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Commander TGK
Gallente
The Deep Space Armada
Posted - 2010.04.23 14:05:00 - [241]
 

This is killing the sandbox, please don't nerf the DSSs. They have tactical use, both to make it a challenge to scan things down, and to avoid lag. Since when is space forced into a tiny "area of play"? That definitely takes away a certain level of immersion and reality. We already have deep space probes that make it possible to scan them down, we have the means, why not leave them as they are? Or at the very least leave the current bookmarks out there, they could become valuable over time.

Zenst
Hall Of Flame
Chain of Chaos
Posted - 2010.04.24 11:17:00 - [242]
 

STICKY?
Rolling Eyes
I noticed this thread nolonger stickied - has it been superceeded again in new thread I missed or are we to take it that CCP is not interested in our feedback upon this matter and are going to Nike it thru? Crying or Very sad


Caladain Barton
Navy of Xoc
The Remnant Legion
Posted - 2010.04.25 04:00:00 - [243]
 

I'm guessing either the Dev's were silenced, or just don't care.

I wouldn't care much if Greyscale just flat out said "we hear you, but trust us, nuking these DSS won't effect your 0.0 battles" or said "we're checking this thread periodically" or some such. But it seems to be a pattern over the last few dozen dev blogs of a single round of dev replies, and then silence.

So.. :welp: i dunno. It's sad though and doesn't help CCP's rep, which used to be awesome. They used to give both technical reasons and laymen reasons, even if they were bunk, and talk to us. I even remember a few times where CCP gave a reason, and then listened to the player base on a better implementation ;-)

Oh well. :CCPDevs:

seregakz
Posted - 2010.04.25 18:22:00 - [244]
 

Originally by: Commander TGK
This is killing the sandbox, please don't nerf the DSSs. They have tactical use, both to make it a challenge to scan things down, and to avoid lag. Since when is space forced into a tiny "area of play"? That definitely takes away a certain level of immersion and reality. We already have deep space probes that make it possible to scan them down, we have the means, why not leave them as they are? Or at the very least leave the current bookmarks out there, they could become valuable over time.


I completely agree with this statement. I think DSS is a good example of players creatively using game mechanics to broaden their tactical options. Just because devs did not intend for this tactic to exist, does not mean that it is invalid or an exploit. If the volume is a problem, let's reduce maximum range to, say, 500AU. Something like that seems to be a much more fair compromise.

Nyx Spire
Posted - 2010.04.26 11:39:00 - [245]
 

Simple solution shame i am so many pages deep. adjust the Cyno beacon mechanic's.

Cyno char clicks Cyno beacon button. new mechanic it consumes the fuel, but the Cyno doesn't pop. units bridge gap to board cast Cyno local spikes said units are stuck in a jump gate like cloak cant be uncloaked by items near by or ships for a similar 30 second window like a jump gate. upon the first ship moving a big Cyno VFX goes off and as it hits each cloaked Cyno'ed ship littler VFX's go off. at that point the Cyno beacon appears on overview and additional/slower forces can use Cyno as well.

What this means giant blobs can cyno jump in they can directional scan survey, hold cloak don't have enemy warp to them and have the same functional mechanics as a jump gate. if you lag out for 45 seconds you safety warp. blobs transverse systems by pass loading lag. both enemy and enemy have a time out period before the initial engagement. the surprise element is still there but it Doesn't take too much away from the covert Cyno
which i think should grant covert Cynoed ships a 15 seconds unconditional cloak after jumping allowing ships to move with out decloaking to maintain there choose your fight superiority.

Natasja Podinski
Posted - 2010.04.27 10:02:00 - [246]
 

this will destroy the game a little bit more for me! thanks ccp. why dont you just turn it into a tetris game .

personally i think this should be a platform game so if u start to implement small changes every week for some years eve will become a platform game!!

****ing morons!!

Praesentius
Posted - 2010.04.29 14:55:00 - [247]
 

Edited by: Praesentius on 29/04/2010 14:55:33
Originally by: Chribba
Edited by: Chribba on 16/04/2010 21:29:56
as my POD only warped some 3,000AU with its cap back in the days.


That distance is still approximately correct.

Thrasymachus TheSophist
Posted - 2010.04.29 16:53:00 - [248]
 

I am just excited for the easter egg hunt that is going to occur once the new system goes live.

Seth Ruin
Minmatar
Ominous Corp
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2010.05.02 08:22:00 - [249]
 

Originally by: Zenst
STICKY?
Rolling Eyes
I noticed this thread nolonger stickied - has it been superceeded again in new thread I missed or are we to take it that CCP is not interested in our feedback upon this matter and are going to Nike it thru? Crying or Very sad




Confirming CCP is done listening to feedback on this, err, feature.

