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Jev North
Ghost Festival
Naraka.
Posted - 2011.05.16 23:26:00 - [121]
 

Edited by: Jev North on 16/05/2011 23:26:53
Originally by: Rek Jaiga
How do you believe peace can be provided for me? Or better still, for the entire cluster?

You could find something rewarding to do, rather than attempt to change people's minds over your own. Failing that, someone. Work and love will, I feel, do far more to heal your soul than any kind of direct neuromanipulation. As for the second part of your question, that's for the cluster to worry about, no?

Rek Jaiga
Minmatar
Crimson Path
Posted - 2011.05.16 23:49:00 - [122]
 

Originally by: Jev North
Work and love will, I feel, do far more to heal your soul than any kind of direct neuromanipulation.


I would overwhelmingly agree with this. It's not so much the neuromanipulation I believe in as the effects of it (notably cluster-wide peace, assuming Nation is correct. That's an entirely different subject which I've already spoken on).

Originally by: Jev North

As for the second part of your question, that's for the cluster to worry about, no?

I try to care for more than just myself, my family, or even my race. I tend to concern myself with all people.

I've been told such a way of thinking leads to high blood pressure and substance abuse, among other things.

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.05.17 12:07:00 - [123]
 

It has come to our attention that members of the incursion fleet group known as 'Ditanian Fleet' have, in recent weeks, begun to refuse to assault the nation revenant during nation assaults upon constellations until the CONCORD status update notifies them that the nation force is mobilising prior to retreat.

To the best of our knowledge, nation forces only mobilise when their task in the constellation has been completed. Therefore it is apparent that those within Ditanian Fleet who support this agreement, or were involved in it's creation, are aiding nation.

While we are under no illusion that all members of this group are involved, as we were witness to more than one altercation due to this, it seems that the vast majority were at the very least, choosing to ignore the fact that their self appointed leaders have chosen to allow nation to succeed.

As for the reason:

ISK. These pilots choose to allow nation to complete their tasks, and mobilise in preparation to move on to another constellation due to the fact that under the current system, CONCORD reward them more, for allowing such events to unfold. as they clear more sites within the affected systems before the revenant is destroyed.

While we understand that the system CONCORD has implemented is automated, we also understand that it's intended use was to galvanise capsuleers into an effective force to battle nation, in this respect, it has failed.

Current primary fleets fighting incursions within empire space are using the system as little more than an ISK pool, yes, these fleets fight nation but they do so in a purposefully inefficient manner, and gain larger rewards for this, than if they fought them efficiently. This seems to be a flaw in the design of the system.

Captain Rivel, Shassandra, Ammzi, Drykor, Torash, Shareeth, Kithran.

These are just a few of the names we have seen referenced, or seen directly attempting to stop a fleet forming to end the threat of Nation within the Ajah constellation.

We Return.

Rek Jaiga
Minmatar
Crimson Path
Posted - 2011.05.17 22:25:00 - [124]
 

ISK: a very poor yet widespread motivator of sub-par activity.

Gosakumori Noh
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2011.05.18 00:48:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: Unit XS365BT

Current primary fleets fighting incursions within empire space are using the system as little more than an ISK pool, yes, these fleets fight nation but they do so in a purposefully inefficient manner, and gain larger rewards for this, than if they fought them efficiently.
We Return.


I commented on this some time ago in another forum, after observing the behavior in Araz (and getting very tired of that rusty tint).

On the one hand, the approach is actually quite efficient, if one's goal is to maximize bounty per minute. On the other, Nation has become little more than a co-conspirator in this effort to destabilize New Eden's economy: tremble in fear of the new dystopia, as it earns you security status improvements and wealth!

Granted, knowing how good the deal is makes it very difficult to work up much enthusiasm for other activities, and sapping motivation could be considered a valid weapon in war. I do find my affection for... that group... rising. No, really, "End" has more punch than "Equilibrium," while acronyms exude so little charm!

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.05.20 12:19:00 - [126]
 

Originally by: Rek Jaiga
ISK: a very poor yet widespread motivator of sub-par activity.


