5,050.12
Vera Cruz Alliance 3 7 $3,276.49
Cascade Associates 2 6 $2,489.38
Goonswarm Federation 6 8 $2,222.43
-Mostly Harmless- 5 11 $1,891.67
Freelancer Coalition 2 3 $1,754.85
Imperial 0rder 4 6 $1,436.72
C0NVICTED 2 5 $1,390.82
Shadow of xXDEATHXx 1 2 $1,369.98
The Devil's Warrior Alliance 1 3 $1,272.18


Candidate comments?



Only 8 buyers out of 5800 in my alliance? p. happy about that

****'em, ban'em

Imigo Montoya
Wildly Inappropriate
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.09 22:25:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: The Mittani
Originally by: Mister Rocknrolla
Edited by: Mister Rocknrolla on 09/03/2011 19:43:29
Originally by: other thread
ALLIANCE CORPCOUNT CHARCOUNT US$

--------------------------------------------------------------
Wildly Inappropriate. 8 12 $5,050.12
Vera Cruz Alliance 3 7 $3,276.49
Cascade Associates 2 6 $2,489.38
Goonswarm Federation 6 8 $2,222.43
-Mostly Harmless- 5 11 $1,891.67
Freelancer Coalition 2 3 $1,754.85
Imperial 0rder 4 6 $1,436.72
C0NVICTED 2 5 $1,390.82
Shadow of xXDEATHXx 1 2 $1,369.98
The Devil's Warrior Alliance 1 3 $1,272.18


Candidate comments?



Only 8 buyers out of 5800 in my alliance? p. happy about that

****'em, ban'em


I would have to agree - any accounts found engaged in RMT and can be conclusively proven as such should be hit with the banhammer.

Also RMT is a separate issue to nullsec rental space, although they are linked simply by the fact that RMT activities need to be funded somehow.

Extreme
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.09 22:37:00 - [8]
 

It's quite delicate that a CSM candidate his alt has been discovered in that list.

And it's even more delicate if you find out who that is, but i am for sure not going to give that away.

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2011.03.09 23:18:00 - [9]
 

I sincerely hope that Eve24News' first action was to inform the authorities when they were handed the database dump ..

Hacking is rather heavily frowned upon and if the allegations that it was done in order to blackmail individuals/corps then the perpetrator is facing a pretty hefty prison sentence.
If Eve24 did not inform the authorities (no, CCP are not the authorities) and publishes the information on an add supported public space (ie. making money off it) then they too are going to need lawyers.

Seeing as Eve24 were so kind as to provide pretty much all the evidence needed for successful prosecution I'd say the case will be very swift, so good luck to them.

On topic: Why vote for a platform wanting what is already there?
CCP already has an RMT taskforce perma-camping the logs but are, due to the nature of the beast, always two steps behind .. throwing more money/resources at the problem will not solve it any faster.


Imigo Montoya
Wildly Inappropriate
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.09 23:55:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Extreme
It's quite delicate that a CSM candidate his alt has been discovered in that list.

And it's even more delicate if you find out who that is, but i am for sure not going to give that away.


That's not delicate, that's grounds for ineligibility for CSM plain and simple, regardless of who it is and what (in-game) position they hold.

Di Mulle
Posted - 2011.03.09 23:59:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Ms PacMan
[

Part of the solution:
By replacing the current way systems are being rented out for a by CCP controlled rent-system , like in game rent-slots (and put a limit on the number of slots) and edit the EULA that any other way to rent out space to others will be a violation of the EULA, you can break open this vacuum.

Now larger numbers of corps and alliances from empire won't be 'Papuans' anymore and can actually fight their way into nullsec and obtain space.
While they obtain more space the powerblocks will lose more ways of making income (R64/R32)

More numbers of indepandants in nullsec will cause to make it harder for the powerblocks to maintain their (illegal) way of making (real) money.

A perfect example of this in real life is currently Libia and the revolt that is going on their against Kadaffi.
He controlled his 'nullsec' and made trillions of oil dollars but now the people are taking over. In a even more wider aspect it happened in Tunesia and Egypt first, with success.




Sorry for the harsh words, your proposal is absolutely delusional.

Not even speaking about obvious ways to work-around any artificial limit put on the interaction of groups - purpose-made sister alliances, etc.

Simplyfing things a bit, some small alliance is either renter or being shot. Now, you want to forbid some alliance A to rent space to alliance B, because it ran out of "game-rent slots". Are you going to forbid alliance A to shoot alliance B? and, say, ask for ransom for not being shot ?

