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Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.02.05 20:42:00 - [121]
 

Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai on 05/02/2011 21:22:23
Originally by: Emilya Tatsuki
Edited by: Emilya Tatsuki on 05/02/2011 19:32:31
Edited by: Emilya Tatsuki on 05/02/2011 19:00:12
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai


Actually the insurance is a money loop and it doesn't create any wealth of its own. The only money faucets ingame are PvE and harvesting, and everything else is either paid for or accounted for beforehand.

Destruction loop (insurance + salvage + loot) < (aka less than) Creation cost (mineral + salvage + manufacture costs + profit + insurance cost + cargohold content)

Or in other words, the insurance adds to the game less ISK than would had been added by selling the raw resources.


That explaination that Kuhn posted was solid. go back and read it again.
it has nothing to do with production or purchasing costs of the ship.

even if you lost a 10 billion isk ship and got 10 isk from insurance.
its still a faucet.

And isk faucet isnt something that makes profit its ANYTHING that creates isk out of this air.


Doh, my English may be even poorer than your economics, apparently.

Insurance doesn't creates money out of nothing. It creates money out of destroyed resources worth more money than the insurance itself, i.e., it still is a net loss.

I sell mineral, I earn 10,000,000 ISK
I build a ship, lose it, get the insurance, I earn 1,000,000 ISK

What a bussiness, huh. Inflation will be blooming, yeah, each time I earn 1,000,000 ISK insurance out of 10,000,000 ISK worth of mineral..

Fullmetal Jackass
Posted - 2011.02.05 21:44:00 - [122]
 

T2 BPOs.

Kali Omega
Immortalis Inc.
Posted - 2011.02.06 00:21:00 - [123]
 

Current Pention system

chrisss0r
The Lowbirds
Posted - 2011.02.06 00:52:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai on 05/02/2011 21:22:23
Originally by: Emilya Tatsuki
Edited by: Emilya Tatsuki on 05/02/2011 19:32:31
Edited by: Emilya Tatsuki on 05/02/2011 19:00:12
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai


Actually the insurance is a money loop and it doesn't create any wealth of its own. The only money faucets ingame are PvE and harvesting, and everything else is either paid for or accounted for beforehand.

Destruction loop (insurance + salvage + loot) < (aka less than) Creation cost (mineral + salvage + manufacture costs + profit + insurance cost + cargohold content)

Or in other words, the insurance adds to the game less ISK than would had been added by selling the raw resources.


That explaination that Kuhn posted was solid. go back and read it again.
it has nothing to do with production or purchasing costs of the ship.

even if you lost a 10 billion isk ship and got 10 isk from insurance.
its still a faucet.

And isk faucet isnt something that makes profit its ANYTHING that creates isk out of this air.


Doh, my English may be even poorer than your economics, apparently.

Insurance doesn't creates money out of nothing. It creates money out of destroyed resources worth more money than the insurance itself, i.e., it still is a net loss.

I sell mineral, I earn 10,000,000 ISK
I build a ship, lose it, get the insurance, I earn 1,000,000 ISK

What a bussiness, huh. Inflation will be blooming, yeah, each time I earn 1,000,000 ISK insurance out of 10,000,000 ISK worth of mineral..


lol.

Kuhn Arashi
Caldari
Wrecking Shots
Posted - 2011.02.06 07:12:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: chrisss0r
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai on 05/02/2011 21:22:23
Originally by: Emilya Tatsuki
Edited by: Emilya Tatsuki on 05/02/2011 19:32:31
Edited by: Emilya Tatsuki on 05/02/2011 19:00:12
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai


Actually the insurance is a money loop and it doesn't create any wealth of its own. The only money faucets ingame are PvE and harvesting, and everything else is either paid for or accounted for beforehand.

Destruction loop (insurance + salvage + loot) < (aka less than) Creation cost (mineral + salvage + manufacture costs + profit + insurance cost + cargohold content)

Or in other words, the insurance adds to the game less ISK than would had been added by selling the raw resources.


That explaination that Kuhn posted was solid. go back and read it again.
it has nothing to do with production or purchasing costs of the ship.

even if you lost a 10 billion isk ship and got 10 isk from insurance.
its still a faucet.

