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Toffee Stunner
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
Posted - 2010.12.22 12:22:00 - [121]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Two clear alts trolling a thread with the same angle whilst providing no substance to a thread? Surely it's just a chance ^_^ Either way I appreciate the constant bumps. You two are welcome to add to the thread as per the Mod request anytime you wish.


I'm sorry Eddie, SadSad

I simply do not agree with what you want to do to the super carriers.

I left it at that and you kept replying with, "Why?! Why?! Why?!" You even used your alt yourself and messed it up exposing the alt as yours. EmbarassedEmbarassed

So can you please let us say we don't like it, give the reasons why, and if you don't agree, leave it there? NeutralNeutral

Anyhoo, again, I strongly advise you take this to Ideas and Discussion forum where it can be worked on. A lot of good things happen there so please don't be afraid. SurprisedSurprised

- <3 Toffee Stunner

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 12:24:00 - [122]
 

Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 22/12/2010 12:24:39
Originally by: Toffee Stunner
Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Two clear alts trolling a thread with the same angle whilst providing no substance to a thread? Surely it's just a chance ^_^ Either way I appreciate the constant bumps. You two are welcome to add to the thread as per the Mod request anytime you wish.


I'm sorry Eddie,

I simply do not agree with what you want to do to the super carriers.

I left it at that and you kept replying with, "Why?! Why?! Why?!" You even used your alt yourself and messed it up exposing the alt as yours.

So can you please let us say we don't like it, give the reasons why, and if you don't agree, leave it there?

Anyhoo, again, I strongly advise you take this to Ideas and Discussion forum where it can be worked on. A lot of good things happen there so please don't be afraid.



You mean when I responded with an alt on accident and immediately admitted it was my alt?
If you haven't noticed all my alts have the same naming scheme and thus are bad for alt posting on forums anonymously.

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 12:44:00 - [123]
 

Fot those of you bleating about imagined NDA scandals as you attempt to cast yourselves as the Julian Assange of Eve, here's a quote from the Winter Summit thread:

Originally by: Sokratesz
Day 3

Post dominion 0.0 (3hrs!)
If I had to fly to Iceland only for this session I would have done it. We had gathered a list of items and prepared it a bit. Important things we went over were supercaps, force projection, empire building, profitability of 0.0, objectives for small gangs and of course sovereingty.


The CSM spent 3 hours talking to CCP about how Dominion had changed 0.0, and the first thing on Sokratesz's list is supercaps. Its not hard to figure out the nature of the discussion.

On the other hand, maybe you're right, and the CSM's priority for this discussion was to talk about how underpowered and useless supercarriers are and how they needed triple the EHP and DPS from their current levels?

(it wasn't)

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 12:46:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Fot those of you bleating about imagined NDA scandals as you attempt to cast yourselves as the Julian Assange of Eve, here's a quote from the Winter Summit thread:

Originally by: Sokratesz
Day 3

Post dominion 0.0 (3hrs!)
If I had to fly to Iceland only for this session I would have done it. We had gathered a list of items and prepared it a bit. Important things we went over were supercaps, force projection, empire building, profitability of 0.0, objectives for small gangs and of course sovereingty.


The CSM spent 3 hours talking to CCP about how Dominion had changed 0.0, and the first thing on Sokratesz's list is supercaps. Its not hard to figure out the nature of the discussion.

On the other hand, maybe you're right, and the CSM's priority for this discussion was to talk about how underpowered and useless supercarriers are and how they needed triple the EHP and DPS from their current levels?

(it wasn't)

Why you gotta ruin my fun Scatim? None of these trolls would have stumbled upon this.

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 12:48:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Fot those of you bleating about imagined NDA scandals as you attempt to cast yourselves as the Julian Assange of Eve, here's a quote from the Winter Summit thread:

Originally by: Sokratesz
Day 3

Post dominion 0.0 (3hrs!)
If I had to fly to Iceland only for this session I would have done it. We had gathered a list of items and prepared it a bit. Important things we went over were supercaps, force projection, empire building, profitability of 0.0, objectives for small gangs and of course sovereingty.


