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I'm Down
Posted - 2010.11.20 23:51:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: I''m Down on 20/11/2010 23:54:46
Oddly enough, watching the new incursion trailer gave me an idea for how to make super capitals balanced while retaining all their glorious firepower.


People complain about supers because they're virtually immune to anything and don't suffer from the same commitment that a carrier or dread would face.

So lets make them Commit-o-Phobes.

Step 1, increase range of titans and SC by 25-50%.

Step 2, increase graphic size of SC by 100%, increase titan graphic size by 150%

Then, add a new feature to these ships. The story for it would be that because of their enormous size, these ships have to fine tune jump calibrations in order to move. This is a Concord feature to limit "planetary disruptions" in all space due to the gravity effects these ships have.


What does this mean:

Super carriers would by default require a calibration time to jump independent of capacitor. I'm personally leaning towards 3 hours between jumps because it makes them commit to fights more. Possibly smaller.

Titans would require a default calibration time of either 12 or 24 hours. They could still bridge normally, but could not move themselves more than once in this time period.

Also, because of cloakings effects on ship sensors, cloaks must be deactivated for between 2 and 5 minutes before a jump can occur.



Why does this work? This commits supers to strategies either offensively, or defensively. There is no 15minutes of fame and then pack up and go home. You're actually committing them to an area of space and allowing enemies to respond. Obviously, you could log them off for 3 hours, but you still run into the issues of being **** cage bubbled on login. If this is to easily exploitable, then change the default log off timer to 3 minutes for any super w/o agro, thus allowing time to probe them out more easily for traps. Possibly also default 50% capacitor for any super on log in. Personally I like both these as added features, but am not committed to them for this proposal.

Basically, If anyone is willing to deploy supers, they become commited to an area for a level of time. This allows the other side to either retaliate, or stear clear of them once they've committed. This should allow Dread naughts a bit more comfort to actually be used because there's always that pesky range limitation for any supers.

Ironically, this makes The Sansha Super all that more attractive because of it's added range.


TLDR

Keep the firepower, Restrict the Movement.

I'm Down
Posted - 2010.11.20 23:55:00 - [2]
 

yep

Angie McFish
Gallente
Caldari Industrial Capitalist Consortium

Posted - 2010.11.21 00:51:00 - [3]
 

Makes sense to me

GlowingBulb
Posted - 2010.11.21 01:33:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: GlowingBulb on 21/11/2010 01:37:37
Could be an interesting idea

Fenix Builder
Posted - 2010.11.21 01:35:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Fenix Builder on 21/11/2010 01:35:15
Horrible idea. But then again this is Yaay so Rolling Eyes

Supers are fine.

mchief117
Posted - 2010.11.21 03:15:00 - [6]
 

I would support this idea only under one condtion ( as supers are living coffens atm) and thats the removal of cynos, if a ship needs to calculate calcualtions to jump and it takes 3+ hours to do it its shouldnt need a becon or else all the work is allready done

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.11.21 07:24:00 - [7]
 

Jesus Yaay you realize that many times you need to use a midpoint, your idea not only forces a person to play for 3 hours just to move to a new system it makes it takes 6 hours to get somewhere if there is a midpoint. This is an awful awful awful idea.

Remember when you said "I have no idea why BFM dislikes me!"

Idiocy like this Yaay. Idiocy like this

I'm Down
Posted - 2010.11.21 07:54:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Jesus Yaay you realize that many times you need to use a midpoint, your idea not only forces a person to play for 3 hours just to move to a new system it makes it takes 6 hours to get somewhere if there is a midpoint. This is an awful awful awful idea.

Remember when you said "I have no idea why BFM dislikes me!"

Idiocy like this Yaay. Idiocy like this


BFM?

BTW, you do realize the goal is to limit what supers do right? They need to be a commitment which they are not. The 2 account thing is a joke of a commitment.

It's not a good thing that supers can move across eve in 20 minutes.

If supers want to be deployed directly into action, then they should need some proximity in the first place. Regular capitals should have the freedom to do the daily bull****.

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.11.21 07:56:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: I'm Down
Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Jesus Yaay you realize that many times you need to use a midpoint, your idea not only forces a person to play for 3 hours just to move to a new system it makes it takes 6 hours to get somewhere if there is a midpoint. This is an awful awful awful idea.

Remember when you said "I have no idea why BFM dislikes me!"

Idiocy like this Yaay. Idiocy like this


BFM?

BTW, you do realize the goal is to limit what supers do right? They need to be a commitment which they are not. The 2 account thing is a joke of a commitment.

It's not a good thing that supers can move across eve in 20 minutes.

If supers want to be deployed directly into action, then they should need some proximity in the first place. Regular capitals should have the freedom to do the daily bull****.

You really don't see how this is an awful awful idea?

darius mclever
Posted - 2010.11.21 08:04:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Jesus Yaay you realize that many times you need to use a midpoint, your idea not only forces a person to play for 3 hours just to move to a new system it makes it takes 6 hours to get somewhere if there is a midpoint. This is an awful awful awful idea.

Remember when you said "I have no idea why BFM dislikes me!"

