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The Cosmopolite
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.11.11 17:17:00 - [151]
 

Edited by: The Cosmopolite on 11/11/2010 18:27:42

Originally by: Furb Killer

The funny part obviously is that SF who claims to be against this sides with UK (really people, enclosurism is just not an existing word), while under CVA controlled providence it was never a problem to be blue with our enemies, just as long as you didnt attack our friends or in any way helped reds that attacked us. But for example quite some atlas renters were neutral and accepted in providence, while they obviously were allied to an enemy.
The only difference then is that SF just doesnt care if you shoot neutrals or not, and happily allies themselves with NBSI alliances (and when they get backstabbed by them they suddenly see this as a problem, while in their history they have mainly been allied with nbsi entities), while CVA/RE-AL style NRDS sees neutrals as (potential) friends, and they dont appreciate it if you shoot their friends.


Such a relief to have a notorious CVA agent provocateur like Furb Killer back to ranting nonsenses against us.

The Star Fraction supports the Ushra'Khan in one simple, clear and straightforward regard: we fully endorse and defend their choice to practice independent diplomacy according to their freely-chosen standards and ethical underpinnings.

Do we subscribe to every jot and tittle of their diplomatic choices? No.
Do we hold as enemies all their enemies? No.
Do we hold as friends all their friends? No.

Which is rather the point.

As for the great debate about NRDS and NBSI and trying to derive meaning from who has friends subscribing to which engagement ruleset: it's nonsense. The many variants of NRDS and NBSI are engagement rulesets, not fully-featured ethical systems that can be used to determine (or as some think, dictate) who can be friends and who should be enemies. It's hardly as if the CVA refuses friendship with all sorts of NBSI entities. It always has had such friendships and no doubt it always will. It's sheerest hypocrisy for propaganda spear-carriers of the CVA to cavil at the fact that the Ushra'Khan and Star Fraction have diplomatic relations with entities that happen to be NBSI.

For us, the key issue has always been the actual political, diplomatic, military and economic ideologies or policies of any given entity and how these are implemented in actuality. Whether an entity holds to NBSI RoE or one of the many variants of NRDS can be a factor in assessing them but it is, at best, a second order factor.

The Cosmopolite

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.11 17:20:00 - [152]
 

It complicates things somewhat, yes, but flying true NRDS is nothing new for us. Perhaps you'd care to try it instead of your CVA model? Just contact one of us ingame and we'll be happy to explain things to you.

Lol you keep telling yourself that i had it with your BULL i makes me think how lucky we are not to have the drama queens of U'K blue
CVA are lucky they dont have to put it with it we will see how long it is until you move on and im sure you will be soon as everyone knows LD emo rage is funny




Nightshade Mary
Sarz'na Khumatari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 17:35:00 - [153]
 

Originally by: papal knight
It complicates things somewhat, yes, but flying true NRDS is nothing new for us. Perhaps you'd care to try it instead of your CVA model? Just contact one of us ingame and we'll be happy to explain things to you.

Lol you keep telling yourself that i had it with your BULL i makes me think how lucky we are not to have the drama queens of U'K blue
CVA are lucky they dont have to put it with it we will see how long it is until you move on and im sure you will be soon as everyone knows LD emo rage is funny




For some reason you keep mentioning drama and emo. What is the matter? Did you run out of arguments?

Michael Bross
Minmatar
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 17:58:00 - [154]
 

Originally by: Nightshade Mary
Originally by: papal knight
It complicates things somewhat, yes, but flying true NRDS is nothing new for us. Perhaps you'd care to try it instead of your CVA model? Just contact one of us ingame and we'll be happy to explain things to you.

Lol you keep telling yourself that i had it with your BULL i makes me think how lucky we are not to have the drama queens of U'K blue
CVA are lucky they dont have to put it with it we will see how long it is until you move on and im sure you will be soon as everyone knows LD emo rage is funny




For some reason you keep mentioning drama and emo. What is the matter? Did you run out of arguments?


No...

He Mad...

Astroyka
Caldari
Mirkur Draug'Tyr
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 18:03:00 - [155]
 

Originally by: papal knight
flying true NRDS is nothing new for us.


It's truly hard to educate a mindless automaton, but as we have said before and will say again, if we ascribe to your standings and you set an entity red then its only RE-AL's opinion that they should be red.

