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Commander Phoenix
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.12.16 12:49:00 - [121]
 

Originally by: Caldariftw123

Again read what I said: How many remaps has that person had in how many months? Right, exactly the same as the other guy, except you used yours earlier. READ. AGAIN. SLOWLY. Char 1 gets 2 remaps, char 2 gets 2 remaps, then they both get a free one. They've both had 3 remaps. One of them used some of theirs, the other did not, they still had the same number of remaps however.

If you use your remap, your timer is reset, yes, does that screw you over? No. Why? Well if you think about it using the same basic logic .. char 1 now has 3, you have 1, you use yours and your timer is set to 12 months from now, char 1 uses all of their's at some point and has to wait 12 months for their next one. Let's say for some stupid reason they both use them all on the same day, so they then wait 12months for their next one. You've both still had the same number of remaps in the same time frame! Amazing how that works right?

Now let's say more realistically you use yours but the other dude uses his over a period of time, then he waits a year for his next one which will come after you've already gotten yours - you are now ahead of him because you've gotten your fourth remap in less time than it takes for him to gets his fourth.

Are you gaining much, you who has 1 month to wait for your next one anyway? No you aren't gaining much, just a month, but it's a month of free all the same, whereas the guy who has 3 still has the same amount of remaps in the same time frame as you, except his fourth one will come later. So in reality those that used their remaps are always going to get more remaps in a shorter time frame, than those that do not use their remaps. So in fact the ONLY pseudo-complaint people could have has NOTHING to do with those people that now have 3 remaps, but those that used all their remaps recently will now get their timer reset. This change benefits those that remapped recently the most and those that remapped later the least. Entitlement convinced idiots can't even complain about the only actual thing that "hurts" someone (IE you don't get AS MUCH as someone else) This whole "3 remaps dudeblahblah" thing is utter nonsense though :)


What the difference is, is choice. those have have 2 remaps showing have a choice when to use them and can plan for it.

My timer was set to expire in June, That remap has now become available now. I still have 6 months of Int/Mem skills that I need to train up before it's feasible to remap.

After the 6 months has ended when my timer ends, I will not get an extra remap, my remap was due to end in June anyway, nothing has been gained surely?

If I don't 'choose' to remap differently to what I'm currently mapped for, I will loose out of the free remap and I will be stuck mapped that way for a year, not 6 months.

Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
Posted - 2010.12.16 12:59:00 - [122]
 

The only thing I regret with this is the non-communication of this 'surprise'.
My main remapped about 2 weeks ago for charisma, but as I don't wanted that many skills trained there I didn't go to the fullest with this.. 12 months can be long.
Would I have known that I get a remap, then I would have had maxed this.. LOL.

Oh well, you win some, you loose some. Laughing

As for the people who had only some days/weeks left until their next remap.. yeah, you got butt-sex surprised with this too. My sympathy. Neutral

Karia Sur
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:02:00 - [123]
 

CCP must have been taking lessons from Milla on how to scam people.

Daneel Trevize
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:06:00 - [124]
 

Edited by: Daneel Trevize on 16/12/2010 13:15:42
CCP, you suck.

Originally by: Korenti Rels
EvE used to be a game with diversity where patience, attention to details and planning ahead was required, and failing at that would have consequences.

Mia Restolo
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:06:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: Mia Restolo
So you're saying that the regular remap I should have gotten on the 15th was generously given during DT rather than 8 hours later? ugh


Well it seems my main squeaked under the wire and has two available now, maybe because of the fix basing itself on the old logs?

Still leaves me confused about another character who had about 8 months to wait, I'm guessing he's going to get screwed... luckily I'm pretty much done his training plan anyway.

Staggerr
Broski North
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:06:00 - [126]
 

Well I've been ****ed over on 2 high SP characters. Petitions already send.

A friend who had no remaps, and a timer running, actually received 2 free remaps. Well played CCP, well played.

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:07:00 - [127]
 

I think all this rabble rabble was for naught, brotatos

logged in to see that i have two remaps available, when previously i had zero and would receive a new one tomorrow afternoon. So...everyone who spent their remaps should be getting two, not one. Everyone who had one got bumped up to three.

