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SirRalph
Minmatar
U.K.R.A.I.N.E
SOLAR FLEET
Posted - 2010.05.24 08:55:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: arjun
ots not in a database u fool.
So what you think that you can reveal by that? Absolutely nothing.



Kesper North
Caldari
Gentlemen of Means
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2010.05.24 08:56:00 - [62]
 

OP, are you kidding? I am an alliance leader with a real job and, less than a month from now, a wife. EVE Gate is going to be my best friend ever.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 09:05:00 - [63]
 

I HATE opt outs, for whatever pretend reason they are presented for.

I am filing a petition against forced opt-out to the European Parliament in this moment and asking for a revision of:

EU Directive 2002/58/EC Directive 2002/58/EC of the European Parliament and of the Council of 12 July 2002
and subsequent Directive 2003/58/EC and Amending Council Directive 68/151/EEC

Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2010.05.24 09:06:00 - [64]
 

Edited by: Othran on 24/05/2010 09:05:51
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 24/05/2010 08:51:31
I am not a lawyer but... isn't opt out illegal in Europe?


Iceland isn't in the EU - nor is it likely to be admitted any time in the next decade (despite their target entry date of 2012) as the EU has more than enough fiscal problems ongoing now. They need Iceland like a hole in the head.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 09:36:00 - [65]
 

Originally by: Othran
Edited by: Othran on 24/05/2010 09:05:51
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 24/05/2010 08:51:31
I am not a lawyer but... isn't opt out illegal in Europe?


Iceland isn't in the EU - nor is it likely to be admitted any time in the next decade (despite their target entry date of 2012) as the EU has more than enough fiscal problems ongoing now. They need Iceland like a hole in the head.


1)

United Kingdom
CCP Games UK

PO Box 150
Herschel House
58 Herschel Street
Slough
Berkshire
SL1 1HD4

That's European enough for me.


2) The *servers* are located in Europe, therefore it's an European affair.

3) Non rogue / illegal non european companies are suggested to adhere to EU laws when dealing with EU citizens. While it may not be obligatory, no international company worth its name that I know have forcibly opted me in something.

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2010.05.24 09:49:00 - [66]
 

Dear EU,

An interwebs game about interwebs spaceships is forcing me to use a spacebook social networkingz site.

I dont want my enemies in xXSPACEPIWATESXx to know all about my interwebs spaceship friends as they might find out where my sekrit Player Owned Station is and that the scout in their system (Iamaspy) is actually my sekrit alt.

Im sure you will take this very seriously as the internetz spaceships are serious business and I have read some stuff on the interwebs about the law (and stuff).

I look forward to your immediate reply and the necessary UN sanctions against the ebil Icelanders.

Yours covered in tinfoil, from cloud cuckoo land,

Internets Spaceship pew pew pilot.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 10:00:00 - [67]
 

Originally by: Cailais
Dear EU,

An interwebs game about interwebs spaceships is forcing me to use a spacebook social networkingz site.

I dont want my enemies in xXSPACEPIWATESXx to know all about my interwebs spaceship friends as they might find out where my sekrit Player Owned Station is and that the scout in their system (Iamaspy) is actually my sekrit alt.

Im sure you will take this very seriously as the internetz spaceships are serious business and I have read some stuff on the interwebs about the law (and stuff).

I look forward to your immediate reply and the necessary UN sanctions against the ebil Icelanders.

Yours covered in tinfoil, from cloud cuckoo land,

Internets Spaceship pew pew pilot.


3 days past patch:

"You have 118 messages in the inbox".

and off we go with ISK sellers spamming the begeezus, Viagra mongers galore, lotto ads and all kinds of stupidly bothersome spam. Which is exactly what our law covers.

Emperors Bride
Amarr
Space Mermaids
Posted - 2010.05.24 10:02:00 - [68]
 

Maybe at first but after Dust 20567 they will open it up to hackers and send us all to the cleaners so I will need to bail then.

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2010.05.24 11:30:00 - [69]
 

Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Originally by: Cailais
Dear EU,

An interwebs game about interwebs spaceships is forcing me to use a spacebook social networkingz site.

I dont want my enemies in xXSPACEPIWATESXx to know all about my interwebs spaceship friends as they might find out where my sekrit Player Owned Station is and that the scout in their system (Iamaspy) is actually my sekrit alt.

Im sure you will take this very seriously as the internetz spaceships are serious business and I have read some stuff on the interwebs about the law (and stuff).

