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Capt'n Blood
Posted - 2010.07.13 06:58:00 - [1]
 

Shocked

1500 assorted ships killed to date Twisted Evil

Go gankers Go

BUT WAIT............

The Killboard, Linkage, is telling us all a lie YARRRR!!

Where's all the suicide ganker loses ?,
I know they are killed by Concord but please.....

If the destroyed ships were also displayed and the "true" number of ships lost by both parties was there to be seen, a shocking picture would "truely" unfold.

An example, looking through the mails, 1 Orca ganked by 12 pilots, 10 of those ended in pods,
another, battleship fitted with smartbombs kills 6 or 7 hulks before going down itself

I for one would like to see how many ships were lost on both sides, if only for the bigger picture,
high numbers of battleships being lost could affect the market prices as it is by the number of exhumers etc being lost allowing ship builders further routes to profiteering.
Evil or Very Mad
So what 1500 ships killed but I bet nearly that figure again were lost by the gankers.....

Hulkageddon Killboard is lying to us YARRRR!!

Galvatine
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:02:00 - [2]
 

*Other brands of killboard are available.

Julienne Poirier
Gallente
Nonya Endeavours
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:04:00 - [3]
 

are you implying that industrialists are behind hulkageddon?

Java Hun
Rockey Mountain Lumber Co.
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:09:00 - [4]
 

No matter what the miners still loose more isk.


So take your emoticons and try again.

Gladys Pank
Amarr
Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:13:00 - [5]
 

Anyone who isn't a total ****ing noob knows you only post pvp losses.

'Losing' to concord is pve. It also isn't a loss since you intended it to happen.

Cry more please.

Valoric Liao
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:40:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Gladys Pank
Anyone who isn't a total ****ing noob knows you only post pvp losses.

'Losing' to concord is pve. It also isn't a loss since you intended it to happen.

Cry more please.



That said, I had a few 3rd parties quickly jump on me once concord arrived, making those full fledged losses :(

Carthus Sondale
Gallente
Power and Water
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:42:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Carthus Sondale on 13/07/2010 07:43:39
And before you even bring it up, a Hulk getting a KM for a thorax that suicide ganked it because the Hulk's drones auto-fired on the thorax before CONCORD wtfpwned it after the Hulk exploded - that also doesn't count.

And yes, I'm sure we've lost 3000-4000 ships, but none of them even came close to the damage they destroyed, so how much of a story is that really going to tell.

I lose 3m per Thorax (maybe), and most of the guys I fly with are in dessies, losing barely 500k. 3-4 of us take down a Hulk, which is typically 210m+, sometimes much more. You do the math.

Dian'h Might
Minmatar
Cash and Cargo Liberators Incorporated
Posted - 2010.07.13 07:50:00 - [8]
 

people trolled (or were terribly misinformed about standard killboard practices) about this during last hulkageddon too, and it's just as dumb a question/point to bring up now as it was then.

1) anything cruiser or smaller is going to be a loss of less than a few million, [b]before[/] factoring in hulk loot and recovering modules. (I don't even bother to insure my destroyers half the time)

2) even with current insurance, the most the ganker is going to loose is ~20m for a battleship if they forget to insure it, and if they don't recover any mods or hulk loot. That's 1/10th of the cost of a hulk. Pre-insurance nerf they'd sometimes even make a profit off the insurance even if they didn't recover any modules.

3) what spank said

Now if you're asking out of scientific interest and not implying something about kb stats in a "zomg they don't poast their losses!!11oeone" sort of way, my suggestion to you is that for next hulkageddon you start your own kb in which people can post gank ship losses in the interest of obtaining statistical data on what sorts of ships are used in suicide ganks.


Ran Khanon
Amarr
Swords Horses and Heavy Metal
Posted - 2010.07.13 09:51:00 - [9]
 

To give the OP a general idea: I made 8 kills so far (of which 4 solo), and I failed 3 or so (of which one while dual accounting) So I am pretty much fail at ganking myself.

