open All Channels
seplocked Ships and Modules
blankseplocked So how much ISK/month do Amarr ship pilots save on ammo?
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: [1] 2

Author Topic

Redshift XIII
Amarr
Posted - 2010.08.07 14:46:00 - [1]
 

Im kinda new still, so don't taze me bros...

But I was curious - how much money do you think an average, active Amarr ship pilot saves every month from not having to buy ammo (let's say he only does Lvl 4's daily for the sake of argument)?? And he'd save even more on T2/faction crystals right?? (instead of t2/faction ammo)

Dr Nefarius
Posted - 2010.08.07 14:55:00 - [2]
 

I don't remember the excact ammount, but faction/t2 crystals will be destroyed after a certain ammount of shots. So they are not 'free ammo' like the t1 versions. I haven't done any calculations to see how much dps/isk you get with large faction/t2 crystals compared to other ammo types. Could be interesting to see.

Redshift XIII
Amarr
Posted - 2010.08.07 14:59:00 - [3]
 

Right, I know they are destroyed after a certain number, but they are still much cheaper over the long run than buying ammo

McRoll
Minmatar
Heatseekers
Posted - 2010.08.07 15:01:00 - [4]
 

I cant tell you a number but can speak from experience that Amarr has quite an advantage here. I flew a Nightmare for a while and used imperial navy crystals, they brought a significant damage increase and held literally for ages. I only replaced them once in 2 weeks or so.

Redshift XIII
Amarr
Posted - 2010.08.07 15:11:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Redshift XIII on 07/08/2010 15:12:23
Yeh thats the exact scenario I thought up that prompted this question... Nightmares + super cheap faction crystals LOL

I fly a Mach to do Lvl 4's in... and the RF ammo is killing me. 20 days till Vargur :\

Frozean
Posted - 2010.08.07 15:12:00 - [6]
 

The real problem with the amarr ships is really simple.

Amarr has insane issues with securing a good science LP store compared to the others.

Their LP store only peaks at 2.5k Isk/LP, and say, if you are generating 200K-250K lp a day, you need brutal ammounts of tag to compensate your LP generation (im talking more then 5,000 tags every f'in day)

You save ammo. yes, its offset by horrible LP store requirements making it difficult to make any sort of fast liquidity sort of farming in amarr space.

Not to mention the place is in a friggin high sec island -.-'

Psychotic Maniac
Caldari
Head Shrinkers
Posted - 2010.08.07 15:37:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Psychotic Maniac on 07/08/2010 15:47:44

Originally by: Frozean
The real problem with the amarr ships is really simple.

Amarr has insane issues with securing a good science LP store compared to the others.

Their LP store only peaks at 2.5k Isk/LP, and say, if you are generating 200K-250K lp a day, you need brutal ammounts of tag to compensate your LP generation (im talking more then 5,000 tags every f'in day)

You save ammo. yes, its offset by horrible LP store requirements making it difficult to make any sort of fast liquidity sort of farming in amarr space.

Not to mention the place is in a friggin high sec island -.-'


amarr space rocks. it has the best low sec. agents. where you make the most lp's, isk/hr.
lasers cut through rats like a hot knife in butter.

just go stick with your missiles and caldari high sec space to get yourself ganked and stfu about amarr/lasers.

you save approx. 2-3m hr. and that's using faction crystals.

Trolling removed. Zymurgist

Redshift XIII
Amarr
Posted - 2010.08.07 16:00:00 - [8]
 

wow you are angry as **** lol

Frozean
Posted - 2010.08.07 16:26:00 - [9]
 

haha.

Low sec is very different business.
I'll only risk doing low sec missions if the payoff is at least 150m isk/hour, which is approximately 2.8x more then the payoff of minnie/caldari mission running with golem-cnr combo.

Why? because i might as well do lv 5 missions :)
Low sec lv 4 missions is as for now a big gray area in eve

You are forced to use sub-optimal ships and suffer mission completion times and isk/hour

Or you field nightmares and get ganked, might as well do lv 5 missions.