The CSM spent 3 hours talking to CCP about how Dominion had changed 0.0, and the first thing on Sokratesz's list is supercaps. Its not hard to figure out the nature of the discussion.

On the other hand, maybe you're right, and the CSM's priority for this discussion was to talk about how underpowered and useless supercarriers are and how they needed triple the EHP and DPS from their current levels?

(it wasn't)

Why you gotta ruin my fun Scatim? None of these trolls would have stumbled upon this.


Because I'm a lol t1 goonie nerfsploiter and so my only reason to play this game is to ruin it for everyone INCLUDING YOU

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 12:50:00 - [126]
 

Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Fot those of you bleating about imagined NDA scandals as you attempt to cast yourselves as the Julian Assange of Eve, here's a quote from the Winter Summit thread:

Originally by: Sokratesz
Day 3

Post dominion 0.0 (3hrs!)
If I had to fly to Iceland only for this session I would have done it. We had gathered a list of items and prepared it a bit. Important things we went over were supercaps, force projection, empire building, profitability of 0.0, objectives for small gangs and of course sovereingty.


The CSM spent 3 hours talking to CCP about how Dominion had changed 0.0, and the first thing on Sokratesz's list is supercaps. Its not hard to figure out the nature of the discussion.

On the other hand, maybe you're right, and the CSM's priority for this discussion was to talk about how underpowered and useless supercarriers are and how they needed triple the EHP and DPS from their current levels?

(it wasn't)

Why you gotta ruin my fun Scatim? None of these trolls would have stumbled upon this.


Because I'm a lol t1 goonie nerfsploiter and so my only reason to play this game is to ruin it for everyone INCLUDING YOU


Ah well, the logs should be out soon and they can see the exact things said with everyone else. But :tinfoil: :tinfoil: :tinfoil: :tinfoil:

Windjammer
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.22 18:03:00 - [127]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Fot those of you bleating about imagined NDA scandals as you attempt to cast yourselves as the Julian Assange of Eve, here's a quote from the Winter Summit thread:

Originally by: Sokratesz
Day 3

Post dominion 0.0 (3hrs!)
If I had to fly to Iceland only for this session I would have done it. We had gathered a list of items and prepared it a bit. Important things we went over were supercaps, force projection, empire building, profitability of 0.0, objectives for small gangs and of course sovereingty.


The CSM spent 3 hours talking to CCP about how Dominion had changed 0.0, and the first thing on Sokratesz's list is supercaps. Its not hard to figure out the nature of the discussion.

On the other hand, maybe you're right, and the CSM's priority for this discussion was to talk about how underpowered and useless supercarriers are and how they needed triple the EHP and DPS from their current levels?

(it wasn't)

Why you gotta ruin my fun Scatim? None of these trolls would have stumbled upon this.
Are you saying this is entirety of your information source?

-Windjammer

Hun Jakuza
We Are So Troubled Everyone Runs Screaming
Posted - 2010.12.22 19:27:00 - [128]
 

Edited by: Hun Jakuza on 22/12/2010 19:29:13
Originally by: Vuk Lau
TBH IMHO motherships should lose their EW immunity (except warp disruption)


No, with warp distruption too. That would be stop the brainless SCs hotdopping on a single ship.
They can safe their ships against with small stuffs, they can use, neutralizer,small drones,fighters etc.

It's time to remove their all EW immunity before the game change to SC online (almost 1500 in game, and every months, this number growing with over 200+), it's time to make it the game to dangerous for them too.
Stop 100+ SC fleet blobs now, before will too late

Bobbeh
Minmatar
Navy of Xoc
The Remnant Legion
Posted - 2010.12.22 20:01:00 - [129]
 

Edited by: Bobbeh on 22/12/2010 20:09:57
Edited by: Bobbeh on 22/12/2010 20:02:42
Originally by: Hun Jakuza
Edited by: Hun Jakuza on 22/12/2010 19:29:13
Originally by: Vuk Lau
TBH IMHO motherships should lose their EW immunity (except warp disruption)


No, with warp distruption too. That would be stop the brainless SCs hotdopping on a single ship.
They can safe their ships against with small stuffs, they can use, neutralizer,small drones,fighters etc.