Fianna Illyasfeld
Broski Enterprises
Elite Space Guild
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:12:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
I think all this rabble rabble was for naught, brotatos

logged in to see that i have two remaps available, when previously i had zero and would receive a new one tomorrow afternoon. So...everyone who spent their remaps should be getting two, not one. Everyone who had one got bumped up to three.


Im the same, but my m8 is still ****ed over.

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:13:00 - [129]
 

Originally by: Fianna Illyasfeld
Im the same, but my m8 is still ****ed over.


they may have screwed up the fix for the initial gift screwup then Smile

Commander Phoenix
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:19:00 - [130]
 

Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
I think all this rabble rabble was for naught, brotatos

logged in to see that i have two remaps available, when previously i had zero and would receive a new one tomorrow afternoon. So...everyone who spent their remaps should be getting two, not one. Everyone who had one got bumped up to three.


No. I didn't get 2. Only 1. So I have a choice. Do I stay with my current plan which ends in 6 months (When my yearly remap was due anyways) and waste the free 'timer reset'. Or do I remap now and be remapped in a way that will mean I have to wait 12 months before I can finish off this skill plan.

CCP Prism X


Gallente
C C P
C C P Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:19:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Fianna Illyasfeld
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
I think all this rabble rabble was for naught, brotatos

logged in to see that i have two remaps available, when previously i had zero and would receive a new one tomorrow afternoon. So...everyone who spent their remaps should be getting two, not one. Everyone who had one got bumped up to three.


Im the same, but my m8 is still ****ed over.


Care to explain how you're messed over? My database tells me you have two respecs available to you?

Judicator Saturnius
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:20:00 - [132]
 

Neural remaps are a stress for human brains and therefore should be performed not sooner than 1 year after the last one. And here some people suggest giving everyone 2 remaps, stacking them to unlimited numbers... OMG.

Actually, the only reason why >1 remaps ever existed is because attribute distribution process had been moved from character creation process to let new players take a thoughtful action on this matter later on in the game. Remaps shouldn't stack, add e.t.c. And frankly speaking, the replacement of learning skills with static bonus didn't require any free remaps, because distribution of 14 points remained the same. Just the speed training have been reduced a bit, meaning people will complete their current plan a bit later and don't need a free remap. Oh, wait, for some people that change meant improved training speed... Ok, they will be able to train a bit more in their current remap, get an extra skill to level V or something.

P.S. I had all Learning Skills at level V and therefore my training speed is now reduced. My usual remap was supposed to be available on the 7-th of January. To sum up, I had a couple of really "awesome" presents. But I still managed to get as much of this situation as I could, postponed some skills for a year, applied reimbursed SP to stuff like Leadership and so on.

Wiki Leaks
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:20:00 - [133]
 

Originally by: CCP Prism X
Originally by: Fianna Illyasfeld
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
I think all this rabble rabble was for naught, brotatos

logged in to see that i have two remaps available, when previously i had zero and would receive a new one tomorrow afternoon. So...everyone who spent their remaps should be getting two, not one. Everyone who had one got bumped up to three.


Im the same, but my m8 is still ****ed over.


Care to explain how you're messed over? My database tells me you have two respecs available to you?


Because we don't have contact folders.

Fianna Illyasfeld
Broski Enterprises
Elite Space Guild
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:22:00 - [134]
 

Originally by: CCP Prism X
Originally by: Fianna Illyasfeld
Originally by: Chaos Incarnate
I think all this rabble rabble was for naught, brotatos

logged in to see that i have two remaps available, when previously i had zero and would receive a new one tomorrow afternoon. So...everyone who spent their remaps should be getting two, not one. Everyone who had one got bumped up to three.


Im the same, but my m8 is still ****ed over.


Care to explain how you're messed over? My database tells me you have two respecs available to you?


Not me, but my mate(m8 = mate) Staggerr is.

Staggerr
Broski North
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:22:00 - [135]
 

Originally by: Fianna Illyasfeld
Not me, but my mate(m8 = mate) Staggerr is.


I'm not your mate, pal.

Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:27:00 - [136]
 

That all is pretty confusing.

CCP Prism X


Gallente
C C P
C C P Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:27:00 - [137]
 

Your mate also has a free respec. He hadn't earned another one through waiting so he only has one.

As to the contact folders: I'm getting rather tired of people thinking that I make game design decisions. I'm a programmer, my just is implementation of decisions made by others. I also like to be active in the community and pass on information when I think it is relevant.
I'll say it again: Something had to be dropped from the refactoring due to time constraint.

We had to pick and chose. Such is life. You win some, you lose some.
I guess that should tell me to stop whining over being blamed for this. I lose. Laughing

Hagbard23Celine
Liga Freier Terraner
Ev0ke
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:28:00 - [138]
 

Sry CCP but this is sh**t.

My plan was made until march 2011 and now I got a "free" remap which I can use for what? Right remap in March 2011 Crying or Very sad. If you are talking about free remaps give ppl with one remap available one additional and ppl with no ramap available 2 remaps or don't reset the remap counter. Your solution is good for ppl who had already one remap available or for ppl who have done some bad job and made a bad plan. ppl with a good skillque (and doing a complete skillque for one year isn't that easy) are totaly fu**ed.

Steijn
Minmatar
Quay Industries
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:32:00 - [139]
 

Originally by: Gnulpie
That all is pretty confusing.


its a complete cluster****

If your lucky you got a freebie, if your unlucky - tough.

Im just glad i havent screwed up my training for 12 months trying to 'fast train' a few skills before my expected remap became available in early Jan. Must admit i nearly did, but glad i didnt as id now be stuck with it for the next year.

Commander Phoenix
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:33:00 - [140]
 

This is not sarcastic.

Thanks CCP for the free remap/timer reset, whatever it is/should have been called. A benefit is still a benefit. Smile Just up to me now to choose what to do with it.

EffBee Primus
Caldari
DCS Ltd
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:34:00 - [141]
 

I have 3 characters on each of 3 accounts and have never ventured into the area of remapping. All nine of my characters have 3 remaps each. I guess I should start using them.

But I am confused - even after skim reading this thread.

1) What does the timer time? Time till I can do another remap? Time till next remap given to me? Other?
2) I THINK I can do 3 remaps anytime I want, but after the last one will have to wait a year for the next.
3) Will I ever lose a remap if I don't use it. Most of my training happens with a main on each account. A little with a secondary support character on each account. Practically none on the third character on each account.

I need to get this right so I don't accidentally screw my mains with a bad attribute setup for a year. Thanks







Commander Phoenix
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:37:00 - [142]
 

Originally by: EffBee Primus
I have 3 characters on each of 3 accounts and have never ventured into the area of remapping. All nine of my characters have 3 remaps each. I guess I should start using them.

But I am confused - even after skim reading this thread.

1) What does the timer time? Time till I can do another remap? Time till next remap given to me? Other?
2) I THINK I can do 3 remaps anytime I want, but after the last one will have to wait a year for the next.
3) Will I ever lose a remap if I don't use it. Most of my training happens with a main on each account. A little with a secondary support character on each account. Practically none on the third character on each account.

I need to get this right so I don't accidentally screw my mains with a bad attribute setup for a year. Thanks









1> your timer will not start untill you have used up all your remaps.

2> correct

3> No

Staggerr
Broski North
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:38:00 - [143]
 

Originally by: CCP Prism X
Your mate also has a free respec. He hadn't earned another one through waiting so he only has one.


Oh boy, oh boy. Well since you like programming so much ill try to talk in your language, bare with me:

if remap then +1 remap
if no remap and remap timer <1month then +2 remap (to compensate for the 'but only 1 month left, bawww' factor. Instead of not removing the timer.)
if no remap and remap timer >1month then +1 remap (also known as, if you happened to have 2 months on timer you're ****ed over. You fell off the boat. Sorry, we're just too bad at programming to help)


CCP Prism X


Gallente
C C P
C C P Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:38:00 - [144]
 

Perhaps it is important to re-iterate on this:

The reason people who already had an implicit respec (after waiting for a year or more) got TWO is because if they'd only gotten ONE they would actually have gotten ZERO.