EULA, you'd say ? Congrats, instead of "game-rent slots" you just have instituted "shooting right slots".

Ironically enough, your Libya analogue pretty demonstrates what things you are not getting. People are "taking over" not because some higher authority changed an EULA for Kaddafi and he ran out of "oil slots".

Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.10 01:15:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Di Mulle


Ironically enough, your Libya analogue pretty demonstrates what things you are not getting. People are "taking over" not because some higher authority changed an EULA for Kaddafi and he ran out of "oil slots".


This part you are mixing up.


To be more clear,

In the last 2 years the player-base increased significantly.
A lot of these players should be made able to 'storm' into nullsec.
Meanwhile you have to limit the options for the "umbrella alliance" in his ways to rent out space but. You will need to give them this option for now at least for a transition period of time.

About Kadaffi, and "oil slots" Kadaffi already cashed trillions of dollars/euros, the people will take over 'his' country, his source of constant income. Meanwhile countries are freezing his bank accounts.

In Eve, people have to take space massively and CCP should freeze the (corp) wallets of every individual that is under investigation.


Di Mulle
Posted - 2011.03.10 07:48:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Ms PacMan
[
In the last 2 years the player-base increased significantly.
A lot of these players should be made able to 'storm' into nullsec.
Meanwhile you have to limit the options for the "umbrella alliance" in his ways to rent out space but. You will need to give them this option for now at least for a transition period of time.



You can't do that without forbidding players to shoot other players, i.e. stopping what EVE is. Simple as it is.

Again, a bit oversimplyfying, If I am not renting - I am shooting. Any limitation on this effectively means consensual PVP.

Originally by: Ms PacMan
About Kadaffi, and "oil slots" Kadaffi already cashed trillions of dollars/euros, the people will take over 'his' country, his source of constant income. Meanwhile countries are freezing his bank accounts.


Yeah, people will take over (or not, this is offtopic however), but not because some supreme being changed the EULA, but, we may say, people themselves are changing it. Other countries in this analogy are neighbour alliances.

Originally by: Ms PacMan
In Eve, people have to take space massively and CCP should freeze the (corp) wallets of every individual that is under investigation.




Please elaborate, investigation about what - RMT or shooting others ?

Trebor Daehdoow
Gallente
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2011.03.10 09:53:00 - [14]
 

196 different alliances tainted. The ones with the most offenders were:

-Mostly Harmless-
Goonswarm Federation
Intrepid Crossing
Ivy League
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Wildly Inappropriate.

Each with about 6-8.

No The Initiative, Initiative Mercenaries, or Initiative Associates members, I am happy to say.

As for my personal opinion, that's simple: RMT, and the botting that fuels it, is a plague that needs more attention. I've been telling CCP that since the June Summit, and it looks like they're finally putting more resources into the issue.

One of my suggestions to CCP was that they engage a forensic accountant to help them develop better ways to detect ISK laundering.

Admiral Feelgood
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.10 10:13:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: Admiral Feelgood on 10/03/2011 10:15:25
I wouldn't start celebrating just because your friends names aren't on this particular list. This was just the database from one of many isk selling websites and it's quite possible that all your friends just buy from somewhere else.

edit: Not to mention that I'm kind of angry that you would use the actions of 8 people out of a group of over 5 thousand as some kind of "taint" on the rest. It's kind of disrespectful in my opinion.

Extreme
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.10 19:41:00 - [16]
 

RMT

PC l0adletter
Posted - 2011.03.10 19:54:00 - [17]
 

Most of these transactions appear to have been to throwaway chars where the isk was transferred a second time. Consequently, any self-back-patting for not having your people on the list is pretty premature.

Nobani
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.10 20:35:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Nobani on 10/03/2011 20:38:29
Originally by: Trebor Daehdoow
196 different alliances tainted. The ones with the most offenders were:

[Inaccurate list snipped]



Your list is inaccurate, at least according to the copy of the sheet I had access to. The 10 top offenders are, from most to least:
1) Unaffilliated (1719)
2) Wildly Inappropriate. (12)
3) -Mostly Harmless- (11)
4) Dead On Arrival Alliance (11)
5) Test Alliance Please Ignore (11)
6) Ivy League (10)
7) Intrepid Crossing (9)
8) Goonswarm Federation (8)
9) Vera Cruz Alliance (7)
10) Intergalactic Exports Group (7)

Generalizing the prevalence of RMT in any alliance from this list is problematic since a client list from a single English language website is prone to systematic bias, and the number of people RMTing on their in-alliance characters is insignificant compared with the number of people trading on unaffiliated characters.

