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CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 18:47:00 - [1]
 

On Wednesday December 15, 2010 we will be releasing our Christmas presents to you. One of these is the removal of learning skills. You can read more about it in CCP Grayscale's dev blog here. Since this is something brand new we decided to provide this FAQ to help you with any questions you might have.

Q: What will happen during Downtime on December 15?
A: CCP Stillman has a great answer to this. This quote is what happened when we tested the change on Singularity and can expect the same thing to happen on Tranquility.

Originally by: CCP Stillman
  • Any injected [learning] skill book that was not trained at all was removed without any reimbursement

  • Any learning skill you had trained was removed, and all SP you had trained in it was reimbursed as free skill points (See the green text at the top of your skill sheet)

  • If you were training a learning skill, the learning skill was removed from the skill queue and your skill queue was restarted with any non-learning-skill you had in your queue

  • If you had any learning skill book in a hangar/cargo/corp hangar/container in space/etc., your skill books have been reimbursed at the following values, to the owning entity
    • Learning skill book: 31,500.00 ISK

    • Tier 1 learning skill book: 35,000.00 ISK

    • Tier 2 learning skill book: 4,500,000.00 ISK

  • Any learning skill books in a contract have been replaced with a Pax Amarria, and the skill book was reimbursed at same above values.

  • Any learning skill books in a market order was reimbursed at the same values listed above



Q: Will my skill training stop during downtime on December 15?
A: One of three things will happen during this change. If you have a long skill set you will notice no change aside from having your new attribute points applied to the skill training time. If you have a short skill set that will end during downtime, because of the new attribute points, then you will stop training like normal unless you have another skill in you skill queue. If you have nothing but learning skills in your queue at downtime then your skill training will be paused and the skills removed. Your skill training will only resume if you have a non-learning skill in the queue. Hint Hint

Q: What happened to the learning skill books?
A: The learning skill books have already been removed from the NPC market. Any books remaining in a hangar/cargo hold/corporation hangar/container in space/etc. will be reimbursed at the amount posted in CCP Stillman's quote above.

Q: Are you going to reimburse us for learning skills we have already trained?
A: Sorry you will not get an ISK reimbursement for injected/trained learning skills. For more information why please read CCP Greyscale's blog.

Q: How does this affect my attributes?
A: After the change you will be given 12 attribute points in each attribute. This means the default attributes will be 20/20/20/20/19 with Charisma being the 19.

Q: Will we still be able to remap attributes?
A: Attribute remaping has not changed. You can still play with your distributable points in the same way after December 15, 2010 as you can today.

Q: I have X.Y million skill points in the learning skills, what happens to them?
A: They are placed in your Skill Point Pool.

Q: How do we use my Skill Point Pool?
A: You can learn how to redistribute your old learning skill points from this EVElopedia article on Skill Reimbursement.

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 18:47:00 - [2]
 

Q: Do we still get the 100% training speed bonus up until 1.6 million skill points?
A: No. You can read CCP Greyscale's Blog for the reasoning behind this change.

Q: If a character with free skill points is transferred, what happens to the free skill points?
A: Free skill points belong to the character and will be transferred with it.

Q: Will I get skill points back for partially trained learning skills?
A: YES! Any skill point put into learning, even if you only have 1 point in each of the basic skills, will be refunded into the skill point pool.

Q: What about implants?
A: Implants are not changing, only learning skills.

Q: Will the learning skill points overwrite any existing bonus skillpoints, like from the unexpected server downtime a few months ago?
A: Nope! They will be added to your skill point queue and the will not expire. Use them now or savor them like a tasty treat for later.

Q:Will I get a free remap?
A: Yes, Merry Christmas Very Happy

Q: *Your question here*
A:

We intended to give every character a free neural remap as part of the Incursion 1.0.1 release. We have been made aware that not every character has received a free remap and we will aim to fix this during downtime on Thursday, December 16. We thank you for your patience. You can see this thread for more information.

An explanation of attribute points

A lot of people have been asking questions about why their attribute points appear lower than expected. My attributes are at 17. The dev blog said we would have 20 points with Charisma at 19? Well both are correct Smile. Let's look at this by ignoring remaps at first. Every pilot has five points in every attribute. When we removed the learning skills we added 12 points to each attribute giving us the '?minimum' 17. Now if your character was created prior to Apocrypha, and have less than the five base points (I'm looking at all you Achura out there) your points will be slightly different, keep that in mind.

Now let's add remapable points to the equation. There are 14 distributable points in remaps. By default these are applied as evenly as possible, 3/3/3/3/2. This gives us the 20/20/20/20/19 that we talked about in the dev blog.

See this handy picture for the current baseline:
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

Now let's get funky and start playing with those remap-able points. You remove two points from charisma and add it to memory. This gives you a 17 in charisma and a 22 in memory. So, if you have remapped at any point in time in your character's history those changes will be reflected in your current attribute points.

