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blankseplocked Enemy Stealth Bombers in a mining system. A becomming curse.
 
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feminakitten
Posted - 2010.10.04 08:13:00 - [361]
 

Seems a lot of people are saying the miner op is not playing the game as intended and judging by the comments your probably right, but lets have a little balance. The AFK cloakers are playing the game correctly by waging psychological warefare, but all you miner haters are happily ignoring the fact that the AFK cloaker is also not playing the game the way its intended. AFK (Away From Keyboard), don't be a hypocrit criticising the miner while praising the actions of an AFK'er

Tcar
Minmatar
Dirt Nap Squad
Dirt Nap Squad.
Posted - 2010.10.04 09:20:00 - [362]
 

Originally by: kasiloth
Edited by: kasiloth on 03/10/2010 18:57:42
First of all i appologize to u for my English but if i say what i want to say in my language nobody could understand me.

What i want to say here is that the tactic of an enemy to send a stealth bomber in a system staying there afk for hrs preventing local miners or raters to work is becoming a curse with a high risk to ruin the entire game. Hoppless miners have to warp back to their pos in system to protect their ships and stay there watching despareted at the local till red or neut will go. This tactic drops the developement indices of the system rapidly make it easier for the enemy to conquer it. The defenders can do absolutely nothing to avoid this situation that is realy frustrated. They cannot track down the stealth bomber and kill him. And also they dont know if he is afk or not to send out baits to uncover him. It is a silly and sick situation.

I can understand that stealth bombers are there to be used. But not that way. I can understand their right to jump into a system and kill as many macks or hulks they can kill. But to stay afk cloaked for hrs into a system that is another thing.It is not fair at all for the owner of the stealth bomber to use another alt of his to enjoy the game whilist the rest of the miners players sitting for hrs or maybe for days in their pos doing absolutely nothing.

CCp must do something on that before players start leaving the game for good.

I dont like to complain without a proposal, i would suggest CCp to deactivate cloacking device after a period of inactivity of lets say 30-60 min. So defenders could scan and chase the intruder.

If anyone of u has the same problem and has something better to propose please do it here.

Thank you

*Kasiloth is an alt of mine for obvious reasons






OP is the best troll since: http://lonelymachines.org/mall-ninjas/

I salute you OP.

MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.10.04 12:40:00 - [363]
 

Originally by: feminakitten
Seems a lot of people are saying the miner op is not playing the game as intended and judging by the comments your probably right, but lets have a little balance. The AFK cloakers are playing the game correctly by waging psychological warefare, but all you miner haters are happily ignoring the fact that the AFK cloaker is also not playing the game the way its intended. AFK (Away From Keyboard), don't be a hypocrit criticising the miner while praising the actions of an AFK'er
Yup.

It's the hipocrisy that abounds these forums. These are usually the same hardcore PVPers that go up in arms and critisize the use of macros by miners because it's cheating. Yet, in the Features and Ideas forums (and even here) there's a thread proposing an idea on how to make AFK cloakers vulnerable where these hardcore PVPers admit they'd use macros and whatever other means to bypass such an implementation. And yet there is NO OUTCRY. There's no one calling them evil for even thinking of doing that. Now imagine a miner or ratter coming to the forums and admitting he's thinking about using a macro Laughing.

Hypocrisy at its best.


Wacktopia
Sicarius.
Legion of The Damned.
Posted - 2010.10.04 12:42:00 - [364]
 

Lrn 2 Munin

Daenna Chrysi
Amarr
Omega Foundry Unit
Shadows Of Betrayal
Posted - 2010.10.04 13:53:00 - [365]
 

just to toss in my 2isk..

In going with the submarine analogy to the stealth bombers and using sonar. There are 2 kinds of Sonar, the active and the passive.

I would say that the current method is similar to the passive sonar, you only see what your sensors can detect. If a sub had gone quiet enough, you wont see it on passive sonar even if it is right next to you. Now the active sonar, it has a nasty drawback when you turn on the active sonar, you light up like a Christmas tree yourself.

So as an solution to this, I would recommend something similar to the active sonar. Would take fuel to use, would lock you in place for the duration. Duration would be dependant on the amount of fuel in cargo hold, and skill. Could not be turned off before all fuel in hold is used. Like a normal Cyno, you would be clearly visible to the whole system in the overview. In exchange, all cloaked ships in range no matter whose they are, would be visible for the duration. IF your ship is destroyed while the active sonar is online, the effect of making all cloaked ships visible is removed instantly.