While it is rare that this occurs, I totally agree with this statement.

We Return.

Ninavask
Gallente
The Synenose Accord
Posted - 2011.05.20 17:37:00 - [127]
 

I personally would like to say these Ditanian fleet pilots give me no end of grief. The longer these Sansha's Nation monsters are allowed to prowl the systems, the more people they will kidnap and thus the more innocents are lost to the horrors of becoming Kuvakei's mindless slaves. If we can't do the job, the Capsuleers from CONCORD should. At least they will actually protect the people, whereas those who want to protect those Constellations cannot do so due to the greed of other Capsuleers, and the disinterest others have shown in human life.

I don't say this in the name of the Synenose Accord, but I say this as a brother to a victim of these invasions. If Capsuleers will not protect New Eden, then CONCORD's Capsuleers should.

- Ninavask

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.05.26 02:11:00 - [128]
 

Edited by: Unit XS365BT on 04/06/2011 13:39:32
As of this time, Unit Commune is preparing to expedite anti-Revenant fleet operations,
Known followers of the anti-nation movement are requested to contact this unit at their earliest covenience to allow us to aquire necessary data for fleet formation.

Data requested :

Pilot Name.
Armour or shield specialist. (state preference if both)
Logistics cruiser capable & type. (state preference if both)
Times & Days of standard availability.
Currently trained leadership skills & their current levels.

It is our hope to form at least one fleet for the express purpose of locating and destroying Revenant class supercarriers during active high security incursions.

Should high security operations prove successful, we may expand the fleet's AOO to include nearby low security constellations.

Unit XS365BT.
Designated communicator.
Unit Commune.

We Return.

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.05.31 04:50:00 - [129]
 

Originally by: UNIT JA525HO
Edited by: UNIT JA525HO on 16/02/2011 18:20:18

Unit JA525HO online.

<initiate communication protocol>


Our faith lay in our duty, the sincerity of our intentions, our strong conviction that humanity must be protected and that Nation must fall.

Our perspective of faith may not coincide with any particular dogma of set of strictures belonging to a particular sect or religion, but it is faith none the less.

Please define faith in its significance to you own person pilot that we may offer a more understandable anwer to your querry if needed.

Does this answer your querry sufficiently pilot?

we wait.

we return.




It would seem then you are using Nationesque means to achieve Empyrean ends. If this is wrong, or incomplete, please correct me.

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.05.31 19:26:00 - [130]
 

Originally by: Jason Galente
It would seem then you are using Nationesque means to achieve Empyrean ends. If this is wrong, or incomplete, please correct me.


Please clarify information request.

Clarifications requested : Nation-eque means.
Empyrean ends.

We Return

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.05.31 20:10:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Unit XS365BT
Originally by: Jason Galente
It would seem then you are using Nationesque means to achieve Empyrean ends. If this is wrong, or incomplete, please correct me.


Please clarify information request.

Clarifications requested : Nation-eque means.
Empyrean ends.

We Return


What I meant was, when comparing Nation and Unit at face value, they seem similar, or at least, of the same 'polarity'. Both groups stress unity and the hive mind, while Nation seeks the destruction of modern society (a Nationesque end) while Unit seeks the destruction of Nation (an Empyrean end: as this goal is shared by the 4 [5?] empires). Is this accurate?

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.05.31 20:39:00 - [132]
 

Edited by: Unit XS365BT on 31/05/2011 20:40:00
Originally by: Jason Galente

What I meant was, when comparing Nation and Unit at face value, they seem similar, or at least, of the same 'polarity'. Both groups stress unity and the hive mind, while Nation seeks the destruction of modern society (a Nationesque end) while Unit seeks the destruction of Nation (an Empyrean end: as this goal is shared by the 4 [5?] empires). Is this accurate?


Negative pilot.
While we are in constant communication with our sister units, this is expedited by a remarkably simillar technology to that which your NEOCOM systems are built upon. We also do not seek to enforce unity upon the cluster, Diversity and struggle are the two greatest catalysts for change and advancement amongst the people of this cluster, this is not something that we feel should be interfered with.