EdTeach
Posted - 2010.05.05 21:58:00 - [250]
 

Edited by: EdTeach on 05/05/2010 21:58:20
I am still confused(no surprise). I am going to show what I believe is happening, and please tell me where I am going wrong. I most likely have some measurements wrong, so speak up please.


I cannot use any kind of 3d graphics apps, so I am going to have to try this with words.

Think of a sphere. This is the "allowed' area of a system.

Slice all the way accross the sphere parallel to the Orbital Plane, approx. 7 AU above the Orbital Plane(most warpable points are there i think.. plexes/wspace sites, etc).

Slice again 7 AU below the Orbital Plane.

Erase all of the sphere that is outside the area between the two Slices.

Draw a catbox around the remaining area.

Draw a Cat squatting over this.

The new emergent sandbox is now truly six inches deep and filled with cat poop.

Please tell me in the year I have been playing I have missed some legal, well-known way to make warpable BMs in all that massive +Z and -Z area.

Please.

If there is no way to accomplish this at present... there jolly well should be now don't you think?


Warp-to-probes comes to mind as a quick fix, but I am most likely missing all sorts of game breaking reasons that is a fail concept.


Call me a newb all you want in any replies, just explain what I am missing.


---------





Sunbird Huy
Caldari
WEPRA CORP
White Noise.
Posted - 2010.05.07 15:17:00 - [251]
 

Let me recap this...

RECAP A) :
CCP announcement: we will F**K you, and WE WILL DO IT HARD. aka. erase your deepsafes, your stuff at deepsafes, mess you up even more by podding you and such.
Playerbase : FFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUU CCP!!! NO ! YOU WILL NOT. Let us try to play without your motherfING DOMINION LAGG...
CCP announcement: *cough*cough* think we got spanked by our sheep...errr...respected customers...

RECAP B) :
CCP devblog: ok, ok we got it...We WILL F**K you only a little bit...WELL, not really, WE WILL STILL F**K U HARD MWAHAHAHA, just without the podding/deletion and mass genocide of those properties in deepsafes. And it's a stenching piece of crap, but this time we wrapped it so nicely...
PLAYERBASE : FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU CCP...SAME **** DIFFERENT WRAP!.

my recap:
Basically, your whatchamacallit-move****-script will bring those titans/moms/caps/cans in scannable range...good luck suckers, coz once the ships are in scan range, they be better off just being deleted in the first place, coz now everyone and his mother will be able to find those items by probing them out - and board/loot/shoot them.. LOL CCP... SERIOUS-****ING-LOL...

RECAP NO.godknowswhichonebynow...
Google translator does not work in ICELAND. Otherwise, CCP, by now, you WOULD HAVE FiNG realized and understood, 50k PEOPLE SUFFER FROM LAGG ISSUES, NOT FING HIDDEN SHIPS 5,000AU away.
Who the FOCK CARES how far they are.

Oh, and an important question...
How much time/resources have you spent trying to find your OWN workaround for lagg since the Dominion fiasco, as opposed to your titanic efforts in nerfing playerbase workaround for it?
HERE are some possible answers:
a)none
b)lol wut?
c)well...you know...we thought about it...man the beer was so good...
d)VOLCANO IS TO BE BLAMED, I SWEAR...
e)all the above?
f)ah, we're fixing it by writing devblogs and turning your attention away from playing the game(as laggy as it is) by our lvl 0 PR skills.

ShockedShockedShockedShockedShockedShockedShockedShocked

Zenst
Hall Of Flame
Chain of Chaos
Posted - 2010.05.07 15:26:00 - [252]
 

Originally by: Sunbird Huy
Let me recap this...

RECAP A) :
CCP announcement: we will F**K you, and WE WILL DO IT HARD. aka. erase your deepsafes, your stuff at deepsafes, mess you up even more by podding you and such.
Playerbase : FFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUU CCP!!! NO ! YOU WILL NOT. Let us try to play without your motherfING DOMINION LAGG...
CCP announcement: *cough*cough* think we got spanked by our sheep...errr...respected customers...

RECAP B) :
CCP devblog: ok, ok we got it...We WILL F**K you only a little bit...WELL, not really, WE WILL STILL F**K U HARD MWAHAHAHA, just without the podding/deletion and mass genocide of those properties in deepsafes. And it's a stenching piece of crap, but this time we wrapped it so nicely...
PLAYERBASE : FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU CCP...SAME **** DIFFERENT WRAP!.

my recap:
Basically, your whatchamacallit-move****-script will bring those titans/moms/caps/cans in scannable range...good luck suckers, coz once the ships are in scan range, they be better off just being deleted in the first place, coz now everyone and his mother will be able to find those items by probing them out - and board/loot/shoot them.. LOL CCP... SERIOUS-****ING-LOL...