Explanation:
They'd already earned ONE through waiting. This is an indisputable fact.
The reason they get TWO is because when they remap, they lose ONE free respec and the timer is UPDATED. If they had been set to ONE free respec that would leave them at ZERO and with a refreshed timestamp. That's ONE respec they can do after having earned one through waiting and getting another one from us.

Those that had not earned anything have their free respec. You can chose to use it whenever you want but when you gain a new one through waiting it's not going to increment that numbers. You cannot hoard free respecs by design.

Again: If you had no respecs you were, effectively, reset a year back giving you a respec.
If you were already a year back resetting you a year back would give you nothing.
Please bear in mind that waiting for two years does not grant you two respecs. They do not accrue!

Steijn
Minmatar
Quay Industries
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:38:00 - [145]
 

Originally by: EffBee Primus
I have 3 characters on each of 3 accounts and have never ventured into the area of remapping. All nine of my characters have 3 remaps each. I guess I should start using them.

But I am confused - even after skim reading this thread.

1) What does the timer time? Time till I can do another remap? Time till next remap given to me? Other?
2) I THINK I can do 3 remaps anytime I want, but after the last one will have to wait a year for the next.
3) Will I ever lose a remap if I don't use it. Most of my training happens with a main on each account. A little with a secondary support character on each account. Practically none on the third character on each account.

I need to get this right so I don't accidentally screw my mains with a bad attribute setup for a year. Thanks









1) the timer times the amount of time until you are given a new standard free remap.

2) yes

3) unofficially i heard you can never have more than 5 but could be completely wrong about this.

Steijn
Minmatar
Quay Industries
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:41:00 - [146]
 

Originally by: CCP Prism X
Those that had not earned anything have their free respec. You can chose to use it whenever you want but when you gain a new one through waiting it's not going to increment that numbers. You cannot hoard free respecs by design.


I disagree with this point, in my case you havent given me anything FREE, all you have done is move my remap date by around 20 days or so.

spyor
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:44:00 - [147]
 

LOLZ... petrol can out, tin foil hat on :)

/me hazzz 3 available for my characters Laughing

CCP Prism X


Gallente
C C P
C C P Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:47:00 - [148]
 

Edited by: CCP Prism X on 16/12/2010 13:47:18
Originally by: Steijn
Originally by: CCP Prism X
Those that had not earned anything have their free respec. You can chose to use it whenever you want but when you gain a new one through waiting it's not going to increment that numbers. You cannot hoard free respecs by design.


I disagree with this point, in my case you havent given me anything FREE, all you have done is move my remap date by around 20 days or so.


Yes, I understand your point and can appreciate that you want a free respec.
I'm not telling you the design is flawless, but the implementation is by design.

You respecced later than someone else, you do not get a respecc but he might.
You subscribed before someone else, you got the Echelon, he might not.
Not perfect, perhaps not just and I'll leave that up for philosophical debate but certainly gave everyone the possibility of respeccing now.

Staggerr
Broski North
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:49:00 - [149]
 

Originally by: CCP Prism X
Edited by: CCP Prism X on 16/12/2010 13:47:18
Originally by: Steijn
Originally by: CCP Prism X
Those that had not earned anything have their free respec. You can chose to use it whenever you want but when you gain a new one through waiting it's not going to increment that numbers. You cannot hoard free respecs by design.


I disagree with this point, in my case you havent given me anything FREE, all you have done is move my remap date by around 20 days or so.


Yes, I understand your point and can appreciate that you want a free respec.
I'm not telling you the design is flawless, but the implementation is by design.

You respecced later than someone else, you do not get a respecc but he might.
You subscribed before someone else, you got the Echelon, he might not.
Not perfect, perhaps not just and I'll leave that up for philosophical debate but certainly gave everyone the possibility of respeccing now.


Sigh. Then why did some people, with no remaps available and their running timer nearing complete, get TWO free remaps.

Aunty Nora
Posted - 2010.12.16 13:51:00 - [150]
 

IF YOU HAVE MORE THAN ONE REMAP, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO WAIT FOR THE TIMER


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