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Martosh Toma
Gallente
Fraction Investment
Posted - 2010.09.07 05:41:00 - [241]
 

BB claimed he would have continued to run T4U legitimately had the trustees insisted the new trustees were brought into the company securely (as in only make shares for one new trustee at a time, perhaps insist the shares not handed out to a now inactive trustee be reused etc), but he would never have wrapped it up or liquidated it.

He did not need to scam it now, he could easily afford to wait for the system to fail and do his best to work towards it in slow steps. In time it would probably only have become easier to take even more isk.

Bastaardicious
FinFleet
Raiden.
Posted - 2010.09.07 07:00:00 - [242]
 

Hahaha, omg i'm ROFL'ing here.

Way to go.

Oh god i love eve.

F90OEX
F9X
Posted - 2010.09.07 08:00:00 - [243]
 

Originally by: cosmoray
I am calling BS on the people who say that scammers in Eve are somewhat dishonest in RL, or certainly that is being implied here.

There are no rules preventing scamming in Eve. It is not against the EULA. Perhaps people might like to commit crimes in the fantsay world which they wouldn't do in RL. It's part of a GAME, it is not neccesarily some indictment on the character.

Too many people need to get off their high horses that they have the same morales in RL as in Eve or that they don't lie in RL or bluff in RL.

I have lied and bluffed my bosses at work for a bigger pay rise. Am I bad person, well I couldn't care what people think as I have more money coming into my house for me and my wife. Anyone who says they would never lie/bluff to better their lives or who have never lied, I will show you someone who is a liar.


Well I think one of the reasons they feel like this is that I bet several people into BB's deal paid real money for ISK either from Time cards/plexs or bought ISK. So in a way they feel money was stolen from them ( indirectly). It's amazing the lengths some people will go to get a nice amount of Isk in eve. Personally I think it's silly also, but then again lots of silly people play eve Razz

GX307
Posted - 2010.09.07 08:15:00 - [244]
 

Originally by: cosmoray
I am calling BS on the people who say that scammers in Eve are somewhat dishonest in RL, or certainly that is being implied here.

There are no rules preventing scamming in Eve. It is not against the EULA. Perhaps people might like to commit crimes in the fantsay world which they wouldn't do in RL. It's part of a GAME, it is not neccesarily some indictment on the character.

Too many people need to get off their high horses that they have the same morales in RL as in Eve or that they don't lie in RL or bluff in RL.

I have lied and bluffed my bosses at work for a bigger pay rise. Am I bad person, well I couldn't care what people think as I have more money coming into my house for me and my wife. Anyone who says they would never lie/bluff to better their lives or who have never lied, I will show you someone who is a liar.



I'm calling BS on cosmoray.

Lets say the player behind Bad Bobby makes a new alt tomorrow called Good Bobby.

And as you suggest he's just playing the game RP'ing or whatever and says:

"On Good Bobby i'm going to be all good! And if some opportunity comes along where I can take all the isk from my brand new Super Good Bond of Goodness, i'm not going to take it, you can trust me this time, scouts honor!"

Please explain how you are going to invest in any of Good Bobby's bonds or ventures or whatever and that the person behind the in game character isn't a factor in your decision.


Cheque Please
Hot Like Mexico
Posted - 2010.09.07 08:50:00 - [245]
 

All this confusing talk about morality and good and evil and the wrongness of scamming...

Let's all follow the advice of George Costanza. Remember folks: it's not a lie if you believe it.

nStedt
X Gate Industris
STR8NGE BREW
Posted - 2010.09.07 11:49:00 - [246]
 

Sorry if this has already been mentioned, but why are the shares stuff important? With any director role you can just cancel the office rent where the BPOs are and everything will drop into "Deliveries" from you can scoop it.

What I am missing?

/ nStedt

Cobalt Sixty
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2010.09.07 12:09:00 - [247]
 

Edited by: Cobalt Sixty on 09/09/2010 05:10:06
Originally by: GX307
I'm calling BS on cosmoray.

No, you're a Battleship!

(See what I did there?)

I am wondering if maybe Cosmo is talking about the hysterical slander that can sometimes build around a character once they do something along the lines of what Bobby has just pulled off - and how often it targets the person behind the character instead of the character itself.

I know when Tarac Nor pulled the plug on Ushra'Khan there were all sorts of crazy **** being spouted by the rage brigade.

