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Jim McGregor
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:22:00 - [1]
 


I wouldnt say its perfect myself, but it has become a pretty cool system. Certainly better than Windows at some things, but thats not too hard. :)

Quote:

The short answer: This is the best operating system currently available.

And here’s why.



Landuke review of Ubuntu 10.04


ReaperOfSly
Gallente
Underworld Protection Agency
South Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:26:00 - [2]
 

Can you play games on it yet?

Tallaran Kouros
Cryptonym Sleepers
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:28:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: ReaperOfSly
Can you play games on it yet?


I was playing games on Linux 10 years ago.

Nice attempt at trolling though.

Taua Roqa
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:31:00 - [4]
 

downloading it now...i assume it won't pass the gaming tests but i'll give it an install on this spare disk i got.

Jim McGregor
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:35:00 - [5]
 


Originally by: ReaperOfSly
Can you play games on it yet?


One of my favorites at the moment is Heroes of Newerth. Played it for months and still suck at it though.

I used to play Urban Terror for a long time too. Very good shooter.

Had lots of fun with World of Goo as well before that.

So yes, you can play games on it. Just not all games available for Windows. Hardly the fault of Linux however. Microsoft makes sure to not support any other platform with DirectX. :)

ReaperOfSly
Gallente
Underworld Protection Agency
South Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:36:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Tallaran Kouros
Originally by: ReaperOfSly
Can you play games on it yet?


I was playing games on Linux 10 years ago.

Nice attempt at trolling though.


I mean games developed for windows. Because no matter my hardware or how I configure Ubuntu, I have never been able to get Windows games working. Not even Eve.

Jim McGregor
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:42:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Jim McGregor on 02/05/2010 18:45:28

Originally by: ReaperOfSly

I mean games developed for windows. Because no matter my hardware or how I configure Ubuntu, I have never been able to get Windows games working. Not even Eve.


Here is the top 25 list of games for Windows working with Wine: http://appdb.winehq.org/votestats.php. Even has World of Warcraft on that list, but Im not sure thats a plus or not. =)

Usually they tend to have minor bugs though. In my experience, its best to use Windows if you want to play Windows games. If you use your computer for gaming only, use Windows. :)


Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:46:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 02/05/2010 18:44:27
Originally by: ReaperOfSly

I mean games developed for windows. Because no matter my hardware or how I configure Ubuntu, I have never been able to get Windows games working. Not even Eve.


Here is the top 20 list of games for Windows working with Wine: http://appdb.winehq.org/votestats.php. Even has World of Warcraft on that list, but Im not sure thats a plus or not. =)

Usually they tend to have minor bugs though. In my experience, its best to use Windows if you want to play Windows games. If you use your computer for gaming only, use Windows. :)


So then what you're saying is, by your own admission, It's not so perfect after all?

Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:48:00 - [9]
 

I hope the latest version of Ubuntu has a better version of the GRUB boot loader. Mine wizzes the hard disks for 15 seconds before displaying the bootloader menu. Not been able to fix it so far.

Jim McGregor
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:48:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Blane Xero
So then what you're saying is, by your own admission, It's not so perfect after all?


Depends on the definition of perfect. Its certainly not perfect for playing Windows games, obviously. Laughing

Dan O'Connor
Cerberus Network
Dignitas.
Posted - 2010.05.02 18:51:00 - [11]
 

I have Ubuntu 9.10 on this machine and was rather disappointed when for some reason EVE no longer played. I installed Windows and that was the end of it.

Mashie Saldana
Minmatar
Veto Corp
Posted - 2010.05.02 19:01:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Jim McGregor
Landuke review of Ubuntu 10.04




Quote:
But you’ll also notice a “Broadcast Accounts…” option there. From this one spot you can post updates (simultaneously) to Twitter, Facebook, FriendFeed and more.

Now that is a reason to mark it as a rubbish OS.

ReaperOfSly
Gallente
Underworld Protection Agency
South Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.05.02 19:47:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: ReaperOfSly on 02/05/2010 19:48:11
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Blane Xero
So then what you're saying is, by your own admission, It's not so perfect after all?


Depends on the definition of perfect. Its certainly not perfect for playing Windows games, obviously. Laughing


No no no no no. No back-pedalling. "Perfect" means the absolute best possible in every aspect. Since it sucks at playing most Windows games, it's not perfect.

Of course, Windows isn't perfect either.

Taua Roqa
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.05.02 19:49:00 - [14]
 

so what does it do better than windows7 x64?

Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
Posted - 2010.05.02 19:55:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: ReaperOfSly
Edited by: ReaperOfSly on 02/05/2010 19:48:11
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Blane Xero
So then what you're saying is, by your own admission, It's not so perfect after all?


Depends on the definition of perfect. Its certainly not perfect for playing Windows games, obviously. Laughing


No no no no no. No back-pedalling. "Perfect" means the absolute best possible in every aspect. Since it sucks at playing most Windows games, it's not perfect.

Of course, Windows isn't perfect either.
Have I ever expressed my love for you, man? Cause man, I love you Embarassed

Tallaran Kouros
Cryptonym Sleepers
Posted - 2010.05.02 20:05:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: ReaperOfSly
Originally by: Tallaran Kouros
Originally by: ReaperOfSly
Can you play games on it yet?


I was playing games on Linux 10 years ago.

Nice attempt at trolling though.


I mean games developed for windows. Because no matter my hardware or how I configure Ubuntu, I have never been able to get Windows games working. Not even Eve.


Like Quake III Arena?

Or indeed, any other game that iD Software have developed that has a native Linux client.

So yeah, 1999 for Q3A so that's 11 years ago.

Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.05.02 20:15:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Vogue on 03/05/2010 11:16:40
You can use WINE to get windows programs to try and work in linux x window gui. You have to install windows components like fonts and Directx. I have got 'windows' EVE to work in Linux but there was a gfx defect in station. Source games like Counterstrike work ok. But others i did'nt have much luck with.

If you really enjoy tinkering with OS's maybe getting games to work in Linux is worthwhile but its mostly a pain in the ass.

Taedrin
Gallente
Kushan Industrial
Posted - 2010.05.02 20:46:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Taedrin on 02/05/2010 20:48:19
Originally by: Taua Roqa
so what does it do better than windows7 x64?
Superior filesystem support: Windows only supports NTFS and FAT 16/32. Ubuntu supports a variety of file systems, including:
JFS, XFS, ReiserFS, ext3 and ext4.

Ubuntu also gives users access to tens of thousands of applications which can be downloaded and installed from their repositories and managed from Synaptic Package Manager. Updates to these applications are also much easier to manage, as Synaptic Package Manager allows you to check to see if ALL of your applications installed via the package manager are up to date. Driver updates made easy, essentially, since you all the drivers you need are provided from a central location.

Ubuntu is also much more secure as it does not encourage you to use an administrator account (in fact, it encourages you to NOT use an administrator account since it does not allow you direct access to root - you must explicitly execute a command via a sudo or graphical equivalent). Windows Vista and 7 has gotten a lot better in this regard by allowing UAC. However, Windows users are so annoyed by UAC that they usually end up disabling it entirely which I bet is the #1 vulnerability that allows viruses/spyware/trojans/etc to infect Windows computers everywhere. This is probably because *nix developers create programs with the fact that most users are not administrators in mind, while windows developers have been obsessed about getting admin privileges on their users machines so they can insert a few settings into the registry (and then fail to clean it up after uninstallation!)

There are also a few other things I could mention, such as a more robust developer environment, open standards which encourage community development. Oh yeah, and the fact that it's all FREE.

That being said, Ubuntu and Linux in general is far from perfect. I have heard that some video game developers mention that Linux is an insufficient platform for professional grade video games, and it has poor vendor support compared to windows.

Taua Roqa
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.05.02 21:16:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Taedrin
Edited by: Taedrin on 02/05/2010 20:48:19
Originally by: Taua Roqa
so what does it do better than windows7 x64?
Superior filesystem support: Windows only supports NTFS and FAT 16/32. Ubuntu supports a variety of file systems, including:
JFS, XFS, ReiserFS, ext3 and ext4.

Ubuntu also gives users access to tens of thousands of applications which can be downloaded and installed from their repositories and managed from Synaptic Package Manager. Updates to these applications are also much easier to manage, as Synaptic Package Manager allows you to check to see if ALL of your applications installed via the package manager are up to date. Driver updates made easy, essentially, since you all the drivers you need are provided from a central location.

Ubuntu is also much more secure as it does not encourage you to use an administrator account (in fact, it encourages you to NOT use an administrator account since it does not allow you direct access to root - you must explicitly execute a command via a sudo or graphical equivalent). Windows Vista and 7 has gotten a lot better in this regard by allowing UAC. However, Windows users are so annoyed by UAC that they usually end up disabling it entirely which I bet is the #1 vulnerability that allows viruses/spyware/trojans/etc to infect Windows computers everywhere. This is probably because *nix developers create programs with the fact that most users are not administrators in mind, while windows developers have been obsessed about getting admin privileges on their users machines so they can insert a few settings into the registry (and then fail to clean it up after uninstallation!)