And isk faucet isnt something that makes profit its ANYTHING that creates isk out of this air.


Doh, my English may be even poorer than your economics, apparently.

Insurance doesn't creates money out of nothing. It creates money out of destroyed resources worth more money than the insurance itself, i.e., it still is a net loss.

I sell mineral, I earn 10,000,000 ISK
I build a ship, lose it, get the insurance, I earn 1,000,000 ISK

What a bussiness, huh. Inflation will be blooming, yeah, each time I earn 1,000,000 ISK insurance out of 10,000,000 ISK worth of mineral..


lol.


There just isn't getting through to some people.

Look. I'll make it easy:

you have 2 cups. each can hold 1 liter of water each.

Now 1 is full to the top with 1 liter of water
The second is empty.

Cup one asks cup to if he can have something that belongs to cup 2.
Cup 2 says sure why not, all I want in return is half of your water.
Cup 1 says Its a deal.

Now cup 1 and cup 2 both have 1/2 (half a liter of water)
Simple right?

Now this economic cycle can continue with them just trading their water back and forth.

Now, say cup 1 breaks something of his and needs to get another one from cup 2.

normally Cup 1 would have to give cup 2 another half a liter to obtain another one of these items
BUT, the item cup one broke had insurance!
But insurance doesnt come from Cup 2, after all its not his responsibility.

So cup one runs over to the faucet and the magical faucet poors 1/4 (one fourth) of a liter into cup one, to pay him for his insurance.

Afterward cup 1 goes over to cup to and gives cup 2 his 1/2 (half) liter of water.

Which he does, and he has his item again, yay!

(so whats the problem? Simple. this experiment started with 1 liter of water. and now has 1 and 1/4 (1.25) liters of water.)

after this cycle happens a few times (because cup 1 just loves breaking things) is that cup 2 will see that there is alot more water available than there was before.

Naturally cup 2 will now start asking for a bit more water each time cup 1 needs something new.

This makes cup 1 mad.
this is why the magic faucet needs to be turned off.

Lienzo
Minmatar
Amanuensis
Posted - 2011.02.06 07:24:00 - [126]
 

Perfect stats on npc stations.

Ronald Raygunn
Amarr
Inferi Legion
Posted - 2011.02.06 08:08:00 - [127]
 

No, there isn't getting through to some people, is there. Cup 1 is not getting money from Cup 2, nor any other cup. Cup 1 has set back water from its own cup to possibly be redeemed at a later date. That water resides in Cup X, and if needed, Cup 1 can draw from Cup X to replenish the water lost. Now, to use bigger numbers, Cup 1 just lost 1 billion molecules of water, and only gets 12% of that back. So to use a visual aid, it would be the equivalent of a kitchen faucet being turned on over Niagra Falls. The obvious isk lost in solid assets will not equal the liquid return, thus, the sink is bigger than the faucet.

In other words, 35 million is put into protecting against the possible loss of a 100 million dollar ship. If said ship is destroyed, only a net balance of 65 million is the outcome. As insurance only protects the ship, modules and rigs then cost more, further reducing the payout. As some rigs alone can run upwards of 20 million, you are already depleting any so-called net gain, and can ultimately end up in the red. Sure, you won't be in the red as much as if you had no insurance, but you are still in the red. Thus no faucet. Try it sometime, crunch the numbers and get back to me.
As for the OP...

