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blankseplocked Feedback on Menu Changes [Updated after new Sisi build]
 
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Lucy Ditti
Posted - 2010.10.06 21:03:00 - [61]
 

I'm going to emoragequit if the most used menu items are not most accessible, like the 'buy item' or 'warp to' options. Anyway i don't like context menus, important options should have proper and well accessible buttons or short cuts.

Also I don't think your shrewd and cunning 'group' order logic works much in terms of ergonomy, i personally do not misnavigate from top to bottom (like accidentally clicking last option vs first), but between nearby options (warp to 10, warp to 30), so if i'm about to **** things up ('trash wallet') it won't help imho that all the 'destroy' options are neatly packed together.

LatexGirl
Posted - 2010.10.07 00:03:00 - [62]
 

"Warp To" and "Jump" are some of the most used in the menus and the new positions is making it more difficult to use.
Putting "Jump" so close to "Remove gate from overview" is a great failure.

Someone wrote about "Align To" and "Approach" are the same thing but there is a difference. You cant press "Approach" while 20 au away, thats when you use the "Allign To". Within short range, 150km, you can use them both so yes, at that point one of them is enough. I prefer the "Allign To" is the one to stay if one of them are to be removed as it can be used at long distance as for close.

Entity
X-Factor Industries
Synthetic Existence
Posted - 2010.10.07 01:47:00 - [63]
 

Hrrrmmmmm....
Judging by the amount of discussion over the order of items, it seems each class of objects you have menus on should really have its own set of definitions.

Trying to have a centralized menu service with priority groups is all clever and stuff, but not very practical because it's trying to dictate a general order in which items appear, which may be fine for an object of class X, but sucks for class Y.

Autogenerated menus will still look autogenerated. Maybe less random than they are on TQ, but still autogenerated.
I know hand-ordered menus are more effort, but the reward is something that is intuitive to use.

If you really want to be pro, give people the power to define their own menu item orders. With a simple text file for all I care. It'd be the first step to a customizable user interface.

Also, icons in front of the menu items would be rather spiffy.py

Anyway, good to see -something- finally being done about this issue though.

now do it properly please <3

Jalxan
Caldari
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2010.10.07 05:55:00 - [64]
 

I've tried out the new interface on Sisi, and I thought it was incredible difficult to navigate. I spent more time accidentally clicking "Show Info" than Warping to 0, buying things, and other high-pirority actions.

Someone said it best before, high-pirority actions should be on the top. To be honest, Show Info on the bottom is just fine, because if I really wanted to click it, I would take the effort too. An unintended side effect of moving Show Info on the top is that, when you have the entirety of Eve mis-clicking Show Info, it will cause many thousands of computers to download show info data, especially portraits, which leads to an overall increase of game lag while the server transfers the tens of thousands of portraits and pages to tens of thousands of active players. It may be a small percentage, but it's completely avoidable.

And besides, my cache is big enough as it is! ugh

Pesets
The Hunt Club
Posted - 2010.10.07 06:48:00 - [65]
 

I'm sure it has been said already but i will say it again - "warp to", "jump through" and similar stuff should remain where they were. It's much more "dangerous" to waste extra half a minute trying to find the damn option when you really need to jump or enter warp NOW, and people have spent years developing muscle memory to click those things where they are (which also is practically impossible when those options are somewhere near mid-bottom of the menu). If someone doesn't want to warp, they can ctrl-space. And i'm not sure how ofter would an FC want to warp somewhere on his own anyways tbh.

Same with "buy item" - there's still a dialogue popup afterwards if you did click it by mistake, but seriously, when i right-click something ON THE MARKET LISTING, 99% of the time it's because i want to bloody buy it. If i wanted to see info, i'd have clicked that blue "i" button.

TL;DR - either leave it as it was, or give us a way to put it back the way it was.