I look forward to your immediate reply and the necessary UN sanctions against the ebil Icelanders.

Yours covered in tinfoil, from cloud cuckoo land,

Internets Spaceship pew pew pilot.


3 days past patch:

"You have 118 messages in the inbox".

and off we go with ISK sellers spamming the begeezus, Viagra mongers galore, lotto ads and all kinds of stupidly bothersome spam. Which is exactly what our law covers.


I didnt say I disagreed with you - merely pointing out that I think its rather unlikely you'll have much joy explaining your case to the EU.

C.

Hanneshannes
Posted - 2010.05.24 11:31:00 - [70]
 

I have no idea what it even is tbqh :S

/me heard something about a social network :?

Serpents smile
Posted - 2010.05.24 11:33:00 - [71]
 

Originally by: Cailais
Dear EU,

An interwebs game about interwebs spaceships is forcing me to use a spacebook social networkingz site.

I dont want my enemies in xXSPACEPIWATESXx to know all about my interwebs spaceship friends as they might find out where my sekrit Player Owned Station is and that the scout in their system (Iamaspy) is actually my sekrit alt.

Im sure you will take this very seriously as the internetz spaceships are serious business and I have read some stuff on the interwebs about the law (and stuff).

I look forward to your immediate reply and the necessary UN sanctions against the ebil Icelanders.

Yours covered in tinfoil, from cloud cuckoo land,

Internets Spaceship pew pew pilot.


LaughingLaughingLaughing

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.05.24 11:42:00 - [72]
 

Can someone give me a quick tl;dr about why I need to care?

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:00:00 - [73]
 

Quote:

I didnt say I disagreed with you - merely pointing out that I think its rather unlikely you'll have much joy explaining your case to the EU



Had no problem, they even let you use your native tongue.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:06:00 - [74]
 

Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 24/05/2010 12:06:48

Jo Ka
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:09:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: Malcanis
Can someone give me a quick tl;dr about why I need to care?


You should care, slowly peoples liberties are being eroded away. Scary part is a lot of people can't see it.

Hooch Flux
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:25:00 - [76]
 

Edited by: Hooch Flux on 24/05/2010 12:35:16
Just wondering how anybody is going to claim any privacy issue with a fictional character that you don't own?

If you are silly enough to connect your personal (rl) data to any of this then you deserve what you get.

Edit: Spelling

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:35:00 - [77]
 

Originally by: Hooch Flux
Just wondering how anybody is going to clain any privacy issue with a fictional character that you don't own?
If you are silly enough to connect your personal (rl) data to any of this then you deserve what you get.


Even without resorting to RL data:

1) You are friend with A and B
2) 6 months pass. B litigates with A and joins enemy alliance.
3) Of course of your 50 contacts you have NO game facility to warn you of 2)
4) You magically find yourself boned by B's new alliance members and wonder WTF happened. Ofc you discover it while you were flying your L4 deadspace fit mission boat...

Now, you could remove B. Could contact B and even convince him to cease. Too bad, your info now has leaked as is completely in the public domain.

Hooch Flux
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:39:00 - [78]
 

Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Originally by: Hooch Flux
Just wondering how anybody is going to clain any privacy issue with a fictional character that you don't own?
If you are silly enough to connect your personal (rl) data to any of this then you deserve what you get.


Even without resorting to RL data:

1) You are friend with A and B
2) 6 months pass. B litigates with A and joins enemy alliance.
3) Of course of your 50 contacts you have NO game facility to warn you of 2)
4) You magically find yourself boned by B's new alliance members and wonder WTF happened. Ofc you discover it while you were flying your L4 deadspace fit mission boat...

Now, you could remove B. Could contact B and even convince him to cease. Too bad, your info now has leaked as is completely in the public domain.


Simple, don't set anyone +10 unless they are someone you personally know, after all it is just a game. Not like you will lose your job over it or something.

Dan O'Connor
Cerberus Network
Dignitas.
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:41:00 - [79]
 

Originally by: Hooch Flux
Simple, don't set anyone +10 unless they are someone you personally know, after all it is just a game.


A simpler solution is to log in to EVEGate once, turn off all sharing, and never use it again.

Hooch Flux
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.24 12:43:00 - [80]
 

Originally by: Dan O'Connor
Originally by: Hooch Flux
Simple, don't set anyone +10 unless they are someone you personally know, after all it is just a game.


A simpler solution is to log in to EVEGate once, turn off all sharing, and never use it again.


Or this if it bothers you that much!

