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Barakkus
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:34:00 - [151]
 

I'm a highsec dweller not involved in large corps, blah blah blah...vote for me next time if I bother to run Razz

Squat Hardpeck
State Protectorate
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:34:00 - [152]
 

Originally by: Mynxee
CSM has no more details than you guys do. Until CCP or Eva choose to share more about the situation, there's a real danger of wild speculation leading to insanely wrong conclusions. While "what if's" and "I betcha's" are fun, they are often inaccurate.

As much as I would like to see this occur, who's to say that Ankh will not completely exclude the choice bits of info which put her in this current negative light to begin with? I'd like two sides to this story, so somewhere in the middle the truth can be found.

Yea, yea /tinfoilhat

Captain Megadeath
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:36:00 - [153]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Killer Gandry
If you have absolute and irrefutable proof that high sec dwellers have no love for EVE and don't care about EVE and it's progress then please put that forward.
How about the fact that, in spite of their supposed numerical superiority, they apparently only managed to get one representative onto the CSM?



Please, for Gods sake, don't lump all Highsec dwellers, we aren't all "carebears", we aren't all afraid of pvp and we aren't all failed pies like the flipers & greifers.

We all didn't vote for Ank either. My votes went on "Abstain" and will continue to do so until I see a candidate that suits my industrialist/FW gamestyle.

Chingyz
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:40:00 - [154]
 

Originally by: DaiTengu
Originally by: Plumpy McPudding
Empire simply has to vote for a better candidate next time.


Nothing good will ever come from empire.


nothing.



This is actually quite funny, seeing as everyone in EVE comes form Empire. However it is quite true.

mazzilliu
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:46:00 - [155]
 

AWESOME

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:48:00 - [156]
 

Edited by: Tippia on 07/07/2010 21:48:57
Originally by: Captain Megadeath
Please, for Gods sake, don't lump all Highsec dwellers, we aren't all "carebears", we aren't all afraid of pvp and we aren't all failed pies like the flipers & greifers.

We all didn't vote for Ank either. My votes went on "Abstain" and will continue to do so until I see a candidate that suits my industrialist/FW gamestyle.
Fair enough after all, I did the same, for much the same reason.

Still, the point remains: the CSM representation comes from those parties who take and interest in, and who believe they can influence, the route CCP will take. I seem to recall that our "abstain" votes didn't account to much certainly not enough to put anyone in the running and the vote itself covered every kind of reaction from "no suitable candidate" to "scrap CSM", so I'm doubtful it would have made any difference even if a good candidate did exist.

Either way, the core complaint here is that "onoz, highsec lost its only CSM", which, as you point out, is just bunk because she didn't represent highsec.

Mara Rinn
Posted - 2010.07.07 21:52:00 - [157]
 

Originally by: Tippia
How about the fact that, in spite of their supposed numerical superiority, they apparently only managed to get one representative onto the CSM?


Welcome to Democracy 101 aka Poll Rigging

Imagine you have 10,000 voters and 10 candidates. The population is split into roughly 50/50 between city folks and country folks. The country folks are split into five regions. Each region has one candidate for elections, while the city has 5. There is room for 6 candidates in government. Each country region will get a candidate in, but the vote for city candidates gets spread out between the lot of them - only made worse by the fact that some city folk are also hobby farmers so they vote for a country region candidate.

If there had only been two city candidates instead of 5, the two candidates could have easily taken two seats in government.

Choice is bad, m'kay?

Ky Vatta
Majority 12
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:03:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: Sokratesz
Originally by: Plumpy McPudding
Empire simply has to vote for a better candidate next time.


There are plenty of good 'carebear' candidates, you just need to look a bit further than the first forcefed propaganda video.


Very HappyI would apply for a CSM 'Carebear' position, if I had the time

(6year+ Eve Carebear, lolLaughing)

I`m known by a few, but whether it would be enough??

Those of you who think Carebears have no place as CSM, are rather narrowminded (I admit I`m a Carebear, but that does not mean I cannot change roles?..I have enough SP to do that quite easily)




JitaPriceChecker2
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:04:00 - [159]
 

No offence, but democracy is a very broken goverment mechanics.

Sadly the best of all tried so far.

FinnAgain Zero
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:06:00 - [160]
 

No, that's the point. Of course 'bears have a place on the CSM, a very necessary place. But rather than electing a viable candidate who'd look out for their interests, the voters voted for someone who was known to be unstable and unqualified.