There are also a few other things I could mention, such as a more robust developer environment, open standards which encourage community development. Oh yeah, and the fact that it's all FREE.

That being said, Ubuntu and Linux in general is far from perfect. I have heard that some video game developers mention that Linux is an insufficient platform for professional grade video games, and it has poor vendor support compared to windows.



i see some old arguements there Razz;

filesystems: why do i need all those? i know my pendrive is exfat, and all my disks ntfs and the DVD drives are whatever.

as for applications, well...uhm windows is not exactly lacking applications! :P i've paid for some of them too, they do a fine job and have no free equivalent (i couldn't find a newsreader that's quite as capable as newsbin with the undue stress i put on them, for example)

security? windows 7 is solid, and applications are not ran as admin by default (you have to specify run as admin) not to mention windows double checks this with you. UAC used to **** me off true, but they stopped it being so damn annoying.

i don't know about the rest as i'm just a normal user.

free is good, and i hope one day linux and open source does kill windows, but sometimes paying someone for writing a program that does something and does it well? that's not a bad thing :s

Taedrin
Gallente
Kushan Industrial
Posted - 2010.05.02 22:00:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Taua Roqa

i see some old arguements there Razz;

filesystems: why do i need all those? i know my pendrive is exfat, and all my disks ntfs and the DVD drives are whatever.

as for applications, well...uhm windows is not exactly lacking applications! :P i've paid for some of them too, they do a fine job and have no free equivalent (i couldn't find a newsreader that's quite as capable as newsbin with the undue stress i put on them, for example)

security? windows 7 is solid, and applications are not ran as admin by default (you have to specify run as admin) not to mention windows double checks this with you. UAC used to **** me off true, but they stopped it being so damn annoying.

i don't know about the rest as i'm just a normal user.

free is good, and i hope one day linux and open source does kill windows, but sometimes paying someone for writing a program that does something and does it well? that's not a bad thing :s


I applaud you for utilizing UAC. It makes me cringe every time people say to disable it, as it is perhaps the best thing to use to prevent an infection. On top of this, UAC encourages windows developers to AVOID requiring an administrator account when using their software.

As for the filesystems - they do not really matter to the average user. However, some file systems perform better at certain types of operations than others. For example, ReiserFS is faster than most other file systems when it comes to dealing with small files. Other file systems may not need to be defragmented as often or not at all.

Applications: What I am trying to say here is that Ubuntu utilizes a software repository. Think of it like Valve's Steam, except instead of allowing you to purchase and download a lot of games, you can download for free a variety of different applications from one location - anything from games to spreadsheets, to word processors, to compilers, to archive managers to desktop managers to antivirus software to a web page server to thousands of other types of applications. This repository will also manage updates, installation and uninstallation of these applications - just like Steam.

Security: As I mentioned above, UAC was definitely a step in the right direction for Windows. But Windows is still too dependent upon administrator accounts. My main complaint here is mostly with users and developers than the operating system itself. There are too many applications for Windows out there that tell you to run them as an administrator. Under *nix, developers keep computer security in mind and realize that they should ask for only the permissions needed to get the job done.

I will also agree with you that paying for a piece of software is sometimes better than getting something for free. Games are a great example - how many professional grade open source games out there do you see? Not very many, if any at all. I was simply trying to explain some of the aspects of Ubuntu that can be argued to be superior to Windows 7. I'm not even trying to argue that Ubuntu is better overall - just that it has some advantages in some areas.

Malaclypse Muscaria
Posted - 2010.05.02 22:33:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Taedrin
For example, ReiserFS is faster than most other file systems when it comes to dealing with small files.


Yeah, well, but the downside is that if you are not careful ReiserFS may murder your wife.

Brujo Loco
Amarr
Brujeria Teologica
Posted - 2010.05.03 03:18:00 - [22]
 

So much bias in here against Linux/Ubuntu.

I´m a frequent user of either XP-Vista-Ubuntu-MacOSX

Why? Cuz My wife ended up with a Mac, I bought a Netbook with XP, have my own personal laptop with Vista and ended up using a dual boot WinXp-Ubuntu setup for my main desktop.