Eve Forum Memes - Seriously, imitation may be the sincerest form of flattery, but the ******ed who imitate the fools are even more ******ed for doing so. All memes should be censored.
EvE = PvP - It's like a bunch of moronic politicians trying to run for office on the platform of smoking bans when the people they lead are trying to get some food to eat.
C&P - A waste of good forum space, and I am being kind when I say good forum space. It's like a cat fondling contest at the humane society, what defines winning?
EULA banning real life identity exposure - Guarantee you more people would be more polite if they had to worry about being stomped on like a bag of flaming dog poo.
Neutral Remote Repping - Mentioned above, make it on par with firing on someone without provocation in highsec.
Sec Status Loss in Lolsec - Just cause the cops think they know you did it, doesn't mean they can prove it. Without a CONCORD presence, there was no crime.
Gate Camps - I mean, c'mon...if you are such a bad-@$$ pvp guy, do you really need get a challenge out of shooting quadriplegics? Cycle the new uber-gate guns for criminals, and continue the negative security status table numbers all the way to nulsec.
Kill Mails - Someone said they help you track your progress in the realm of pvp. No, no they don't. It's unnecessary. See, there's this cool little thing in your character sheet called a combat log. It tells you whom you've actually killed. At the very least, if you didn't fire the final shot, you don't get a kill count for the kill. You just an honorable mention...make you put some work into your pvp.
TL;DR - If you can't or won't take the time to read a post, then why the f*ck did you come to a forum in the first place? Seriously, it's a place with nothing but posts and words...there are no naked chicks or Hostess ads. That's not bound to change the next time you log in. Maybe we can get someone to put the entire forum on audiotape so you don't have to strain yourself, you mongoloid.
The term Carebear - Watching a Carebear movie with my kids made me realize that this is such a misnomer. Sure, Carebears don't fight amongst themselves, but then again, they don't fire missiles and scoop up loot or salvage either. Working Schlub is an acceptable replacement term. Also acceptable is Person who doesn't have time to deal with the lazy, the moronic or just doesn't want to deal with other people in general...though that might not fit well on a business card.
Finally...(cause I am ashamed that I have posted this much on the forums) the general d-baggery of Eve in general. No description needed. It just brings out the worst in people.

Lisa Eldridge
Posted - 2011.02.06 08:11:00 - [128]
 

Quite a tough one...

I think the one thing I absolutely would love to be removed is the limit on training one character per account. It would be satisfactory for those of us who don't wish to pay for additional accounts and get to explore other aspects of EVE without having to play for 10 years. Players still wishing to run multiple accounts at once may still do so and have more alts to play around with if so desired. There is no change to players' ability and will to trade characters.

Ronald Raygunn
Amarr
Inferi Legion
Posted - 2011.02.06 08:33:00 - [129]
 

One thing I forgot...

Go Back to WoW - This generic phrasing is very overused and smacks of ignorance. Being a player of that MMO, there is no AFK anything...you have to work for everything you get. PvP is so hands on that there is no "starter" ship, so to speak. You have to work to advance your skills, and you have to take the time to apply what you do in-game. The behind-the-scenes mechanics of WoW are mind-boggingly similiar to EvE's. I think that what annoys most people is that unless you are on a PvP server (yes, there are servers that are entirely PvP, just like EvE), you can't just gank people, and even if you could, you can't steal their stuff. It's such a turn-off to them that they would rather mock it than ever understand it. And hey, that's ok, but you look like an @$$hat in the process of such a simple-minded assessment to an MMO rival. You want to destroy something, you learn about it and understand it find a good reason to bash it, not just attack it blindly like it's a minority in the south during the 60's.

I know that this alone would make anything I say suspect, but ultimately, it would prove my point. But think about this...Cataclysm...Incursion...mighty coincidental to one who plays both games...

Kuhn Arashi
Caldari
Wrecking Shots
Posted - 2011.02.06 09:26:00 - [130]
 

Edited by: Kuhn Arashi on 06/02/2011 09:26:25
Originally by: Ronald Raygunn
No, there isn't getting through to some people, is there. Cup 1 is not getting money from Cup 2, nor any other cup. Cup 1 has set back water from its own cup to possibly be redeemed at a later date. That water resides in Cup X, and if needed, Cup 1 can draw from Cup X to replenish the water lost. Now, to use bigger numbers, Cup 1 just lost 1 billion molecules of water, and only gets 12% of that back. So to use a visual aid, it would be the equivalent of a kitchen faucet being turned on over Niagra Falls. The obvious isk lost in solid assets will not equal the liquid return, thus, the sink is bigger than the faucet.

In other words, 35 million is put into protecting against the possible loss of a 100 million dollar ship. If said ship is destroyed, only a net balance of 65 million is the outcome. As insurance only protects the ship, modules and rigs then cost more, further reducing the payout. As some rigs alone can run upwards of 20 million, you are already depleting any so-called net gain, and can ultimately end up in the red. Sure, you won't be in the red as much as if you had no insurance, but you are still in the red. Thus no faucet. Try it sometime, crunch the numbers and get back to me.



