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Ivana Twinkle
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.01.07 08:58:00 - [121]
 

I'm having this issue with closed sockets. I work at the ISP I'm using and we're really not traffic shaping in any way.

What is this I dont even

Cibelia
Posted - 2011.01.11 13:16:00 - [122]
 

My French ISP don't want to contact CCP, they say all work as needed.

TY CCP, another solution ? Wink

Tecnicolor Yawn
Posted - 2011.01.12 02:13:00 - [123]
 

+1 peeved Optus customer in Australia.
Running the ping plotter it actually looks like a London ISP dropping the packets at times too.

Understandably its out of CCP's hands (beyond the protocol change) but pretty frustrating if Optus et al won't fix their stuff, doesn't really leave us anywhere to go.

Drone bill for d/c's is bad, but null sec roams are a nightmare.

1rn Bru
Posted - 2011.01.15 16:15:00 - [124]
 

Any update on this CCP?

As I constantly suffer d/connections when I remain connrcted to the internet. Rolling Eyes

Tecnicolor Yawn
Posted - 2011.01.18 10:38:00 - [125]
 

I'm being wildly optimistic, but was there any change in the protocol in this patch that might 'fix' the issue?

I'm enjoying 1-2 minute sessions before being d/c'ed now, and it kicks in some time after 6pm AEST. After that, its pretty much impossible to play reasonably.

Optus in Australia responded with:

"I have not been able to confirm that Optus is treating the particular traffic in question as P2P Traffic"

which isn't exactly reassuring, but I'm not sure how much traction I'll get with them continuing the email chain.

I'll petition with a Ping Plotter dump etc as requested shortly when the problem kicks in again, but seems to me like its a Herculean job 'fixing' all the ISP's (if that is in fact the problem) - if they haven't applied said 'whitelist' by now (its been weeks, or months?) on their 'can't disclose it' filtering appliance, its probably not going to happen soon.

ElfeGER
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.01.18 19:05:00 - [126]
 

do you have some nice graphs about the disconnect probability per isp to share?

an other option might be to offer a normal ssl secured connection on port 443 in the future (unless some isp enforce timeouts there as well)


Hikaru Kobayashi
Posted - 2011.01.19 18:24:00 - [127]
 

What a bunch of uninformed short-sighted comments in this thread.

If you are going to cancel a subscription, cancel the right thing: the subscription of your ISP, not EVE. Direct your discontent at the party causing your issue.

Traffic shaping violates the ISO layering model, one of the core principles of the internet, and if your ISP is doing this they are to blame for any issues this causes. Direct your threats at them.

This is a result of companies ignoring net neutrality, which there is much fuss about in the news. Maybe next time you should give organisations trying to protect that principle some support.

If CCP can not alter their network communication protocols then the game can not progress. It is ridiculous if they couldnít. ISPs are just there to forward traffic, not to be a censor and decide what can go on the internet and what canít.

conradesc3
Posted - 2011.01.20 04:46:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: Hikaru Kobayashi

Traffic shaping violates the ISO layering model, (....)
cancel the right thing: the subscription of your ISP (...)
If CCP can not alter their network communication protocols then the game can not progress.

indeed, any sufficiently advanced bug is indistinguishable from a feature...
Shaping/No Shaping,ISOs,Layers,Models and bla's ... F-F-S, same pc, same isp, same cables, all online games work ok.
Not the new Eve patch..


Killerjock
Posted - 2011.01.24 18:02:00 - [129]
 

Originally by: conradesc3
indeed, any sufficiently advanced bug is indistinguishable from a feature...


You've obviously been contaminated by the evil empire propaganda.
The difference between a feature and a bug is that a bug is both unintended and a malfunction. A feature is intended and aimed at improving something.
Advance it as much as you want, a bug remains a bug.

Quote:
Shaping/No Shaping,ISOs,Layers,Models and bla's ... F-F-S, same pc, same isp, same cables, all online games work ok.
Not the new Eve patch..


One should try to understand what one talks about before making inane comments.

If I use the color of your shirt to adjudicate if you've been drinking, and decide that when you're wearing red at the wheel you should be fined for drunk driving, who's to blame?
you for wearing red or me for deciding arbitrarily to use the wrong metric to adjudicate your behaviour?

Who should be blamed? CCP for doing their work or the traffic shaping equipment for using a mechanism they did not understand to shape eve's protocol?
If they had been using the version information to spot eve's traffic, would you have asked CCP to never change anything in eve anymore?

COMM4NDER
Amarr
Posted - 2011.01.25 11:22:00 - [130]
 

Wouldn't a VPN tunnel solve this for users that have ****ty ISP's ?