To balance it the active sonar could be fitted onto interdictors or similar destroyer sized ships. Anything heavier and it would be easy to give the ship a serious tank that the SB cannot take out. This would work in two ways, it would make the interdictor a bait for the active SB pilots, or face being hunted down and killed. The duration based on fuel, would bring an additional degree of balance, since there would be no clear 10sec duration or anything like that it would be a hazardous job. What if the SB is an active one and attacks you before you are ready to flee? or what if the SB is an AFK cloaker, and you run out of fuel before it can be hunted down?

The active sonar would not have system wide range, this way you need to move around the system and scan the region around you, and you cant all the time just sit outside your POS shield and lure the SB to its death by your POS guns.

Dragodos
Posted - 2010.10.04 14:18:00 - [366]
 

Ease way to solve this problem.

Disconect a client if he is more than 15 min AFK. If the is no activity on the client in more than 15 min there should be a warning pop up to be cliked. If not, log out from the server.

baltec1
Posted - 2010.10.04 14:36:00 - [367]
 

Originally by: Voith
Originally by: baltec1
Originally by: Acer Lorenz

I think what he means is that the miner sacrifices earnings and having to beef up security in order to stay alive. The cloaker seems to sacrifice nothing other than a lost opportunity for a kill.




Miners are earning more than the AFK guy.

This whole thread is a fine example of why removing local as an intel tool is a good thing to do. Cant hold up a system full of bears for days on end if they have no idea you are even there. And unlike the changes others in here want, removing local will hurt the marco ravens too.


No, it won't hurt macro ravens, they'll have a cloaked ship on the gate that sends the "dock up" singnal. It will have 0 effect on macroers.

Perfect stealth is massively stupid. More and more PvP games are going away from having any stealth because it just doesn't work.

If they're going to have a cloaking type device it should just hide you from local (and hide local from you), but leave you scannable. It lets the hunters hunt and prevents lame **** like flooding systems with Trial accounts in AFK cloaked Rifters.


4 gates means they will need 5 accounts to rat in a single system active for however long the raven is there and not making any isk. They can do it but its gonna mean they will have to pay for 4 more accounts which at the very least means less profits or more expensive isk which it good no matter how you look at it.

Cyrus Doul
E0 Corp
Posted - 2010.10.04 15:07:00 - [368]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: flummox
and the rest of you guys need to stop the Remove Local debate. it's been going on for years. and it's not even a solution for anything but your paranoia. the local channel is generated by the stargate that you use to jump in (kinda assuming this, but). if you want no local channel, then go to W-Space. as long as you are in a system that can have sovereignty, you'll have local.

DEAL !
But only if coming into any system without using a stargate makes me NOT show up in local.
Twisted Evil



Where do we sign, and how long does cyno 5 take? No seriously i would love this. BoPs gangs into provi would become awesomeer.

Hidden Sausage
Posted - 2010.10.04 15:14:00 - [369]
 

No risk flying a Stealth Bomber? you ever been targeted? or shot at in a stealth bomber? they're not exactly Durable...

And if the Stealth Bomber is infact afk... whats the issue? hes not at his keyboard.. resume life...

zomgzors.. hes in my system! AFK !!! Invisible!! Doing nothing!!!! what ever sohuld i do?!?!?! cry 2 the forums... like the rest of the taint nibblers...

if they nerf cloaks, they nerf my account into being unsubscribbed... Every Single MMO i have ever played, this happens... taint nibblers cry cry and cry for a nurf because they cant find a instant gratificating solution for there problems....

Razor Vision
Posted - 2010.10.04 15:35:00 - [370]
 

Edited by: Razor Vision on 04/10/2010 15:36:54
Originally by: Hidden Sausage
No risk flying a Stealth Bomber? you ever been targeted? or shot at in a stealth bomber? they're not exactly Durable...

And if the Stealth Bomber is infact afk... whats the issue? hes not at his keyboard.. resume life...

zomgzors.. hes in my system! AFK !!! Invisible!! Doing nothing!!!! what ever sohuld i do?!?!?! cry 2 the forums... like the rest of the taint nibblers...

if they nerf cloaks, they nerf my account into being unsubscribbed... Every Single MMO i have ever played, this happens... taint nibblers cry cry and cry for a nurf because they cant find a instant gratificating solution for there problems....