Please put aside your bias, and what you think you know for just a minute.

Any money used to purchase the ships is given directly to another player (Cup 2)
Modules are the same way, just more stuff that was obtained from Cup 2.

Now for insurance you pay a certain amount. this actuall goes down the drain. (sink)
however the money the faucet gives you is more than what you sent down the drain.
and I know this money you get back from teh faucet isnt anywhere near enough to replace what you broke

BUT that doesn't matter. the only thing important here is that instead of ISK that already exists in the economy (EG player held, CUP 2) being given to you. (thus maintaining the current amount of total isk in the world.)

what is given to you(even small, unprofitable, not enough to replace anything amounts of ISK, get magically generated from no where.

Any isk that does not come from a player source. is a faucet.
It has Nothing whatsoever to do with how much it cost you to get that money from nowhere.

Even if you paid 1 billion Isk to another player just to get an agent to give you 100 isk as a result.

that 100 isk. didnt exist before.
and that is the problem.



If you want to compare this to actual real world economics.
it would be like if Insurance was run by the government, and instead of
using bank or invested money to pay out when people have claims
they printed all the money to give to people.

So, that money that is printed is real, its from the government and all.
but that money did not come from the economy.

A piece of currency is only worth so much as long as the number of said currency in circulation remains teh same.

If you add more in out of nowhere (printing press) the value of said currency drops

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.02.06 11:42:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
(long long long explanation with cups of water and yet not adressing the core issue of where does all the water come from)


You want to make it complicated and yet it is very simple.

Q: Does insurance create extra wealth on its own?

A: No.

That's oll folks, se acabó lo que se daba.Wink


Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.02.06 11:50:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
If you add more in out of nowhere (printing press) the value of said currency drops


Insurance does not come out of nowhere, it comes out of harvesting resources, make them into a ship and then destroy those resources.

Put in short, insurance makes money out of harvesting.

Outrageous and outrageouser! Evil or Very Mad

Mad Hatteras
Posted - 2011.02.06 19:47:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
(long long long explanation with cups of water and yet not adressing the core issue of where does all the water come from)


You want to make it complicated and yet it is very simple.

Q: Does insurance create extra wealth on its own?

A: No.

That's oll folks, se acabó lo que se daba.Wink




Uh.. YOU invest money to other players. if this mechanic was your investement paying off
then it would be the other players giving you your money back.

On the other hand, insurance as it currently is, is Money that is printed fresh just for you.
no investement, no resources,no minerals were traded, invested, consumed, or otherwise.

And ALL water comes from the "faucet" orignally. but as that cup thing showed
the more the faucet gives the less special that water becomes,because its becoming very common
(This would be inflation by the way) and that is the major problem here.
Kuhn had it right. You people need to really read what he said and just try a bit to understand.

Side note to Kuhn: You understand this mechanic. They're ******ed.(or trolling you)
I'd just leave the topic alone because its not these guys you need to tell what isk faucets are
its CCP. and im sure they already know.

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.02.06 20:39:00 - [134]
 

Originally by: Mad Hatteras
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
(long long long explanation with cups of water and yet not adressing the core issue of where does all the water come from)


You want to make it complicated and yet it is very simple.

Q: Does insurance create extra wealth on its own?

A: No.

That's oll folks, se acabó lo que se daba.Wink




Uh.. YOU invest money to other players. if this mechanic was your investement paying off
then it would be the other players giving you your money back.

On the other hand, insurance as it currently is, is Money that is printed fresh just for you.
no investement, no resources,no minerals were traded, invested, consumed, or otherwise.


Saying this when a ship has been destroyed and removed from game does not make you look smart... Laughing

Quote:
And ALL water comes from the "faucet" orignally. but as that cup thing showed
the more the faucet gives the less special that water becomes,because its becoming very common
(This would be inflation by the way) and that is the major problem here.
Kuhn had it right. You people need to really read what he said and just try a bit to understand.


Kuhn just drowned himself with his cups of water and lost whatever perspective he had left after failing to notice how insurance ISK come from harvesting.

