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Quan Yu
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2010.12.11 15:46:00 - [1951]
 

Originally by: Ebisu Kami
Originally by: YAMANTAKA
few days left but one final question now that i understand finally what will happen.

for example : i have in inteligence attribute 22 points that means 8 basic + 8 from learning skills + 5 from implant = 22
the question is after 14th dec will i have 22 + 12 points ?
or 8 basic -8 from learning skills + 5 from implants +12 gift = 25 ?

sorry if it answered but i miss it
thank you


slighty wrong info


You have currently: 22 ~ ( 5 basic + 3 remappable points + 8 learning skills + 5 implant )*(1+0.05*learning skill level)

after the 14th you will have
17 base + 3 remappable points + 5 implant = 25

Ebisu Kami
Posted - 2010.12.11 16:46:00 - [1952]
 

Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 11/12/2010 16:45:50
Originally by: Quan Yu
You have currently: 22 ~ ( 5 basic + 3 remappable points + 8 learning skills + 5 implant )*(1+0.05*learning skill level)

after the 14th you will have
17 base + 3 remappable points + 5 implant = 25


Whoops, thanks for correcting. Confused 5 and 3.

Darial
Gallente
Dodixie hoes
Posted - 2010.12.11 17:54:00 - [1953]
 

I guess I owe CCP some beers Embarassed

Ibhin Fharteen
Posted - 2010.12.11 19:09:00 - [1954]
 

Originally by: Corbeau Lenoir
CCP, why are you doing this? Confused Firstly you removed attribute diversity for bloodlines, now learning skills. Do you realize, that they added depth to the game? Now everybody will be the same? What' the point? This game is getting too casual...Evil or Very Mad


Agreed... Seems like many are unwilling to put some time into learning a game. IMHO, 2 weeks or so is not unreasonable to get to know and understand a game of EVE's complexity and depth. As a newb I would rather see the addition of StarTrek like ground missions or for that matter more and varied missions would be nice. But people who need instant gratification seem to win out on the whining game. And so why then should we have to mine? Or grind?

Cornwalace
Posted - 2010.12.11 20:00:00 - [1955]
 

If we purchase the Commissioned Officer Edition from a store, do we still have access to the Cerebral Accelerator, since it's an implant anyway? I would like to confirm.

Carulis
Posted - 2010.12.11 20:48:00 - [1956]
 

Hmm not read all th post here, but it was nice to get the additional Attributes on sisi, however if you do a neural remap afterwards you will lose two attribute points Embarassed

Aldera Discordus
Posted - 2010.12.12 11:52:00 - [1957]
 

Originally by: Saul Dhampir
Joy. What next? Removing the crafting system and replacing it with a nice simple buy from NPC vendor one?

If I wanted a simple console game I'd go buy a console.

Way to go SOE.




Um....there is no crafting in EVE......If you want crafting, GO PLAY WOW!!!!!

Otto Toten
Minmatar
The Real OC
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2010.12.12 16:17:00 - [1958]
 

Great.

Rip Minner
Gallente
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
Posted - 2010.12.13 03:52:00 - [1959]
 

Edited by: Rip Minner on 13/12/2010 03:57:45
Edited by: Rip Minner on 13/12/2010 03:56:33
Edited by: Rip Minner on 13/12/2010 03:55:40
Originally by: Aldera Discordus
Originally by: Saul Dhampir
Joy. What next? Removing the crafting system and replacing it with a nice simple buy from NPC vendor one?

If I wanted a simple console game I'd go buy a console.

Way to go SOE.




Um....there is no crafting in EVE......If you want crafting, GO PLAY WOW!!!!!


If you like crafting you would be better off in Istaria.ugh

Edit: But he is right we dont Craft here we Manufacture here. If you think I am wrong go ask your blacksmith in one of the other games to build you a Apoc Twisted Evil





Blackjack EvE
Posted - 2010.12.13 12:17:00 - [1960]
 

Thank you for the new update. It seems X-mass comes early in the EvE Universe. To all the hate posts try to think of a change in the game as a whole, the mens to and end, as long as it affects everyone you basically have nothing to gain or lose in the long run.

