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blankseplocked Thin client is looking good
 
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ShadowMaster
Gallente
Posted - 2010.07.20 23:31:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: ShadowMaster on 20/07/2010 23:33:19
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs187.snc4/37706_416429199393_17614129393_4315910_1577162_n.jpg

Taken from the CCP Facebook page:
Quote:
Anti-lag testing using the “thin client”: A fleet of Maelstroms using utmost irony (civilian lasers) as a means to take down an Amarr titan


Linkage

Sorry if this was posted already, I have not seen it posted and am at work right now so can not look around a whole lot.

Quote:
Since it's a bit hard to count in an image that size, that's 2000 civ laz0rz from 250 Maelstroms. Next time the Amarr pilot should probably bring some friends to the fight.


Quote:
For clarity, the thin clients are what's running the 250 Maelstroms - on one, very beefy, machine. The screenshot was taken on my regular ol' workstation, which had a lot of stuff going on it. Plus, I couldn't bring myself to turn gun effects off for obvious reasons. Tomorrow's task: 5 drones per Maelstrom. Moar pewpew!


Quote:
Maksym - that's exactly the problem I'm going after with this setup. Once I can reliably reproduce it in the lab, a fix is likely to follow.

Gene - Very uncommon, obviously. From a bugfixing point of view though, generally what a developer wants is the simplest reproduction possible, so you have a small set of starting points for investigation. In other words, more complexity will be added until the bugs show up, then we fix 'em.


Quote:
Jules - I'm testing the server with this. It's 9FPS 'cause I couldn't bring myself to turn the laser effects off and my workstation isn't super-beasty. It was 1 PC running 250 clients, and they managed just fine; the thin client is an amazing piece of tech!


Quote:
Shawn - The first successful test today was with 250 noob ships. Not as impressive looking as the Maelstroms, as 8 lasers per ship is better than 1. Smartbombing them all was highly entertaining, however.


Image changed to link. Navigator



Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.07.20 23:35:00 - [2]
 

Originally by: ShadowMaster
Smartbombing them all was highly entertaining, however.

Laughing Indeed.

-Liang

Genya Arikaido
Posted - 2010.07.20 23:37:00 - [3]
 

I want a thin client so I can dink around with EVE stuff offline. Sad

Felix Esperium
Lysergic Distortions Research and Development
Posted - 2010.07.21 00:04:00 - [4]
 

250 clients on 1 pc...

Macros and RMT farmers rejoice!


Primarry
Posted - 2010.07.21 00:33:00 - [5]
 

Whats the point in testing on a non standard client? surely that takes away any real world application of the issue?

Gecko O'Bac
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.07.21 00:34:00 - [6]
 

Looks cool... Let's just hope that the bug resides server side and is not a networking problem of some kind, otherwise the thin client won't help since I guess it'll be run locally...

Julienne Poirier
Gallente
Nonya Endeavours
Posted - 2010.07.21 00:36:00 - [7]
 

is this the realistic fleet battle testing AI?

Celestine Santora
Posted - 2010.07.21 00:37:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Primarry
Whats the point in testing on a non standard client? surely that takes away any real world application of the issue?


Uh because they're hunting server side lag?

SurrenderMonkey
Posted - 2010.07.21 00:37:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Primarry
Whats the point in testing on a non standard client? surely that takes away any real world application of the issue?


In some contexts it would. If the goal is to simply stress the server by flooding it with "normalish" traffic, however, this works fine.

I would imagine that the guts of the client are mostly the same with regard to networking and I/O. What it's lacking are probably the heavy-duty client side functions, like a GUI (or graphics at all, for that matter), which allows them to run a lot of clients on one machine.

CCP Veritas

Posted - 2010.07.21 00:43:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Gecko O'Bac
Looks cool... Let's just hope that the bug resides server side and is not a networking problem of some kind, otherwise the thin client won't help since I guess it'll be run locally...


I'd be okay with that outcome. Often knowing what a problem isn't is just as valuable as knowing what it is.

For instance, the test pictured showed us that 2000 civvy lasers isn't enough by itself to cause module lag. Now we'll add things in until module lag does show up, and we'll be much more informed as to the why of it. We'll also then have a reproducible situation that we can test solutions against quickly.