All of these systems have their flaws yes, but what some people that obviously have never tried ubuntu or just installed and got confused at having to sudo su their way when installing certain apps or didnt even bother to try WINE fail to realize is that Ubuntu is SUPERIOR in versatility outside of GAMES.

To make this clearer, my netbook, due to being unaccustomed to the searing heat and marine breezes from the Pacific here in Panama, went KAPUT in the HD.HD simply began to fail as xp somehow managed to overheat it or the cooling fans were dust clogged. Havent bothered to replace it due to it being my wifes current puter as her Mac fried up alongside my old Laptop (Venezuela has SEVERE power outtages and restrictions on power use like Communist Cuba).

So unless I planned to fork out another 500 or more $ to buy a new laptop/netbook whatever, I decided to check the integrity of the laptop with a 1 minute operation called LOADING A WHOLE OS from a mem stick.

Point being, I made my mem stick a bootable Ubuntu disk. Plugged it into the netbook, made it first boot on setup and Voila! My netbook was running Ubuntu for Netbooks distro RIGHT AWAY without any real hassle. Oh yes, had some intermittent issues with the Wireless card in the netbook wich I fixed with a quick Google/ubuntu forums help, also discovered my whole HD was beggining to lose sectors and was more or less a glorified electronic parts paperweight.

Perhaps you can boot other OS's with your pen drive, but Ubuntu is the only one I know doesnt come with hiddenwtflol .dlls and preset commands that make your pirated os an open window to a random nerdhacker wannabe angstfilled teen, plus It's like FREE, easy to download and a dream to make bootable with Unetbootin

Yes, if you plan to use any game designed for Windows on a Ubuntu box you really need to tweak your way around, and it wont work most of the time, but I have successfully played EVE for some hours in Ubuntu NO PROBLEM.

Others obviously will never play, but the reason I use Ubuntu is for enjoying my time playing strange games, tweaking around and just wondering what exists outside of the crap that M$ creates, and my level of expertise is like level 2 on a 100 scale.Up to this day that small bootable pen drive with ubuntu has managed to save several people's computers.

It might not be FLAWLESS, but it's an extremely light, stable and super system for a casual user these days I'd reccomend it for anyone bringing a laptop abroad. You can find ANY KIND OF APPLICATIOn that will easily replace any commercial ones out there. <cough> OpenOffice <cough> and yes, it reads/makes Word files.

Even better, if you just want to TRY it without any real hassle, it even RUNS UNDER WINDOWS LOL!!!

BEHOLD : WUBI

So, yes, like a tool, it does several thing well, if you plan to use your puter just for Gaming stick to windows or if you are feeling bold and patient try Wine Under Ubuntu.

I have succesfully played CS:Source, EVE and WOW on it. Seems Fallout 3 can work on it too, but I usually use Ubuntu just to navigate, ****, IM and Social networking.Point is I use it extensively as my main OS when I travel abroad,some countries even ask you to boot up your laptop to see if you are bringing in pirate software or illegal "violent" games , Venezuela for instance meh.

Nothing like seeing a Customs official trying to rip off your laptop for "bringing in dangerous material" and you explaining to him/her it has Ubuntu installed and all games on it atm are Open License, completely free and mostly dedicated to solving puzzles, rpg's and spaceships.

Dan O'Connor
Cerberus Network
Dignitas.
Posted - 2010.05.03 10:15:00 - [23]
 

Edited by: Dan O''Connor on 03/05/2010 10:16:23

I'm really sick of things like "Ubuntu is best! BEST!" - "Nah ah, Windows is!" - "What the heck do you know, Mac is!" - "Man, I just told you, Windows is!" - ad infinitum.

I solved the problem by buying an external hard drive and put my data on it, so I can use whatever OS I need to suit my purpose, and right now Windows is on the machine as OS because of EVE.

Everybody has different opinions on OSes and it really is a waste of time to discuss things like this (EDIT: obviously you can discuss it in any way you like anywhere, I just think it's pointless on forums like these), you'll never get to common ground. Especially not on this forum.


Dan out

Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.05.03 12:49:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Vogue on 03/05/2010 12:51:49
Tried to Install Ubuntu 10.04 on my games PC. It seemed to install then after reboot i got a GRUB bootloader rescue prompt that i couldnt do anything with despite looking for answers on my laptop. So popped in Windows 7 DVD to repair bootloader. It wouldnt do anything with GRUB. Which i can well imagine being a deliberate Microsoft tactic of punishing me for putting none Microsoft OS on my PC. So i had to unplug two SATA hard disks and leave the one that has \WINDOWS on it plugged in. So i could boot into MS-DOS do fdisk/mbr on it. Rebooted into Windows 7 DVD repair mode. It then did recognise my Windows installation and repaired the bootloader for Windows 7.