RECAP NO.godknowswhichonebynow...
Google translator does not work in ICELAND. Otherwise, CCP, by now, you WOULD HAVE FiNG realized and understood, 50k PEOPLE SUFFER FROM LAGG ISSUES, NOT FING HIDDEN SHIPS 5,000AU away.
Who the FOCK CARES how far they are.

Oh, and an important question...
How much time/resources have you spent trying to find your OWN workaround for lagg since the Dominion fiasco, as opposed to your titanic efforts in nerfing playerbase workaround for it?
HERE are some possible answers:
a)none
b)lol wut?
c)well...you know...we thought about it...man the beer was so good...
d)VOLCANO IS TO BE BLAMED, I SWEAR...
e)all the above?
f)ah, we're fixing it by writing devblogs and turning your attention away from playing the game(as laggy as it is) by our lvl 0 PR skills.

ShockedShockedShockedShockedShockedShockedShockedShocked




Dont worry when they role this as it stands it will introduce a expliot that will make people cry even more. Coz I cant discuss it at the moment and its not live yet. But watch this space for some realy epic tears.

But hear is a thought if the closest object is 20au away and its a planet and nothing else is close and I fly a little bit further away, according to CCP nobody would be able to warp to me due to this change not allowing it! How would I be scanned down then if the scanner is unable to warp to me as I moved just of the edge so to speak. Does pose some serious WTF CCP you made it worse type comments too come.

AkJon Ferguson
JC Ferguson and Son Ltd
Ferguson Alliance
Posted - 2010.05.07 17:07:00 - [253]
 

CCP gets ridiculously few things right.

CCP got this right.

gj CCP

Zenst
Hall Of Flame
Chain of Chaos
Posted - 2010.05.08 15:51:00 - [254]
 

Originally by: AkJon Ferguson
CCP gets ridiculously few things right.

CCP got this right.

gj CCP


Would you care to explain what exactly they got right?

Was it the fix to a problem that never existed?

Was it a change to a tactic to fix a problem they are ignoring?

Was it the introduction of a expliot with this change?

Was it the inability to grasp that not everything is 20au apart and some
systems will have problems now due to this and them being so large
(gate<>gate)

Was it there ability to ignore player requests to fix problems and to
introduce more problems?

Was it the fact that they ignored feedback after the first round and
burried this thread in a surge of blogs/fap-role-playing sticky content?


Please explain what they got right as I and others clearly can't see it and would be most grateful if you would enlighten us with what they actualy did get right on this change they are too railroad thru.



Doctor Ungabungas
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.05.12 17:23:00 - [255]
 

Originally by: Zenst

Was it the inability to grasp that not everything is 20au apart and some
systems will have problems now due to this and them being so large
(gate<>gate)



I think your inability to grasp the actual mechanics of the change is a problem. :3


Zenst
Hall Of Flame
Chain of Chaos
Posted - 2010.05.12 20:56:00 - [256]
 

Originally by: Doctor Ungabungas
Originally by: Zenst

Was it the inability to grasp that not everything is 20au apart and some
systems will have problems now due to this and them being so large
(gate<>gate)



I think your inability to grasp the actual mechanics of the change is a problem. :3




Rolling Eyes

Proof or STFU Razz

All I shall say is X-7

Ceirah
SniggWaffe
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2010.05.14 20:33:00 - [257]
 

So is it right that when your ship is moved to the 20AU exact border, you can burn out opposite side of the sun and it would be impossible to warp to you since you're 20.000000001 AU away? Very Happy

Jamie Banks
Quantum Horizons
Posted - 2010.05.16 07:57:00 - [258]
 

Originally by: Ceirah
So is it right that when your ship is moved to the 20AU exact border, you can burn out opposite side of the sun and it would be impossible to warp to you since you're 20.000000001 AU away? Very Happy


No. Once you get out there, you can BM, you can warp you can do anything you want. But the 'only' viable way of getting out there is sub-warp speeds, so good luck AFK'ing an intercepter for a year to get a few AU outside the boundary.

Wedge Reskanor
Posted - 2010.05.25 19:17:00 - [259]
 

Hay, does anyone remember the warp mechanic from the Homeworld series? I think CCP should implement something like that. I should be able to utalize the entire space in a stellar system. Of course the maximum range would be 20+ AU from the farthest planet like is bieng implemented. This would allow for far more tactical flexability while not making fleets overly difficult to locate.