Some of which was dealt with. EDIT: and the point I'm trying to make with that is that such reactions only serve as increasing the amount of blood in the water for the unfeignedly malicious out there. In other words, screaming that the person who effected your internet spaceship pixels is a "real life ciminal" only makes you look like a fool and a target to people who want to precipitate those kinds of reaction from you in EVE.

Martosh Toma
Gallente
Fraction Investment
Posted - 2010.09.07 13:30:00 - [248]
 

nStedt,

I think that trick falls under exploits and can be petitioned.
That is the detail you are missing I think.

Bill Alt
Posted - 2010.09.07 13:36:00 - [249]
 

Originally by: cosmoray

Too many people need to get off their high horses that they have the same morales in RL as in Eve or that they don't lie in RL or bluff in RL.

I have lied and bluffed my bosses at work for a bigger pay rise. Am I bad person, well I couldn't care what people think as I have more money coming into my house for me and my wife. Anyone who says they would never lie/bluff to better their lives or who have never lied, I will show you someone who is a liar.


You're doing a little projecting here to ease your own conscience. I don't, as a general rule lie in RL or Eve. Though in Eve, to a point, it's a perfectly acceptable part of the game. (The thing wouldn't work without opposing forces.) I have never lied to my employer, and getting benefit from lying certainly doesn't justify it. You might not care what people think about your character flaw, that doesn't mean it's not there. And frankly, knowing that you lie in RL to gain benefit, certainly makes you a worse risk in game to handle huge amounts of isk. So the difference between you and Ricdic is only the perception of what you think you're owed at the moment? You have no problems with his theft?

KaarBaak
Minmatar
Seatec Astronomy
Posted - 2010.09.07 14:02:00 - [250]
 

Originally by: Bill Alt
Originally by: cosmoray

Too many people need to get off their high horses that they have the same morales in RL as in Eve or that they don't lie in RL or bluff in RL.

I have lied and bluffed my bosses at work for a bigger pay rise. Am I bad person, well I couldn't care what people think as I have more money coming into my house for me and my wife. Anyone who says they would never lie/bluff to better their lives or who have never lied, I will show you someone who is a liar.


You're doing a little projecting here to ease your own conscience. I don't, as a general rule lie in RL or Eve. Though in Eve, to a point, it's a perfectly acceptable part of the game. (The thing wouldn't work without opposing forces.) I have never lied to my employer, and getting benefit from lying certainly doesn't justify it. You might not care what people think about your character flaw, that doesn't mean it's not there. And frankly, knowing that you lie in RL to gain benefit, certainly makes you a worse risk in game to handle huge amounts of isk. So the difference between you and Ricdic is only the perception of what you think you're owed at the moment? You have no problems with his theft?



IIRC, there are many people who don't have a problem with what Ricdic did due to his claims that he needed the money to take care of some kind of family emergency or some such.

Apparently it's ok to lie, cheat or steal as long as it's for the "right" reasons.

KB

Kazzac Elentria
Posted - 2010.09.07 14:26:00 - [251]
 

Such a shame.. wish I had more time for the game otherwise I would have been in here screaming from the tops of the mountains not to create anymore shares. At least I know I voted against it.

SencneS
Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks
Posted - 2010.09.07 14:35:00 - [252]
 

The whole morals in games equals morals in real life is stupidity personified...

People that play EVE as a Pirate, do not go out in real life and attack and kill people willy nilly.. They don't stand in dark allies with weapons and hold people ransom, and then kill them if they do or don't get their demands. It's morally wrong to kill someone in real life, yet billions of online avatars die every single day at the hands of people who have never committed a felony in any sovereign state anywhere in the world.

To say if someone steals something in a game, they are more apt to perform the same actions in real life is probably a sad sign of lack of intelligence or more the point lack of logical reasoning then anything else.

Bill Alt
Posted - 2010.09.07 14:56:00 - [253]
 

Edited by: Bill Alt on 07/09/2010 14:58:04
Originally by: SencneS
The whole morals in games equals morals in real life is stupidity personified...

People that play EVE as a Pirate, do not go out in real life and attack and kill people willy nilly.. They don't stand in dark allies with weapons and hold people ransom, and then kill them if they do or don't get their demands. It's morally wrong to kill someone in real life, yet billions of online avatars die every single day at the hands of people who have never committed a felony in any sovereign state anywhere in the world.

To say if someone steals something in a game, they are more apt to perform the same actions in real life is probably a sad sign of lack of intelligence or more the point lack of logical reasoning then anything else.


Speaking of lacking in intelligence, “killer” exaggeration is nothing but a strawman, no one has suggested it but you.