Breakdown of the 12 ships I lost (figures by head, no access to game atm):

5 x Harbinger + 50% fit lost + insurance fee - insurance pay out = 5 x 10 mil loss
1 x Cane + 50% fit lost + insurance fee - insurance pay out = 1 x 10 mil loss
1 x Armageddon + 50% fit lost + insurance fee - insurance pay out = 1 x 15 mil loss
5 x Arty Apoc + 50% fit lost + insurance fee - insurance pay out = 5 x 15 mill loss

Modules looted from targets in all of this; maybe 15 million isk

So total loss is around 150 million - 15 million gained = 135 million lost as well as -4.25 security status (Started at 5.01 so still in the good books ^_^)

Isk destroyed still eclipses my losses; according to kb: 1.03 billion ISK destroyed (3 Hulks + 5 Macks but four of those are team kills)
Also 4 macks of those were clearly botters so I am not feeling so bad for them.

So yeah, making losses on every kill but I don't give a damn about that. The fun I have doing this and what I learn from it is worth it. Some say it is easy, takes no skill whatsoever, but the hunt, trying not to spook potential targets, scanning them with an alt and creating a warp in, ending with the final assault is very addicting and fun to me. :>

I admit I wouldn't go on suicide sprees for guaranteed losses if it wasn't Hulkageddon though. That is perfect balance in my opinion: We can, but most of us only will if there is a good reason for it. (Event / profits / revenge /'getting to someone', etc) and if your desired sec status allows it for some players.

Also what Spank says. Mister Concord is a filthy npc.


Edith Bunker
Posted - 2010.07.13 12:00:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Gladys Pank
Anyone who isn't a total ****ing noob knows you only post pvp losses.

'Losing' to concord is pve. It also isn't a loss since you intended it to happen.

Cry more please.




LaughingLaughingLaughingLaughingLaughing

enterprisePSI
Unimatrix 0.1
Posted - 2010.07.13 12:36:00 - [11]
 

It is not about the money or damage caused etc. It is for the LULZ!
ISK is irrelevant. Ships losses is irrelevant. OP is irrelevant.

Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
Posted - 2010.07.13 12:38:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Capt'n Blood
a shocking picture would "truely" unfold.


I think this calls for a...

Duh Dun DUNNN!

Grohalmatar
The Tuskers
Posted - 2010.07.13 13:10:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Ran Khanon
but the hunt, trying not to spook potential targets, scanning them with an alt and creating a warp in, ending with the final assault is very addicting and fun to me. :>

I admit I wouldn't go on suicide sprees for guaranteed losses if it wasn't Hulkageddon though. That is perfect balance in my opinion: We can, but most of us only will if there is a good reason for it. (Event / profits / revenge /'getting to someone', etc) and if your desired sec status allows it for some players.


Pretty much spot on.

Lady Ayeipsia
Posted - 2010.07.13 13:31:00 - [14]
 

Honestly, I too am curious as to the total number of ships lost in connection to hulkagedon. The Industrial alt in me is curious simply to see the ships used for the ganking so I can prepare if we have another hulkagedon. Find out what is used often and just prep to sell that. This would especially help me know what BPOs to research. Still, i have a general idea, but it would be nice to see the stats.

On the other hand, the just plain curious side in me really wants to know not just the total number of hulks and other mining vessels lost, but the total ships lost. I don't care about the isk value, or for any measurement or to hear people say but the gankers lost XXX value or anything. I'd just like to know the total number of ships involved in hulkagedon. Is it about 3000, 10,000 or more? I just really would like to know.

Helicity Boson
Amarr
The Python Cartel.
The Defenders of Pen Island
Posted - 2010.07.13 13:44:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Lady Ayeipsia
Honestly, I too am curious as to the total number of ships lost in connection to hulkagedon. The Industrial alt in me is curious simply to see the ships used for the ganking so I can prepare if we have another hulkagedon. Find out what is used often and just prep to sell that. This would especially help me know what BPOs to research. Still, i have a general idea, but it would be nice to see the stats.

On the other hand, the just plain curious side in me really wants to know not just the total number of hulks and other mining vessels lost, but the total ships lost. I don't care about the isk value, or for any measurement or to hear people say but the gankers lost XXX value or anything. I'd just like to know the total number of ships involved in hulkagedon. Is it about 3000, 10,000 or more? I just really would like to know.


Feel free to make a board where people can post their losses. the singular reason i remove them is because its enough of a headache to find winners without having to filer through a million dessie losses. (incidentally, I am pretty interested in the statistics of the destroyed ganking vessels personally.)