Mortalius DiVear
Amarr
The Faceless Corporation
Posted - 2010.10.07 09:31:00 - [66]
 

Leave the right click context menu's as they are plz, after 6 years of eve and then change these is kinda stupid IMO

Perhaps, allow the individual client to move up and down as they see fit. ugh

Shade Millith
Caldari
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.10.07 09:56:00 - [67]
 

Edited by: Shade Millith on 07/10/2010 10:13:06
Edited by: Shade Millith on 07/10/2010 10:08:24
Edited by: Shade Millith on 07/10/2010 10:06:01
Warp to 0 = Top most, this is not negotiable. The most important means of travel is warping, not being able to select warpto as the very top, and easiest to hit button is not acceptable

Show-info = Back to the bottom, rarely used in space. You are NOT going to use it in any kind of dangous situation, due to the small lag spike opening that window will cause

Buy this = Back to the top, making many purchases quicker. You have a second window pop up anyway, so it's not a worry hitting by mistake

I haven't bothered looking into the rest, these are just the ones I feel are badly, badly misplaced. I'll probably update this with more scorn when I find more problems

Quote:
If you really want to be pro, give people the power to define their own menu item orders. With a simple text file for all I care. It'd be the first step to a customizable user interface.

Quote:
Perhaps, allow the individual client to move up and down as they see fit.


This times 100. The popup rose also needs to be userdefined, having just ONE orbit distance annoys the hell outta me, and there's even an unused space most of the time

Riho
Gallente
Drop of Blood
Posted - 2010.10.07 15:17:00 - [68]
 

Some of the changes are idiotic... been playing 5 years with that config and now changing is BAD... ok.

or atleast give us a option to set buttons like they where and the new way.

because atm when ever i try to do anything... i want to kill a kitten.... i hate the change.

Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron
Legion of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2010.10.07 15:20:00 - [69]
 

Lot's of people with 0 reading comprehension ITT.

Daedalus II
Helios Research
Posted - 2010.10.07 15:47:00 - [70]
 

Edited by: Daedalus II on 07/10/2010 15:50:05
Add an "importance" index and a "danger" index to each item.

Sort items in each group according to this with importance as high as possible and danger as low as possible. The relative value between importance and danger when calculating this can be experimented with to give the optimal menu.

Then also calculate the mean importance and danger values of the whole group to determine where on the menu the group should end up.

If an item has a danger level higher than x it can automatically be given a confirm sub-menu like "self destruct -> confirm".

With some fine tuning of the indices I think we could end up with warp to and similar on top again, while still maintaining a consistent ordering in the rest of the menu.

Also there could be different menu orders depending on if you're docked or in space. In space trading and such isn't that important, but when docked it is.

Krystal Flores
Amarr
Missions Mining and Mayhem
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2010.10.07 17:58:00 - [71]
 

[Quote: everything in this thread]

Like it been said moving nav buy this, ect is a horrible idea, much like this change.
If you really wanna do this make it so you can use the old one or make it so it isnt just plain awful.

Xamiakas
Caldari
BRABODEN
Posted - 2010.10.07 21:29:00 - [72]
 

whoever came up with this bright idea of messin` up the right-click menu should be shot dead thrice! damn it, now every single time, when i want to orbit smth keep distance or whatever at various distances i`m sitting there and trying to find the damned "orbit".. great idea! i hope u`ll run out of them soon. ugh

Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
Posted - 2010.10.08 05:15:00 - [73]
 

Can we please have a vote for this?
I would like to have no change at all or player customizable menu orders.. anything else is wasting (your) time.

Murixo
M. Corp
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2010.10.08 10:00:00 - [74]
 

I like that "Jump to" and "Bridge to" are now seperate. You can change the rest back. Wink

Imuran
Zentor Industries
Posted - 2010.10.08 14:46:00 - [75]
 

Really dont like some of these changes - why move Warp to, buy item etc

SXYGeeK
Gallente
do you
Posted - 2010.10.08 16:44:00 - [76]
 

customizable menu's FTW.
and we could all have it our way.
read it from a preferences file for the "ninja hack" release and put a GUI on it later.

Amda Tori
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.10.08 18:44:00 - [77]
 

Edited by: Amda Tori on 08/10/2010 18:45:36
Originally by: Shade Millith
Edited by: Shade Millith on 07/10/2010 10:13:06
Edited by: Shade Millith on 07/10/2010 10:08:24
Edited by: Shade Millith on 07/10/2010 10:06:01
Warp to 0 = Top most, this is not negotiable. The most important means of travel is warping, not being able to select warpto as the very top, and easiest to hit button is not acceptable

Show-info = Back to the bottom, rarely used in space. You are NOT going to use it in any kind of dangous situation, due to the small lag spike opening that window will cause

Buy this = Back to the top, making many purchases quicker. You have a second window pop up anyway, so it's not a worry hitting by mistake

I haven't bothered looking into the rest, these are just the ones I feel are badly, badly misplaced. I'll probably update this with more scorn when I find more problems

Quote:
If you really want to be pro, give people the power to define their own menu item orders. With a simple text file for all I care. It'd be the first step to a customizable user interface.

