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blankseplocked A real community request to get a fully supported Eve linux client.
 
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AureuSZ
Posted - 2011.01.01 20:55:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: AureuSZ on 01/01/2011 21:05:40
Hi everyone,

CCP tried, with a good effort, to maintain cross platform compatibilty, paying back in the process a little to the open source community (even if not exclusive to linux, open source devs often have roots with the linux world).

Their reason for dropping compatibility support with the linux client is understandable. And I'd like to say I see nothing wrong with their actions from a marketing and technical standpoint, and I understand that the use of open source technologies (stackless python for example) is not a reason to have to "pay back" with a linux client... anyway :

As a linux player, I dropped my subscription two times already when client updates broke wine compatibility.
I went out of 0.0 twice as well considering every big fights occuring crashed my client.
Linux is getting more and more users on the desktop, noticeably more than mac os users considering some sources.

My request to CCP, is to help the linux community more and support an official way to play the game on our platform. I pettitioned already about it but I would like the community to get involved with this.

It might not be a full blown linux client, but at least a knowledge base support and patches support, so they dont break compatitility with the linux client.

Some of the members of the creative community CCP likes to praise in recent blogs are making their best to maintain coss platform compatibility for their eve related tools. Ports are made to linux for some popular tools, as well as some exciting projects arount the android OS. (Aura)

Mac OS client might not have too much technical differences with a linux client. We can all use X11 right ?

On a commercial standpoint, there is a big buzz recently surrounding success stories of linux game sales. CCP might get an even bigger support from the community, and surrounding effects, as well as an inclusion for example, within the ubuntu software center if they decided to give it a fully supported client.

I'm asking here to you guys, what we can do to be heard, and if you know if some actions of this type has been already tried and what has been the ccp answer to those issues so far. Sorry if my english is not perfect ! I'm doing my best to be understood :)

Best regards and have a very good linux gaming year !

Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
Posted - 2011.01.01 23:22:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Scorpyn on 01/01/2011 23:23:58
I'd love an officially supported linux client, but unfortunately I doubt that's going to happen, especially not a native client.

Time for a history lesson.

They did have an eve/cedega client a while ago, but since eve/wine worked better almost nobody used it.

With their linux user data being based on who was using the cedega client, ccp came to the conclusion that almost nobody was running eve on linux, and that was the end of the linux support.

I'm not aware that they've been giving anything to the open source world, but I could of course be wrong.

Sovetskii Rosisski
Posted - 2011.01.01 23:42:00 - [3]
 

Update your system. I haven't had EvE break compatability with Wine in over a year. Wine did once break compatability with EvE on one of their point releases. That was fixed by a simple wine reinstall. Otherwise it's been smooth sailing in everything from Highsec, to 0.0, to big fleet fights, to POS sieges.

AureuSZ
Posted - 2011.01.02 01:24:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: AureuSZ on 02/01/2011 01:29:36
I actually tried to play the cedega client but yes, the premium graphics were windows version + wine only...

They didn't give code you're right. I believe but at some point they might have submitted fixes to stackless python... don't know.
I believe that cross platform compatibility is something important, they should have kept it.

now about keeping the system updated and things broken, there are a couple things that were broken, like memory leak and crash at startup which are still unfixed with some hardware/distro. I have had the weird strange texture bug (black portraits) I couldn't solve on one computer even following various tutorials and howtos. (intel core i3 embeded card, which works very well for everything else and perfectly under windows, I admit it may be a driver issue)

I manage my way through wine and dx settings quite well, I even made a patch to wine for DAOC to play with the right shader lvl enabled (catacombs look).

I think you are right, we don't have to expect anything and we chose to use an unsupported system. But we can try anyway and find a way to ask and put numbers on the table. I'm bored to login to windows if I want to play it safe.

I think CCP should make a poll at client startup, displaying once :"Which OS you would find the most convenient to use for playing eve online ?", I bet they'd get 15 % Linux answers.

StimpyCat
Posted - 2011.01.02 02:46:00 - [5]
 

I'd love to see a native client for Linux, and perhaps the differences between the Mac and Linux client might not be too much, but they probably don't have enough in-house resources using Linux to have adequate quality testing for each release.