And i will say this again. Lv4 low sec is just a waste of time for most sane people who weights rewards and risk.

Kurfin
Amarr
Posted - 2010.08.07 16:45:00 - [10]
 

Any savings we make on ammo is partially offset by rate our ships can chew though cap boosters.

I'm not even convinced that our faction/T2 crystals are cheaper than the ammo, you can but a lot of faction/T2 ammo for the cost of the equivalent crystal.

Where the crystals really score over ammo is situations when you won't be able to resupply for a while, like wormholes, but then there are still the cap booster charges if you use them...

Valoric Liao
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2010.08.07 18:17:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: Valoric Liao on 07/08/2010 18:18:01
Fail math is fail!

:)

Torpir Lee
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
Posted - 2010.08.07 18:29:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Torpir Lee on 07/08/2010 18:36:12
Unless you're using T1 ammo exclusively, you're not gonna be saving any ISK.
Amarr T2/Faction ammo costs a whole lot, especially for large guns. Many times you actually lose your ship before you manage to damage your crystals beyond even 10%, and ammo ends up costing you a fair bit.

EDIT: That's for PVP. As far as PVE is concerned, you will be saving ISK if you only use T1 ammo and mission for a good while. Not sure if faction/t2 ammo on Amarr is less pricy than faction/t2 ammo on any other race for PVE.

Lugalzagezi666
Posted - 2010.08.07 18:41:00 - [13]
 

Nonstop shooting with faction ammo :
- paladin 30k isk/min
- machariel 150k isk/min
- cnr 100k isk/min

Im not sure if i remember numbers good and cba to do the math again, but using faction crystals with amarr ships IS cheaper than using other types of faction ammunition.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.08.07 19:35:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: Liang Nuren on 07/08/2010 19:34:57
Originally by: Torpir Lee
Edited by: Torpir Lee on 07/08/2010 18:36:12
Unless you're using T1 ammo exclusively, you're not gonna be saving any ISK.
Amarr T2/Faction ammo costs a whole lot, especially for large guns. Many times you actually lose your ship before you manage to damage your crystals beyond even 10%, and ammo ends up costing you a fair bit.

EDIT: That's for PVP. As far as PVE is concerned, you will be saving ISK if you only use T1 ammo and mission for a good while. Not sure if faction/t2 ammo on Amarr is less pricy than faction/t2 ammo on any other race for PVE.


Wut, your whole post is wrong. Per shot, laser Faction/T2 ammo is way way way cheaper than other racial faction/t2 ammos. Like, several orders of magnitude cheaper.

-Liang

Ed: Also, stop losing your ships.

Torpir Lee
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
Posted - 2010.08.07 19:41:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
Edited by: Liang Nuren on 07/08/2010 19:34:57
Originally by: Torpir Lee
Edited by: Torpir Lee on 07/08/2010 18:36:12
Unless you're using T1 ammo exclusively, you're not gonna be saving any ISK.
Amarr T2/Faction ammo costs a whole lot, especially for large guns. Many times you actually lose your ship before you manage to damage your crystals beyond even 10%, and ammo ends up costing you a fair bit.

EDIT: That's for PVP. As far as PVE is concerned, you will be saving ISK if you only use T1 ammo and mission for a good while. Not sure if faction/t2 ammo on Amarr is less pricy than faction/t2 ammo on any other race for PVE.


Wut, your whole post is wrong. Per shot, laser Faction/T2 ammo is way way way cheaper than other racial faction/t2 ammos. Like, several orders of magnitude cheaper.

-Liang

Ed: Also, stop losing your ships.


I wasn't talking about per shot, was I? I believe Lugal covered that part.

As for the stop losing my ships part, sorry. People lose ships at this game.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.08.07 19:45:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Torpir Lee
I wasn't talking about per shot, was I? I believe Lugal covered that part.


No, he didn't. He covered "ISK/min" - which is highly variable based on what you have fit.