Idiocy like this Yaay. Idiocy like this


agreeing with a goon. *thumbs down*

Intigo
Amarr
Genos Occidere
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.11.21 08:27:00 - [11]
 

Yaay is a joke, much like this suggestion.

FinnAgain Zero
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.11.21 10:00:00 - [12]
 

Deploying a super to the front lines from your home base?
Hope you've got a few days.

Darveses
Fantastulousification Inc.
Posted - 2010.11.21 10:45:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: I'm Down

increase titan graphic size by 150%



Sounds like an excellent idea. YARRRR!!

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2010.11.21 11:15:00 - [14]
 

Three hours is way too long and it needs to be associated with aggression, eg. unable to jump for 1 hour after engaging in offensive operations.

But; it doesn't actually solve anything, merely makes using supers a pain in the arse.
The super blob will still trump any other available strategy with a comfortable margin and does nothing to mitigate the ridiculousness of supers being used outside null to gank bs/sub-bs.

Good idea as part of a solution but by no means a stand-alone.

Trebor Daehdoow
Gallente
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2010.11.21 11:16:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: FinnAgain Zero
Deploying a super to the front lines from your home base?
Hope you've got a few days.

As opposed to the current system, where supercapitals are as fast to deploy over long distances as interceptors? Just like in the real world, where Aircraft Carriers are just as fast as F-18's. Twisted Evil

If SuperCaps are intended to be a strategic weapon, then there should be strategic consequences to deploying them, and there should be ways for clever enemies to exploit errors in their deployment.

I am not saying the OP's suggestion is the best way to do this, but it is worthy of serious discussion.

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.11.21 11:27:00 - [16]
 

The caps can be in ONE system every 10-15 minutes. An interceptor can hop between systems at will. These are different kinds of mobility entirely.

FinnAgain Zero
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.11.21 11:27:00 - [17]
 

Anything with a jump drive deploys at the same general speed. Supers a bit slower than some due to their limited range. As for the real world, I'm still waiting for functional immorality via FTL cloning.

Quote:

If SuperCaps are intended to be a strategic weapon, then there should be strategic consequences to deploying them, and there should be ways for clever enemies to exploit errors in their deployment.


Bubbles and counter attacks seem like a tactical and a strategic dynamic that can screw with super deployment.

Lallante
Reikoku
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2010.11.21 14:51:00 - [18]
 

Horrible Idea from a terrible person.

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2010.11.21 17:48:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Cyrus Doul on 21/11/2010 17:52:16
Originally by: FinnAgain Zero
Anything with a jump drive deploys at the same general speed. Supers a bit slower than some due to their limited range. As for the real world, I'm still waiting for functional immorality via FTL cloning.

Quote:

If SuperCaps are intended to be a strategic weapon, then there should be strategic consequences to deploying them, and there should be ways for clever enemies to exploit errors in their deployment.


Bubbles and counter attacks seem like a tactical and a strategic dynamic that can screw with super deployment.



Counter attacks maybe, bubbles no unless you know they are coming and their cyno is a complete tard with a shiny complex and makes the cyno in the middle of the bubble. a hic or dic will melt the moment a mom gets a lock on them pretty much, and mobile bubbles will tend to die faster then they can come on line. There needs to be capital sized points to lock them down. both as a cap mod and a tower mod.

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
The caps can be in ONE system every 10-15 minutes. An interceptor can hop between systems at will. These are different kinds of mobility entirely.
sure if its traveling solo. You are going to tell me that they don't travel in packs, most likely with remote energy to boost eachother to move faster?

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.11.21 18:03:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 21/11/2010 18:03:55
Originally by: Cyrus Doul
Edited by: Cyrus Doul on 21/11/2010 17:52:16
Originally by: FinnAgain Zero
Anything with a jump drive deploys at the same general speed. Supers a bit slower than some due to their limited range. As for the real world, I'm still waiting for functional immorality via FTL cloning.

Quote:

If SuperCaps are intended to be a strategic weapon, then there should be strategic consequences to deploying them, and there should be ways for clever enemies to exploit errors in their deployment.


Bubbles and counter attacks seem like a tactical and a strategic dynamic that can screw with super deployment.



Counter attacks maybe, bubbles no unless you know they are coming and their cyno is a complete tard with a shiny complex and makes the cyno in the middle of the bubble. a hic or dic will melt the moment a mom gets a lock on them pretty much, and mobile bubbles will tend to die faster then they can come on line. There needs to be capital sized points to lock them down. both as a cap mod and a tower mod.

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
The caps can be in ONE system every 10-15 minutes. An interceptor can hop between systems at will. These are different kinds of mobility entirely.
sure if its traveling solo. You are going to tell me that they don't travel in packs, most likely with remote energy to boost eachother to move faster?


It still takes 10 or so minutes even with the supercaps circle jerking capacitor. If you have a group of archons or chimeras devoted only to this then MAYBE you can do it in 7 minutes. But an interceptor can still get around much faster.

Also dictors and hictors dont immediately melt anymore as fighter bombers do nearly nothing to subcaps come the 30th.


 

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