I hope for HAG4 to have a custom killboard that will allow a more sensible way of data collection that will also allow for all the concord losses to be recorded for the sake of statistics.


PlagueDog Omega
Posted - 2010.07.13 13:58:00 - [16]
 

I mis-read the subject line and thought it said:

Hulkageddon: The <b>PIE</b>.

Now I'm disappointCrying or Very sad

Ran Khanon
Amarr
Swords Horses and Heavy Metal
Posted - 2010.07.13 13:58:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Lady Ayeipsia
Honestly, I too am curious as to the total number of ships lost in connection to hulkagedon. The Industrial alt in me is curious simply to see the ships used for the ganking so I can prepare if we have another hulkagedon. Find out what is used often and just prep to sell that. This would especially help me know what BPOs to research. Still, i have a general idea, but it would be nice to see the stats.

On the other hand, the just plain curious side in me really wants to know not just the total number of hulks and other mining vessels lost, but the total ships lost. I don't care about the isk value, or for any measurement or to hear people say but the gankers lost XXX value or anything. I'd just like to know the total number of ships involved in hulkagedon. Is it about 3000, 10,000 or more? I just really would like to know.


My guess would be at least around 2.5x the amount of ships killed.

A lot of group kills with smaller ships

All failed ganks don't show up on the killboard but do involve concorded ships (I participated in a failed orca kill in which we lost around 13 ships for instance)

It should be over 3000 gank ships concorded so far I guess.

Main ship types used (from what I've seen):

Destroyers; mainly Thrashers and Catalysts.

Battle cruisers; mainly Cane's and Brutix'

BS's; Tempests, Typhoons, not so sure about Caldari, Gallente and Amarr BS's but I use Arty Apocs because I can't fly tempests.

Most used mods are probably cheap arty of all kinds, cheap blasters of all kinds, damage mods of all kinds, sentry drones, tracking and sensor boosting modules and T2 rigs not.


TonyCandthejets
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2010.07.13 14:16:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Helicity Boson
Originally by: Lady Ayeipsia
Honestly, I too am curious as to the total number of ships lost in connection to hulkagedon. The Industrial alt in me is curious simply to see the ships used for the ganking so I can prepare if we have another hulkagedon. Find out what is used often and just prep to sell that. This would especially help me know what BPOs to research. Still, i have a general idea, but it would be nice to see the stats.

On the other hand, the just plain curious side in me really wants to know not just the total number of hulks and other mining vessels lost, but the total ships lost. I don't care about the isk value, or for any measurement or to hear people say but the gankers lost XXX value or anything. I'd just like to know the total number of ships involved in hulkagedon. Is it about 3000, 10,000 or more? I just really would like to know.


Feel free to make a board where people can post their losses. the singular reason i remove them is because its enough of a headache to find winners without having to filer through a million dessie losses. (incidentally, I am pretty interested in the statistics of the destroyed ganking vessels personally.)

I hope for HAG4 to have a custom killboard that will allow a more sensible way of data collection that will also allow for all the concord losses to be recorded for the sake of statistics.




IT's all a lie.

There are not enough people ganking hulks to cover more then 25% of the hulk population. There are hulks that know nothing about H3. You Helicity are you SPY!

GIVE US OUR UTURUS SHIPS!


tl;dr
Helicity = bob minton

Barakkus
Posted - 2010.07.13 15:10:00 - [19]
 

Capt'n Blood is a lie.
So is the cake.

enterprisePSI
Unimatrix 0.1
Posted - 2010.07.13 15:31:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Ran Khanon
All failed ganks don't show up on the killboard but do involve concorded ships (I participated in a failed orca kill in which we lost around 13 ships for instance)



Confirming i was at that fail gang, and they kept bumping the orca away from my optimal. Also we where at a gate Neutral
While the fail was strong with this gang, it was still fun Very Happy

Griznatle
Caldari
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2010.07.13 15:38:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Carthus Sondale
Edited by: Carthus Sondale on 13/07/2010 07:43:39
And before you even bring it up, a Hulk getting a KM for a thorax that suicide ganked it because the Hulk's drones auto-fired on the thorax before CONCORD wtfpwned it after the Hulk exploded - that also doesn't count.

If a player gets on the mail then its a kill, sucks for you.