It's time to remove their all EW immunity before the game change to SC online (almost 1500 in game, and every months, this number growing with over 200+), it's time to make it the game to dangerous for them too.
Stop 100+ SC fleet blobs now, before will too late



Omg cause we were already at Dreads online......... Think before you post.

Tho i do agree with vuk i think they should have a large sensor srength but not be immune to ewar. I do think they should keep their immunity to points and webs. or else we are gonna see dd titans that get webbed off grid immediately after their immobility timer.


Its obvious something needs to change for super carriers.

earlier in the thread i voiced my opinion that a simple change to neut range for sc's would suffice as then they cant counter hics with neuts.
Another Thing i wanted to mention is Removing their ability to use Ewar, Meaning Supers cant web or tackle, or target paint or anything like that (minus their projected ecm.) My final Point is Make FB's Signatures bigger.

AS's and Cruisers should beable to lock them quickly so make their signatures bigger.

So to sum it up
If i was gonna recommend a change to super carriers it would be this
-40% to Neutralizer and Nos range
Cannot Fit EW mods
Fighter Bombers get a larger sig.
+20% to Smart Bomb Range
Cannot use Combat Scout Drones (This means mediums heavys and lights cant be used) but sentries and ewar drones and logi drones can
Give SUper caps back their old insurance.

Oh i also forgot If we do to much to Nerf them we will see a drastic reduction in their use and therefore also their death.

At the moment at least 1 is dieing per week on average. The best way to combat the growth of Super carriers is to make them worth flying. so that people use em in combat.


Regina Wylde
Minmatar
The Demon Gate
SCUM.
Posted - 2010.12.22 20:17:00 - [130]
 

As discussed on twitter...

Make super carriers actual carriers.

- increase ship maintenance array from 2.5M m3 to 10M
- bring back the clone bay
- remove +3 fighter / bomber per level and set it back to 1
(dropping their dps dramatically, but still able to defend themselves) Borrowing Ed's idea a bit...have a separate fighter bay and drone bay. 600m3 drone bay, enough fighter space to hold 1 full set of bombers and fighters.
- keep their current HP and ECM burst
- increase their jump range to that of carriers

I believe this would help to re-balance super caps. Super carriers would be more logistical support, but still able to defend themselves on the field...but they wouldn't be the main damage dealers anymore. Let Titans and Dreads fill that role again.

They would be able to help pilots re-ship during an op and if someone gets podded they can jump clone back to the carrier. This might make them less of a front line ship, but that is the point.

I envision the future of large fleet battles to be (in order of damage) Titan, Dread, Super Carrier, Carrier, Battleship, HAC, BC etc...

peace o/

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 20:25:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Regina Wylde
As discussed on twitter...

Make super carriers actual carriers.

- increase ship maintenance array from 2.5M m3 to 10M
- bring back the clone bay
- remove +3 fighter / bomber per level and set it back to 1
(dropping their dps dramatically, but still able to defend themselves) Borrowing Ed's idea a bit...have a separate fighter bay and drone bay. 600m3 drone bay, enough fighter space to hold 1 full set of bombers and fighters.
- keep their current HP and ECM burst
- increase their jump range to that of carriers

I believe this would help to re-balance super caps. Super carriers would be more logistical support, but still able to defend themselves on the field...but they wouldn't be the main damage dealers anymore. Let Titans and Dreads fill that role again.

They would be able to help pilots re-ship during an op and if someone gets podded they can jump clone back to the carrier. This might make them less of a front line ship, but that is the point.

I envision the future of large fleet battles to be (in order of damage) Titan, Dread, Super Carrier, Carrier, Battleship, HAC, BC etc...

peace o/


I will edit more into this response later as I have time tonight I just wanted to say do you remember how utterly worthless clone bays are/were?

Rixiu
The Inuits
Posted - 2010.12.22 21:36:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: Regina Wylde
As discussed on twitter...

Make super carriers actual carriers.