CCP Veritas

Posted - 2010.07.21 00:44:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: SurrenderMonkey
I would imagine that the guts of the client are mostly the same with regard to networking and I/O. What it's lacking are probably the heavy-duty client side functions, like a GUI (or graphics at all, for that matter), which allows them to run a lot of clients on one machine.


You hit the nail on the head.

Yuki Kulotsuki
Posted - 2010.07.21 01:36:00 - [12]
 

I approve of this.

Barkaial Starfinder
Minmatar
The Kairos Syndicate
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2010.07.21 01:39:00 - [13]
 

local is full of <insert country> isk farmers!
[/joke]

What is next on the list of things to add on the tests?

SlayerOfArgus
Gallente
Hermes Enterprises
Posted - 2010.07.21 02:15:00 - [14]
 

Is this available for us to download as of yet?

If not is there a time frame as to when this "thin client" will be given to the public?

When this test was conducted, was the node reinforced?


So far I'm impressed though Cool very good job. Will there be a dev blog in the near future about this?

Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2010.07.21 02:26:00 - [15]
 

Hate to break it to you but you are not getting the thin client or any other CCP in-house developmental tools.

Jade Kitana
Posted - 2010.07.21 03:07:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: CCP Veritas
Originally by: SurrenderMonkey
I would imagine that the guts of the client are mostly the same with regard to networking and I/O. What it's lacking are probably the heavy-duty client side functions, like a GUI (or graphics at all, for that matter), which allows them to run a lot of clients on one machine.


You hit the nail on the head.


Originally by: SlayerOfArgus
Is this available for us to download as of yet?

If not is there a time frame as to when this "thin client" will be given to the public?




Why would you want it?

Jim Luc
Caldari
Rule of Five
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2010.07.21 06:32:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Jade Kitana
Originally by: CCP Veritas
Originally by: SurrenderMonkey
I would imagine that the guts of the client are mostly the same with regard to networking and I/O. What it's lacking are probably the heavy-duty client side functions, like a GUI (or graphics at all, for that matter), which allows them to run a lot of clients on one machine.


You hit the nail on the head.


Originally by: SlayerOfArgus
Is this available for us to download as of yet?

If not is there a time frame as to when this "thin client" will be given to the public?




Why would you want it?



It could run on my iPad. Instead of a 3d representation, a UI overlay and symbolic gameplay can be substituted for the full Eve experience. Kind've a cool concept.

Or - it can be converted to a companion client, that keeps track of everyone in your fleet, or a whole army of fleets, their location, etc. Idunno, it's late and I'm rambling ugh

Nareg Maxence
Gallente
Posted - 2010.07.21 07:39:00 - [18]
 

It's a dev tool. You will never get your hands on it.

Ban Doga
Posted - 2010.07.21 07:43:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Jim Luc
Originally by: Jade Kitana
Originally by: CCP Veritas
Originally by: SurrenderMonkey
I would imagine that the guts of the client are mostly the same with regard to networking and I/O. What it's lacking are probably the heavy-duty client side functions, like a GUI (or graphics at all, for that matter), which allows them to run a lot of clients on one machine.


You hit the nail on the head.


Originally by: SlayerOfArgus
Is this available for us to download as of yet?

If not is there a time frame as to when this "thin client" will be given to the public?




Why would you want it?



It could run on my iPad. Instead of a 3d representation, a UI overlay and symbolic gameplay can be substituted for the full Eve experience. Kind've a cool concept.

Or - it can be converted to a companion client, that keeps track of everyone in your fleet, or a whole army of fleets, their location, etc. Idunno, it's late and I'm rambling ugh


Yeah, EVE definitely needs more macros... Evil or Very Mad

Dragon Greg
Posted - 2010.07.21 09:13:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: CCP Veritas
Originally by: SurrenderMonkey
I would imagine that the guts of the client are mostly the same with regard to networking and I/O. What it's lacking are probably the heavy-duty client side functions, like a GUI (or graphics at all, for that matter), which allows them to run a lot of clients on one machine.


You hit the nail on the head.


Sounds like the perfect Fleet Warfare client.

Gecko O'Bac
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.07.21 10:07:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: CCP Veritas
I'd be okay with that outcome. Often knowing what a problem isn't is just as valuable as knowing what it is.


True that... But a networking problem may prove itself to be much more difficult to pin down and correct...

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2010.07.21 11:46:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Vaal Erit
Hate to break it to you but you are not getting the thin client or any other CCP in-house developmental tools.

