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blankseplocked Grendell is a corp thief
 
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Ekon Bor
Amarr
Van Diemen's Demise
Merciless.
Posted - 2010.06.02 21:08:00 - [91]
 

Edited by: Ekon Bor on 02/06/2010 21:10:51
So having read this thread through, and having some small awareness of Grendell but none of the other side, and taking both views objectively into consideration, I'd like to say cheers to Scott Woods.

Many men, faced with the difficulty of assailing someone's reputation in this fashion, would have wavered. "But I have no proof I can post" they would have whined... "And when I say I have proof, I'll have to hide behind forum rules and ignore the fact that people use third-party hosting to post logs and screenshots every day of the week" they would have quavered... "I'll lose all credibility and my reputation will be stained for evermore by anyone who google's my toon's name"...

Lesser men, men without the spine to hurl an allegation the way it should be hurled, without the gumption to look an opponent square in the eye while throwing a baseless slander, without the courage to state a bald assertion regardless of fear or favour (or facts) - would have backed down. Would have shunned the challenge. But not our man Scotty. The more historically minded of you may be reminded of Emile Zola, but I say, no. Zola was a hack. When he wrote "J'Accuse" he carelessly littered it with facts and disputable argument. No such mistakes here. I look forward to seeing him take this talent out of game, and can only hope he applies it to a productive field such as law, politics or Wall St, where it will surely serve as a beacon to future generations.

captain foivos
Posted - 2010.06.02 21:41:00 - [92]
 

Originally by: Ekon Bor

Many men, faced with the difficulty of assailing someone's reputation in this fashion, would have wavered. "But I have no proof I can post" they would have whined... "And when I say I have proof, I'll have to hide behind forum rules and ignore the fact that people use third-party hosting to post logs and screenshots every day of the week" they would have quavered... "I'll lose all credibility and my reputation will be stained for evermore by anyone who google's my toon's name"...

Lesser men, men without the spine to hurl an allegation the way it should be hurled, without the gumption to look an opponent square in the eye while throwing a baseless slander, without the courage to state a bald assertion regardless of fear or favour (or facts) - would have backed down. Would have shunned the challenge. But not our man Scotty. The more historically minded of you may be reminded of Emile Zola, but I say, no. Zola was a hack. When he wrote "J'Accuse" he carelessly littered it with facts and disputable argument. No such mistakes here. I look forward to seeing him take this talent out of game, and can only hope he applies it to a productive field such as law, politics or Wall St, where it will surely serve as a beacon to future generations.


QFT

kiki mo
Suddenly Ninjas
Posted - 2010.06.02 22:33:00 - [93]
 

hmmmm

Confirming that Scott Woods is IRL Robert Gibbs Razz

Epegi Givo
Amarr
Department of Redundancy Dpt.
Posted - 2010.06.03 02:21:00 - [94]
 

Scott Woods very likely does not have any evidence. Meanwhile Grendell DOES. The reason Grendell with-holds this evidence makes very little sense to me, unless the evidence does not exist, and Scott Woods is simply waiting to prove that he was right until this thread has gone on long enough to blow everyone who doubted him away.

Some say "Innocent until proven guilty" I say "Suspect until proven otherwise". I can't be the only one who thinks is suspicious that Grendell with-holds evidence that he obviously has.

Grendell keeps saying "The evidence is the Corp API and the forums, which I can't access" I say that he has chat-logs and eve-mails that could be used as proof which he seems to be with-holding.

Some may say "Why would Grendell want to steal a measly 10 bil and lose his rep" Perhaps Grendell knew that people would think that way, and could very easily be using it as a defense even though he could be guilty.

Honestly, this thread will go on to no end of people insulting eachother unless one of the parties gives up evidence of their innocence.

And Grendell, you never became guilty, you just became suspected. It does not matter who is the victim, if someone seriously accuses them then they are to be suspected. And I find the seeming unwillingness of you to post your evidence puts you under more suspicion.

Don't get me wrong though. It is still more likely that Scott is full of it and you are being wrongly accused, but justice is blind, and you are still to be suspected no matter how unlikely it is you are guilty until solid proof is presented.