Perhaps if CCP reached out to the Linux community for testing, we'd have more joy, but organizing the EVE player base would be akin to herding bees. Unless we can convince someone who is both a Linux user, and has decent relations with CCP, we'll have to make do with the Windows client.

I for one would volunteer to do testing on a Linux client. Despite the lag behind Windows and MacOS, I think Linux still has a larger role to play in the future of the PC and it would be a shame if CCP were not able to be ready for the revolution when it inevitably comes.

Originally by: AureuSZ
I think CCP should make a poll at client startup, displaying once :"Which OS you would find the most convenient to use for playing eve online ?", I bet they'd get 15 % Linux answers.


Who would need a poll, I'm sure the EVE client does some checking on the OS being used to launch the client. 15% would be a stretch, I would guess that the more realistic number is about 1%. Unless the bots out there are running 15 EVE clients on a single box. Linkage

Originally by: Sovetskii Rosisski
Update your system. I haven't had EvE break compatability with Wine in over a year. Wine did once break compatability with EvE on one of their point releases. That was fixed by a simple wine reinstall. Otherwise it's been smooth sailing in everything from Highsec, to 0.0, to big fleet fights, to POS sieges.


I've been running EVE with two clients for over a year and beyond some annoying issues patching the client, and the whole Jukebox thing not working on SiSi, its been very smooth. Just by using the info supplied in the AppDB on WineHQ, I've have success with every release of Wine I've used so far.

If anyone wants help running the EVE Client in Wine, just fire me a message. I'd be happy to help get the Linux community together in force to give CCP something to think about.

StimpyCat

AureusX
Posted - 2011.01.02 10:02:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: AureusX on 02/01/2011 10:02:37
Originally by: StimpyCat

Who would need a poll, I'm sure the EVE client does some checking on the OS being used to launch the client. 15% would be a stretch, I would guess that the more realistic number is about 1%. Unless the bots out there are running 15 EVE clients on a single box. Linkage
Quote:


I think they could get more than 1%. desktop usage statistics are flawed... either is it because it is counted by activated licences, or by browser platform count (windows users typically surf on more counted website than linux users (software updates, new software downloads, licence activations, proprietary drivers and so on...), not counting proxied users... and theres a lot usins linux for various reasons, and the vast majority dual boots...

I think 1 % users actually uses linux to run eve, but if you ask people today, you'd be surprise of the answer I bet :)

edit : wrong char but you'll recognize me ;)

Miraqu
Caldari
Posted - 2011.01.02 10:41:00 - [7]
 

Desktop usage share is flawed Linky

"Nobody knows" is probably the closest estimate.

As for the client, native would be nice, of course but I'd be happy if at least a dev would get lost on the forums every so often and post in the linux forum. Just to know that they haven't forgotten us Rolling Eyes.

The jukebox thing will probably get fixed since it doesn't work on mac too. Link to the mac forum



Maybe we should have bought a plush tux as x-mas present for every EvE dev?

Kargyraa
Posted - 2011.01.02 11:21:00 - [8]
 

The linux gaming community is very small. I doubt it is near 15% and would guess it's somewhere in the range 2-4% of the total eve gaming populace. Though it would be nice to see what CPP's numbers were for people who tried the linux client.

On top of that the pure linux gaming community is even smaller (these are linux gamers who only play games in linux and don't use windows in the case a game is unplayable in linux). And since eve is playable via wine, CPP probability is only missing out on a very few new players if there was a native linux client (its been a while since a patch has made eve unplayable in wine).

CPP does acknowledge its linux gamers in they have attempted to work with the possibility of a linux wrapper (the cedega client) and have given us a form where we can help each other getting the linux os running on our ships computers. I do agree it would be nice to see some new numbers of people who run eve in linux and how much it has increased since their last attempt, but I still doubt it will be to an acceptable number to spend the amount of resources it would require to build a native linux client.

I think the most reasonable request of CPP is not for a native linux client (since the amount of rewrite of the code base to be able to use the linux kernel and libs isn't going to be cost effective) but to continue development of eve in such a way that it will run well in wine. If when the eve programmers are implementing a new feature/patch to eve they are asking themselves how to implement said feature in a standard way to keep compatibility with wine/linux -- then the linux community is being heard.