Also, we do not directly seek the utter destruction of Nation, though this seems to be the most efficient manner to ensure it will not threaten the safety of the cluster at large at any point in the future. We seek to enforce Unit Directives, while adhering to CONCORD Directive Omega-One-Five.

We Return

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.05.31 23:06:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: Unit XS365BT
Edited by: Unit XS365BT on 31/05/2011 20:40:00
Originally by: Jason Galente

What I meant was, when comparing Nation and Unit at face value, they seem similar, or at least, of the same 'polarity'. Both groups stress unity and the hive mind, while Nation seeks the destruction of modern society (a Nationesque end) while Unit seeks the destruction of Nation (an Empyrean end: as this goal is shared by the 4 [5?] empires). Is this accurate?


Negative pilot.
While we are in constant communication with our sister units, this is expedited by a remarkably simillar technology to that which your NEOCOM systems are built upon. We also do not seek to enforce unity upon the cluster, Diversity and struggle are the two greatest catalysts for change and advancement amongst the people of this cluster, this is not something that we feel should be interfered with.

Also, we do not directly seek the utter destruction of Nation, though this seems to be the most efficient manner to ensure it will not threaten the safety of the cluster at large at any point in the future. We seek to enforce Unit Directives, while adhering to CONCORD Directive Omega-One-Five.

We Return


Suddenly this seems much less bizarre than I had originally conceived. Just what exactly is Unit then?

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.01 19:48:00 - [134]
 

An informed question pilot, but one that is difficult to answer fully at this time.

We are Unit Commune. Human conciousness / AI construct hybrid entity.

We Return


Rek Jaiga
Minmatar
Crimson Path
Posted - 2011.06.02 00:37:00 - [135]
 

Human consciousness mixed with AI construct? Quick! What's the expansion series definition of the sine function?

I jest, of course. But I must wonder: are your cognitive and reasoning abilities enhanced as a result of your hybrid nature?

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.02 14:47:00 - [136]
 

Originally by: Rek Jaiga
Human consciousness mixed with AI construct? Quick! What's the expansion series definition of the sine function?

I jest, of course. But I must wonder: are your cognitive and reasoning abilities enhanced as a result of your hybrid nature?


In some ways pilot, yes. In others it may have proved a disadvantage. This was however expected.

We Return

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.06.02 15:11:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: Unit XS365BT
Originally by: Rek Jaiga
Human consciousness mixed with AI construct? Quick! What's the expansion series definition of the sine function?

I jest, of course. But I must wonder: are your cognitive and reasoning abilities enhanced as a result of your hybrid nature?


In some ways pilot, yes. In others it may have proved a disadvantage. This was however expected.

We Return


I wonder how this hybrid would deal with a complex moral dilemma. Confused


Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.02 20:16:00 - [138]
 

Originally by: Jason Galente


I wonder how this hybrid would deal with a complex moral dilemma. Confused




We request such a hypothetical scenario.
Perhaps we can aid your understanding in such a manner.

We Return.

Rek Jaiga
Minmatar
Crimson Path
Posted - 2011.06.02 20:31:00 - [139]
 

Edited by: Rek Jaiga on 02/06/2011 20:32:05
Originally by: Unit XS365BT
We request such a hypothetical scenario.
Perhaps we can aid your understanding in such a manner.

We Return.


You are near a cliffside, and hanging from the cliffside are two people of equal importance and mass (say, your two children). You only have the capability and time to save one. Who do you save?

Edited for technical clarity.

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.02 20:47:00 - [140]
 

Edited by: Unit XS365BT on 27/06/2011 11:44:01
Originally by: Rek Jaiga
Edited by: Rek Jaiga on 02/06/2011 20:32:05
Originally by: Unit XS365BT
We request such a hypothetical scenario.
Perhaps we can aid your understanding in such a manner.

We Return.


You are near a cliffside, and hanging from the cliffside are two people of equal importance and mass (say, your two children). You only have the capability and time to save one. Who do you save?

Edited for technical clarity.


Requesting further detail. That is difficult to answer without knowing the full picture.