Aesynil
Caldari
The Unit...
Posted - 2010.06.03 02:28:00 - [95]
 

Originally by: Ekon Bor
Edited by: Ekon Bor on 02/06/2010 21:10:51
So having read this thread through, and having some small awareness of Grendell but none of the other side, and taking both views objectively into consideration, I'd like to say cheers to Scott Woods.

Many men, faced with the difficulty of assailing someone's reputation in this fashion, would have wavered. "But I have no proof I can post" they would have whined... "And when I say I have proof, I'll have to hide behind forum rules and ignore the fact that people use third-party hosting to post logs and screenshots every day of the week" they would have quavered... "I'll lose all credibility and my reputation will be stained for evermore by anyone who google's my toon's name"...

Lesser men, men without the spine to hurl an allegation the way it should be hurled, without the gumption to look an opponent square in the eye while throwing a baseless slander, without the courage to state a bald assertion regardless of fear or favour (or facts) - would have backed down. Would have shunned the challenge. But not our man Scotty. The more historically minded of you may be reminded of Emile Zola, but I say, no. Zola was a hack. When he wrote "J'Accuse" he carelessly littered it with facts and disputable argument. No such mistakes here. I look forward to seeing him take this talent out of game, and can only hope he applies it to a productive field such as law, politics or Wall St, where it will surely serve as a beacon to future generations.


I lol'd for real :( To fall into the meme fad...

/thread

Grendell
Technologies Unlimited
Posted - 2010.06.03 02:49:00 - [96]
 

Originally by: Epegi Givo
Scott Woods very likely does not have any evidence. Meanwhile Grendell DOES. The reason Grendell with-holds this evidence makes very little sense to me, unless the evidence does not exist, and Scott Woods is simply waiting to prove that he was right until this thread has gone on long enough to blow everyone who doubted him away.

Some say "Innocent until proven guilty" I say "Suspect until proven otherwise". I can't be the only one who thinks is suspicious that Grendell with-holds evidence that he obviously has.

Grendell keeps saying "The evidence is the Corp API and the forums, which I can't access" I say that he has chat-logs and eve-mails that could be used as proof which he seems to be with-holding.

Some may say "Why would Grendell want to steal a measly 10 bil and lose his rep" Perhaps Grendell knew that people would think that way, and could very easily be using it as a defense even though he could be guilty.

Honestly, this thread will go on to no end of people insulting eachother unless one of the parties gives up evidence of their innocence.

And Grendell, you never became guilty, you just became suspected. It does not matter who is the victim, if someone seriously accuses them then they are to be suspected. And I find the seeming unwillingness of you to post your evidence puts you under more suspicion.

Don't get me wrong though. It is still more likely that Scott is full of it and you are being wrongly accused, but justice is blind, and you are still to be suspected no matter how unlikely it is you are guilty until solid proof is presented.


I'll put it simply then, somebody like me receive anywhere form 10-20 eve-mails a day. Once every few days I delete all mails once they have been dealt with. Chat logs in-game don't exist. My work was done in my head then dumped onto the forums. I worked mainly alone, and when dealing with others it was done on Teamspeak. There might be a few chat logs here and there with some bits, but to sort through all of them to prove what claim?

What bits I have are a few screenshots, which have been posted. Blacked out are the names of other investors for the corp bonds. The screenshots were only shown because Scott being an investor, claimed he was never paid back. I posted them to prove he was full of itWink

The things like POS equipment and towers were taken down by the CEO and 2 of his directors after I had already left. But as always Scott only see's and hears what he wants. He wants a scapegoat, and he picked me. I'm honored.Laughing

Epegi Givo
Amarr
Department of Redundancy Dpt.
Posted - 2010.06.03 02:58:00 - [97]
 

Originally by: Grendell
Originally by: Epegi Givo
Scott Woods very likely does not have any evidence. Meanwhile Grendell DOES. The reason Grendell with-holds this evidence makes very little sense to me, unless the evidence does not exist, and Scott Woods is simply waiting to prove that he was right until this thread has gone on long enough to blow everyone who doubted him away.

Some say "Innocent until proven guilty" I say "Suspect until proven otherwise". I can't be the only one who thinks is suspicious that Grendell with-holds evidence that he obviously has.

Grendell keeps saying "The evidence is the Corp API and the forums, which I can't access" I say that he has chat-logs and eve-mails that could be used as proof which he seems to be with-holding.