Kri Matar
Minmatar
Heretic Army
B A N E
Posted - 2010.07.13 15:49:00 - [22]
 

wah wah wah, hulk got on my killmail...wah wah wah, my bc stats can't afford that, wah wah wah....not only did the hulk agress me before i kilt hiem the killmail shows him in pod and now i loss uber points on bc, wah wah wah....

Go mine, griefing is not for you.

GIVE US US YOUR HULKS!


Valoric Liao
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2010.07.13 16:15:00 - [23]
 

In other news, B A N E makes poopy in C&P thread.

Lily ThePink
Posted - 2010.07.13 16:16:00 - [24]
 

YEA YOU NOOBS!!!

Its only aloss if you want it to be!


No wonder so many people have good Kill to Death ratios!

Rolling Eyes

Cozmik R5
Minmatar
Dock 94
Posted - 2010.07.13 16:18:00 - [25]
 

A ship sacrificed in good clean fun is not a loss Very Happy

captain foivos
Posted - 2010.07.13 18:12:00 - [26]
 

The answer to this is so obvious even captain foivos noticed it.

Every ship on a Hulkageddon KM in highsec died.

Therefore, you can count all those for confirmed "losses" (even though they're not per se). Make up an arbitrary and irrational percentage to be the number of ganks that fail. Then times your ship numbers by that percentage.

Voila. You now have the number of suicide ships that died.

Grace Wing
Gallente
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2010.07.13 18:49:00 - [27]
 

How many exhumers survived and got killmails on gankers? They should post their killmails. It would surely put things into perspective.

Ashina Sito
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2010.07.13 19:42:00 - [28]
 

If it is a PvP kill, for the ganker, then it is a PvP loss. The fact that CONCORD did it does not matter. Ether your in PvP or not.

If the target got on the kill mail the it is absolutely a PvP loss. 2 players attacked each other and ships were lost. Just because you claim the ship will be lost by default does not remove it's status as a lost ship.

If the target gets the killing blow.... well.... if your arguing it is not a PvP loss there your an idiot. Hate to go there but there is no other response.


Originally by: Helicity Boson


Feel free to make a board where people can post their losses. the singular reason i remove them is because its enough of a headache to find winners without having to filer through a million dessie losses. (incidentally, I am pretty interested in the statistics of the destroyed ganking vessels personally.)

I hope for HAG4 to have a custom killboard that will allow a more sensible way of data collection that will also allow for all the concord losses to be recorded for the sake of statistics.




I understand your position.

I run with a group and we do not post losses on the kill board. The mixed corp status of the group results in a convoluted unusable mess. With Hulkageddeon you have to track kills and to have kill mails from invalid ships makes it a PTA.

BTW this group also plays the ISK war. 10 ships lost with the replacement value of 30 million for killing a single command ship worth 300 million, that is a win.

Anyway, Helicity if you get a custom KB that works for you I would be interested in taking a look at it... or at least sending someone your way that could understnad what they were looking at.

captain foivos
Posted - 2010.07.13 19:49:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Ashina Sito
If it is a PvP kill, for the ganker, then it is a PvP loss. The fact that CONCORD did it does not matter.


So CONCORD is a player now...Interesting concept.

Also: u mad?

Harrigan VonStudly
Original Sin.
Underworld Excavators
Posted - 2010.07.13 21:24:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Capt'n Blood
Shocked

1500 assorted ships killed to date Twisted Evil

Go gankers Go

BUT WAIT............

The Killboard, Linkage, is telling us all a lie YARRRR!!

Where's all the suicide ganker loses ?,
I know they are killed by Concord but please.....

If the destroyed ships were also displayed and the "true" number of ships lost by both parties was there to be seen, a shocking picture would "truely" unfold.

An example, looking through the mails, 1 Orca ganked by 12 pilots, 10 of those ended in pods,
another, battleship fitted with smartbombs kills 6 or 7 hulks before going down itself

I for one would like to see how many ships were lost on both sides, if only for the bigger picture,
high numbers of battleships being lost could affect the market prices as it is by the number of exhumers etc being lost allowing ship builders further routes to profiteering.
Evil or Very Mad
So what 1500 ships killed but I bet nearly that figure again were lost by the gankers.....

Hulkageddon Killboard is lying to us YARRRR!!


You really have no ****ing clue, do you?


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