- increase ship maintenance array from 2.5M m3 to 10M
- bring back the clone bay
- remove +3 fighter / bomber per level and set it back to 1
(dropping their dps dramatically, but still able to defend themselves) Borrowing Ed's idea a bit...have a separate fighter bay and drone bay. 600m3 drone bay, enough fighter space to hold 1 full set of bombers and fighters.
- keep their current HP and ECM burst
- increase their jump range to that of carriers

I believe this would help to re-balance super caps. Super carriers would be more logistical support, but still able to defend themselves on the field...but they wouldn't be the main damage dealers anymore. Let Titans and Dreads fill that role again.

They would be able to help pilots re-ship during an op and if someone gets podded they can jump clone back to the carrier. This might make them less of a front line ship, but that is the point.

I envision the future of large fleet battles to be (in order of damage) Titan, Dread, Super Carrier, Carrier, Battleship, HAC, BC etc...

peace o/


Why not simply use a normal carrier?

I'd go the other way and add the removal of the remote repair range bonus to the list in the first post. The supercarrier role is dps, so why do they have logistic bonuses? If we compare them to subcaps we see that battleships don't have remote repair bonuses...

Supporting this though :)

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.22 23:20:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: Rixiu
Why not simply use a normal carrier?

I'd go the other way and add the removal of the remote repair range bonus to the list in the first post. The supercarrier role is dps, so why do they have logistic bonuses? If we compare them to subcaps we see that battleships don't have remote repair bonuses...


Basically this.

If CCP wants the supercarriers role to be megabuffered anti-capital gankmobiles, then fine, lets have megabuffered anti-capital gankmobiles. No problem with that. What's problematic is when they are megabuffered anti-capital gankmobiles which also have the abilty to sustain permarepping circlejerks, neut and ECM Burst anything that looks like tackling them, switch between effectively infinite waves of different drone types to respond to any threat, and carry vast amounts of assets in their CHA and SMA, all at the same time, from the same hull, and even the same fitting.

HolyNerfBatman
Posted - 2010.12.23 02:08:00 - [134]
 

Funny how every comment from someone in the NC power block is welcomed with open arms but if your not part of the NC power block, your comments are meet with extreme tear filled bitter rage.

Take off the political goggles ehh?

Just saying.

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.23 02:15:00 - [135]
 

Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 23/12/2010 02:15:17
Skimming the thread I see a number of non NC powerbloc posters supporting this and only 3 non NC not supporting it. Also the thread has been a lot more of our powerbloc than anyone else because ive been spattering this all over our various forums, jabbers, voice comms, etc to get as much input as possible. The thread's like 2 days old. I am sure it will spread. So far the only people with problems with it haven't really been able to articulate what about it they think is bad. With the exception of Marlona who did a pretty good job and voiced actual concerns I have thought over.

edit: Thanks for PNQY Btw London.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.23 02:19:00 - [136]
 

Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Originally by: Rixiu
Why not simply use a normal carrier?

I'd go the other way and add the removal of the remote repair range bonus to the list in the first post. The supercarrier role is dps, so why do they have logistic bonuses? If we compare them to subcaps we see that battleships don't have remote repair bonuses...


Basically this.

If CCP wants the supercarriers role to be megabuffered anti-capital gankmobiles, then fine, lets have megabuffered anti-capital gankmobiles. No problem with that. What's problematic is when they are megabuffered anti-capital gankmobiles which also have the abilty to sustain permarepping circlejerks, neut and ECM Burst anything that looks like tackling them, switch between effectively infinite waves of different drone types to respond to any threat, and carry vast amounts of assets in their CHA and SMA, all at the same time, from the same hull, and even the same fitting.
This sounds right to me. The supercarrier is too powerful against sub-caps, mostly cause of fighters, regular drones, and heavy neuts.

Regular carriers also have most of that power against sub caps, but least regular carriers can be tackled and killed by medium gang of sub caps.

HolyNerfBatman
Posted - 2010.12.23 02:39:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
With the exception of Marlona who did a pretty good job and voiced actual concerns I have thought over.


Really? Because it looks like you did a good job of scaring her out of the thread on her last idea/comment. It was a bit long and I didn't follow what she was on about but never the less, my point still stands.