Some may say "Why would Grendell want to steal a measly 10 bil and lose his rep" Perhaps Grendell knew that people would think that way, and could very easily be using it as a defense even though he could be guilty.

Honestly, this thread will go on to no end of people insulting eachother unless one of the parties gives up evidence of their innocence.

And Grendell, you never became guilty, you just became suspected. It does not matter who is the victim, if someone seriously accuses them then they are to be suspected. And I find the seeming unwillingness of you to post your evidence puts you under more suspicion.

Don't get me wrong though. It is still more likely that Scott is full of it and you are being wrongly accused, but justice is blind, and you are still to be suspected no matter how unlikely it is you are guilty until solid proof is presented.


I'll put it simply then, somebody like me receive anywhere form 10-20 eve-mails a day. Once every few days I delete all mails once they have been dealt with. Chat logs in-game don't exist. My work was done in my head then dumped onto the forums. I worked mainly alone, and when dealing with others it was done on Teamspeak. There might be a few chat logs here and there with some bits, but to sort through all of them to prove what claim?

What bits I have are a few screenshots, which have been posted. Blacked out are the names of other investors for the corp bonds. The screenshots were only shown because Scott being an investor, claimed he was never paid back. I posted them to prove he was full of itWink

The things like POS equipment and towers were taken down by the CEO and 2 of his directors after I had already left. But as always Scott only see's and hears what he wants. He wants a scapegoat, and he picked me. I'm honored.Laughing


Fair Enough.

There are only 2 options i can see to proceed.

We will need your CEO to post confirming that he took the POSs, or someone in the corp to confirm it.

Or, we can have Scott give access of the forums/API to Chribba or another trusted third party to confirm one side or another, posting screen-shots as evidence to prove your innocence or guilt.

vile56
Metalworks
Majesta Empire
Posted - 2010.06.03 03:28:00 - [98]
 

Originally by: Epegi Givo
Originally by: Grendell
Originally by: Epegi Givo
Scott Woods very likely does not have any evidence. Meanwhile Grendell DOES. The reason Grendell with-holds this evidence makes very little sense to me, unless the evidence does not exist, and Scott Woods is simply waiting to prove that he was right until this thread has gone on long enough to blow everyone who doubted him away.

Some say "Innocent until proven guilty" I say "Suspect until proven otherwise". I can't be the only one who thinks is suspicious that Grendell with-holds evidence that he obviously has.

Grendell keeps saying "The evidence is the Corp API and the forums, which I can't access" I say that he has chat-logs and eve-mails that could be used as proof which he seems to be with-holding.

Some may say "Why would Grendell want to steal a measly 10 bil and lose his rep" Perhaps Grendell knew that people would think that way, and could very easily be using it as a defense even though he could be guilty.

Honestly, this thread will go on to no end of people insulting eachother unless one of the parties gives up evidence of their innocence.

And Grendell, you never became guilty, you just became suspected. It does not matter who is the victim, if someone seriously accuses them then they are to be suspected. And I find the seeming unwillingness of you to post your evidence puts you under more suspicion.

Don't get me wrong though. It is still more likely that Scott is full of it and you are being wrongly accused, but justice is blind, and you are still to be suspected no matter how unlikely it is you are guilty until solid proof is presented.


I'll put it simply then, somebody like me receive anywhere form 10-20 eve-mails a day. Once every few days I delete all mails once they have been dealt with. Chat logs in-game don't exist. My work was done in my head then dumped onto the forums. I worked mainly alone, and when dealing with others it was done on Teamspeak. There might be a few chat logs here and there with some bits, but to sort through all of them to prove what claim?

What bits I have are a few screenshots, which have been posted. Blacked out are the names of other investors for the corp bonds. The screenshots were only shown because Scott being an investor, claimed he was never paid back. I posted them to prove he was full of itWink

The things like POS equipment and towers were taken down by the CEO and 2 of his directors after I had already left. But as always Scott only see's and hears what he wants. He wants a scapegoat, and he picked me. I'm honored.Laughing


Fair Enough.

There are only 2 options i can see to proceed.

We will need your CEO to post confirming that he took the POSs, or someone in the corp to confirm it.