Anyway cya in the New Year EVE.

highlateralg
Posted - 2010.12.14 07:01:00 - [1961]
 

CCP, Dont really comprehend removing something that actually fits into the whole sp thing. Having to make compromises to skill training is part of the depth of Eve. Not any different than the myriad of skill choices to improve ability in game.Removing them is short term gain for long term loss, if it attracts new players by making things even then your chippin away part of what makes eve a long term attraction. There are more games than any of us can count that wont keep your interest for a week much less a few years!

Jonah Sands
Posted - 2010.12.14 13:02:00 - [1962]
 

Originally by: Einear Lightfingers
WOW! Way to screw the pooch. Anyone remember Star Wars Galaxies when they converted all the potential characters had to 8 simple templates? This is the same idea. Dumb the game down to keep the noob kid base happy at the expense of the players who worked to understand the game. Like a lot of people I spent the 3 months training those extra skills to 5 to have the advantage over my pirate friends who spent the time grinding weapon skills and ****d me every time I stepped in the wrong system. Now those same people want the same advantage of the person who spent the time to train it and still keep their pew pew.

Thank you CCP for becoming more like Star Wars Galaxies daily. First with the patch for more broken crap and now with taking one of the better parts of the games ability to create individuals away so PVPer can have their guns and all the skills they want to. I'll wait until next year see how this all works out, but this will more than likely be the end of my 4 year run in EVE.



Can I have yer stuff? Wink

Eradiani
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2010.12.14 15:17:00 - [1963]
 

as the dev blog pointed out, the max learning skill people were 2.3 points on average.

I am one of the people who will be training slower come this patch. Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower.

really wished they would have went with 13 un-allocatable skill points

devonii
Posted - 2010.12.14 20:01:00 - [1964]
 

CCP, IF you are reading this, can you please explain why you have completely ignored the very valid requests of people who have trained all skills to 5??? We're now aware that you aren't changing ANYTHING because of the complaints. You could have done several things to address this and apparently have chosen none of them. An explanation would at least be nice...by CCP...not Ebisu or any of the blog lurkers on here who are ardent defenders and probably do NOT have skills trained all trained to 5.

Would like to at least have ONE reply from CCP to those who have raised valid points.

Thanks,

A paid subscriber of multiple accounts...

Ebisu Kami
Posted - 2010.12.14 20:53:00 - [1965]
 

Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 14/12/2010 21:04:04
Originally by: devonii
CCP, IF you are reading this, can you please explain why you have completely ignored the very valid requests of people who have trained all skills to 5??? We're now aware that you aren't changing ANYTHING because of the complaints. You could have done several things to address this and apparently have chosen none of them. An explanation would at least be nice...by CCP...not Ebisu or any of the blog lurkers on here who are ardent defenders and probably do NOT have skills trained all trained to 5.


Baseless assumption, as said several times before. Also, it's in part a rebalance. We benefitted from our 5/5s and now are going on at a slightly reduced rate. Not much different to nerfing the FOTM. But sure, go on rambling about 72 potential SP/h.

Bubba Zennedi
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.15 04:13:00 - [1966]
 

Originally by: Vito Parabellum
Not that fair at all, we olduns that sacrificed months to get maximized learning will lose on this deal because we did not have +12 when we started (means xp lost, compared to new newbies). So this evens the field and our sacrifice (fun,time,xp,money) is nullified. Also the cost of the learningbooks is being dismissed because "we had some use from them?". If we had had +12 from the start we wouldnt have needed them at all. But surprised I'm not, must get moaar playerbase (money)!


This guy makes a good point and I wonder how much old heads will have suffered by losing out exponentially, since now everyone new gets to have the equivalent of all learnings at level 5. Wonder what the real math is. I mean who trained all their learnings to 5 at the opening day? I think there should be some sort of extra bonus for trained learnings, not just the exact returned sp's and maxed base attributes.
Also, how is the long term thinking player being rewarded for that early game sacrifice to train learnings rather than more interesting skills?

