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Seth Ruin
Minmatar
Ominous Corp
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2010.04.19 07:27:00 - [151]
 

Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Planetary interaction looks awesome


LOL, you're funny. Laughing

Niccolado Starwalker
Gallente
Shadow Templars
Posted - 2010.04.19 07:47:00 - [152]
 

Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 19/04/2010 07:49:26
Originally by: Seth Ruin
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Planetary interaction looks awesome


LOL, you're funny. Laughing


Yepp. I am the funny man.


silentalleycat
Posted - 2010.04.19 08:33:00 - [153]
 

Edited by: silentalleycat on 19/04/2010 08:39:12
To be honest it looks to me most of you are complaining because there isn't much new 'pewpew', only a major industrialist addtion, it is about time we honest hardworking industrialist get new toys so you boys and girls can go buy more stuff to blow up and probably even cheaper

I for one am looking forward to this new expansion

Thank you ccp for giving us this greatest of mmo games

Seth Ruin
Minmatar
Ominous Corp
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2010.04.19 08:48:00 - [154]
 

Originally by: silentalleycat
Edited by: silentalleycat on 19/04/2010 08:39:12
To be honest it looks to me most of you are complaining because there isn't much new 'pewpew', only a major industrialist addtion, it is about time we honest hardworking industrialist get new toys so you boys and girls can go buy more stuff to blow up and probably even cheaper

I for one am looking forward to this new expansion

Thank you ccp for giving us this greatest of mmo games


No, you're completely missing the point. We were anticipating something similar to what they were saying at fanfest, something similar to what the teaser trailer said. We wanted something, anything but a freaking moon mining clone. What happened to the populous? What happened to city building and all that? CCP threw away everything we thought would add an interesting dynamic to this expansion and said, "No. Moon mining mechanics are awesome. We'll do that, only with dots and links."

I mean, of course this is just the first iteration and they'll revisit it later, right? Rolling Eyes

Kiri Serrensun
Posted - 2010.04.19 09:26:00 - [155]
 

Originally by: Gil Danastre
I think part of it is that there's only so much to add. Back when EVE launched there were no cap ships, tech 2, etc. So it was easy to add in gaps. Now though we have ships for nearly every role, so adding in new ones is a lot harder.

Though I would have liked the ship revamp to be more than ONE ship. One down, 52+ to go!


I don't think we need new stuff that much, we just need the stuff that was started (better PVE, more T3 ships and systems, factional warfare, treaties, AF's, corp and POS UI) to be followed up on. There's a whole expansion worth of content that's already in the game, it's just not viable or widely implemented enough because the expansions seem to be a string of "This is limited at the moment, we'll expand this when we have....ooh, shiny, let's bring in something new instead!". My hope is that this expansion will be a bit of flash, and a lot of quieter fixing stuff.

T0KER
Posted - 2010.04.19 09:32:00 - [156]
 

I agree with the OP, the Tyrannis expansion features seem pathetic. PI seems like a gimmick, and the trailer is completely misleading.

I was under the impression CCP was a growing company...ugh

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2010.04.19 09:35:00 - [157]
 

Originally by: CCP Manifest

fix whats broke
add features that the players want
reduce lag
and above all communicate with the player base in the way that made EVE what it was

As you know, adding features players want might increase lag. Fixing "what's broke" and reducing lag means taking time off from adding features that players want. They are all the source of endless internal debate (passionate yelling debate let me tell you) and we do our best to balance them all.

Like you said, what can improve them all with the last item on your list.

With all due respect the problem with your list is that to my knowledge noone actually asked for planetary interaction. Maybe someone did somewhere in some long forgotten thread on Features & Ideas but it certainly wasn't something the playerbase was clamouring for.

It doesn't take a genius to realise that PI is part of the grand plan of integration with DUST, and that's fine and all, but frankly effort expended on that should honestly be really focused on fixing more critical things like fleet lag. We don't yet know what additional show-stopping bugs/exploits/lag PI will introduce, but we're soon to find out like it or not.

I consider myself quite fortunate that I've never been involved in big 0.0 fleet fights. I say "fortunate" with some sadness since the idea of big fleet fights does interest me, it seems like it is the "end game" of Eve, but seeing things like this makes me realise that currently it's just not a reality no matter what the CCP promo media would like the uninitiated to believe.

When your game fundamentally can't support reasonable numbers of players fighting in the same space without one side never loading grid and just watching their ships be blown up without any means of control - that is too critical to just be treated as "we'll get around to fixing it once we've finished retexturing this PI cargo container", or whatever.

I realise with the best will in the world there will always be bugs in the system, but I do honestly think you need to concentrate at least one expansion on fixing everything that exists in game right now, rather than adding more tinsel to attract new subscribers.

Niccolado Starwalker
Gallente
Shadow Templars
Posted - 2010.04.19 10:22:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: Durzel
With all due respect the problem with your list is that to my knowledge noone actually asked for planetary interaction.[...]


I have. Many many times. But then in conjunction to Incarna. I so much want to walk on spacestations and planets. I see PI as the first basic step to this. Incarna will be the next. I am sure there will be a third and a fourth step too in the coming years.




Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
Posted - 2010.04.19 11:42:00 - [159]
 

Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 19/04/2010 11:44:13
You are all spoilt. CCP has spoilt you with expansions. It is CCP's game, not yours, don't forget that. You are not shareholders, you shouldn't really get any say at all.

You say CCP doesn't listen? Skill queue, wormholes, T2 BS, Invention, Sov 2.0, Titan DD nerf, nano nerf, ecm nerf, falcon nerf, need I go on.