It would be nice to see the linux community get to the point it's large enough that CPP would find it cost effective to work more with wine, and try to find ways to fix the current bugs/issues to help eve run better via wine. But I still think the linux community is way to small for CPP to spend its resources on. But as a whole the pure linux gaming community is so small there is a long ways to go to see regular support and development for it.

This is far from the ideal situation, but as a pure linux gamer, I am glad to see any game that has even a small linux community.

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2011.01.02 13:36:00 - [9]
 

I believe that CCP has got enough projects to work on as it is, and that it was a good decision to drop the native Linux client to focus more on a single platform. I, too, was disappointed to see the Linux client disappear, but in return do I now run an EVE client on Linux, which is better looking than the Linux client ever was.

EVE is a game, and Linux never has been a gaming platform. CCP then is extending their business onto consoles from what I have read (DUST514) and it seems to me to be the better decision for CCP as a game maker.

I sure would find a client tailored to all my needs and desires awesome, but let us not forget that CCP needs to run a successful business and should not spend our money on developing a full blown client for a tiny market as the Linux game market.

All one can ask for in my opinion is to keep the Windows client as resource friendly as possible so that it can continue to run on cheap and older hardware as well as under Linux/WINE. I see this as the much better goal, because it serves a much greater part of the community rather than to support all sorts of bells and whistles with native clients.

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see
Chained Reactions
Posted - 2011.01.05 18:43:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Karak Terrel on 05/01/2011 18:44:17
I think you overestimate the amount of people that use Linux on desktops. It is a very very tiny fraction . I don't think that supporting a native Linux Client would be wise. The only way that makes sense in my opinion is to support wine as an official platform. This way there is only one client that supports Win Xp/Vista/7 and wine this could also replace the Mac client. I have no idea why CCP outsources the Mac client to Transgaming, maybe they don't have the know how to support wine.

Another thing is how you install this stuff on Linux. There are some things that work very different compared with other software on a Linux system:

- The EVE client updates itself
If you do this over apt-get or whatever you always lag behind the official releases

- You probably can't just redistribute the Client
Proprietary software usually has some strict policies and you can't repack that thing into a .deb or whatever yourself

- Per user installation
Don't know if thats actually true for Windows, but usually there is a huge mess cause Windows progs try to write some stuff into C:\ bla whatever and there is no difference in "the user" that uses a software and "root" that actually installs stuff. I mean there is somehow multiuser in a broken way in windows, but anyone really knows a windows user that installed EVE as admin and plays as a user?!? Anyway, it is just f**** up and someone should someday shoot the guy that is responsible for how Windows user have to install programs.

In my opinion there is something like PlayOnLinux needed that integrates into the normal package manager frontends (over PackageKit or whatever) so the user can easy install the EVE client with one click. But license stuff may still be an issue and if there is no change in the industry i don't see it happen.

So what CCP should do is: support wine (stable releases?) as an official Platform and allow the redistribution of the client. (Thats actually the easy part)

What the community has to do is to integrate those Windows program installers into the package manager frontends and integrate software like the EVE client into a software catalog for easy installation.

I don't see this happen... There are to few Linux players and there are even fewer of them want to f*** around with Windows software. Cause it is a mess! Did i mention that someone should shoot the guy that is responsible for that Windows program installation mess? That guy is probably also responsible for cancer and stuff.

AureuSZ
Posted - 2011.01.07 18:16:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: AureuSZ on 07/01/2011 18:17:59
Edited by: AureuSZ on 07/01/2011 18:17:14
I think right now, you're right, less than 1 % plays the game under linux.

But I know a lot of players (perhaps it's very country specific but anyway) That Really wait only one thing to use linux full time, and that are playing Eve... that's why my poll question would be "what OS would be the most convenient to play eve if you had to chose ?" and not what os are you using to play...

My girlfriend is using linux (ubuntu) daily, and she was before I knew her. Some friends, seeing the slickness of the desktop I use, and the features I get coupled with my android phone, asked me to install it on theirs.

A friend of my gf also asked me last week if she could get an install, to use ubuntu one/ ubuntu music and evolution/phone contacts sync. (I share a lot of things with U1 and my girlfriend too...)

Perhaps I have a very wrong perception of the market share but everyone seems to be doing the switch around me !