Quote:
Side note to Kuhn: You understand this mechanic. They're ******ed.(or trolling you)
I'd just leave the topic alone because its not these guys you need to tell what isk faucets are
its CCP. and im sure they already know.


Oh quit the cheap by-telling how we are either trolls or ******s for understanding Economics 101, will you? Rolling Eyes

Corina's Bodyguard
Posted - 2011.02.07 00:22:00 - [135]
 

Edited by: Corina''s Bodyguard on 07/02/2011 00:24:00
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
If you add more in out of nowhere (printing press) the value of said currency drops


Insurance does not come out of nowhere, it comes out of harvesting resources, make them into a ship and then destroy those resources.

Put in short, insurance makes money out of harvesting.

Outrageous and outrageouser! Evil or Very Mad


You do not understand the mechanics.

The isk from insurance is just like the money from bounties. it comes from no where (insurance can never run out).

The whole "insurance is backed by mineral" thing is flawed.

Minerals are separate from ISK.
If you mine for several hours, make a ship, then trash the ship, you have done the following things:
1) made minerals out of thin air
2) destroyed said minerals

If you insure the same ship and self destruct it, you have done the following:
1) made minerals out of thin air
2) destroyed said minerals
3) made money from nothing

The ISK was tied to nothing. It was not existent in the first example, so therefore it is not tied to actual minerals, but tied to the supposed value of the ship.

Also, what the heck do you mean by harvesting resources? Insurance doesn't harvest anything, it is just there. The only ones harvesting are the minors and the salvager/looters.

Edit: for that matter, if insurance makes money from minerals, then why can't we.

Ludacrys
Posted - 2011.02.07 00:26:00 - [136]
 

Local
Neutral RR mechanics
Falcons

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.02.07 07:57:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: Corina's Bodyguard
Edited by: Corina''s Bodyguard on 07/02/2011 00:24:00
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
If you add more in out of nowhere (printing press) the value of said currency drops


Insurance does not come out of nowhere, it comes out of harvesting resources, make them into a ship and then destroy those resources.

Put in short, insurance makes money out of harvesting.

Outrageous and outrageouser! Evil or Very Mad


You do not understand the mechanics.

The isk from insurance is just like the money from bounties. it comes from no where (insurance can never run out).

The whole "insurance is backed by mineral" thing is flawed.

Minerals are separate from ISK.
If you mine for several hours, make a ship, then trash the ship, you have done the following things:
1) made minerals out of thin air
2) destroyed said minerals

If you insure the same ship and self destruct it, you have done the following:
1) made minerals out of thin air
2) destroyed said minerals
3) made money from nothing

The ISK was tied to nothing. It was not existent in the first example, so therefore it is not tied to actual minerals, but tied to the supposed value of the ship.

Also, what the heck do you mean by harvesting resources? Insurance doesn't harvest anything, it is just there. The only ones harvesting are the minors and the salvager/looters.

Edit: for that matter, if insurance makes money from minerals, then why can't we.


First off, please notice how ALL money in EVE is printed out of thin air, be by blowing stuff, by performing tasks, by supplying resources to NPC or by getting your minerals (ship) blown.

Insurance is a legit income source, limited by how much can you harvest (which in turn is limited by belt spawn), and is by far the more costly of all money printers. It actually is a part of a money sink and earning an insurance destroys wealth rather than creates it, unlike all other money printers.

Go from A to B, money for nothing-> faucet
Blow stuff, money for nothing-> faucet
Give minerals to an agent, money for nothing-> faucet
Earn an insurance, money for disabling all the above-> sink

And second, blaming insurance of triggering inflation in a game whose main economical issue is deflation is about as much uninspired as a point can get.

Donnovich Vacano
Posted - 2011.02.07 08:23:00 - [138]
 

Originally by: Burseg Sardaukar
Remote repping non-alliance members in hisec. I can't shoot anyone I want, why can I buff anyone I want? Destroys wardec mechanic


This sounds fair. But only if concord no longer responds to repping criminals. 50 people loosing their ships because one guy shot the wrong person by mistake is just stupid..