Hope this has answered all the questions about attributes. Just remember to keep in mind old base stats, old remaps, and your implants when reviewing your character sheet.

DJWiggles
Gallente
Eve Radio Corporation
Posted - 2010.12.12 18:53:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: CCP Zymurgist


Q: *Your question here*
A:


Can I have a Pony?

Love and kisses..

Wiggles

So Cash
Posted - 2010.12.12 18:55:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: So Cash on 16/12/2010 18:12:53
Edited by: So Cash on 16/12/2010 18:10:52
Edited by: So Cash on 16/12/2010 18:09:09
Edited by: So Cash on 16/12/2010 18:08:28
Seeing as I reserved this post earlier.

What the hell CCP? Why can't you get the remap points correct.

Now people who have remap timers just about to expire have been given a "timer reset" rather than a free remap point. Sure I have one but in 2 weeks I was going to get one anyway.

Now people who didn't even have a remap timer active i.e after a year they were awarded a free remap and didn't spend it now they have 2 remaps and no timer.

What the hell? How is that balanced, your "free gift" has given a large portion of players a massive advantage in terms of SP/Hour. I thought this whole learning skill things was to bring people on a level playing field and now you go and ruin it with something as simple as awarding Remap points unfairly and rather than observing the mechanics you made for your own remap system you go and reset the timers on everyone elses who didn't have a remap available..

To elaborate
People who's timers were set to expire after the 15th only have 1 remap point, whether it be minutes, hours, days or months.

People who's timers expired and were awarded a remap point before the 15th have also been awarded a free remap point.

In the first case it is effectively a timer reset. Completely unbalanced and unfair, people optimise a years worth of planning so the timer reset isn't going to help them any way unless they were "gifted" ANOTHER to balance. There is no sign of any feedback on the threadnaught forming in general discussion either. Another PR blunder.

No, you can't have free stuff.

Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
Posted - 2010.12.12 18:57:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Tres Farmer on 12/12/2010 18:59:54

Q: Did CCP Santa think of this all by himself or had he help from elves?

Q: Does CCP Santa fly a North Polaris sled?

Q: Does CCP Santa talk with CCP Easter Bunny about additions to this, so that CCP Easter Bunny doesn't bring us something totally unrelated?

Q: Has CCP Easter Bunny a totally coloured Pod, like those Easter Eggs?

Q: What's CCP Santas and CCP Easter Bunnys opinion on Armageddon Day on New Years Eve?

Q: Will CCP Santa give us new Balls for our launchers from last year?

Arkhelus
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:02:00 - [6]
 

Are we going to get a free remap aswell?

Lirael Dyrim
Gallente
In Bacon We Trust
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:05:00 - [7]
 

"Any injected skill book that was not trained at all was removed without any reimbursement"

Does that only count for Learning skills or all skills that have not been trained?

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:06:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Tres Farmer
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 12/12/2010 18:59:54

Q: Did CCP Santa think of this all by himself or had he help from elves?
CCP Santa drinks beer instead of milk so all the elves had to help out.

Q: Does CCP Santa fly a North Polaris sled?
Yes

Q: Does CCP Santa talk with CCP Easter Bunny about additions to this, so that CCP Easter Bunny doesn't bring us something totally unrelated?
CCP Easter Bunny was unavailable for comments.

Q: Has CCP Easter Bunny a totally coloured Pod, like those Easter Eggs?
Yes, I reported him once for hacking and GM Horse just laughed at me.

Q: What's CCP Santas and CCP Easter Bunnys opinion on Armageddon Day on New Years Eve?
They think the current amount of chaos on Tranquility is enough.

Q: Will CCP Santa give us new Balls for our launchers from last year?
Have you been a good little boy or girl this year? Guess you will have to wait and see.


Now with answers from me Twisted Evil

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:07:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Lirael Dyrim
"Any injected skill book that was not trained at all was removed without any reimbursement"

Does that only count for Learning skills or all skills that have not been trained?


Only learning skills.

Salpad
Caldari
Carebears with Attitude
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:09:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Lirael Dyrim
"Any injected skill book that was not trained at all was removed without any reimbursement"

Does that only count for Learning skills or all skills that have not been trained?


There's no logical reason whatsoever for removing injected-but-not-yet-trained skillz from outside the Learning category.

I'thari
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:09:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: CCP Zymurgist
Q: *Your question here*
A:
What about my "72 sp/hour"?

Penicilin
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:10:00 - [12]
 

Does our current rewmap stay the same + aded points or it resets to 20.20.20.19?
Do we get a mini or full rewmap to reallocate additional attribute points we are getting now (ppl that didn't have all learning skills trained to lvl5)?