Ganagati
Caldari
Perkone
Posted - 2010.05.25 20:25:00 - [260]
 

Can someone clarify something for me: I was under the impression that after the move we would be able to go back and make new bookmarks- that this nerfed only CURRENT deepspace bookmarks. However, some folks are saying that from this patch forward you will not be able to warp past 20 AUs no matter what... which is true?

Konnore
Posted - 2010.05.26 15:16:00 - [261]
 

Originally by: Ganagati
Can someone clarify something for me: I was under the impression that after the move we would be able to go back and make new bookmarks- that this nerfed only CURRENT deepspace bookmarks. However, some folks are saying that from this patch forward you will not be able to warp past 20 AUs no matter what... which is true?



As far as I understood, you will be able to warp from and to a bookmark further than 20AU, but you will not be able to create that bookmark with probes

So if you like to create a BM at 30AU (e.g.) you'll have to fly there normaly for months!

(correct me if I'm wrong)

Shinma Apollo
BURN EDEN
Posted - 2010.05.26 15:23:00 - [262]
 

Dear CCP,


As you patch this into tranquility, I figure now's a good time to tell you: You pretty much once again shot yourself in the foot. You've not only not stopped deep safe book marks, but you've raised the barrier for entry once again to: People who have a carrier, people who have a black ops. Nothing prevents you from making new bookmarks beyond the limit, but it does prevent newer players from taking one well documented and publicly accessible way that wasn't skill point intensive, and supplanted it with another, far more elitist, less documented method.

Better luck next time.

Viglen
Gallente
Taurus Inc
Posted - 2010.05.26 22:18:00 - [263]
 

Edited by: Viglen on 26/05/2010 22:18:51
OK, Who is responsible for this!

I honestly thought TomB's nerfbat was lost in an the a expedition to Jove space!

This is just to extreme imo, make it 250au!

Widemouth Deepthroat
Posted - 2010.05.27 18:40:00 - [264]
 

Delayed cyno safe spot still work. I'm very happy LOL

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2010.06.15 11:58:00 - [265]
 

To whom it may concern:

Deep Safe Spots are STILL in game. CCP only eliminated those situated on the horizontal plane, vertical safes are an "intended feature" (yes I bug reported one).

Probably not that many compared to those that were nuked, but if the have/have not argument is to be used ..

Vertical truly is > All Very Happy


Libin Herobi
Posted - 2010.06.15 20:47:00 - [266]
 

Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
To whom it may concern:

Deep Safe Spots are STILL in game. CCP only eliminated those situated on the horizontal plane, vertical safes are an "intended feature" (yes I bug reported one).

Probably not that many compared to those that were nuked, but if the have/have not argument is to be used ..

Vertical truly is > All Very Happy




I'm beginning to refuse to believe that all this fuzz and "we crush everything - no, we only change everything - no, we only change some parts - well since not enough people hated the latest suggested change we will go with a new one that most people will hate for sure" can actually happen by accident.
No one is that confused, distracted and unorganized to produce one OOPS after the other.

CCP play drama queen with us. C/D

Zelot Blueice
XTC Cartel
Posted - 2010.07.24 08:50:00 - [267]
 

This is just ****ing bull****. I mean CCP you guys are ****ing idiots ya'll know that? I would ****ing love to watch you all perform under a producer at Activision, cuz they would ****ing love you. But we wont and I dont think many other people like you even now. Just give us our **** back so we can continue the game. Also I would like reimbursemnt for the SP needed for deep safe probes cuz i dont need them anymore. Now, give me my ****ing SP back for a pointless ****ing skill and btw, ..i.. you Evil or Very Mad

sm1thy
Posted - 2010.08.01 07:42:00 - [268]
 

Originally by: notreallyachar
I think of all the things to remove, keep that BM and make it a public warp point ha ha!


This....

Also place a small jove refueling station

and release word that once a month a jove industrial filled with 'deadspace - faction' rare modules will dock / undock there ... lol.

grrfsweld
Posted - 2010.08.02 22:44:00 - [269]
 

Why are BURN EDEN ELITE PVPERS still using deep safe spots in NC CAREBEAR systems, do people need to petition this or how is IT(pun intended) handled. Is BURN EDEN ELITE PVPERS maybe operating in a greyzone(pun intended)?

See the conclusion next time on Star Mist Deep Space Safespot.

Tiger's Spirit
Caldari
Posted - 2010.08.04 15:15:00 - [270]
 

Really removed ? Check it again, because Deep safes still working.


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