Gonzo Fronzo
Posted - 2011.01.25 20:42:00 - [131]
 

I have every 5 mins a disconnect since the last patch (incursion 1.1.1). what happened?

JP Goodwin
Posted - 2011.01.26 04:08:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: CCP Fallout


Why did this occur? ... This change, essentially increasing the number of fields from six to seven, resulted in a bit in our handshake packet to change from a "6" to a "7" which was enough ...



A bit can't change from 6 to 7, I'm guessing you meant byte.

A bit will only stand for so much! (Then it resigns in protest).

The byte that represents 6 is different from the byte that represents 7 by only one bit, but that's irrelevant, the signature scanners are comparing bytes not bits.

Nadarius Chrome's post above about the problem not being the traffic shaper vendor's fault (and especially not CCP's fault) is pretty good except for the analogy at the end about the cop's speed gun. If the cop misreads the speed gun it's his fault.

It's more like a mass murderer, known to be armed and dangerous has been reported seen driving a blue car with a license plate that begins with XYZ, but the witness didn't get the whole plate number. You are out innocently driving your blue car and your license plate happens to begin with XYZ also. The cops pull you over, surround your car with guns drawn, order you to get out and lay down on the ground, cuff you and beat you up a little (claiming that saying 'ouch' when you're cuffed is resisting arrest) and shoot "Chippy", your pet chihuahua, when he barks at them. That's not the cops fault (except for poor Chippy, for that you sue the daylights out of them; get PETA to help pay for your lawyer).

I think that analogy nicely captures the overreaction (dropping a packet) to a perceived threat (bit torrent) by people who are never held accountable for any overreaction that doesn't involve a death (campus IT).

I'm surprised your campus IT people didn't simply revoke all your accounts for using University resources to play a game.

As for people overseas, you're really stuck because it's very possible that it's not your internet service provider who's doing the blocking. It could very well be the internet backbone companies that connect your local (or national) ISP to other continents.

Tecnicolor Yawn
Posted - 2011.01.28 14:59:00 - [133]
 

Way, way too frustrating to play at the moment. Sessions last about 1-2 minutes before disconnecting. Whatever the cause is, I've not changed a thing in terms of my networking, and everything else runs smoothly during these disconnects, except the Eve client, so something is rotten.

Seems to be a lot of people suffering from it, that to fob it off on upstream providers, while (possibly) fair, without doing anything else about it apart from asking for packet dumps from individuals, is a pretty poor response.

Canceling my accounts (and, no you can't have stuff) until I read that something has changed.

dark'illuminati
Amarr
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers
The 0rphanage
Posted - 2011.02.04 23:56:00 - [134]
 

Traffic shaper seems to describe my problem. My ISP is Telstra Clear located in New Zealand so will try to get them to 'handshake' with CCP on the issue.

Saelyth
Caldari
SerenTek BioResearch
Posted - 2011.02.07 21:34:00 - [135]
 

I worked on a similar issue on my campus, and after some digging with the IT staff, determined that the problem turned out to be a TippingPoint Intrusion Prevention System, rather than a "Traffic Shaping Device". While a Traffic Shaping device and an IPS do have some similar functionality, their base purpose is significantly different. Below is the rule that Tranquility server data is triggering, which is blocked in most applications of the Tipping Point IPS system:

Device: TippingPoint IPS
Filter: 7120: TCP: Segment Overlap With Different Data, e.g., Fragroute
Filter Details: This filter detects overlapping TCP segments in which the overlapping data is different. This filter does not cover TCP keep-alive messages with 1 garbage octet (RFC 1122). To detect TCP keep-alive messages with 1 garbage octet, use filter 7122.

The change in packet data for Incursion has brought this about. Apparently, TippingPoint systems believe that the construction and encapsulation of the data packets does not fit within normal parameters, and thus is being dropped from propagation into their protected networks.

If your IT contacts have only been looking at specific Traffic Shaping devices (which generally just prioritize traffic), be sure to specifically mention Intrusion Prevention Systems the next time you speak with them.

If all else fails, I recommend ProxyCap and a subscription to YourFreedom. They have various pricing tiers to fit just about any budget, along with various access speeds and about 180 servers between the US and Europe to route through at your choice. I myself opted for an upgraded subscription through their proxy (using SSL ports) for $10 / 3 months before I managed to get to the bottom of the issue here on campus. Access through YourFreedom was certainly sufficient, permitting me to run sleeper anoms and radars/mags in both DPS and Logistic roles.


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