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Yarrow Naritus
Caldari
Divisione Ricerca e Sviluppo
OWN Alliance
Posted - 2011.01.22 17:31:00 - [1]
 

The ships we are flying around in, were they designed for capsuleers, or are they refitted "normal human" ships?

Faolan Fortune
Posted - 2011.01.22 19:30:00 - [2]
 

Refitted for capsuleers.

Well... I don't think there is a ship that was specifically built for capsuleers, except maybe the Sansha's Nation line of ships and I think the Jovian ships, but their capsule technology is a bit different from what we use, so I'm not sure with those.

Kind of strange that no Capsuleer corps have made a ship designed for a Capsuleer. Eh, Maybe CONCORD banned it Sad

Kiandoshia
Posted - 2011.01.22 20:21:00 - [3]
 

I usually go with refitted.

Esna Pitoojee
Amarr
Knighthood of the Merciful Crown
Posted - 2011.01.23 08:37:00 - [4]
 

All tech one ships are refitted versions of existing vessels, where the capsule has been substituted for the bridge and bridge crew.

Some very old news articles from the time of the first tech two ship releases indicate that at least tech two ship classes (Assault Frigates and Heavy Assault Cruisers) were designed explicitely for the capsuleer, and as such entirely lack the capability to be flown without a capsuleer aboard; I've assumed that all other tech two ships work similarly. Tech three ships are also almost certainly capsuleer-specific.

Existing ships most likely have the capsule shoehorned into some random spot deep within the ship, leaving the bridge intact (quite possibly in the supply storage areas, unneeded due to the lack of a full bridge crew), while tech two ships have the former bridge area taken up by whatever advanced systems they use to merit tech-twoness.

Allant Doran
Amarr
Locus Industries
Posted - 2011.01.23 16:22:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Esna Pitoojee
...Tech three ships are also almost certainly capsuleer-specific.


T3 ships are SO Capsuleer-intergrating that you lose skillpoints in one of it's subsystems at random if you blow up while in one. This is because the pod pilot doesn't just become an extension of the ship, he literally becomes part of it's working order. His mind doesn't control the ship, his mind IS the ship.

Then again, that's what you get for poking around with Sleeper tech I suppose ;)

Vigo the Carpathian
Posted - 2011.01.25 00:25:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Vigo the Carpathian on 25/01/2011 14:54:45
I playing around with some ship design concepts for whenever the next design contest comes up.

I'm guessing CCP didn't do a lot of math to work out dimensions. The 3D view of a Giant Secure Container shows that it's 440 M long on it's axis. The Volume of the container is 3,000 m3 (I won't get into the fact that it holds 3,900 m3, I'll just chalk that up to wormhole storage technology). If it's 440m long, I'd estimate it's width at ~110m and height as ~110, therefore, 440m3 x 110 m3 x 110m3 = 5,321,400 m3.

I'm sure I'm thinking too hard about this, but I like details. Can someone please tell me I'm wrong, and I'm missing something?

Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2011.01.25 01:17:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Vigo the Carpathian
I playing around with some ship design concepts for whenever the next design contest comes up.

I'm guessing CCP didn't do a lot of math to work out dimensions. The 3D view of a Giant Secure Container shows that it's 440 M long on it's axis. The Volume of the container is 3,000 m3 (I won't get into the fact that it holds 3,900 m3, I'll just chalk that up to wormhole storage technology). If it's 440m long, I'd estimate it's width at ~110m and height as ~110, therefore, 440m3 x 110 m3 x 110m3 = 5,321,400 m3.

I'm sure I'm thinking too hard about this, but I like details. Can someone please tell me I'm wrong, and I'm missing something?


The 3D view seems to contradict lore on the ship sizes too.

Yarrow Naritus
Caldari
Divisione Ricerca e Sviluppo
OWN Alliance
Posted - 2011.01.25 01:36:00 - [8]
 

that sucks. Is there an a source that most people consider authoritative?

Jagga Spikes
Minmatar
Spikes Chop Shop
Posted - 2011.01.25 14:12:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Vigo the Carpathian
...