* Imperial Navy Multifreq L 250 ISK/shot
* Multifrequency L 0 ISK/shot
* Scorch L 500 ISK/shot

* EMP L 110 ISK/shot
* RF EMP L 1300 ISK/shot
* Barrage L 600 ISK/shot

* Wrath Cruise 100 ISK/shot
* CN Wrath Cruise 1900 ISK/shot
* Wrath Fury 450 ISK/shot

* Scourge 35 ISK/shot
* CN Scourge 1350 ISK/shot
* Scourge Fury 450 ISK/shot

* Antimatter 100 ISK/shot
* Fed Navy Antimatter 1100 ISK/shot

-Liang

Torpir Lee
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
Posted - 2010.08.07 19:50:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Torpir Lee on 07/08/2010 19:55:33
Edited by: Torpir Lee on 07/08/2010 19:50:41
It's all variable on ship types and guns though. You can't deny that Minmatar AC ships use ammo more frequently than Caldari Torp ships for example. He covered the main missioning boats with the popular fits, which is fitting for this thread. Though it would be better if he had more ships, like the Vargur and Golem. Comparing two 7 gun ships with one 4 gun ship isn't too good.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.08.07 20:20:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Torpir Lee

It's all variable on ship types and guns though. You can't deny that Minmatar AC ships use ammo more frequently than Caldari Torp ships for example. He covered the main missioning boats with the popular fits, which is fitting for this thread. Though it would be better if he had more ships, like the Vargur and Golem. Comparing two 7 gun ships with one 4 gun ship isn't too good.


Are you drunk? ISK/shot totally removes the entire question of "7 gun vs 4 gun" and "Artillery vs AC".

-Liang

Robot Unicorn
Posted - 2010.08.07 20:27:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Robot Unicorn on 07/08/2010 20:28:45
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Torpir Lee

It's all variable on ship types and guns though. You can't deny that Minmatar AC ships use ammo more frequently than Caldari Torp ships for example. He covered the main missioning boats with the popular fits, which is fitting for this thread. Though it would be better if he had more ships, like the Vargur and Golem. Comparing two 7 gun ships with one 4 gun ship isn't too good.


Are you drunk? ISK/shot totally removes the entire question of "7 gun vs 4 gun" and "Artillery vs AC".

-Liang


OP didn't ask about ISK/Shot(Though it undoubtedly helps getting a good idea if you can be bothered to do some math with your fits in mind). Considering most level 4 fits don't have artillery or pulses, ISK/Min with the most common fits gives you a practical picture, while ISK/Shot is something to take into account.

Edit: posted with wrong altEmbarassed guess that answers your drunk question

Daergaar
Caldari
Posted - 2010.08.08 08:24:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Robot Unicorn
Edited by: Robot Unicorn on 07/08/2010 20:28:45
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Torpir Lee

It's all variable on ship types and guns though. You can't deny that Minmatar AC ships use ammo more frequently than Caldari Torp ships for example. He covered the main missioning boats with the popular fits, which is fitting for this thread. Though it would be better if he had more ships, like the Vargur and Golem. Comparing two 7 gun ships with one 4 gun ship isn't too good.


Are you drunk? ISK/shot totally removes the entire question of "7 gun vs 4 gun" and "Artillery vs AC".

-Liang


OP didn't ask about ISK/Shot(Though it undoubtedly helps getting a good idea if you can be bothered to do some math with your fits in mind). Considering most level 4 fits don't have artillery or pulses, ISK/Min with the most common fits gives you a practical picture, while ISK/Shot is something to take into account.

Edit: posted with wrong altEmbarassed guess that answers your drunk question


ISK/shot is actually more important to know, because rates of fire can vary between different types of launchers (or guns), and different levels of skill. Knowing the ISK/shot, you can actually calculate how much a slower gun with a higher damage multiplier saves you in ISK or something.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2010.08.08 11:03:00 - [21]
 

I dunno what the exact amount is, but after fitting 8 good tachs to my maelstrom and loading those up with faction multi freq and others, i have saved alot of isk.