Obviously, the point where these kinds of things cross the line is entirely subjective. You could carry the “value” argument to a ridiculous extreme by pointing out that even Eve spaceships have value, and thus blowing them up is theft. I think it’s safe to say that most everyone would regard that as a silly position.

On the other hand, stealing the equivalent of thousands of dollars of isk crosses a line somewhere, and reasonable, ethical people see that. It’s the position that real value has not been taken from real people in significant amounts that appears lacking in intelligence or logic. The fact that it was through a game mechanism make legal sense, but not moral sense.

Would I change the system? No. There's really no suitable way do so that wouldn’t result in the solution being worse than the problem. Do I have a problem pointing out that it takes a type of real-life integrity deficient to do something like this? Hardly.

BB want to show he's a RL stand-up guy? Laugh about his success, give the isk back to the folks that trusted him, and move on.

RAW23
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:00:00 - [254]
 

Originally by: Kazzac Elentria
Such a shame.. wish I had more time for the game otherwise I would have been in here screaming from the tops of the mountains not to create anymore shares. At least I know I voted against it.


Against the creation of holding company shares or public shares? Because the creation of the latter was irrelevant to the scam, other than that it increased Bobby's prize pot somewhat. It was the former that allowed the scam to take place.

Kazzac Elentria
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:03:00 - [255]
 

Originally by: RAW23
Originally by: Kazzac Elentria
Such a shame.. wish I had more time for the game otherwise I would have been in here screaming from the tops of the mountains not to create anymore shares. At least I know I voted against it.


Against the creation of holding company shares or public shares? Because the creation of the latter was irrelevant to the scam, other than that it increased Bobby's prize pot somewhat. It was the former that allowed the scam to take place.


Both actually

Mme Pinkerton
The pink win
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:05:00 - [256]
 

Originally by: Bill Alt
On the other hand, stealing the equivalent of thousands of dollars of isk crosses a line somewhere, and reasonable, ethical people see that.

The problem with reasonable, ethical people is that they are usually neither able to tell you at which point this line is drawn nor why the line has to be drawn at exactly that point and not one epsilon below or above.

In most cases they will say something like "there's the line", so you start slightly below the line and expand the example step by step - at the end they will have said "yes, this wouldn't change much" at each of your steps but you have gone with them way above their original line.

not sure what's reasonable about this kind of behavior...

Bill Alt
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:11:00 - [257]
 

Originally by: Mme Pinkerton
The problem with reasonable, ethical people is that they are usually neither able to tell you at which point this line is drawn nor why the line has to be drawn at exactly that point and not one epsilon below or above.




You're right of course. The line can't be drawn at any agreeable place, thus you can't mandate it. So, we'll just BS about it on an internet forum to amuse ourselves because it's a more interesting subject than a new Rifter fitting.

Still, the notion that morality is only relevant if it's enforceable is problematic for me, personally.

SencneS
Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:13:00 - [258]
 

Originally by: Bill Alt
Speaking of lacking in intelligence, “killer” exaggeration is nothing but a strawman, no one has suggested it but you.


I guess your definition of straw man differs from the definition that everyone else uses..

You and others are talking about moral compass, not the scenario of actually act of committing a crime. Morally those that commit a defined in real life type crime, in EVE do not go out and commit the same crime in real life. Theft, Killing, Espionage, and anything else illegal in real life but "OK" in the gaming community. Killing is mealy one of those actions in game you're allowed to commit that has a moral consequence in real life, just as theft is also immoral in real life. Hence the relationship between killing and theft in game verse real live is hardly straw man...

So next time you want to attempt a Ad hominem make sure you use the right terms numb nuts.

Ji Sama
Caldari
Tash-Murkon Prime Industries
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:14:00 - [259]
 

Originally by: Bill Alt
Originally by: Mme Pinkerton
The problem with reasonable, ethical people is that they are usually neither able to tell you at which point this line is drawn nor why the line has to be drawn at exactly that point and not one epsilon below or above.





Still, the notion that morality is only relevant if it's enforceable is problematic for me, personally.

Cool


Bernard Schuyler
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:38:00 - [260]
 

Originally by: nocSTANtine
Edited by: nocSTANtine on 04/09/2010 13:19:36
Hat's off!

But really this isn't down to Bob, if I had the chance to turn game isk into $47K I
would rip you all off in a heart beat!

This is down to CCP, the scam's will come thick and fast while GTC/Plex's are in existence.