I'm sure I'm thinking too hard about this, but I like details. Can someone please tell me I'm wrong, and I'm missing something?


model size is purely visual. all stats are tweaked for playability.

Qayta'al
Caldari
Posted - 2011.01.25 22:25:00 - [10]
 

Another ship question,

is there only the capsuleer on board, or are there other 'normal' crew members that we never see?

Mort Eveson
Gallente
Intaki Liberation Front
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
Posted - 2011.01.25 23:07:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Qayta'al
Another ship question,

is there only the capsuleer on board, or are there other 'normal' crew members that we never see?


Other crew, hundreds if not thousands of them on a battleship.

Yarrow Naritus
Caldari
Divisione Ricerca e Sviluppo
OWN Alliance
Posted - 2011.01.25 23:46:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Mort Eveson
Originally by: Qayta'al
Another ship question,

is there only the capsuleer on board, or are there other 'normal' crew members that we never see?


Other crew, hundreds if not thousands of them on a battleship.


Oh really? why? I've only read a small amount of the fiction. But I thought the benefit of being a capsuleer was running the ship yourself.

Mel Lifera
Gallente
Ambrye Logistics Ltd.
Posted - 2011.01.26 00:32:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Yarrow Naritus
Originally by: Mort Eveson
Originally by: Qayta'al
Another ship question,

is there only the capsuleer on board, or are there other 'normal' crew members that we never see?


Other crew, hundreds if not thousands of them on a battleship.


Oh really? why? I've only read a small amount of the fiction. But I thought the benefit of being a capsuleer was running the ship yourself.


Someone has to shovel the coal into the boiler furnace, as it were.

Mort Eveson
Gallente
Intaki Liberation Front
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
Posted - 2011.01.26 01:37:00 - [14]
 

Discussed a couple of days ago on this thread: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1447754

Maxx Overseer
Gallente
Royal Advanced Industries
Imperial Crimson Legion
Posted - 2011.01.31 16:30:00 - [15]
 

yes I agree, refitted, I beleive they took some space in the cargo or area of a few passagers and put the mounts in for the pod, well plus cords and a hatch for the pod to get out real fast.

Kiljaedenas
Posted - 2011.02.04 22:08:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Yarrow Naritus
Originally by: Mort Eveson
Originally by: Qayta'al
Another ship question,

is there only the capsuleer on board, or are there other 'normal' crew members that we never see?


Other crew, hundreds if not thousands of them on a battleship.


Oh really? why? I've only read a small amount of the fiction. But I thought the benefit of being a capsuleer was running the ship yourself.


I've read a bit more of the fiction, and it looks like even though a capsuleer can run a ship far more efficiently than a standard crew, he can't replace them completely. Automated programs and drones for running the various systems can only go so far; at some point humans need to do some of the work by hand. The capsuleer issues commands by thought all over the ship and the crew responds instantly, avoiding cumbersome voice commands. Aside from the really small ships that can be flown exclusively by a capsuleer on their own (i.e. pretty much any frigate sized ship), the capsuleer drops the amount of crew required by a ship by a factor of about 10.

Tfear
Posted - 2011.02.14 02:00:00 - [17]
 

I've always assumed that they're just a typical ship but refitted for pod pilot use (that would explain why they have windows, indicating crew compartments, but no crew).

Shadow Leon
Leon's and Scarlet's Universal Trade Inc
Posted - 2011.02.17 13:49:00 - [18]
 

once upon a time back in the day. The info sheet used to tell you how menay people where on the ship i believe.

SadisticSavior
Caldari
Posted - 2011.02.17 23:03:00 - [19]
 

Quote:
that sucks. Is there an a source that most people consider authoritative?


All of the EVE fiction I have read so far (including both novels) says that the ships are all normal ships modified for Capsuleers.

Capsuleers are unusual and rare. And even Capsuleer ships still have a full crew...they just lack the officer part of it.

Max Singularity
Posted - 2011.02.19 18:59:00 - [20]
 

I reject your reality, and substitute it with my own:

I've read the fiction, there are references to caps+crews. However, despite the refs, I reject it for the following...