That is offset by the factions i face though, usually serps or angels. Still, it does well.

Sarah Shadows
Posted - 2010.08.08 11:57:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Sarah Shadows on 08/08/2010 11:57:45
Take however much you spend, on whatever crystals you use for amarr whatever ship and this = how much more you are spending than someone using a dual rep domi.

Veliria
Posted - 2010.08.08 14:00:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Headerman
I dunno what the exact amount is, but after fitting 8 good tachs to my maelstrom and loading those up with faction multi freq and others, i have saved alot of isk.

That is offset by the factions i face though, usually serps or angels. Still, it does well.


Meal with Tachs?
If you're gonna ignore the Amarrian cap bonus for lasers, why not use an Abbadon (or a Nightmare)?

Fh'ear
Caldari
Asset Relocation Specialist Enterprises
Galactic Syndicate
Posted - 2010.08.08 14:14:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren


No, he didn't. He covered "ISK/min" - which is highly variable based on what you have fit.

* Imperial Navy Multifreq L 250 ISK/shot
* Multifrequency L 0 ISK/shot
* Scorch L 500 ISK/shot

* EMP L 110 ISK/shot
* RF EMP L 1300 ISK/shot
* Barrage L 600 ISK/shot

* Wrath Cruise 100 ISK/shot
* CN Wrath Cruise 1900 ISK/shot
* Wrath Fury 450 ISK/shot

* Scourge 35 ISK/shot
* CN Scourge 1350 ISK/shot
* Scourge Fury 450 ISK/shot

* Antimatter 100 ISK/shot
* Fed Navy Antimatter 1100 ISK/shot

-Liang


Hmm, never actually knew it was that big a difference in regards to the faction disparity,

How many shots do you get with a Imperial Navy L Crystal anyway?

Smk56
Posted - 2010.08.08 15:57:00 - [25]
 

Faction crystals last for 4000 shots I believe. T2 lasts for only 1000.

Xereyn
Posted - 2010.08.09 06:21:00 - [26]
 

Re: the dual-rep Domi: These *can* occasionally lose a drone, and there's the isk/hour factor of generally being a slower way to run a mission, afaik.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2010.08.09 08:29:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Veliria
Originally by: Headerman
I dunno what the exact amount is, but after fitting 8 good tachs to my maelstrom and loading those up with faction multi freq and others, i have saved alot of isk.

That is offset by the factions i face though, usually serps or angels. Still, it does well.


Meal with Tachs?
If you're gonna ignore the Amarrian cap bonus for lasers, why not use an Abbadon (or a Nightmare)?


Alot of reasons really:
1) I was testing with lasers to see what they were like
2) An abaddon takes time to train up to be effective
3) A nightmare is expensive

I did not run my maelstrom as a solo L4 ship, but as pure DPS, and it did it pretty well. Mael only has 1 bonus to gunnery as well

Dr Sheepbringer
Gallente
Halinallen veroparatiisi
Inglorious Carebears
Posted - 2010.08.09 09:24:00 - [28]
 

Gallentes use drones, so no ammo ;)

Firkragg
Blood Covenant
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.08.09 10:06:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Smk56
Faction crystals last for 4000 shots I believe. T2 lasts for only 1000.


T2 lasts for nearer 2000. hence the isk per shot in liang's excellent post was double the isk/shot of faction.

Its not an exact number though since damage to crystals is chance based.

AstarothPrime
Posted - 2010.08.09 10:07:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: AstarothPrime on 09/08/2010 10:08:56
Everyone got tangled up in ISK per shot when, considering savings are an issue, it should be ISK per damage inflicted Idea

Edit so then:

1 scourge fury OPS ~380 dmg and costs me 415 ISK, therefore I pay 1.1 ISK per damage.

Now you say it...

I.



Pages: [1] 2

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only