Granted I'm sure if relations were different there would have been instances where both alliances would have set a given entity red, but we don't do subservience and we certainly don't enforce subservience on others.

Simple, we didn't and don't want your standings, we have our own!

Andarias
Posted - 2010.11.11 18:05:00 - [156]
 

Edited by: Andarias on 11/11/2010 18:06:27

Zebes
Caldari
Ningishzida Research and Enterprises
Posted - 2010.11.11 18:10:00 - [157]
 

Originally by: time 3290

Yes we did set U'k red first they opend fire on a RE-AL fleet http://republicalliance.killmail.org/?a=kill_related&kll_id=7917025

We was both blue and they attack us for what they said we attack one of there fleet members who was a member of Thukker Tribe Mercebaries who was sat on a gate on his own and is RED to RE-AL and has been for a very long time, for all you guys who like to look a facts look when Thukker Tribe was made funny they made an ally called that the same time U'K said there coming to GW to help you out here is them before the made this sad alliance
http://republicalliance.killmail.org/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=7809069 13-10-2010 oh......




I was wondering if you would have the gall to bring that up. Nuknuk mentioned the loss of his precious cyclone, but I'd figured the rest of you for smarter.

What actually happened, for those of you who make a habit of believing Nykitah's version of events. As you can see, we were in a fleet - several U'K with a single member of the Thukker Tribe Mercs. We were roaming around looking for things to shoot - a decidedly difficult task when running NRDS as with a diplomatic team as good at getting blues as ours. We were paused on a gate while our scout was in the next system. Nykitah and his fleet arrived in system from another direction.
Nyk arrived at our gate and immediately opened fire on the lone non-U'K member of our gang. Said individual was not 'sat on a gate on his own.' He was sat on a gate in the midst of several of us, and our FC wasn't about to have us sit around and watch him get attacked. Interestingly enough, it wasn't until after we engaged in defense of our fleetmate that the rest of Nykitah's fleet rolled in, causing some issues, as most of us didn't show blues on our combat displays.

In short, Nuknuk showed up looking for a fight, attacked our fleet, and got a fight. Kwitcherbichin.

As for the rest of your ****, it's just a matter of whose story you believe. First notification most of us got that you guys were hostile to us was the loss of Ratokus Loki. The messages you sent went to diplomats who were not available to receive them and pass them along at the time. Given how absurdly easy it is to determine whether a pilot is in their pod, this speaks to either deliberate negligence or gross incompetence on the part of your diplomats. For future reference, when setting a formerly neutral entity KOS, it's considered polite to make real-time contact with them so that they can match the standings change. Simply sending a message to a diplo who can't receive it and then starting to shoot is... well...

Good day.

Nykitah
Posted - 2010.11.11 18:20:00 - [158]
 

Edited by: Nykitah on 11/11/2010 18:21:53
Oh aye, I recall that time... that little fleet of yers being reported in our intel channels, them flyin' with Thukker Tribe Mercs even after multiple warnings that the Mercs are hostile to us. So, I went and went to talk with the only Ushra'k sittin' in their diplo channel - C Walken.

[ 2010.10.28 01:54:07 ] Nykitah > So, I've been told that you guys are flying with our reds.
[ 2010.10.28 01:56:45 ] C Walken > lil bit
[ 2010.10.28 01:57:28 ] Nykitah > Well, just to tell you right now - we will shoot them regardless.
[ 2010.10.28 01:57:33 ] C Walken > thukker mercs are pretty chill guys
[ 2010.10.28 01:57:39 ] C Walken > thats cool
[ 2010.10.28 01:57:53 ] C Walken > we're ok with you guys shooting nay of our blues

There ya have it! Straight from the freakin' slave hound's maw. Course it ain't no surprise that his words were full of the **** all them are.

As for yer idiotic Loki pilot? Heh, caught him tryin' to incap the offline guns on me tower with some fighters soon after we declared yer lot hostile. Sat himself right up against the force field, didn't even start runnin' 'til after I had the pirate scum locked down and tackled.

Please do not evade the profanity filter. Zymurgist

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.11 18:32:00 - [159]
 

No no no its wrong its all lies there you go said it for you U'K

No matter what the truth is you swing round to be everyone else and not them

Nightshade Mary
Sarz'na Khumatari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 18:36:00 - [160]
 

Originally by: papal knight
No no no its wrong its all lies there you go said it for you U'K

No matter what the truth is you swing round to be everyone else and not them


Does not compute, please clarify. I suggest punctuation and proof-reading your post before selecting "Post Reply".