Given the limited information presented at this time, we would asses the situation of each, then aid the one most likely to fall first. this would grant us a higher chance of reaching the second prior to their fall.

All that said, in the situation you have given, my partner would have been there, and she was just as physically fit, and capable as I. so both would be saved. I...

We Return.

Rek Jaiga
Minmatar
Crimson Path
Posted - 2011.06.02 21:08:00 - [141]
 

Edited by: Rek Jaiga on 02/06/2011 21:09:07
Originally by: Unit XS365BT




Requesting further detail. That is difficult to answer without knowing the full picture.

Given the limited information presented at this time, we would asses the situation of each, then aid the one most likely to fall first. this would grant us a higer chance of reaching the second prior to their fall.


You have given the best possible answer, at least in my mind. I see that even in the darkest of situations you do what's best; I am satisfied. I was mostly interested in seeing your thought-process on so abstract a dilemma.

Originally by: Unit XS365BT

All that said, in the situation you have given, my partner would have been there, and she was just as physically fit, and capable as I. so both would be saved. I...


How fortunate to have a partner...

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.02 21:13:00 - [142]
 

Originally by: Rek Jaiga

How fortunate to have a partner...


It was.

We Return

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.06.02 22:26:00 - [143]
 

I suppose my next question would be... were you born, or created?

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.02 23:10:00 - [144]
 

Originally by: Jason Galente
I suppose my next question would be... were you born, or created?


First the former, Then the latter. As a capsuleer, We are certain that you understand the difference.

We Return

Rek Jaiga
Minmatar
Crimson Path
Posted - 2011.06.03 00:24:00 - [145]
 

Originally by: Jason Galente
I suppose my next question would be... were you born, or created?

A better question is, what is the difference between being born and created? Sounds a bit like splitting hairs, eh?

Unit XS365BT
The Synenose Accord
Celestial Imperative
Posted - 2011.06.03 20:22:00 - [146]
 

We shall, for ease of understanding, limit this response in scope. To clarify, our statements refer implicitly to humanity.

Creation and birth are, by definition, very separate events.

Consider a human birth. creation of said human usually occurs close to 9 months prior to this.

In the case of a capsuleer, you are first created, a biological imperative within the species, then born.
After this initial birth, a capsuleer likely spends 18-30 years, or more, growing, learning and training to become a capsuleer.

It is at this point, that the capsuleer is 'created' once more, as a new body, containing the required implants for capsule interface is cloned for you, and you, as an entity, truly leave your old life behind, along with the body you spent your formative years within.

We Return.

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.06.03 22:35:00 - [147]
 

Originally by: Rek Jaiga
Originally by: Jason Galente
I suppose my next question would be... were you born, or created?

A better question is, what is the difference between being born and created? Sounds a bit like splitting hairs, eh?


The question was to determine whether they have more human or robotic qualities. Humans are born, AI are created.


Roga Dracor
Caldari
Mental Disorders Inc.
Posted - 2011.06.04 01:12:00 - [148]
 

Edited by: Roga Dracor on 04/06/2011 01:15:11

Humans are born, capsuleers are created..

I could formulate a similar query to ascertain your humanity..

Though, I have found that a spirited conversation over a good meal is a superior method..

Jason Galente
Gallente
mishima ryu
Posted - 2011.06.04 01:35:00 - [149]
 

Originally by: Roga Dracor
Edited by: Roga Dracor on 04/06/2011 01:15:11


Though, I have found that a spirited conversation over a good meal is a superior method..


There is something we can agree on. A good meal, cigar and fine wine. Cool


Roga Dracor
Caldari
Mental Disorders Inc.
Posted - 2011.06.04 01:47:00 - [150]
 

Edited by: Roga Dracor on 04/06/2011 01:47:08
I don't find myself in Empire much these days.. If we cross paths in the future, the meal and cigars are on me.. The wine is on you. I have an affinity for Gallente wine..

More pertinant questions for unit might be, do you feel? Do you experience regret? Do you have fondness, or even hate, for that matter, for others? I believe emotions keep us honest, or try to, with regards to our humanity. And, no, I don't think I am as human as I once was..


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