Jannx
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.15 10:34:00 - [1967]
 

Ah, woe is me...

The original announcement sadly passed me by a month ago which meant, reading CCP Greyscale's (yes, most excellent) blog this morning came as a it of a shock...

...mainly because I was one skill level away from a complete set of all 11 level 5 learning skills, which I would have accomplished on Boxing Day. Scream? The milk was curdled inside the cows 2 miles away.

OK, we're getting reimbursed and it should all even out and the majority of longer players (which doesn't include me. I merely returned after finding other games pretty brainless) should benefit and all of the other stuff that's been said in the last sixty-odd pages, but what happens to the actual time invested and the sense of achievement that comes with dedicating your alt to the learning process?

I know, so what? I can plug all those points into ships, guns, mining, whatever, and I'll have a much better alt than when I started (as will everybody else). But, what if I wanted to have a smarter character to play? Is the only way to become better, academically speaking, by neural remaps and cyber technology? Is there now no room for the "Big Brain" unless it's fully pimped out?

I may have missed something, but I hope that this has been thought of. I understand the need to revamp the learning system (I think...) but, surely, there is room to have some sort of academic skill tree that can be taken up? After all, we don't want all capsuleers to end up exactly the same, and IRL the academics tend to write the text books from which the rest of us learn.

Anyway, that's just me and my way of thinking. Hope it all works out. I will certainly be busy trying to figure out what to spend all those skill points on and, in a week, would probably have forgotten all about it.

Boxing Day will be just a little bit sadder, though.

JcJet
Caldari
Pretenders Inc
W-Space
Posted - 2010.12.15 12:40:00 - [1968]
 

Well, it's not just unfair if someone just get something for free, while others was train for monts. Think about how is it to train with bad learnings for some years and then this...:) so train it or not, it's sucks.

But it's so cheap, who cares, older players will still have their advantage in SP, at least until next **** up from ccp.

There is an issue with game philosophy - there is should be some difference, but i've wrote that many times.

Who cares, it's buisness, no need to worry about quality of community, if we have quantity. Because all players pays a same subscription fee...

Viscar Ra'Torr
Posted - 2010.12.15 14:24:00 - [1969]
 

"This is silly", "clearly hella awesome" and very entertaining. As for the changes....those are cool too :)

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.12.15 16:02:00 - [1970]
 

Originally by: Eradiani
Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower.


With that 4.5M SP, that means you'll have more SP than you otherwise would for 3,750 days, just over 10 years.

How long do you intend to keep skill that particular character for? You'll have accumulated another 234,000,000 SP by then. Will you really care about training 50 SP/hr slower or quick when you have around 300 million SP?


Really?

Bluemorphium
Posted - 2010.12.15 16:56:00 - [1971]
 

Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?)

Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
Posted - 2010.12.15 17:01:00 - [1972]
 

Originally by: Bluemorphium
Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?)


There is no time limit on them.

Bluemorphium
Posted - 2010.12.15 17:23:00 - [1973]
 

Originally by: Destination SkillQueue
Originally by: Bluemorphium
Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?)


There is no time limit on them.


From who you know that? Source?

JeanClaude Solange
Posted - 2010.12.15 19:06:00 - [1974]
 

To the complainers, I think it's great that they're getting rid of learning skills. The whole learning system takes way to long, in my opinion. Keep in mind people, this is a game, this isn't a career. You can't just have players with 4+ years of training and experience running around blowing up newbies. There's plenty to do in EVE to keep people occupied and subscribed, but if all I'm doing is looking at a skill queue and wondering when I'm finally going to be able to fly that next ship...please. CCP benefits greatly from the fact that there are no real other space-based MMOs. If there were, I think we'd have faster training, to keep people's interest.