Just try and be a bit more neutral politically when it comes to AH, can you do that?

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.23 02:55:00 - [138]
 

Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 23/12/2010 02:57:47
Originally by: HolyNerfBatman
Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
With the exception of Marlona who did a pretty good job and voiced actual concerns I have thought over.


Really? Because it looks like you did a good job of scaring her out of the thread on her last idea/comment. It was a bit long and I didn't follow what she was on about but never the less, my point still stands.

Just try and be a bit more neutral politically when it comes to AH, can you do that?

His last point was awful. But at least he tried to actually point out where he thought the flaws in the concept was. Unlike you ^_^

Originally by: Ephemeron
This sounds right to me. The supercarrier is too powerful against sub-caps, mostly cause of fighters, regular drones, and heavy neuts.

Regular carriers also have most of that power against sub caps, but least regular carriers can be tackled and killed by medium gang of sub caps.


That's exactly what I came to as well. I think making them jammable would also help but I wouldnt like to see their ewar immunity completely removed. Things such as scramblers and webs should still not work on them.

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.23 03:25:00 - [139]
 

Edited by: Marlona Sky on 23/12/2010 03:25:12
Originally by: HolyNerfBatman
Really? Because it looks like you did a good job of scaring her out of the thread on her last idea/comment. It was a bit long and I didn't follow what she was on about but never the less, my point still stands.

Just try and be a bit more neutral politically when it comes to AH, can you do that?


I appreciate the white knight thing here, but I don't need someone to defend me. Especially a dirty alt. I said what I thought and that was that. I am still watching the thread, so I'm hardly 'scared' away from it.

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
His last point was awful. But at least he tried to actually point out where he thought the flaws in the concept was.


My intent on that idea was not to punish the active players. The idea was to scale back the amount of super capitals showing up, that actually does scale up and down. I will admit that what goes on in my head and when I talk about it on comms, it sounds better when I start talking about all the different scenerios it would apply to and how it would interact heavily with strategy and the political landscape. In a good way, I assure you.

It is that whole brain to keyboard thing, a lot is lost in translation. Embarassed

Originally by: Ephemeron
That's exactly what I came to as well. I think making them jammable would also help but I wouldnt like to see their ewar immunity completely removed. Things such as scramblers and webs should still not work on them.


I am not a fan of this idea. Not to disagree just to disagree, but this statement just shows how over powered ECM is. When by allowing them to not be EW immune just so you can jam them. Now if something was done to make ECM a different type of EW completely, like is some other guys thread on here about a resist debuff, it would be different. What sucks is this could be a good option if the EW wasn't so incredibly unbalanced across the board.

Time for Caldari to have two different types of EW like the other races instead of one all powerful one. Meh, who knows, but that is another topic.

Ophelia Ursus
Posted - 2010.12.23 03:49:00 - [140]
 

Originally by: Windjammer


Originally by: HolyNerfBatman


Originally by: Toffee Stunner



Drink bleach.

Windjammer
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.23 04:46:00 - [141]
 

Originally by: Ophelia Ursus
Originally by: Windjammer


Originally by: HolyNerfBatman


Originally by: Toffee Stunner



Drink bleach.
Cope with life.

Windjammer
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.23 05:16:00 - [142]
 

Originally by: Scatim Helicon
Fot those of you bleating about imagined NDA scandals as you attempt to cast yourselves as the Julian Assange of Eve, here's a quote from the Winter Summit thread:

Originally by: Sokratesz
Day 3

Post dominion 0.0 (3hrs!)
If I had to fly to Iceland only for this session I would have done it. We had gathered a list of items and prepared it a bit. Important things we went over were supercaps, force projection, empire building, profitability of 0.0, objectives for small gangs and of course sovereingty.


The CSM spent 3 hours talking to CCP about how Dominion had changed 0.0, and the first thing on Sokratesz's list is supercaps. Its not hard to figure out the nature of the discussion.

On the other hand, maybe you're right, and the CSM's priority for this discussion was to talk about how underpowered and useless supercarriers are and how they needed triple the EHP and DPS from their current levels?