This is supposed to be a game (fantasy!) when it has real world implications its crossed the line, especially when it condoned by CCP.

Get rid of plex's and this sort of thing will pale, I'm all for scam's becuase if you fall for them more you fool you, but scam's shouldn't transverse game play into the real world.

I know what your going to say ppl sell isk and items in the real world, well there is a leagal frame work that covers that which is supported but ccp

Bob Very Happy
CCP ugh


You are mistaken. PLEX actually is a means for CCP to curtail the RMT market. A casual player who wants to make a few hundred million in seed money can do so reasonably safely and legally. Now, whether you agree that should or should not be, it takes money out of the pockets of RMT people.

There is no way to "cash out" ISK via PLEX except having the game subscription paid for free.

People who "sell" ISK via RMT sites do not get nearly the same return as the value of PLEX, and could easily get scammed themselves. Do you think they will wire you cash before you turn over the ISK?

If he goes RMT he won't be making anywhere NEAR the "street value" of this ISK people are bandying about. For many reasons, including supply and demand.

Ratchman
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:38:00 - [261]
 

I can't believe people are still falling for these scams all the time. No matter how official and cosher-looking it is, your investment is instantly at risk. You should assume that your money is gone as soon as you have handed it over to someone else.

Remember Brenie Madeoff? Someone with a sterling reputation and a legitimate looking scheme? Real-life business couldn't throw money at him fast enough. And what happens? They lose the lot. Companies are no more wise than in-game investors. Time and again they fall for the same tricks, and make the same mistakes.

Bad Bobby didn't even make that much effort to hide his intentions.

Still, one thing occurred to me while reading this column, and that is the idea that you can be petitioned for offending someone in local. This can end up in a ban from the game, because the victim has been left in a state of distress (or so it goes). How then, do we justify scamming as a legitimate activity, when it can cause distress as well? Is this a double-standard?

I'm kind of curious how things like this are going to play out, as it is only a matter of time before someone tries taking this down a legal route (should they lose a sufficient amount in-game). Would they hold CCP responsible? Or the individual who did the scam? I believe similar things have happened in other games, so it is something to bear in mind. In-game items have been ruled as 'real' property in some cases, so there is a legal precedent.

There's also an interesting economic question. If this happens enough times, is it likely to topple the in-game economy, as relatively few people would end up with the large majority of cash. Or would this just end up with those who can manufacture bleeding those with bags of ISK dry simply because they can? Would the value of ISK be so devalued that it becomes worthless? Not like this is going to happen, because there's plenty of cyncial bastards like me in this game that wouldn't touch those things with a ten-foot barge pole, but it is theoretically possible, and with people seeing this as a highscore to beat, there will be intent.

corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
Posted - 2010.09.07 15:56:00 - [262]
 

Edited by: corestwo on 07/09/2010 16:29:24
Edited by: corestwo on 07/09/2010 16:05:23
Edited by: corestwo on 07/09/2010 15:56:15
Originally by: GX307
I'm calling BS on cosmoray.

Lets say the player behind Bad Bobby makes a new alt tomorrow called Good Bobby.

And as you suggest he's just playing the game RP'ing or whatever and says:

"On Good Bobby i'm going to be all good! And if some opportunity comes along where I can take all the isk from my brand new Super Good Bond of Goodness, i'm not going to take it, you can trust me this time, scouts honor!"

Please explain how you are going to invest in any of Good Bobby's bonds or ventures or whatever and that the person behind the in game character isn't a factor in your decision.


Calling BS on you, because it's a stupid argument. The line of reasoning isn't "He stole isk in-game, he must be a horrible person IRL, so I won't invest in him", it's "He stole isk in-game, he can't be trusted in-game, so I won't invest in him." His out of game personality doesn't enter into the evaluation at all.

Originally by: Bill Alt
Obviously, the point where these kinds of things cross the line is entirely subjective. You could carry the “value” argument to a ridiculous extreme by pointing out that even Eve spaceships have value, and thus blowing them up is theft. I think it’s safe to say that most everyone would regard that as a silly position.

Oh, so a crime only crosses the line when its of a certain size?

Originally by: Bill Alt
On the other hand, stealing the equivalent of thousands of dollars of isk crosses a line somewhere, and reasonable, ethical people see that. It’s the position that real value has not been taken from real people in significant amounts that appears lacking in intelligence or logic. The fact that it was through a game mechanism make legal sense, but not moral sense.