Or, we can have Scott give access of the forums/API to Chribba or another trusted third party to confirm one side or another, posting screen-shots as evidence to prove your innocence or guilt.


step 3 reread the thread

step 4 know thread is lies



Xereyn
Posted - 2010.06.03 04:22:00 - [99]
 

Originally by: Epegi Givo
Don't get me wrong though. It is still more likely that Scott is full of it and you are being wrongly accused, but justice is blind, and you are still to be suspected no matter how unlikely it is you are guilty until solid proof is presented.


... No. That's not how justice works. That's how injustice works.

The way justice works is that an accusation must have at least some basis of evidence to be granted credence of any kind. Arguments regarding the sanctity of the presumption of evidence go back centuries, but moral philosophy and, relevantly, legal precedent in most countries' courts and in the international courts, are in that the individual is held innocent until proven guilty.

Until such time as something beyond a mere accusation is given, Grendell can and should be considered to have no stain upon his character in this matter.

moneyshot II
Posted - 2010.06.03 04:29:00 - [100]
 

Originally by: Epegi Givo
Originally by: Grendell
Originally by: Epegi Givo
Scott Woods very likely does not have any evidence. Meanwhile Grendell DOES. The reason Grendell with-holds this evidence makes very little sense to me, unless the evidence does not exist, and Scott Woods is simply waiting to prove that he was right until this thread has gone on long enough to blow everyone who doubted him away.

Some say "Innocent until proven guilty" I say "Suspect until proven otherwise". I can't be the only one who thinks is suspicious that Grendell with-holds evidence that he obviously has.

Grendell keeps saying "The evidence is the Corp API and the forums, which I can't access" I say that he has chat-logs and eve-mails that could be used as proof which he seems to be with-holding.

Some may say "Why would Grendell want to steal a measly 10 bil and lose his rep" Perhaps Grendell knew that people would think that way, and could very easily be using it as a defense even though he could be guilty.

Honestly, this thread will go on to no end of people insulting eachother unless one of the parties gives up evidence of their innocence.

And Grendell, you never became guilty, you just became suspected. It does not matter who is the victim, if someone seriously accuses them then they are to be suspected. And I find the seeming unwillingness of you to post your evidence puts you under more suspicion.

Don't get me wrong though. It is still more likely that Scott is full of it and you are being wrongly accused, but justice is blind, and you are still to be suspected no matter how unlikely it is you are guilty until solid proof is presented.


I'll put it simply then, somebody like me receive anywhere form 10-20 eve-mails a day. Once every few days I delete all mails once they have been dealt with. Chat logs in-game don't exist. My work was done in my head then dumped onto the forums. I worked mainly alone, and when dealing with others it was done on Teamspeak. There might be a few chat logs here and there with some bits, but to sort through all of them to prove what claim?

What bits I have are a few screenshots, which have been posted. Blacked out are the names of other investors for the corp bonds. The screenshots were only shown because Scott being an investor, claimed he was never paid back. I posted them to prove he was full of itWink

The things like POS equipment and towers were taken down by the CEO and 2 of his directors after I had already left. But as always Scott only see's and hears what he wants. He wants a scapegoat, and he picked me. I'm honored.Laughing


Fair Enough.

There are only 2 options i can see to proceed.

We will need your CEO to post confirming that he took the POSs, or someone in the corp to confirm it.

Or, we can have Scott give access of the forums/API to Chribba or another trusted third party to confirm one side or another, posting screen-shots as evidence to prove your innocence or guilt.



I am a director in Retribution, and I verify that myself and another director were the people who took down the POS network in JFV-ID. I dimantled the POS network and moved it back to 5H-SM2, stored the POSes and modules in the corporate hangar. I do not know what happened to the POS system after that. I logged in the next day to find the entire hangar emptied of all modules, ammunition, reactions, and POSes themselves.

I don't believe that it was Grendell, however that is just my personal opinion. I am also doing an independent investigation in to the corp wallet issue, but so far it's looking on the level. I personally invested in the corp bond program, and was promptly repaid before Grendell left corp. When I'm finished with my investigation, I'll post the findings here.

Any questions can be sent to me via EVE-Mail.

Matrixx
Gallente
Retribution Corp.
Posted - 2010.06.03 05:10:00 - [101]
 

I am CEO of Retribution and I echo Moneyshot II's sentiments and findings. Moreover Grendell did not have any characters in the corp at the time of the theft which he could of used to perpetrate the theft.