The ships are refitted former crewed ship now robotically fit for capsuleers. They are the most awesome and incredible technology that the Jovians have presented to the Galaxy. We can move other people around in the cargo bays, and their various life support elements required to plug into the ship is included with the size of their "suitcase" (their icon) we bring into our ships.

As for NPC ships, Faction Navy, Pirates, and civilian cargo ships, they are still fully crewed and when you kill those Gurista 8astards, you take down 1,000s of poor under paid, poverty stricken no choice but better then living on a planet crew members that were shanghied from some bar. (Since I'm Amarr, I'm sending these poor souls to God and liberating them from their plight.)

^^^ This is not cannon, but it is so much more cooler and unique for SciFi. Sort of a deviation from Star Trek crews (so outdated) and almost like Homeworld & Battlestar Galactica Hybrid... I think the model above makes EVE unique, and NOT like those other SciFi stories. I hope CCP gets this soon.

** GAME **
Until the game reflects the cannon, I reject reality and "wants" of authors past. There are many threads that talk about crew mechanics which includes "paying salaries", having a "key staff crew" you can move from ship to ship, and "crew experience" ability. There have been advanced concepts suggested to having escape pods during battle animated and the crews would escape "magically" to the designated station where they would meet the Capsuleer.

Most critics simply say, "It's all 'Magic' how this works, and your crews are in your ships, and that's how it is deal with it." But like I said. Nope.

Idonis Callor
Posted - 2011.02.22 01:05:00 - [21]
 

I'm going to agree with the Homeworld Model of explaining Capsuleers and Crews.

Remair
Posted - 2011.02.23 12:40:00 - [22]
 

Max even Homeworld had very large crew onboard the mothership running the various sub-sections. Although much was automated they still had people looking at sensor data, coming up with tactical solutions, performing research and so on.

In eve I have always gone with the capsuleer effectively does whatever you personally do while playing, just with a direct interface to their mind as oposed to keyboard + mouse and a GUI. So they give overall commands, set which ships to target, which turrets to activate, when to reload and what subsystems to use. Someone actually has to either do all of the above or make sure AI routines do it correctly.

Whether its sensor teams analysing the raw data coming in, targeting crews checking firing solutions, maitenance teams repairing internal systems that nanites are incapable of correcting or medical staff making sure the capsuleer is healthy at all times. The powercore of a battleship can be thought of similar to a large modern day powerplant. Sure computers do a lot of the work but you have tons of engineers, scientists, managers, mechanics and support staff keeping it running.

One of the best ways I have thought of this so far is with ECCM. That "module" you install I think of as a specific subsection inside the ship filled with several crewmen working at stations. Every time a jaming attempt is made they employ needed counter-programs, reset overloaded systems, lock out hacking attempts and so forth.

Max Singularity
Posted - 2011.02.23 15:23:00 - [23]
 

@Remair
Yeup. What you described above is canon. And as I said, it is outdated also in the storyline because New Eden is in the midst of a very long transition from the old school to the capsuleer environment thanks to the Jovians gift of the Pod technology. Sort of a robotics revolution like Earth 1990's factories.

My point is... if the single pod crew member can control, operate, and maintain a ship with the full power of the technology and his mind, then there is no other SciFi out there that has this as a main feature and it makes Eve unique. But it's not unique the way the players "hold on to their dear crews".

As for the game... They (ccp) show me missile smoke (a minor detail). They animate moving ship parts (minor). They have icons for ultra obscure nicknacks and brickabrack like spice wine et al (minor, and no function). So I do not buy for a second I have a crew because: There is no icon for them; I don't pay them; I have no clue how many I have; I don't get sued for 5exual harassment... all of which is a MAJOR GAME FUNCTION if I had a crew.

That being said... give me the function and I'll accept your reality. But nope, I think there are elements in CCP that also have the vision I've stated and are disappointed the fiction and some player base is taking it so old school. Long live the Capsuleers! :)



Evolution1979
Posted - 2011.02.25 11:32:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Evolution1979 on 25/02/2011 11:33:06
capsule: it is an escape pod.
You walk in your ship, when that is almost destroyed, you step into a capsule. Much like an ejector seat with an jet-fighter in RL.
When you get this, you can see what the pod is used for!

Also: didnt read everything above Wink


 

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