Thank you.

Michael Bross
Minmatar
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:03:00 - [161]
 

Running time > so attacking OUR fleet last night
Forlorn Wongraven > we fought cva for years against their standing enclosure bull**** and our (minmatar) buddies want to force it upon us
Forlorn Wongraven > dramalama
Forlorn Wongraven > nyk forced it
Running time > yip and im sorry over that

We have every mail and chat log from your alliance since the first contact. Do we really want to play that game?

(Secition edited from OOC to IC referance.)

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:28:00 - [162]
 

Talk is good on here tell why are you all sat in EO2 with the numbers and not going to fight with your new master -V- tell you what U'K get 3x our numbers and come what im trying to say stop the talk and fight for the rights to stay in RE-AL space we rent it out to the thukker tribe it looks cool that way

Nightshade Mary
Sarz'na Khumatari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:31:00 - [163]
 

Originally by: papal knight
Talk is good on here tell why are you all sat in EO2 with the numbers and not going to fight with your new master -V- tell you what U'K get 3x our numbers and come what im trying to say stop the talk and fight for the rights to stay in RE-AL space we rent it out to the thukker tribe it looks cool that way

Hmm, let me see if I understand you correct.

You claim to be the true owners of Thukker space; the Thukkers actually rent from you.

Really...

I wonder what the Thukkers have to say about that.

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:40:00 - [164]
 

Like i said you have all the time you want to reply to this crap as youe sat in E02 with more in fleet then us and still not fight screenshot coming up

Syyl'ara
Gallente
Intaki Prosperity Initiative
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:42:00 - [165]
 

Edited by: Syyl''ara on 11/11/2010 19:51:58
See, a NAP is one thing. Engaging in cooperative roams is another entirely. Taking sides in blue/grey on blue/grey engagements is another still. From what has been described here, this sounds more like a mutual defensive alliance than a non-aggression pact.

Everything else that followed was kind of inevitable, if you think about it.

If you so much as cycle a remote repper on your allies when they engage a non-red target (assuming you are operating NRDS) that has not aggressed you specifically, you should very much expect they will now consider you hostile.

U'K actually uses this logic all the time whenever they see fit to engage forces they consider to be "giving material support to slavers" and the like. This doesn't have to even be in the form of fielding combat forces in many cases.

Please take notice that I am not giving any opinion on who is right or wrong in this instance, I'm simply saying that the actions taken and decisions made by a number of involved parties really couldn't have resulted in any other outcome.

Nightshade Mary
Sarz'na Khumatari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:44:00 - [166]
 

Originally by: papal knight
Like i said you have all the time you want to reply to this crap as youe sat in E02 with more in fleet then us and still not fight screenshot coming up


Am I? That's odd. When I look at my navigation computer it reports that I am in Uplingur.

Tell me though , what is a screenshot? Must be a feature my ship doesn't have.

I do look forward to your answer, you are somewhat entertaining.

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.11 20:24:00 - [167]
 

Well if you was with your fleet you might of won cos man you lot just got your ass kick

Nightshade Mary
Sarz'na Khumatari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.11 20:27:00 - [168]
 

Win some, lose some, that is the life of a capsuleer.

Mad Murgan
Minmatar
Night Breed Pack
Spectrum Alliance
Posted - 2010.11.11 21:01:00 - [169]
 

quote]
I'm sorry, I mean dear, sweet Victoria and I have a bit of a history.
In short, about six months ago, she was responsible for the murder of a fellow slave. This murder she not only freely admits to, but is rather proud of.
Oh and incidentially, I know you guys are new to U'K but do you think you could at least try not to sound like you're still in Star Fraction? that would add loads to your credibility.
As for the rest of your juvinile thread...
Here I am. Come free me.



Wait, I have credibility? When did that ever happen? I have as much credibility as, how shall I put this, you.
As for my friends over in the Star Fraction, nice jab by the way, so maybe they rubbed off on me a little. I fail to see how that is a bad thing, and how not sounding like them could help my nonexistant credability. Not that I want any...
As for your allegations against my friend Victoria, please show some proof. Seriously, right now it sounds like your bitter because she didn't want to take you out on a date or something.
As for sounding juvinile, well I was shooting for angry as hell, so I guess I need to work on that.
As for liberating you...well...from the looks of things you don't really need to be. Unless that was an open challange for a fight. In which case, see you when I see you. So to sum it all up. Please stop stalking my friend and pitching a fit already...it's huanting, in a way.