Tortugan
Internal Anarchy
WE FORM VOLTRON
Posted - 2010.06.03 05:22:00 - [102]
 

Originally by: Matrixx
I am CEO of Retribution and I echo Moneyshot II's sentiments and findings. Moreover Grendell did not have any characters in the corp at the time of the theft which he could of used to perpetrate the theft.


So what you're saying is Scott Woods scammed your alliance? You'd better have some damn solid evidence if you're going to try to slander the name of such an upstanding member of the Eve-O community.

Tiberizzle
Posted - 2010.06.03 05:29:00 - [103]
 

confirming that I, too, have logs absolutely proving the allegations (which ones? take your pick!) in this thread but cannot post them for mysterious reasons

Hel O'Ween
Men On A Mission
EVE Trade Consortium
Posted - 2010.06.03 09:48:00 - [104]
 

Originally by: Ekon Bor

Brilliant stuff



Ha ha, You, sir, won the internet this day! Very Happy

To all others: for all what's sacred, please think about editing the quotes you're going to include in your post to the relevant parts ... makes reading such an entertaining thread much easier. Thank you very much in advance.

James Tritanius
Posted - 2010.06.03 15:29:00 - [105]
 

Well, case closed I guess.

The CEO and also a director of that corp came on and confirmed Grendell's story.

W0wbagger
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
Posted - 2010.06.03 17:40:00 - [106]
 

Originally by: James Tritanius
Well, case closed I guess.

The CEO and also a director of that corp came on and confirmed Grendell's story.


Shame it took 4 pages

Hel O'Ween
Men On A Mission
EVE Trade Consortium
Posted - 2010.06.03 20:24:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: W0wbagger
Shame it took 4 pages


Look at it that way: we had four pages of fun. Cool

Zeplnossus
Posted - 2010.06.03 21:43:00 - [108]
 

In conclusion:

PAAAAAAANCAAAAAAAAKES

Barakkus
Posted - 2010.06.03 22:03:00 - [109]
 

Who recruits someone named Odet?

Heinky
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2010.06.04 02:10:00 - [110]
 

I for one would like to personally thank Scott Woods for providing this service.


Thank you for providing all the proof...to the negative effects of prolonged usage of narcotics.

The children of eve all owe our superhero Scott Woods a debt of gratitude.

I for one have now given up my acid usage and will try to pursue a clean life to hopefully avoid one day being this dumb

oldmanst4r
Minmatar
oldmanst4r's Corporation
Posted - 2010.06.04 04:25:00 - [111]
 

I find this unacceptable. No evidence+Grendell's reputation means that nothing will change for Grendell because of this thread. However, threads like this can kill a less well known character's rep even if there is no evidence. I mean c'mon if you eve-search a prospective member's name and the first thread that pops up is a ------'s a corp thief thread. Are you going to argue with the player about the evidence that may or may not be present in the thread or are you just going to not take the chance and pass on recruiting them.

I know what I would do....

Never post again, Scott.

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2010.06.04 10:00:00 - [112]
 

The subject line is wrong. The expression is "He is a thief." If he was a "corp thief" then he would have stolen the corp, or he is a thief who in general works for a corporation - a corporate thief. For example, a "car thief" is someone who steals a car and is not a person who steals something out of your car after he gained your trust. If you want you can call him a "corp lifter", similar to a "shop lifter".

So much for my thoughts on the subject. YARRRR!!

Kikki Di'je
Lay Low
Posted - 2010.06.04 17:06:00 - [113]
 

Scott Woods is a dirty Minmatar liar.

I'd love to see this be delt with.

James Tritanius
Posted - 2010.06.04 17:48:00 - [114]
 

Originally by: Kikki Di'je
Scott Woods is a dirty Minmatar liar.

I'd love to see this be delt with.
RACIST!

I demand this be dealt with!

Biggus McChinnus
Minmatar
Ausbruch
Posted - 2010.06.04 18:11:00 - [115]
 

Originally by: James Tritanius
Originally by: Kikki Di'je
Scott Woods is a dirty Minmatar liar.

I'd love to see this be delt with.
RACIST!

I demand this be dealt with!


Seconded.


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