Hakaru Ishiwara
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2010.05.24 13:32:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: Othran
I'll be turning it all off on launch day too and ignoring it thereafter.

Auto opt-in shows a total disregard for your customers.
This is the most elementary lesson learned, oh, about ten years ago with web-based customer-oriented offerings.

Make damn sure that your customer is aware of the shiny, but also give them the chance to choose if they want to turn on the shiny. Simple, respectful and effective.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.05.24 13:41:00 - [82]
 

Quote:

Simple, don't set anyone +10 unless they are someone you personally know, after all it is just a game. Not like you will lose your job over it or something



Of course it never occurred that you could be demanded to set some standings to use some facilities, or that people who setup standings 3 years ago might not know (no notice in game) they are bound to have to reset them.


Quote:

A simpler solution is to log in to EVEGate once, turn off all sharing, and never use it again.



Of course we are all meant to wake up in the middle of the night, in the hotel 500 miles off home to be _1st_ to log in after the server comes back up after the patch to disable sharing and avoid the spiders to gather the data in the first minutes, right?

Dan O'Connor
Cerberus Network
Dignitas.
Posted - 2010.05.24 13:49:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote:

A simpler solution is to log in to EVEGate once, turn off all sharing, and never use it again.



Of course we are all meant to wake up in the middle of the night, in the hotel 500 miles off home to be _1st_ to log in after the server comes back up after the patch to disable sharing and avoid the spiders to gather the data in the first minutes, right?



Of course Razz

Hooch Flux
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.24 13:54:00 - [84]
 

Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote:

Simple, don't set anyone +10 unless they are someone you personally know, after all it is just a game. Not like you will lose your job over it or something



Of course it never occurred that you could be demanded to set some standings to use some facilities, or that people who setup standings 3 years ago might not know (no notice in game) they are bound to have to reset them.
Quote:


I understand where you are coming from but tbh the worst case senario is someone finds out some information about a fictional character and some pixals are destroyed, not to big a deal in the great scheme of things.

Face Palmer
Republic Military School
Posted - 2010.05.24 14:24:00 - [85]
 

I tried to use the Eve gate but right clicking it does nothing - no 'warp to' , 'orbit' , or 'jump' option.

haz I been h4x?


Othran
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2010.05.24 15:49:00 - [86]
 

Originally by: Hakaru Ishiwara
Originally by: Othran
I'll be turning it all off on launch day too and ignoring it thereafter.

Auto opt-in shows a total disregard for your customers.
This is the most elementary lesson learned, oh, about ten years ago with web-based customer-oriented offerings.

Make damn sure that your customer is aware of the shiny, but also give them the chance to choose if they want to turn on the shiny. Simple, respectful and effective.


The point with this sort of stuff is the company's attitude. CCPs is pretty bad given that they are assuming everyone would wish to be opted into something most of them won't know exists.

Its not a question of "tinfoil hats", its a question of trust. We (sort of) know what info is available now but for the future? I'm sure we've all had emails from companies we opted out from when they "changed/updated their email system" yes? So how often are you meant to check that CCP haven't exposed data you don't want exposed due to patches/upgrades stuffing up previous settings? I have no idea but I don't want to have to check.

Anyone who operates a system which requires a customer to opt-out is someone who doesn't have a clue about CRM.

An Anarchyyt
Gallente
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.05.24 15:55:00 - [87]
 

Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Internet Law



So, what law school did you go to? The 4chan Institute of Legal Studies?

Agent Unknown
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.24 16:21:00 - [88]
 

Edited by: Agent Unknown on 24/05/2010 16:21:28
Did anyone see the part where CCP said scraping/using spiders to obtain information will warrant a ban from the service? I think that it won't prevent all crawlers, but it'll stop most.

If you don't trust someone enough to see your contacts list, why do you have them +10 anyway? +10 implies friend or ally...+5 just means "Okay, I won't shoot, but no access to secret stuff!" It's similar with outposts and the like in this function.

As a couple others have said, either reset all your +10s (except alts ofc) or put them at +5 if you don't trust them enough. I'm also sure it's at a pilot level so corporation and alliance standings won't have any effect.

laksmi2
Posted - 2010.05.24 16:56:00 - [89]
 

are my corpmates automatically +10?

Agent Unknown
Caldari
Posted - 2010.05.24 17:02:00 - [90]
 

Originally by: laksmi2
are my corpmates automatically +10?


When I briefly tested the alpha, I didn't see that ability (I couldn't see other people in my corp).


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