Quote:
Perhaps, allow the individual client to move up and down as they see fit.


This times 100. The popup rose also needs to be userdefined, having just ONE orbit distance annoys the hell outta me, and there's even an unused space most of the time


This.

Or don't change the right click menu, please. You don't know what errors may occur. :D

Dark Zebra
Posted - 2010.10.08 21:47:00 - [78]
 

Edited by: Dark Zebra on 08/10/2010 21:51:12
how about put it back to how it was, maybe just move the offline, trash and self distruct(might be a couple more of the omg thats in a stupid place ones) options to the bottom as they were always in the wrong place. rest was fine, dont break everything that works to fix such a small issue

Supersnowprs
Posted - 2010.10.08 23:20:00 - [79]
 

Originally by: Dark Zebra
Edited by: Dark Zebra on 08/10/2010 21:51:12
how about put it back to how it was, just move the offline, trash and self distruct(might be a couple more of the omg thats in a stupid place ones) options to the bottom as they were always in the wrong place. rest was fine, dont break everything that works to fix such a small issue

Exactly what i was thinking.

Zelot Blueice
XTC Cartel
Posted - 2010.10.09 16:13:00 - [80]
 

Whats all this bull**** about the warp to button being on the bottom of the list and same with buying an item on the market and added ship ****? If this is where EVE is going by making a horrid and unoptimized POS UI, then you can count me out CCP. If I see this on TQ, I am out.

Mieryn Caval
Posted - 2010.10.09 21:28:00 - [81]
 

Do we even need expel member and prepare to quit corp in right click menus? People really do that often enough that they need to shave ten seconds off of the process?

Valisk
Caldari
Dark Materials
Posted - 2010.10.09 22:47:00 - [82]
 

please please please put it back, at least the warp to and buy! if you could just revert back or give us an option to?

Valisk


Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention
Middle of Nowhere
Posted - 2010.10.10 02:54:00 - [83]
 

Edited by: Catari Taga on 10/10/2010 02:57:00
Originally by: CCP karkur
OK, I think we all agree that "warp to" needs to be moved back.
I know that some of you have problems with the position of "show info" and "buy this", and we will take a look at that, but are there any other options you have a problem with?


If you really have to ask just revert it all back to where it was, most were in good locations. Otherwise all those commands that you need all the time need to be easily accessible and thus need to be at the top. E.g. warp to 0/warp to range, approach, orbit, keep at range, dock, jump, launch drones, buy, etc. Everything else that you can use in a quiet moment like Show Info, Pilot, etc. must go to the bottom where it is out of the way.

Originally by: Mieryn Caval
Do we even need expel member and prepare to quit corp in right click menus? People really do that often enough that they need to shave ten seconds off of the process?


Agreed, another example is "avoid solar system" on bookmarks.

riverini
Gallente
Reliables Inc
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2010.10.10 07:34:00 - [84]
 

Edited by: riverini on 10/10/2010 07:37:37
DID YOU GUYS PUT ****ING AUTISTIC CHILDREN TO DESIGN THESE NEW MENUES?

i mean, how many times we have to SHOW INFO WHEN BUYING stuff?!!!???

SAME FOR WARP TO ZERO, MAKE ACTIVE AND ETC.

PUT THE MOST USED stuff AS THE FIRST OPTION,

REALLY, REALLY ANNOYING .

WHO WAS THE GENIUS WHO CAME UP WITH THIS "AMAZING IDEA"?

SERIOUSLY, U GUYS ARE PROFESSIONALS, u can do better than this.




Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
Posted - 2010.10.10 12:49:00 - [85]
 

Originally by: riverini
Edited by: riverini on 10/10/2010 07:37:37
DID YOU GUYS PUT ****ING AUTISTIC CHILDREN TO DESIGN THESE NEW MENUES?

i mean, how many times we have to SHOW INFO WHEN BUYING stuff?!!!???