With chrome OS doing the buzz, we might see a lot more things appear geared toward linux.

We see angry birds being ported to ubuntu and arm processors all over the place, using linux in tablets...

It's now, or never.

I hope I'm right and CCP will realize it :)

it's as well the time to focus on designing a multitouch interface for EVE !!! How Awesome !

Onyx47
Caldari
U-208
Posted - 2011.01.07 21:47:00 - [12]
 

It would be great to have a native Linux client but I think you are all missing the point of why there isn't one:

DirectX

EVE's engine is written in DirectX, and unless Steve Balmer decides to feel like Santa and open sources DirectX we won't run EVE natively on nothing but Windows. Ever. DirectX is a closed-source Windows-specific piece of software. No source - no way to recompile it to work on anything else but Windows. Not to mention the huge differences between Windows and Linux and amount of work needed to even compile the damned thing even if you had the source.

Now, I know there's wineD3D project which, I guess, is trying to do the same thing for DirectX as Wine does for Win API (I didn't really study it so might be wrong), but it still means you'll have to run EVE in wine since, again, Windows and Linux are two very different types of beasts.

Only way to get a native client would be to rewrite the entire graphics engine in OpenGL. As much as I would LOVE to see that think about it from CCP's point of view:

1) It's a HUGE undertaking which would probably take years
2) DirectX is still more powerful (even though id manages to do wonders in it, hats off to them (id4 engine used in Doom 3 used OpenGL))

So yeah... I'd say we're stuck with wine Sad

Morgenholt Blue
RED.Legion
Posted - 2011.01.08 15:17:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Onyx47
It would be great to have a native Linux client but I think you are all missing the point of why there isn't one:

DirectX

EVE's engine is written in DirectX, and unless Steve Balmer decides to feel like Santa and open sources DirectX we won't run EVE natively on nothing but Windows. Ever. DirectX is a closed-source Windows-specific piece of software. No source - no way to recompile it to work on anything else but Windows. Not to mention the huge differences between Windows and Linux and amount of work needed to even compile the damned thing even if you had the source.

Now, I know there's wineD3D project which, I guess, is trying to do the same thing for DirectX as Wine does for Win API (I didn't really study it so might be wrong), but it still means you'll have to run EVE in wine since, again, Windows and Linux are two very different types of beasts.

Only way to get a native client would be to rewrite the entire graphics engine in OpenGL. As much as I would LOVE to see that think about it from CCP's point of view:

1) It's a HUGE undertaking which would probably take years
2) DirectX is still more powerful (even though id manages to do wonders in it, hats off to them (id4 engine used in Doom 3 used OpenGL))

So yeah... I'd say we're stuck with wine Sad


Could always do what Valve did for Mac and not actually rewrite it but add OpenGL and translate DX calls to the respective OpenGL ones. It is slower and you would not have as good performance as running it on Windows but it (might?) should be faster than Wine I think..?

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2011.01.10 14:52:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Morgenholt Blue
Could always do what Valve did for Mac and not actually rewrite it but add OpenGL and translate DX calls to the respective OpenGL ones. It is slower and you would not have as good performance as running it on Windows but it (might?) should be faster than Wine I think..?

It is exactly what WINE does. It would not be any faster.

Septimus Jr
Posted - 2011.01.11 12:48:00 - [15]
 

I would support this issue. Make more love for linux!

Newt Rondanse
Posted - 2011.01.14 16:31:00 - [16]
 

If they simply acknowledged Wine as a supported Windows version, that would do the trick.

Vaneshi SnowCrash
Posted - 2011.01.20 10:44:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Newt Rondanse
If they simply acknowledged Wine as a supported Windows version, that would do the trick.


I think at least one CCP employee has said that whilst they don't officially support wine, they also test basic functionality (client fired up = tick in the box level I'd guess) against wine.

However I'd like to see a native client myself, on OS X obviously (hey, I'm a Wine + XQuartz user deal with it) but an OGL based .app should make a Linux client easier I suppose.

The problem is Valve made Source fairly modular, same as the ID4 engine. So compiling with a DirectX output library and poof windows game, OpenGL output module and it's a multiformat game. I'd guess the same about Unreal 3 as well. But that only makes sense when the 3D engine is itself a product for sale (not sure if Valve will let you use Source but ID4 & U3 are avaliable for a price)... as far as I can tell the only game the EVE engine is used for is EVE and CCP don't offer it to other companies.