(it wasn't)
The OP stated in post 32 of this thread, “We know a supercarrier nerf is incoming. That's been confirmed beyond a shadow of a doubt. We just don't know what it contains yet.” If this is the single source of his information, then it’s all the proof needed to show he’s spewing rubbish designed to misinform. Much as the rest of his posts insisting drastic nerfs need to be applied to Supercarriers.

A large nerf of Supercarriers benefits goons and any other blob happy group with a large number of newer players in their membership. It isn’t good for EVE. It’s good for the OP’s group and similar groups.

The proposed nerfs would virtually mean that only large corporations or alliances could field Supercarriers without unrealistic risk to a heavy investment. Large corporations have many people on simultaneously and can afford the increased demand on logistics the proposed nerf would require. Any carrier, even Supercarriers, require support to be used without high risk of getting killed quickly. The proposed nerf would raise the required support to such a level that smaller corporations/alliances would seldom be able to have enough personnel on at one time to field support for a Supercarrier and that’s IF they could do it at all. Thus any but the largest of corporation/alliances would be at a severe disadvantage.

This proposed nerf would create an elitist environment where numbers would say whether a corp can have access to Supercarriers, not skills trained, not resources to build, not knowledge of EVE, but simply numbers.

These are Supercarriers, formerly known as Motherships. They’re expensive as all get out, they’re huge and they’re SUPPOSED to be hard to kill. Enough with the nerfs to make the blobs life easier. Let’s leave people with something to aspire to other than to join one of the enormo alliances and be a good little follower.

-Windjammer


Omara Otawan
Posted - 2010.12.23 06:27:00 - [143]
 

Originally by: Windjammer

The proposed nerfs would virtually mean that only large corporations or alliances could field Supercarriers without unrealistic risk to a heavy investment.



Why would that be? Even a medium sized corp would be fine using them in their intended role as anti-capital platform, its not like they'd suddenly be made out of paper and could be tackled by a t1 frigate.

They would have to bring a minimal support fleet with them though, I dont see how it is too much to ask to bring like 2 additional regular carriers plus say 15 battleships as support.

If the entity in question does not have the option to field about 20 ships, then they shouldnt be fielding supercapitals.

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.23 09:31:00 - [144]
 

Edited by: Furb Killer on 23/12/2010 09:32:56
Quote:
even Supercarriers, require support to be used without high risk of getting killed quickly

BS, unless you mean by support of supercarriers more supercarriers...

This is the only way you got 0.0 a bit healthy again. The current situation forces every powerblock member to either RMT or bot to be able to keep up with the arms race. It also removes any kind of player skill and brings us back to bigger is better, and more of the bigger is especially better. I thought the idea behind eve was that every ship has their role, and bigger is not automatically better.
If you cannot field a support fleet with a few supercaps you shouldnt be fielding a few supercaps. Really are you saying a small-medium corp should be able to use supercaps that walk over the enemy small-medium corps subcap fleet without any support?

Tbh the idea of making SCs back into motherships (as in make them carry loads of subcaps + clone bay so during a fight people can reship, something like a mobile station) is interesting, but the main issue i see is that it will never leave POS shields. And if you force it to be outside pos shields to operate it will never leave hugging the POS shields.

Also @ goonies and other NC here. A previous poster pretty much said that everyone in favor is an NC member. Since that apparently makes me an NC member, do you guys have some kind of NC wide reimbursement scheme that i am then eligeble for?

Hollow Confrontation
Decepticle Corp
Posted - 2010.12.23 13:09:00 - [145]
 

There is no solution to my mind, they were added and implemented badly, were nerfed then buffed and nerfed again.

Sov is fkd, super caps are fkd, this proposal is fkd.

No, because I'm fking sick of every one and his wife crying nerf, and because your goons I suspect an underlying reason for the change based on selfish reasons not the good of the game as your offensive in Fountain and moves into Delve against IT cap systems suggests.

Just calling it how I see it.

For me remove all super caps from the game and make titans gigantic mobile space stations hard to kill with limited offensive capability, as for sov I honestly can't see a good solution that would work.