Donnovich Vacano
Posted - 2011.02.07 08:31:00 - [139]
 

Originally by: Batolemaeus
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai

Actually the insurance is a money loop and it doesn't create any wealth of its own.


Wrong.
Insurance payouts inject isk into the economy out of thin air. Isk enters the economy, therefore it is an isk faucet.


Wrong. for every person who gets money back from insurance there are a hundred people who pay for insurance and then don't lose their ship, thus removing money from the economy. That's further compounded by people having more than one ship. That's how real world insurance companies work. That said the default insurance does need to go, if they can't be bothered to set it up people shouldn't get paid for it.

reddot23
Posted - 2011.02.07 09:58:00 - [140]
 

get rid of players that grift 100% of time and never pvp make it where they cant mess with your loot are wrecks mission turn ins in high sec
up too you the players that pay the most to play game from ccp are not grifters you want to make money are let grifters do there thing and make less money your call lot of naw game coming out where grifters are not welcome to call what they do pvp is a joke at best when put up next to real pvp

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.02.07 12:55:00 - [141]
 

Originally by: Ultim8Evil
Russians


Sadly, I agree. Ban Russia, in its entirety, with their huge, closed Alliances, formed for just one purpose: to cheat, and EVE would return to normalcy.

Admiral Mendel
Caldari
Haita de lupi
ROMANIAN-LEGION
Posted - 2011.02.07 13:13:00 - [142]
 

Edited by: Admiral Mendel on 07/02/2011 13:17:04
Edited by: Admiral Mendel on 07/02/2011 13:13:44
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Corina's Bodyguard
Edited by: Corina''s Bodyguard on 07/02/2011 00:24:00
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Kuhn Arashi
If you add more in out of nowhere (printing press) the value of said currency drops


Insurance does not come out of nowhere, it comes out of harvesting resources, make them into a ship and then destroy those resources.

Put in short, insurance makes money out of harvesting.

Outrageous and outrageouser! Evil or Very Mad



You do not understand the mechanics.

The isk from insurance is just like the money from bounties. it comes from no where (insurance can never run out).

The whole "insurance is backed by mineral" thing is flawed.

Minerals are separate from ISK.
If you mine for several hours, make a ship, then trash the ship, you have done the following things:
1) made minerals out of thin air
2) destroyed said minerals

If you insure the same ship and self destruct it, you have done the following:
1) made minerals out of thin air
2) destroyed said minerals
3) made money from nothing

The ISK was tied to nothing. It was not existent in the first example, so therefore it is not tied to actual minerals, but tied to the supposed value of the ship.

Also, what the heck do you mean by harvesting resources? Insurance doesn't harvest anything, it is just there. The only ones harvesting are the minors and the salvager/looters.

Edit: for that matter, if insurance makes money from minerals, then why can't we.


First off, please notice how ALL money in EVE is printed out of thin air, be by blowing stuff, by performing tasks, by supplying resources to NPC or by getting your minerals (ship) blown.

Insurance is a legit income source, limited by how much can you harvest (which in turn is limited by belt spawn), and is by far the more costly of all money printers. It actually is a part of a money sink and earning an insurance destroys wealth rather than creates it, unlike all other money printers.

Go from A to B, money for nothing-> faucet
Blow stuff, money for nothing-> faucet
Give minerals to an agent, money for nothing-> faucet
Earn an insurance, money for disabling all the above-> sink

And second, blaming insurance of triggering inflation in a game whose main economical issue is deflation is about as much uninspired as a point can get.


i'm sorry...but u do know that when u sell something, or buy something it's from another player right? the isk you get is from HIS wallet, he sold something to someone before, and that person sold something to a guy he mined before, and that person bought stuff from you (it's a perfect circle)until insurance(ccp gives your group more isk).


U have a room, with 2 kids, and each has 2 pieces of candy. 1st kid makes a toy, and sells it to the second kid for 1 piece of candy. 1st kid makes another toy, sells, for another piece of candy.... 1st kid now has 4 candy and 3nd kid 2 toys. there still is 4 pieces of candy in the room. 2nd kid (no candy) gathers stuff from room (minerals) sells to the 1st kid for 1 piece of candy (still 4 pieces of candy in room)..... now for insurance 2nd kid breaks one of the toys he bought and gets 1 piece of candy from dad (this is the insurance payout for breaking your ship)....now there are 5 pieces of candy in the room!!!