So I'd assume it's modular enough to add a DX11 shader or two if they want it's not modular enough to accept a whole new output layer without major work.

Of course the only people who can confirm or deny that are CCP themselves and I'm reasonably sure the only response they could give is "business sensitive information".

Br41n
Amarr
Ministry of War
Posted - 2011.01.20 14:23:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Onyx47
It would be great to have a native Linux client but I think you are all missing the point of why there isn't one:

1) It's a HUGE undertaking which would probably take years
2) DirectX is still more powerful (even though id manages to do wonders in it, hats off to them (id4 engine used in Doom 3 used OpenGL))

So yeah... I'd say we're stuck with wine Sad


Point 1 ur correct, point 2 ur not, direct3d/openGL make programming easier, neither is more powerful. If theres a difference then your driver just has poor openGL support.

AureuSZ
Posted - 2011.01.23 11:26:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: AureuSZ on 23/01/2011 11:28:35
Edited by: AureuSZ on 23/01/2011 11:27:52
My personal opinion on the whole thing is that Eve online is perfectly suited for next gen computing alias Tablet computers running ARM chipsets.

Linux is dominating this market by a large margin and we won't see any serious answer from Microsoft until 2013 or so, with windows 8 beign compatible with arm computers.

But even then, Microsoft's Market share will be thin. (unless they do something very unexpectedly awesome)
The surprise is gone in this market, M$ sat on their fat asses for too long and don't want to eat their foot writing a lightweight OS. (so they can keep selling W7 tablets with intel CPUs... meeeh...)

CCP is betting on a new Carbon engine, they made it portable, it runs on the PS3 / Xbox 360... They are a footstep away from porting the whole thing to our platform, and they should really do it.

If carbon is Android Friendly, Carbon could be used more (in other games I mean), and Perhaps it will even replace Trinity at some point.

Is CCP going to do the Gold Move and put Eve online on the android market? :) (unigine has just been ported to android... so it has to be possible...)

Honestly, my next mmo will be playable natively on my tablet and my linux computer.

Sevarus James
Minmatar
Meridian Dynamics
Posted - 2011.01.23 11:31:00 - [20]
 

Another thing to remember is Google...the 8million pound gorilla in the house...and Chrome...which is built using...drumroll....linux. Could be interesting stuff coming up for CCP to make decisions on. Prior poster has the right of it.

betterdent
Project Nemesis
Posted - 2011.01.26 14:04:00 - [21]
 

If they put eve on linux,

I wouldn't use windows anymore.

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2011.01.26 23:04:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Whitehound on 26/01/2011 23:05:33
Originally by: AureuSZ
My personal opinion on the whole thing is that Eve online is perfectly suited for next gen computing alias Tablet computers running ARM chipsets.

Linux is dominating this market by a large margin and we won't see any serious answer from Microsoft until 2013 or so, with windows 8 beign compatible with arm computers.

But even then, Microsoft's Market share will be thin. (unless they do something very unexpectedly awesome)

Microsoft does what they always do. They wait and see if a market is developing into a size big enough to blob it. As long as the tablet PC market stays small and unimportant will everyone only use Linux to keep the costs at a minimum, because no money can be made through selling large volumes of tablet PCs.

Once this changes will everyone run to Microsoft and beg them to sell a Windows version to them so they can sell their tablet PCs with a Windows into the market.

Sorry, but you are only getting your hopes up that Linux will suddenly dominate a market through sheer excellence. If it was all about excellence then Windows would not have made it beyond Windows 95. The economy is however ruled by money and Microsoft products are money makers.

One can only sell Linux and use it as a cost saving factor as long as no one sees the operating system. I.e. set top boxes, satellite receivers, etc.. If an operating system needs to be visible to the customers then the choice is always Windows.

Incipus
Posted - 2011.02.08 20:08:00 - [23]
 

Quote:

Microsoft does what they always do. They wait and see if a market is developing into a size big enough to blob it. As long as the tablet PC market stays small and unimportant will everyone only use Linux to keep the costs at a minimum, because no money can be made through selling large volumes of tablet PCs.