Ebisu Kami
Posted - 2010.12.15 19:24:00 - [1975]
 

Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 15/12/2010 19:26:13
Originally by: Bluemorphium
Originally by: Destination SkillQueue
Originally by: Bluemorphium
Is there a date, that when i dont spent the SP on any skills, the SP get delete? Or they available, until i spent them to skills? (in 1 or 2 years maybe?)


There is no time limit on them.


From who you know that? Source?


Experience. There has been a reimbursement already some time ago, when the server was out for an unexpected long time. Those points are still there since then. Same will hold true for this reimbursement. ;)

Mara Abraham
Minmatar
The Tuskers
Posted - 2010.12.15 19:40:00 - [1976]
 

Greetings:

Are we not supposed to get extra attribute points we can do with as we please?

If not, then we did not get a fair exchange. Right now, it looks like CCP dumped the extra attributes where they wanted them, not where I would put them as a paying customer.

Thank you.

Elrinarie
Gallente
Scan This
Posted - 2010.12.15 20:01:00 - [1977]
 

Edited by: Elrinarie on 15/12/2010 20:01:52
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Eradiani
Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower.


With that 4.5M SP, that means you'll have more SP than you otherwise would for 3,750 days, just over 10 years.

How long do you intend to keep skill that particular character for? You'll have accumulated another 234,000,000 SP by then. Will you really care about training 50 SP/hr slower or quick when you have around 300 million SP?


Really?

I think the point is they are getting penalized for being patient when the impatient people are getting a bonus how is that right?

Ebisu Kami
Posted - 2010.12.15 20:20:00 - [1978]
 

Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 15/12/2010 20:22:15
Originally by: Mara Abraham
Greetings:

Are we not supposed to get extra attribute points we can do with as we please?

If not, then we did not get a fair exchange. Right now, it looks like CCP dumped the extra attributes where they wanted them, not where I would put them as a paying customer.

Thank you.



The allocation of the free attribute points did not change. Learning skills were reimbursed and removed and everyone got a flat +12 to each base attribute value, so no, no extra freely distributable points.

Yodayar
Caldari
Knights of Apathy
Posted - 2010.12.15 21:01:00 - [1979]
 

Originally by: Elrinarie
Edited by: Elrinarie on 15/12/2010 20:01:52
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Eradiani
Sure I get 4.5 million skill points to distribute, but I will be training 40-50 sp per hour slower.


With that 4.5M SP, that means you'll have more SP than you otherwise would for 3,750 days, just over 10 years.

How long do you intend to keep skill that particular character for? You'll have accumulated another 234,000,000 SP by then. Will you really care about training 50 SP/hr slower or quick when you have around 300 million SP?


Really?

I think the point is they are getting penalized for being patient when the impatient people are getting a bonus how is that right?


What CCP Needs to do is to add 1 more attribute point to each base, this would make up for the loss of SP/hour. I was getting 2674/hr now I'm getting 2610, for a loss of 64 sp/hr, if CCP added 1 more attribute point to each base I would get 2700 SP/hr giving me a slight increase of 26 sp/hr. As I only have +4 implants in someone with +5 implants would feel this effect even more as they would lose an additional 6 sp/hr for a total loss of 70 sp/hr (with perfect skills and +5 implants).

Xavier Fate
Gallente
Eleutherian Guard
Posted - 2010.12.15 21:17:00 - [1980]
 

Edited by: Xavier Fate on 15/12/2010 21:17:38
Originally by: JeanClaude Solange
To the complainers, I think it's great that they're getting rid of learning skills. The whole learning system takes way to long, in my opinion. Keep in mind people, this is a game, this isn't a career. You can't just have players with 4+ years of training and experience running around blowing up newbies. There's plenty to do in EVE to keep people occupied and subscribed, but if all I'm doing is looking at a skill queue and wondering when I'm finally going to be able to fly that next ship...please. CCP benefits greatly from the fact that there are no real other space-based MMOs. If there were, I think we'd have faster training, to keep people's interest.


Seconded. I agree with the whole post.



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