- dad= insurance company
- kid #1 industrial dude
- kid #2 pvp dude that buys and looses ships, salvages and sells to industrialist
- room = EVE
inflation = when the total amopunt of candy in room grows = something will cost more candy cause the buyer has more candy to offer!
isk faucet = dad(insurance) that puts in candy into the room

p.s. if u do not understand now, then 1 (think about the big picture, not just what you are doing) if that don't work then......i give up and u fail at economy....or at comprehending stuff....pick one
-pe

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.02.07 13:57:00 - [143]
 

Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai on 07/02/2011 14:44:54
Originally by: Admiral Mendel
...strikes back with candies...


Hey, we may discuss this elsewhere? Yes? We're derailing this thread... will edit & post link ASAP.

Here we go, now at the proper forum:

Insurance, a faucet or a sink?

Erika Bronz
Gallente
The Wyld Hunt
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2011.02.07 16:53:00 - [144]
 

Balancing. Becouse I-win-buttons with huge achilles drawbacks are more fun.

NinjaSpud
Posted - 2011.02.07 20:59:00 - [145]
 

Originally by: Ultim8Evil
Originally by: NinjaSpud
Edited by: NinjaSpud on 04/02/2011 15:18:47

LOL

I've noticed a trend here.

Everyone has a different Idea of what should be removed. No two posts are the same, meaning that there really isn't a problem with Eve. You guys are just posting ideas to remove that would help YOU out, not Eve...no pvp, no stargates, no clones....that would help YOU keep your pretty little implants from harms way. BOO FREEKING HOO, man up people...this isn't WOW.

Edit: I stand corrected, I've seen a few posts that say "remove Whiners...."
Read above, and I agree Razz


Remove forum-warriors who are trying in vain to take the moral high ground in yet another pointless thread that has already run its course?




Embarassed

Sig Sour
Posted - 2011.02.07 23:02:00 - [146]
 

Content people.

Donnovich Vacano
Posted - 2011.02.07 23:16:00 - [147]
 

Admiral Mendel:

Your grasp of real world economics is more or less accurate, but eve does not operate on real world principles. It operates on obscure forces that only weirdos with obscure Harvard business degrees in hypothetical macroeconomics. Oh wait that's me. Here's the thing eve is a classic economy based on a boundless supply. In any economy there are two thing acting together to define the value of money. Value (meaning material and emotional value) and supply (in this case referring to the supply of money not goods). If value exceeds supply then the value of isk goes up and the cost of goods goes down. If this happens to much that is bad. If supply exceeds value then inflation occurs. In the real world this is a problem, the reasons why this is not a problem in a closed market with no competition are complicated an frankly irrelevant. What is important is this; Missions inject supply. Gathering of resources injects value. This leads to the economy being balanced by time investment rather than the material goods themselves; however, an economy based on something that varies so randomly would result in destructive volatility. Since there is effectively no limit to the amount or raw materials that can be poured into the economy, the market must be bound by the influx of isk. If inflation is left unchecked then the amount of time required to obtain enough isk to buy ships would be prohibitively high. Thus the upper limits of inflation are defined by the isk obtained from mission running. On the flip side the price of a ship cannot fall below the insurance payout because then selling them would be unprofitable. There is no financial limit to the amount of raw materials that can be obtained, therefore without insurance the value of goods would plummet and a single unit of tritium would be worth less than the smallest unit of isk. Thus the economy is bound on both sides by "money faucets". If that 400 million isk ship of yours would suddenly be worth about 5 isk. I don't know about you but that would kinda **** me off.

Dro Nee
Posted - 2011.02.07 23:23:00 - [148]
 

Remove Brits, Frenchies, and Americans (Russians are p. chill along with the Canadians and Germans.... keep them)

Also: this thread Laughing

Donnovich Vacano
Posted - 2011.02.07 23:51:00 - [149]
 

Originally by: Dro Nee
Remove Brits, Frenchies, and Americans (Russians are p. chill along with the Canadians and Germans.... keep them)

Also: this thread Laughing


Do scotts still get to play?


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