SAME FOR WARP TO ZERO, MAKE ACTIVE AND ETC.

PUT THE MOST USED stuff AS THE FIRST OPTION,

REALLY, REALLY ANNOYING .

WHO WAS THE GENIUS WHO CAME UP WITH THIS "AMAZING IDEA"?

SERIOUSLY, U GUYS ARE PROFESSIONALS, u can do better than this.






Yeah, dude, how often you call "Show Info" on a planet or moon? STFU.

Dark Zebra
Posted - 2010.10.10 16:11:00 - [86]
 

Originally by: Tonto Auri
Originally by: riverini
Edited by: riverini on 10/10/2010 07:37:37
DID YOU GUYS PUT ****ING AUTISTIC CHILDREN TO DESIGN THESE NEW MENUES?

i mean, how many times we have to SHOW INFO WHEN BUYING stuff?!!!???

SAME FOR WARP TO ZERO, MAKE ACTIVE AND ETC.

PUT THE MOST USED stuff AS THE FIRST OPTION,

REALLY, REALLY ANNOYING .

WHO WAS THE GENIUS WHO CAME UP WITH THIS "AMAZING IDEA"?

SERIOUSLY, U GUYS ARE PROFESSIONALS, u can do better than this.






Yeah, dude, how often you call "Show Info" on a planet or moon? STFU.


why break the interface so you can show info easy?

'put it back to how it was, maybe just move the offline, trash and self distruct(might be a couple more of the omg thats in a stupid place ones) options to the bottom as they were always in the wrong place. rest was fine, dont break everything that works to fix such a small issue'

Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2010.10.10 17:09:00 - [87]
 

You never can do it right for ALL of the people...

...unless we can customize the menus on our own.


Why not allow us to customize (at least the order) the menus on our own?

Saman Ayan
Minmatar
Lazy.
Posted - 2010.10.11 12:40:00 - [88]
 

Wow, a lot of emorage here, but then I guess after 7 years of the same menus, people will find it hard to change.

I don't really hear a lot of complaining about the current menus, but there have been problems when you accidently press the wrong option because they were right next to each other.

So yeah, keep the most important options that you need to press right away at the top like warp to and buy. Non-essential options should be at the bottom, like get info. Sure, it will be easy to misclick them, but most of the time you can stop them, like stopping warp and cancelling the dialogs. Also, try to seperate all the easy-to-misclick options, like 'jump to' and 'bridge to', like everyone else has said.

One thing about fleet menus: It would be a bonus if, when you right click a member in fleet, you get some options like warp to, jump to or watch list on the first menu instead of having to go to the fleet submenu.

And if you can, you should add a list of distances to right click menus of the orbit and keep range buttons in the info window (above the overview)? Having to right click the target in overview or in space is cumbersome and there are so many times I clicked on the orbit button only to find it's at the wrong distance and I had to change the default distances.

Originally by: Trebor Daehdoow
From a human-factors perspective, submenus are a disaster that needs to avoided whenever possible. If you don't believe me, try warping to 70km off the 5th moon of the 4th planet.

Well, the average system in empire space has a sun (of course), 2 stations, 9 planets, 10 belts and 43 moons. Assuming there is a customs office on every planet, that's a total of 65 celestial objects to warp to, apart from stargates. With 8 different distances at which to warp to, that's 520 different positions to warp to Wink Submenus still allow that much options even if it's annoying to use. The best alternative to finding a specific place to warp to is to set up a separate tab with only the celestial objects on, so it'll be easier to find a particular one. The dscanner would work well, but only within 14.3 AU.

Zarak1 Kenpach1
Minmatar
Aperture Harmonics
Posted - 2010.10.11 15:06:00 - [89]
 

The only thing thats going to satisfy everyone fairly is the ability to reorder context menu's locally on the client side.

This idea that reordering the menus for everyone is the CSM and CCP being very out of touch with their constituents

skittles666
Posted - 2010.10.11 16:29:00 - [90]
 

i will only say this to ccp...........did the menu need changing?...no....is it better...no it bloody isnt it is crap tbh

solution.....put it back to where it was and we can all be happy because it was fine before and always will be


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