Lirael Dyrim
Gallente
In Bacon We Trust
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:11:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Salpad
Originally by: Lirael Dyrim
"Any injected skill book that was not trained at all was removed without any reimbursement"

Does that only count for Learning skills or all skills that have not been trained?


There's no logical reason whatsoever for removing injected-but-not-yet-trained skillz from outside the Learning category.



Yeah but this is EVE, remember. :P

Lancashirian
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:11:00 - [14]
 

*BOING*

I'm VERY much looking forward to this.

Dark Odile
Caldari
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:13:00 - [15]
 

Q: If a character with free skill points is tranferred, what happens to the free skill points?

Kaztor Troy
Minmatar
The Nietzsche Followers
Shades of Gray
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:14:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Kaztor Troy on 12/12/2010 19:15:55
Question:

Will characters in accounts that are inactive by Dec. 14th find the SP from learning in their pool, when they reactivate?

P.S. Are any free days promotions coming this x-mas? ^^

Skin Miner
Minmatar
DEM0N HUNTERS
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:15:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Penicilin
Does our current rewmap stay the same + aded points or it resets to 20.20.20.19?
Do we get a mini or full rewmap to reallocate additional attribute points we are getting now (ppl that didn't have all learning skills trained to lvl5)?

A: Based on what I saw on Sisi your current allocation stays the same and you don't get another remap.

LeadFarmer
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:16:00 - [18]
 

Q: was CCP Santa brutally murdered by hackers? Does CCO Santa believe in flying rain deers?
A:

NYTERRORZ
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:16:00 - [19]
 

Q: so these attribute points will they default into the assigned learning skill they were taken from or are they assignable to what ever we want? IE there are X ammount of learning skill bonus points to charisma can i put those into intelligence instead?

realdognose
Caldari
Biotronics Inc.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:18:00 - [20]
 

Q: Are the Skillpoints of partialy trained learning skills reimbursed, too? (i.e. if you have trained 300k from lvl IV to V)

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:18:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Dark Odile
Q: If a character with free skill points is tranferred, what happens to the free skill points?


Q and A added to second post Very Happy

Im Blue
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:20:00 - [22]
 

Q as my attributes are being reduced at what point will i slow down my training speed? will it be the next time i change or add a skill or will it be the start or end of the downtime

Giselle Garner
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:20:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Arkhelus
Are we going to get a free remap aswell?


Every time that CCP change some of our EveMon plans without enough antelation, a baby cry:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_EuNx_rpWg10/SQkXnyvnhwI/AAAAAAAAAU0/FdLy0uUw_no/s320/crying_baby.jpg

Please CCP, don't do this baby cry. Give us a neural remap to "correct" the new situation.

Reicine Ceer
Rodents of Unusual Size
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:21:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Reicine Ceer on 12/12/2010 19:21:30
Q:Should i dump my skillpoints into ECM or Gunnery?
A: Your Answer Here

Q: But seriously now, is CCP anticipating any negative effects of this change, and if so, is there anything we should look out for?
A: Your Answer Here

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:21:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: NYTERRORZ
Q: so these attribute points will they default into the assigned learning skill they were taken from or are they assignable to what ever we want? IE there are X ammount of learning skill bonus points to charisma can i put those into intelligence instead?


The skill point pool does not discriminate based on learning attributes. You can put these points wherever you want! Paging CCP Coffee Machine!

Your re-mappable attribute points will not be touched, and will not change unless you remap them. No rules have been changed considering remaps, just the extra attribute points giving from learning skills are being changed.

I'thari
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:23:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Giselle Garner
Give us a neural remap to "correct" the new situation.
Would be good, btw, because some peope actualy made new characters in last few months and rempped having learning skills in mind (or purely for learning skills, in "worst" case).

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:24:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: realdognose
Q: Are the Skillpoints of partialy trained learning skills reimbursed, too? (i.e. if you have trained 300k from lvl IV to V)


Q and A Added to Second post Very Happy

Guinness Hooker
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:27:00 - [28]
 

tell People what happens if you have max learning skills and a major remap with +5. 22/33/22/26.40/22 if you spent the time you get the shaftCrying or Very sad

NYTERRORZ
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:28:00 - [29]
 

Q:i wasnt talking about the skill points i was talking about the attribute points that we get from the learning skills. like if you train iron will up to 5 you get 5 perception points from it. or are all the attribute points that come with the learning skills dissapeering as well? because thats gonna increase training time by a lot.

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.12.12 19:30:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Reicine Ceer
Edited by: Reicine Ceer on 12/12/2010 19:21:30
Q:Should i dump my skillpoints into ECM or Gunnery?
A: Your Answer Here

Q: But seriously now, is CCP anticipating any negative effects of this change, and if so, is there anything we should look out for?
A: Your Answer Here


You may find this thread interesting. It deals with testing these changes on Singularity.


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