No, sorry. The only "line that was crossed" here is perhaps the line that marked the size of the largest scam to date.

Also, I don't think that myself, cosmoray, nor SencneS is arguing that nothing of real value was taken from people. The point of dispute is entirely on the whole "someone who would do X ingame would/would not do X IRL". Isk was taken, that took people real time to make. Even ignoring the dubiously legitimate isk <-> $$ conversion, that means it has value.

Originally by: Ratchman
There's also an interesting economic question. If this happens enough times, is it likely to topple the in-game economy, as relatively few people would end up with the large majority of cash. Or would this just end up with those who can manufacture bleeding those with bags of ISK dry simply because they can? Would the value of ISK be so devalued that it becomes worthless? Not like this is going to happen, because there's plenty of cyncial bastards like me in this game that wouldn't touch those things with a ten-foot barge pole, but it is theoretically possible, and with people seeing this as a highscore to beat, there will be intent.

No.

Bill Alt
Posted - 2010.09.07 16:11:00 - [263]
 

Originally by: SencneS
Originally by: Bill Alt

So next time you want to attempt a Ad hominem make sure you use the right terms numb nuts.



Are you an angry person in real life, or is it only on the netz? There's help. Incidently, stawman works fine. Thanks.

We should stop "dicussing" this, since you've spoken?

Dzil
Caldari
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
The Fourth District
Posted - 2010.09.07 16:52:00 - [264]
 

Originally by: GX307


I'm calling BS on cosmoray.
Lets say the player behind Bad Bobby makes a new alt tomorrow called Good Bobby.
And as you suggest he's just playing the game RP'ing or whatever and says:
"On Good Bobby i'm going to be all good! And if some opportunity comes along where I can take all the isk from my brand new Super Good Bond of Goodness, i'm not going to take it, you can trust me this time, scouts honor!"
Please explain how you are going to invest in any of Good Bobby's bonds or ventures or whatever and that the person behind the in game character isn't a factor in your decision.



Well if we take this back to the analogy of diplomacy (which is far better than my poker analogy, but I don't play it), if last game someone lied to you about their intentions and backstabbed you, would you trust them this game? Probably not. Should you trust another player instead? You could... for a while. It's difficult to say whether the betrayal ensuring certain victory in one game is a viable strategy, given it could weaken your winning chances in future sessions when no one trusts you. On the other hand, are you even planning on ever playing the game again? Hence, "some people are playing a different game".

This problem interestingly reappears in other moral decision games, like Prisoner's dilemma. In classic Prisoner's dilemma, both sides gain a self serving advantage by betraying their accomplice, even though they'd be better off cooperating. In perhaps a more interesting scenario, the iterative prisoner's dilemma, the pair face the same question over and over again, and thus how you behave can have negative impacts on your future performance as well. Most optimal strategies involve some kind of cooperative tit-for-tat system, where you go in cooperating, and when someone betrays that trust then you betray them back next round. While this certainly doesn't guarantee your safety, there's at least a sense of justice that some self serving backstabber is going down with you. And perhaps, this justice will course correct the backstabber into cooperating, if not for your benefit, then for his own.

As a final thought, while tit-for-tat usually gives a favorable result in iterative prisoner's dilemma, since a side ultimately gains more short term benefit from betrayal, the final round (if known) becomes a bit different, because without a future to be concerned about, both sides are back to betrayal as the optimal strategy. And extrapolating, if you know the other guy will betray you in the last round, the you might as well go ahead and betray him the round before. And so on backwards. Therefore tit-for-tat only really works if you don't know when the music will stop. And THIS - this is the key advantage the scammer has on the scammed in EVE. For the scammer runs his con and walks off, he's no longer forced to continue playing the MD investment game as a scammer - he either stops playing altogether, or takes on an alias/alt to continue his presence on the forums where investments are concerned.


But above all else, let us remember this: it's just a game. If you don't trust someone with your isk who openly acknowledges it's just a game, so be it: don't invest in them or trust them with your collateral, etc. But I don't really trust that guy more or less than someone that professes some deeper, higher meaning. Even if they believe it now, when their son is in trouble, their family's house is on the line, or maybe they just experience a moment of disillusionment ... I believe they'll see EVE like I do: just a game.

Berikath
Posted - 2010.09.07 17:41:00 - [265]
 

Originally by: Bill Alt
On the other hand, stealing the equivalent of thousands of dollars of isk crosses a line somewhere, and reasonable, ethical people see that. It’s the position that real value has not been taken from real people in significant amounts that appears lacking in intelligence or logic. The fact that it was through a game mechanism make legal sense, but not moral sense.