You would literally unsubscribe if you were no longer allowed to "afk cloak" in enemy systems for hours on end? Is your life really that sad? That's really so important to you that you'd go to such an extreme as quit the game? You must really suck in RL if you need such a pathetic way to boost your ego. There's absolutely nothing special about anyone who AFK cloaks in systems. And for you to attach yourself so much to it, well that's just utterly pathetic and sad. Really, you need to find betters ways of 'pvping'. Because if this afk-cloaking mechanic is so important to you, then you really are 'doing it wrong'. Once you become good at real pvp, then you'll have a legit way of being satisfied with yourself. But until then, you're just a sad little space creature.

Jack Gilligan
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.10.04 15:48:00 - [371]
 

Edited by: Jack Gilligan on 04/10/2010 15:51:01
As I once stated on a thread about this in the CSM area, what is needed is a disincentive to be away from keyboard.

ie: a mechanism that makes a cloaked ship become visible (and scannable) if it's remained in the same system with no activity for more than say, 30-60 minutes. Leaving the system and returning resets the clock.

This would mean that someone who really wanted to be that cloaked red in local could still do it, but they'd have to actively remain bored to death at their keyboard instead of doing something else to accomplish it.

I have nothing against cloakers, hell, I FLY black ops, recons, and bombers, I love doing the hotdrop surprise attack, but AFK cloaking as it currently works is giving people too much for zero effort.

As for macros, for anyone, they should be an automatic permaban. If CCP put forth half an effort they could end macroing in this game just by analyzing their logs. Macros can be easily distinguished from human activity by their machine precision.

Frankly I don't think CCP is serious about cracking down on macros because of all the money they'd lose from Russia and China.

Napro
Caldari
Simplistic Syndicate
Cha0s Theory
Posted - 2010.10.06 22:21:00 - [372]
 

Originally by: Jodi Goulsti
Originally by: Napro
People saying to mine with an escort are down right retaarded! Mining profits are slim as it is... splitting them with an escort results in a loss since that escort could make more money ratting. Who in their right mind would take the option? Especially considering that the Cloaking griefer would never engage with you around so any chance of PvP is out the window?

End this broken game mechanic that lets people play only when they'll win and is in effect, an "I Win" Button with a time delay


Originally by: Tau Cabalander

I don't worry about cloaked ships until they uncloak next to me. When that happens, I find this fit works well (don't forget the drones, or to overheat the hardeners):

[Hulk, GTFO]
Damage Control II
'Halcyon' Core Equalizer I

Invulnerability Field II
Viscoelastic EM Ward Salubrity I
Additional Thermal Barrier Emitter I
Invulnerability Field II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II
Modulated Strip Miner II, Arkonor Mining Crystal II

Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I


Vespa EC-600 x5



And wheres the danger to the Cloaking griefer in this fit? OH wait.. That would entail losing your "I Win" Button.. What was I thinking..

SuicideDonkey
Posted - 2010.10.09 11:59:00 - [373]
 

I haven't been playing for too long, but from my observations playing thus far, I can see the OPs point to a degree, if he's had a fleet hotdroped on him and there's nothing to be done about it besides a jammed system, the continued threat of that can be argued (and it has been) as unbalanced, and if he's upset that one singular lone SB is taking potshots at him and harassing him, well, that's part of the game.

I don't care about the whole afk thing, if someone wants to sit in a station afk all day, then well, yay......that sounds...um...fun?, and for the most part, afk is a risk of it own, regardless of sec rating.

Following the fairly appropriate submarine analogy, CCP should just do a T3 destroyer that can equip a rig that can scan down stealth ships, not perfectly of course, but enough to keep a stealth ship on their toes, give it a bomb launcher that does a small radius but high damage...or something like that, I'm not to concerned about the mechanics, that's CCPs thing, and the ships specifically designed with stealth in mind should be buffed in some way, maybe make SBs hit a lot harder, Coverts faster, and so on.

On the subject of local, personally I'd say that removing it would cause me to go back to highsec, as risk vs reward would become unacceptable for me in low and nullsec as a solo miner, it's a valuable tool that has saved my hulk on many occasions, I haven't pvped much, so I can't honestly make a informed opinion on that.

I just figured I throw my penny in.

afndayle
Posted - 2010.10.09 13:25:00 - [374]
 

As a person who has both mined and ratted in 0.0, dealing with afk cloakers was never a big deal. They enter system, dock up. If they're still there after 15 minutes, hop in a shuttle and warp around a little bit. No sign of 'em? Get back to mining and ratting.

The vast majority of the ships I lost while making isk occurred from me not paying attention and having gangs scan me out quickly. Not from solo stealth bombers.


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