People get the leaders they vote for, unfortunately.

Hopefully next cycle we can get a really solid 'bear or two onto the CSM who's willing to work with other play styles and who knows what the game is about.

Belid Hagen
Resilience.
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:16:00 - [161]
 

Originally by: JitaPriceChecker2
No offence, but democracy is a very broken goverment mechanics.

Sadly the best of all tried so far.


are you commenting on the western world, or EVE-online? I'm asking because your post has no relevance to EVE

Ein Spiegel
Minmatar
Fly-by-Night Industries LLC PTY LTD
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:20:00 - [162]
 

No matter what CCP says regarding "you're now stakeholders!", the truth is, you're not. You're consumers with a voice. If they choose to listen to your voice, then yes, the CSM gets things accomplished. If they choose not to, then no, they won't.

CCP is a privately held company, which means that a closed person or group of individuals gets to make all the big decisions, and if they want, all the little ones too. As a business that now has at least three products either released or in the pipeline (not including anything White Wolf may or may not publish, which is a gripe from white wolf customers), Eve's priority may not be #1. And saying "stakeholders" just really means that you're people with an interest in what CCP decides to do. While you can vote with your feet if it gets too bad, you don't really have any power beyond that threat. And there's no reason that you should be surprised if things change in ways you are opposed to them changing. If CCP were publicly traded, a player might amass a significant portion of stock and demand actual changes in priority or business method. (In fact, there are some players that have significant resources and might be more than happy to do so... sadly, I am not one. If you can, give me moneys. Or a job. Or something.) Ahem.

When I say three products, I don't refer to Incarna either. Dust is a separate product, Eve is another, and the mysterious but heralded World of Darkness MMO is the third.

Personally, I think it pretty much sets the tone when the CSM doesn't have a chance to at least say hello to the CEO. Sure, he's busy, but doesn't everyone want to meet a real Viking giant?

Kern Hotha
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:21:00 - [163]
 

Kick everyone off the CSM. Next year, instead of buying airplane tickets for worthless CSM candidates, CCP buys a pool table for their offices. It would be money better spent.

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:22:00 - [164]
 

Originally by: Kern Hotha
Kick everyone off the CSM. Next year, instead of buying airplane tickets for worthless CSM candidates, CCP buys a pool table for their offices. It would be money better spent.


I been voting they put a beer fountain in the lobby.

Brought that up as soon as the announcement of CSM. If they're gonna throw away RL money, at least do it in style.

Meissa Anunthiel
Redshift Industrial
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:24:00 - [165]
 

Originally by: Plumpy McPudding
Empire simply has to vote for a better candidate next time.


Not everyone who lives in highsec votes for ankhe. I got many carebear votes (I'm a carebear), as did Teadaze and Dierdra, at the very least... Highsec proposals are not going to fall on the wayside because the one <expletive removed> member.

Actually this should be better without her in the way to emorage on every highsec proposal, that's my opinion.

FinnAgain Zero
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:27:00 - [166]
 

Yah, but you're a modified carebear. Cool

Ky Vatta
Majority 12
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:29:00 - [167]
 

Next election I may put myself forward for CSM

I admit I`m a carebear, but I also understand many other careers, as I have been playing Eve nonstop since early 2004

I admit I`m fallible, and will listen to all sides in any argument


...but that is a long time away



Ghoest
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:34:00 - [168]
 

Originally by: Mynxee
CSM has no more details than you guys do. Until CCP or Eva choose to share more about the situation, there's a real danger of wild speculation leading to insanely wrong conclusions.



Did you really use the word "danger?"

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:35:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Sokratesz
Originally by: Plumpy McPudding
Empire simply has to vote for a better candidate next time.


There are plenty of good 'carebear' candidates, you just need to look a bit further than the first forcefed propaganda video.


I should apply for CSM as a carebear candidate. ugh

-Liang


You really should.

Cobalt Sixty
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:36:00 - [170]
 

Originally by: Verone
Glad she's off the CSM tbh, for the best part her ideas and input were horrendous.

Absolutely, this.

Barakkus
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:45:00 - [171]
 

Originally by: Misanth
Originally by: Kern Hotha
Kick everyone off the CSM. Next year, instead of buying airplane tickets for worthless CSM candidates, CCP buys a pool table for their offices. It would be money better spent.


I been voting they put a beer fountain in the lobby.

Brought that up as soon as the announcement of CSM. If they're gonna throw away RL money, at least do it in style.