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.23 18:51:00 - [146]
 

Originally by: HolyNerfBatman
Funny how every comment from someone in the NC power block is welcomed with open arms but if your not part of the NC power block, your comments are meet with extreme tear filled bitter rage.


Its more funny how so many of the comments actively opposing the various proposals come from no-name alt and NPC corpers making ham-fisted innuendo about the ulterior motives of the Evil T1 Goonie Nerfsploiters.

I mean, if this was so clearly a plot to get CCP to nerf the people we fight against, I'm sure the members of those entities would be falling all over themselves to jump into this thread and call us out on it, but 5 pages in for some reason it seems they don't possess the x-ray vision required to spot our Machiavellian espionage.

(Dont worry, I'm sure they'll be along any minute now)

Crias Taylor
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.24 02:18:00 - [147]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 19/12/2010 13:03:48
Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 19/12/2010 10:52:57
Proposed changes

: Wyvern and Hel -1 lowslot
: Aeon and Nyx -1 midslot
: Reduce capacitor and/or capacitor recharge rate
: Reduce scan resolution
: Seperate Fighter Bay with room for full flight of fighters OR bombers
: Regular dronebay of less than 1000m3
: Cap destabilizer and NOS activation cost increase of 3000%
: 30% reduced DPS to Fighter Bombers

With these changes a supercarrier or even group of them would be much harder pressed to counter hictors, interdictors, and subcap fleets in general.

The reduction of DPS would finally allow titans to out dps them but keep a supercarriers DPS high enough to fulfill their role as an anti capital ship.

The nos/nuet removal hinders their ability to nullify hictors and to a lesser extent interdictors which are countered more by the scan res reduction.

None of these changes would stop a supercarrier from killing capitals, only subcaps. You would be required to bring support to strip tacklers or defend against a conventional fleet.

edit: Oh and I am a long time Wyvern pilot. This isn't about me hating Supercarriers. It's pretty plain to see they are presently overpowered.

Alternatively here is a suggestion by XTTZ
Quote:

: Reduce scan resolution
: Turn current drone bay into fighter/bomber only bay.
: Regular drone bay of 250m3 (400m3 Nyx)
: Aeon armour reduction 1.1m -> 975k
: Nyx armour reduction 1.05m -> 950k
: Wyvern shield reduction 1m -> 975k
: Hel bonus change -> +5% shield hp per level
: All SC's can deploy 1 additional drone per level
: Role bonus: Each DCU allows for 3 additional drones
: (No change to current bandwidth)

: Anchorable bubbles cannot be targeted by bombers/fighters
: New module for AF's - Focus point with 10-15km range.
: New bubble probe for interdictors - 30km range, only affects jump drives and not warp drives.



:condi:

This is terrible. This is a Nyx nerf while the aeon and wyvern keep their ehp. **** you and die BFM.

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.12.24 19:27:00 - [148]
 

Originally by: Hollow Confrontation
There is no solution to my mind, they were added and implemented badly, were nerfed then buffed and nerfed again.

Sov is fkd, super caps are fkd, this proposal is fkd.

No, because I'm fking sick of every one and his wife crying nerf, and because your goons I suspect an underlying reason for the change based on selfish reasons not the good of the game as your offensive in Fountain and moves into Delve against IT cap systems suggests.

Just calling it how I see it.

For me remove all super caps from the game and make titans gigantic mobile space stations hard to kill with limited offensive capability, as for sov I honestly can't see a good solution that would work.


Actually if you know anything of IT's supercap fleet you would know it's quite Titan Heavy. They have something along the lines of a dozen times our amount of titans. So if we wanted to have our best chance of getting into delve we would want Supercarriers to be as strong as possible not nerfing them if this was part of some ulterior motive.

Kalle Demos
Amarr
Helix Protocol

Posted - 2010.12.24 20:29:00 - [149]
 

Not sure about damage reduction on FB tbh, but yes to everything else.

As for Xttz idea, not really keen on AF getting a focus point but would be nice to see titans changed so they cant kill non caps.

Rip Minner
Gallente
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
Posted - 2010.12.24 22:33:00 - [150]
 

Nerf them into the gound baby! INTO THE GROUND!

lmaoVery Happy



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