Victoria Stecker
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2010.11.11 21:03:00 - [170]
 

Originally by: papal knight
Well if you was with your fleet you might of won cos man you lot just got your ass kick


Hey, congrats. We need you guys to win some of these. If every battle went like last night's little scuffles, this would be over quickly and spoil all our fun.

CONCORD OOC censor applied. Zymurgist

Norsey
Minmatar
Unforeseen Consequences.
THE UNTHINKABLES
Posted - 2010.11.11 22:58:00 - [171]
 

Originally by: Victoria Stecker
Originally by: papal knight
Well if you was with your fleet you might of won cos man you lot just got your ass kick


Hey, congrats. We need you guys to win some of these. If every battle went like last night's little scuffles, this would be over quickly and spoil all our fun.

CONCORD OOC censor applied. Zymurgist


Your right this will be over in no time at all Shocked

CONCORD OOC censor applied. Zymurgist

Pablos Locos
Caldari
Discount Slave Emporium
Posted - 2010.11.11 23:05:00 - [172]
 

Originally by: papal knight
what im trying to say stop the talk and fight for the rights to stay in RE-AL space we rent it out to the thukker tribe it looks cool that way


So, The Republic Military School is challenging the Thukker's SOV by granting it to RE-AL? Oh, the political strife.

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.11 23:47:00 - [173]
 

Yes we will take the Thukker guys down hard http://republicalliance.killmail.org/?a=kill_related&kll_id=8027653 see more info for you oh and here the link from U'K fail mix fleet with there masters -V- http://republicalliance.killmail.org/?a=kill_related&kll_id=8026293 what the kill mail does not show is all the scim they had bad repping guys very bad night night

Pablos Locos
Caldari
Discount Slave Emporium
Posted - 2010.11.12 00:15:00 - [174]
 

papal knight, due to the lack of any public records or military reports concerning your capsuleer affiliations, would you be so kind as to clarify your political status? Since you have claimed to speak on behalf of RE-AL, do you claim to hold a leadership position in RE-AL? If so, does RE-AL dispute this?

time 3290
Unforeseen Consequences.
THE UNTHINKABLES
Posted - 2010.11.12 00:39:00 - [175]
 

Im sure papal Knight can talk for RE-AL

Borza Slavak
Minmatar
Mirkur Draug'Tyr
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.11.12 01:47:00 - [176]
 

Originally by: time 3290
Im sure papal Knight can talk


Really?


Well, perhaps by your standards.

papal knight
Posted - 2010.11.12 01:59:00 - [177]
 

oh yeah!! keep talking this is all you guys do oh and be good pets for -V-

Victoria Stecker
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2010.11.12 02:07:00 - [178]
 

Papal knight is essentially what you get when someone wants to talk but doesn't have the testicular fortitude to put their own name on the things they say. It's a common phenomenon among capsuleers here on IGS. Presumably his words could be attributed to a member of Re-Al, but the member (or lack thereof) in question wishes to remain anonymous. This gives him the freedom to spew absurdities like calling us pets and generally make a fool of himself without risking his own reputation.

Additionally, I know full well that today's fight went poorly, including someone engaging in a passive rather than buffer tanked drake. It happens. And I am grateful, as it would be quite dull if every battle went our way and the war ended too soon.

Pablos Locos
Caldari
Discount Slave Emporium
Posted - 2010.11.12 02:11:00 - [179]
 

Originally by: time 3290
Im sure papal Knight can talk for RE-AL


Oh dear. That is somewhat disturbing. And here I was thinking he was an Ursha'khan agent trying to make you sound like idiots. I was hoping he wasn't legitimate.

Now for my own inherent interest in this conflict. Your political stance of superiority over the Thukker Tribe must not be very good for trade. Would you impose additional taxes on shipping in the region on top of what the Thukkers demand?

time 3290
Unforeseen Consequences.
THE UNTHINKABLES
Posted - 2010.11.12 02:16:00 - [180]
 

And you are???


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