Jim McGregor
Posted - 2010.05.03 16:08:00 - [25]
 

Edited by: Jim McGregor on 03/05/2010 16:09:22

Originally by: Vogue
Edited by: Vogue on 03/05/2010 12:51:49
Tried to Install Ubuntu 10.04 on my games PC. It seemed to install then after reboot i got a GRUB bootloader rescue prompt that i couldnt do anything with despite looking for answers on my laptop. So popped in Windows 7 DVD to repair bootloader. It wouldnt do anything with GRUB. Which i can well imagine being a deliberate Microsoft tactic of punishing me for putting none Microsoft OS on my PC. So i had to unplug two SATA hard disks and leave the one that has \WINDOWS on it plugged in. So i could boot into MS-DOS do fdisk/mbr on it. Rebooted into Windows 7 DVD repair mode. It then did recognise my Windows installation and repaired the bootloader for Windows 7.



Sounds like you installed the release candidate. There was a bug that made the computer unable to boot Windows. They fixed it before release.

Of course, Windows still have this "bug". Windows always overwrites the MBR completely.

Frouste
Posted - 2010.05.08 18:31:00 - [26]
 

i don't know how people have soo many problems with linux but i have completely stopped using windows for the past year. i play eve just fine through wine and i recently installed windows 7 and i have to say that performance was much better on ubuntu/wine. through my experience i say that ubuntu is more perfect than windows and any windows program i have trouble with in wine i usually have trouble with in windows. not to mention the fact that linux doesn't have viruses. i don't have anti-virus software on either of my machines. ubuntu is has windows beat on every platform. the only gaming problem linux has is the microsoft communism which has also spread to steal games from sony playstation to the "xbox only" category

Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.05.08 18:39:00 - [27]
 

Linux is perfect for people who aren't gamers or multimedia developers (see Adobe Master Collection). Linux is better than Windows at everything that doesn't involve sound/music creation and DirectX9 (and above). That's a pretty big con for those that need it. As a music-listening/browsing forums and watching movies platform, there is no better option.


NightmareX
Nomads
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2010.05.08 23:17:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: NightmareX on 08/05/2010 23:33:04
Originally by: Tobias Sjodin
As a music-listening/browsing forums and watching movies platform, there is no better option.

Can i ask what's better by starting a movie file / mp3 file in a movie / mp3 player in Linux / Ubuntu over Windows 7?.

And how is Firefox / Opera better in Linux / Ubuntu over Firefox / Opera in Windows 7?.

I'm not saying Ubuntu is bad in any ways. I'm just trying to find out why Linux / Ubuntu should be better than Windows 7 in those fields.

EDIT: The thing about DRM might be something about it. But to be honest, i have never had any problems with anything related to the DRM on Windows though.

hired goon
Posted - 2010.05.08 23:25:00 - [29]
 

At this point I am really feeling that Windows 7 will be the last windows I use, with Chrome on the way, Linux ever improving, OnLive to bring gaming to all platforms equally, and the overall shift away from desktops. I can't wait to ditch Windows all together for something else. I truly hope it is killed off one day. The intrusiveness and DRM just annoy me too much.

Brujo Loco
Amarr
Brujeria Teologica
Posted - 2010.05.09 00:11:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: hired goon
At this point I am really feeling that Windows 7 will be the last windows I use, with Chrome on the way, Linux ever improving, OnLive to bring gaming to all platforms equally, and the overall shift away from desktops. I can't wait to ditch Windows all together for something else. I truly hope it is killed off one day. The intrusiveness and DRM just annoy me too much.


This is why I always strive for people to learn about other OS'es, I remember running a experiment once on people when I used to be a small tech support guy that fixed computers on a store. I always told customers if they wanted a newer and better "windows" version for free. I managed to install the old puters with ubuntu and several common apps that had windows/linux equivalents like Openoffice.

Did it for several weeks, only two or three guys wanted their old windows, rest never bothered to call again. You must realize the average computer user JUSTS browses, emails, hears music and uses IM on their puters and this is where ubuntu shines for instance.

Also, If you only play EVE, you CAN play EVE on WINE under Ubuntu.


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