Like cellular phones? :) I hear that's a small market.

Katrina Bekers
Gallente
Fighters Squadron
Posted - 2011.02.11 14:24:00 - [24]
 

Q:
Originally by: Whitehound
Sorry, but you are only getting your hopes up that Linux will suddenly dominate a market through sheer excellence.

A:
Android.

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see
Chained Reactions
Posted - 2011.02.11 17:37:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Whitehound

Microsoft does what they always do. They wait and see if a market is developing into a size big enough to blob it.
...
Sorry, but you are only getting your hopes up that Linux will suddenly dominate a market through sheer excellence.


Another example:

Top500 List (Operating System Family)

k, let's wait for that blob then.

Avatar2
Posted - 2011.02.12 09:57:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Br41n
Originally by: Onyx47
It would be great to have a native Linux client but I think you are all missing the point of why there isn't one:

1) It's a HUGE undertaking which would probably take years
2) DirectX is still more powerful (even though id manages to do wonders in it, hats off to them (id4 engine used in Doom 3 used OpenGL))

So yeah... I'd say we're stuck with wine Sad


Point 1 ur correct, point 2 ur not, direct3d/openGL make programming easier, neither is more powerful. If theres a difference then your driver just has poor openGL support.



No hes more then correct. Direct X is a much more powerfull and feature rich API then opengl. Though this wasn't always true the open source nature of it is why its fallen behind and why linux doesn't get the love people want it to. Want more stuff for linux? standardize it a lot more close some of it down make all distros adhere to a specific set of rules. Otherwise your going to get 1% of the total market like linux has gotten. To one of the first posters no we dont all run dx11 only windows does.. some programs try and emulate how dx runs but they are iffy. Honestly i don't see any reason at all for a company to support a small fraction of 1%. If open source is so important to you then this is the result. Its your choice. OPENGL lost its lead in graphics api when to many people had to much say in what will and wont be going into it and the last thing i read about opengl was they left a lot out because no one could agree. #1 reason open source is still lagging behind. Its simple.... play games in windows or deal with having to do a bunch of crap to play in linux.. your only other hope other then some organization and standardization in linux which would somewhat kill the open source part like thats a bad thing anyways.. is to get microsoft to open up direct x for other platforms..... gl. If ccp wants to make eve compatible even in the smallest way to linux.. i dont really care honestly.. but wasting their time on a fraction of a percent is up to them.

I for one would love to see linux be what it claimed it would be almost 20 years ago but im not going to delude my self into thinking its more then what it is. windows for games.. linux for............ doing less then what i can do on windows in a much harder way for from my use of linux no benefit. So in the end i hope linux does become a viable windows competitor since apple refuses to be but i don't see that for many many many years so ill wait until that happens.

Sevarus James
Minmatar
Meridian Dynamics
Posted - 2011.02.12 11:06:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Avatar2
More FUD than I've seen in quite awhile.


As I've captured in the quotes. FUD filled post.Rolling EyesRolling Eyes


Malena VXXI
Amarr
Persia Capital Investments Group
Posted - 2011.02.12 11:58:00 - [28]
 

I want CCP to make a official linux client for EvE online that work out of the box.

I dont want to hear som BS

If my bank can make a linux version for my crypt logging device becouse Im a customer on that bank and I use Linux.

So can CCP make a linux version for EvE online.

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2011.02.12 15:17:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Incipus
Quote:

Microsoft does what they always do. They wait and see if a market is developing into a size big enough to blob it. As long as the tablet PC market stays small and unimportant will everyone only use Linux to keep the costs at a minimum, because no money can be made through selling large volumes of tablet PCs.



Like cellular phones? :) I hear that's a small market.


Originally by: Katrina Bekers
Q:
Originally by: Whitehound
Sorry, but you are only getting your hopes up that Linux will suddenly dominate a market through sheer excellence.

A:
Android.


Do you want a native EVE client for your mobile phones? Or are you just saying that there are markets where Microsoft has no interest in?

kakmonstret
Posted - 2011.02.12 20:10:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Whitehound


Do you want a native EVE client for your mobile phones? Or are you just saying that there are markets where Microsoft has no interest in?


For being a market they have no interest in they do seem to spend quite a pile of money on it.


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