I would disagree. I would say that, ethically, stealing is either wrong or it is not; in general I think most would agree that theft is ethically wrong. However, EVE is not "normal", it is a game- one which, in certain aspects, it is by design very different from real life.

Note- for the purposes of this argument, I'm assuming that forums are part of the "game".

In, for instance, World of Warcraft any scamming is considered "illegal". If you are legitimately scammed, you can put in a ticket and get your property or money back by the "police" (aka, GMs). However, EVE is a game built around the idea that anything within intended game mechanics is allowed, including scamming. So long as your scam does not abuse game mechanics or venture out of the game world, I would say that ethically it remains the same (regardless of size).

If BB had somehow influenced people to invest using something outside the game, or had taken investments in legal currency or something only available in legal currency (such as a GTC), that would be an entirely different ethical situation. It would also be different if the ISK he scammed could somehow (legally) be converted BACK to legal currency. Since that is not the case, he just scammed some pixels in a game; how the people he got them from acquired them is irrelevant.

Caleb Ayrania
Gallente
TarNec
Posted - 2010.09.07 17:48:00 - [266]
 

Originally by: cosmoray
I am calling BS on the people who say that scammers in Eve are somewhat dishonest in RL, or certainly that is being implied here.

There are no rules preventing scamming in Eve. It is not against the EULA. Perhaps people might like to commit crimes in the fantsay world which they wouldn't do in RL. It's part of a GAME, it is not neccesarily some indictment on the character.

Too many people need to get off their high horses that they have the same morales in RL as in Eve or that they don't lie in RL or bluff in RL.

I have lied and bluffed my bosses at work for a bigger pay rise. Am I bad person, well I couldn't care what people think as I have more money coming into my house for me and my wife. Anyone who says they would never lie/bluff to better their lives or who have never lied, I will show you someone who is a liar.


Its ironic that if you google "fantasy escalation" it seems its just "a game".. but add psychology and some interesting facts emerge..

There is a big difference between small socially functional borderline fantasy, and the big ones..

I have seen how some types seems to slip down into more and more sociopathic behaviour, sure its not everyone that is at risk, but the high horse statements are just as natural as a protective/precaution behaviour, as its opposite.. Game theory 101 imho..


cosmoray
Perkone
Posted - 2010.09.07 18:03:00 - [267]
 

The link has my favorite example of Prisoner's Dilemna.

The UK TV show Golden Balls is based on the prisoners dilemna premise, where contestants could potentially split a large cash pool, or attempt to "steal it". If both players choose split they share the pot, if they both choose "steal" they both get nothing, one chooses "steal" and the other doesn't then the "steal" gets all. Look at them try to convince each other they are going to split.

100K Golden Balls link

You can all talk about character as much as you like, but I would pick "steal" every time. I would either get all or nothing, but I suppose I would be more hurt by losing it all if I chose "split" and was outplayed. Also no consequences for "stealing" all the cash, and I wouldn't feel bad about some poor sap who I don't know anyway.

Those people who call my character into question but I would walk across the "line" in Akita's theoretical dilemna every day of the week. $100K with no consequences, no brainer.

Bill Alt
Posted - 2010.09.07 18:12:00 - [268]
 

Interesting spin on an old dilemma.

I guess I'm a split guy.

SencneS
Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks
Posted - 2010.09.07 18:29:00 - [269]
 

Edited by: SencneS on 07/09/2010 18:29:57
Originally by: Bill Alt
Are you an angry person in real life, or is it only on the netz? There's help. Incidently, stawman works fine. Thanks.

We should stop "discussing" this, since you've spoken?


No, not an angry person in real life, I'm actually pretty content with everyone. Though if I may ask a question about your personality as you did mine. Are you just as blissfully ignorant in real life as you are on the interwebs?

Feel free to continue discussing whatever you want, but if you want to appear more intelligent then you are currently being perceived, then you should seriously look up meanings of terms and phrases before you attempt to elevate yourself at the self deluded expense of others.

Edit:- Quote fix

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.09.07 18:30:00 - [270]
 

Quote:

Also no consequences for "stealing" all the cash, and I wouldn't feel bad about some poor sap who I don't know anyway.

Those people who call my character into question but I would walk across the "line" in Akita's theoretical dilemna every day of the week. $100K with no consequences, no brainer.



Now I feel alone. You too have a price.


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