This ^^

But in all seriousness, it's a tax write-off anyways, at least in the US it would be, so really no real money is being spent in the long run, a beer fountain though, I think would be a wee bit difficult to write off on your taxes lol.

Renser Benser
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:49:00 - [172]
 

Originally by: Helicity Boson
http://i31.tinypic.com/3583w5s.jpg

Rolling Eyes

Image changed to a URL - Adida


LO ****ing L...you better be ****ing kidding me! That is quite pathetic actually. ugh

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:55:00 - [173]
 

Originally by: Barakkus
This ^^

But in all seriousness, it's a tax write-off anyways, at least in the US it would be, so really no real money is being spent in the long run, a beer fountain though, I think would be a wee bit difficult to write off on your taxes lol.


Representation. Anything goes there, extra good for bar tabs. Razz

In all seriousness, does anyone take CSM serious? Because seriously, that'd be quite hilarious.

Barakkus
Posted - 2010.07.07 22:58:00 - [174]
 

Originally by: Misanth
Originally by: Barakkus
This ^^

But in all seriousness, it's a tax write-off anyways, at least in the US it would be, so really no real money is being spent in the long run, a beer fountain though, I think would be a wee bit difficult to write off on your taxes lol.


Representation. Anything goes there, extra good for bar tabs. Razz

In all seriousness, does anyone take CSM serious? Because seriously, that'd be quite hilarious.


Lots of game companies do almost exactly what the CSM does, but they don't hold elections for it, you get in "the program" from your history interacting with the developers, which is where CCP should take their CSM deal. SOE has a group of players similar to the CSM, but they were picked by community reps for the respecitve games, and no, the people in those "focus groups" aren't all the ass-kissers on the forums.

Tiny Montgomery
Posted - 2010.07.07 23:16:00 - [175]
 

CCP should also dump any CSM member who makes personal public attacks against other CSM members. This undermines the CSM in general and makes the whole thing look like more of a joke than it already is. And maybe screen for ***holes while they're at it, and people who make a complete mockery of the process. And if thats not possible, just dump the whole CSM thing.

There are a few CSM members who conduct themselves in an adult, semi-professional, appropriate manner. Some of these other jokers just F everything up. While CCP could benefit from the input of a group that represents large swaths of the player base, what CCP (or the players) don't need is representation from the chuckleheads that lurk in the game.

Shakon
Posted - 2010.07.07 23:17:00 - [176]
 

Does it really matter? This CSM is a bigger joke than the rest.

Elaine Threepwood
Minmatar
Royal Black Watch Highlanders
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2010.07.07 23:19:00 - [177]
 

I've abstained on all my chars every single CSM it's a joke

Delilah Wild
Posted - 2010.07.07 23:21:00 - [178]
 

Meissa,

Please give some thought before posting denigrating comments about other members of the CSM. Speculation combined with animus only reflects badly on you. Mynxee has scolded you before for this (e.g. spoongate), and many of us expect better from you as one of our CSM representatives.

If it is helpful, consider CCP Fallout's words on a related matter of trolling.

Delilah Wild
friendsofeve.wordpress.com


Originally by: Meissa Anunthiel

Not everyone who lives in highsec votes for ankhe. I got many carebear votes (I'm a carebear), as did Teadaze and Dierdra, at the very least... Highsec proposals are not going to fall on the wayside because the one <expletive removed> member.

Actually this should be better without her in the way to emorage on every highsec proposal, that's my opinion.

Cergorach
Amarr
The Helix Foundation
Posted - 2010.07.07 23:22:00 - [179]
 

Could be me, but according to Massively, Eva responded that "I do not share CCP's conclusion that there has in fact been an NDA breach". So...

Who has the popcorn? Unsalted please!

;-)

Black Dranzer
Caldari
Posted - 2010.07.07 23:27:00 - [180]
 

I love watching Delilah and Finn. One's rabidly for Ankh, the other is rabidly against. Maybe one day they'll fall madly in love in spite of their political differences and get married or something. Feel good romantic drama of the year!

So, initial reaction: Hahaha, Oh wow.

Secondary reaction:

If this were anybody else on the CSM, I wouldn't so much as bat an eyelid. But the fact that it's Ankh makes me suspicious. Not suspicious that she did something evil or vile, but suspicious that this is just a simple NDA breach. It could be just a complete coincidence that the most talked about and controversial CSM member got blasted for an NDA breach.

Personally, I don't believe in coincidence.


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