Booo ! And I wanted to get somebody to code a fully functional text-mode-only interface for EVE, boo Laughing

Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
Posted - 2010.07.21 12:00:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Hate to break it to you but you are not getting the thin client or any other CCP in-house developmental tools.

Booo ! And I wanted to get somebody to code a fully functional text-mode-only interface for EVE, boo Laughing

Mandatory console-mode EVE linkage. And as far as thin client goes, my guess it's just a normal client started in console mode with a script, or an extension of the built in tools the client previously had.

But regardless, yes me too would like a thin client, would make it easier on my laptop Laughing

Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2010.07.21 12:05:00 - [24]
 

I've been wondering about the effect of jumping in a load of people each of whom probably have hundreds/thousands of bookmarks to sort/check/load for system is having. Sounds like that'll be fairly easy to check now - sounds like a decent load simulator.

Wacktopia
Sicarius.
Legion of The Damned.
Posted - 2010.07.21 12:07:00 - [25]
 

Edited by: Wacktopia on 21/07/2010 12:08:53
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Hate to break it to you but you are not getting the thin client or any other CCP in-house developmental tools.

Booo ! And I wanted to get somebody to code a fully functional text-mode-only interface for EVE, boo Laughing



Yeah that would be sweet...

> look -planets
You can see
PN-432 - Planet 1 Gas
PN-53V - Planet 2 Gas
> align -PN-53V
> warp -PN-53V
Aligning . . . . Warping . . . . Dropping out of warp
> look -ships
You can see...
SN-314 - Arbitrator - 23km - 100ms(v) - 12ms(t)
SN-P31 - Vagabond - 23km - 3202ms(v) - 232ms(t)
> lock -SM-314
Identifier not present
> lock -SN-314
Acquiring lock (3.321s)
> orbit -SN-314 -r:20000
Notify: Locked SN-314
> speed -max
Notify: SN-314 is agressing you
Notify: SN-314 is warp scrambling you
> mod -activate l1,h1-5,m3,m2
> look -ships
You can see...
SN-314 - Arbitrator - 20km - 240ms(v) - 120ms(t) [SCRAM]
Notify: SN-314 Pulse Laser hits you doing 432 damage
Notify: Your group of 220mm Autocannon hits SN-314 doing 352 damage
> status
-Shield: 95%
-Armor: 100%
-Struture: 100%
-Capacitor: 56%
-You are warp scrambled (2)

Ran Khanon
Amarr
Swords Horses and Heavy Metal
Posted - 2010.07.21 12:13:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Othran
I've been wondering about the effect of jumping in a load of people each of whom probably have hundreds/thousands of bookmarks to sort/check/load for system is having. Sounds like that'll be fairly easy to check now - sounds like a decent load simulator.


Yeah, it all comes down to stuff like that I guess; bookmarks, personal and corp standings checks for everyone in system, 100's of different ship set-up/skill combinations loading, bio's, etc. *shivers*

Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2010.07.21 12:22:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Othran on 21/07/2010 12:33:01
Originally by: Ran Khanon

Yeah, it all comes down to stuff like that I guess; bookmarks, personal and corp standings checks for everyone in system, 100's of different ship set-up/skill combinations loading, bio's, etc. *shivers*


Yeah I think the Factional Warfare lag last year had something to do with standing checks - can't remember really.

Edit - no it was aggression notifications getting sent to each client about each aggression. Bit of a sod to find but hopefully it'll be easier now.

Shade Millith
Caldari
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.07.21 16:26:00 - [28]
 

I can't speak for all 0.0 dwellers

But a client that has NO fluff whatsoever for maximum client performance for fleet fights?

Yes please

Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation
RONA Directorate
Posted - 2010.07.21 17:35:00 - [29]
 

CCP Veritas

Does this mean on the next mass test you will have the players vs 250 civilian laser maelstroms?

CCP Veritas

Posted - 2010.07.21 18:01:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Obsidian Hawk
CCP Veritas

Does this mean on the next mass test you will have the players vs 250 civilian laser maelstroms?


For now, no. There's a lot of routes of investigation we can tackle in the lab with this tool, and adding players to that right now would just confuse things. That said, the mass tests are still very valuable, as any fixes that come from the lab have to be vetted through the player stress of mass tests before I feel comfortable deploying them on TQ. That, of course, is in addition to all the information that QA gets out of them.


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