Trebor Daehdoow
Gallente
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2011.03.10 20:44:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Nobani
Generalizing the prevalence of RMT in any alliance from this list is problematic since a client list from a single English language website is prone to systematic bias, and the number of people RMTing on their in-alliance characters is insignificant compared with the number of people trading on unaffiliated characters.

An excellent point. And sorry for the minor mistakes in my list, I just did a quick hand count of a list I made sorted by alliance, and missed a few.

It should also be noted that quite a few of the unaffiliated toons were likely laundry-alts.

Extreme
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.11 22:05:00 - [20]
 

Seems my corp has been rejected rentspace "for political reasons"

I will try to find a clarification on these political reasons.

Seems to me that if you are not involved in any 'EULA violation' that you have no political reasons.

I will not hand out details on this matter (yet).

This underscribes the need for MS PacMan to get into the Council!!!

Not Kalle Demos
Amarr
Hedion University
Posted - 2011.03.11 23:12:00 - [21]
 

The questions you should be asking is

1. How did ISKBank get away with RMT for so long freely without CCP doing anything?

2. Why are NC buying the most ISK?

3. Why the sudden interest on ISKBank? ;)

I did make a thread about this exaplaining all of the above but NC devs deleted the thread

Gehen Sealbreaker
Amarr
Posted - 2011.03.12 11:07:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Extreme


If you read this Eve24news article you will understand better why you should vote for Ms PacMan.

In her platform she wants to fix the kartels/renterspace in Eve.


I fail to see your point. I doubt there is any candidate in favor of RMT.
Besides, you should post this kind of things with Ms PacMan. Not all the people know that she's your alt. :/

Extreme
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.12 11:39:00 - [23]
 

Edited by: Extreme on 12/03/2011 11:51:15

Originally by: Gehen Sealbreaker
Originally by: Extreme


If you read this Eve24news article you will understand better why you should vote for Ms PacMan.

In her platform she wants to fix the kartels/renterspace in Eve.


I fail to see your point. I doubt there is any candidate in favor of RMT.
Besides, you should post this kind of things with Ms PacMan. Not all the people know that she's your alt. :/



In the platform it has been declared that Ms PacMan is an alt of Extreme and also explained why.



Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.12 16:29:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Ms PacMan on 12/03/2011 16:45:55

Today Ms PacMan will be interviewed by Eve Uni (approx 19.00 hrs Evetime) and will also be one of the four guests at debate 4 of lostineve

Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.12 19:51:00 - [25]
 

I thank Eve Uni for their time, you are a great group of people.

I enjoyed being with you taking and answering your questions

Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.13 01:07:00 - [26]
 

I thank lostineve.net for having me at debate 4.

Podcast of this debate will be released monday march 15.


Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.14 23:09:00 - [27]
 

here's the podcast of debate #4 hosted by Lost in Eve.net where i was one of the four guests

Ms PacMan
Caldari
Eye of God
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.03.18 00:25:00 - [28]
 

i plead for a different way of elections for next year:

I like to see a new setup:

4 CSM candidates get into CSM by players votes

3 CSM candidates will get into CSM by 'Jury' (CCP), based on any criteria that the Jury may have.

2 CSM members of the current running CSM can get pushed forward by the other councillors (internal vote) for continuation purposes. (rule: The CSM members that made use of this option cannot make use of this option twice in a row)


* more guarantee on quality of CSM
* less chance on 'CSM blocks'
* improved continuation

* not everyone with the best skills and plans are capable running campaign as it should or lack campaigning skills.
Pick by Jury will be fair for this group of candidates.

Pirokobo
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.18 01:57:00 - [29]
 

Edited by: Pirokobo on 18/03/2011 01:58:00
Originally by: Ms PacMan
i plead for a different way of elections for next year:


So in other words, take away the majority of the chairs from the electorate because the electorate outnumbers you.

There shall be no House of Lords here.

Doctor Ungabungas
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.03.18 02:32:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Ms PacMan
3 CSM candidates will get into CSM by 'Jury' (CCP), based on any criteria that the Jury may have.


It makes perfect sense for the council that CCP created in response to proven CCP corruption have members on it appointed by CCP.


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