People hate CCP for nerfing things, people love it when CCP nerfs the things they complained about.

People want CCP to not add too much new content and focus on fixing the bugs. People want more new content AND CCP to fix the bugs. People want bugs fixed and no new content.

People want PI. People don't want PI. People want Incarna. People don't want Incarna. People want DUST. People don't want DUST.

People think their set of values and concepts about EVE are dominant over others whose views do not coincide. So what if you pay a subscription? So do I! Most of the eve playerbase just enjoys whatever CCP implements and they don't ***** on these forums.

You know if I were the owner of CCP, i'd have said **** off a long time ago and taken the money and sold up to faceless corporation XYZ. Have they done this...no. You all sound like 4 yr olds demanding ice cream before dinner, but worse yet you are demanding no ice cream, ice cream after dinner and no dinner with just ice cream. What gives CCP consensus? CSM. You want this to be a democracy then go through CSM or run for it. Stop *****ing about stuff that quite frankly most of you haven't even tried. Most comments on PI are from people who haven't even tested it. You know who CCP will listen to, people testing their **** for them.

In fact I'm posting this in my own new thread.

Good Day!

Napro
Caldari
Simplistic Syndicate
Cha0s Theory
Posted - 2010.04.19 12:04:00 - [160]
 

Still disappointing after a year Confused

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2010.04.19 13:02:00 - [161]
 

Originally by: Celeste Coeval
Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 19/04/2010 11:44:13
You are all spoilt. CCP has spoilt you with expansions. It is CCP's game, not yours, don't forget that. You are not shareholders, you shouldn't really get any say at all.
Even though we're paying customers? Interesting concept you've got there - an entity unaccountable to the people that ultimately pay for its existence.

Tarhim
Caldari
Posted - 2010.04.19 13:20:00 - [162]
 

Originally by: Durzel
Interesting concept you've got there - an entity unaccountable to the people that ultimately pay for its existence.


Works for Apple Computer Inc. quite well tbh.

Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
Posted - 2010.04.19 13:52:00 - [163]
 

Originally by: Durzel
Originally by: Celeste Coeval
Edited by: Celeste Coeval on 19/04/2010 11:44:13
You are all spoilt. CCP has spoilt you with expansions. It is CCP's game, not yours, don't forget that. You are not shareholders, you shouldn't really get any say at all.
Even though we're paying customers? Interesting concept you've got there - an entity unaccountable to the people that ultimately pay for its existence.


yup, but funnily enough I don't see people leaving in droves...quite the opposite. The only way you can really make a company accountable is by voting with your wallet.

Average Jack
Posted - 2010.04.19 15:37:00 - [164]
 

Edited by: Average Jack on 19/04/2010 15:43:20
Originally by: CCP Manifest
Awww darling it just breaks my heart that this is your opinion of our dev team. Anti-PR vitriol, SURE!, as nobody, including myself, likes a snake oil salesman. Flowery, precise language designed to get people excited about features is, truthfully, kinda sketchy.

However, It's not my job to lie to you, stretch the truth or break the sacred covenant we all entered into when we started making EVE and you guys started playing it. In fact, it's my anti-job. CCP Pann would have the head of anyone who deceived you. Literally....she's plopped down a pike right outside the Reykjavik office for just that purpose, awaiting the CCPer who would dare do such a thing and providing a place for their mistake to be a warning to other employees. And that's key lime pie compared to what Hellmar and Oveur would do.


If this is true, why then does your company feel the need to release trailers claiming to be "in-game footage" when they are neither in-game graphics nor have anything else to do with the game (a side from using the same ship models).

In the past you used to create cool in-game scenes and videos (realistic ones) that actually were a decent representation of what EVE is like.

Now you seem to have broken with this tradition and have started to use the exact same tools as the "snake oil salesmen" you claim to dislike (eg. creating videos that only relate to the actual product in the most remote way).

Either you must think your game really sucks and needs all the marketing-polish to attract at least a few (gullible) customers or there must be some other reason behind this.

Either way, a company that needs to rely on this kind of crap is definitely not a company that I like to pay money. There used to be a time when I genuinely liked CCP as a company because they didn't have to coat everything in marketing-blabla and that made me far more sympathetic to their cause (and their need for cash to further said cause) then all this "dear customer" talk.

You didn't get 70'000 customers and 300'000 accounts by sugar-coating everything and releasing over-polished trailers - you got your customers for creating a good game and for giving us the impression that you didn't just want to earn money off our backs but actually provide us with a unique experience (which is a way more effective way to get loyal customers then with the second-hand-car-salesman crap you're pulling at the moment).

Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2010.04.19 15:43:00 - [165]
 

Originally by: Average Jack
If this is true, why then does your company feel the need to release trailers claiming to be "in-game footage" when they are neither in-game graphics nor have anything else to do with the game (a side from using the same ship models).

Well, since they actually are in-game footage... Does that mean you're wrong in everything you said, or just most of it?

Average Jack
Posted - 2010.04.19 15:51:00 - [166]
 

Edited by: Average Jack on 19/04/2010 15:53:51
Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab
Originally by: Average Jack
If this is true, why then does your company feel the need to release trailers claiming to be "in-game footage" when they are neither in-game graphics nor have anything else to do with the game (a side from using the same ship models).

Well, since they actually are in-game footage... Does that mean you're wrong in everything you said, or just most of it?


In-game footage is what you get when you download the EVE client, install the game and then log in. What you see in the videos has little or nothing in common with that. CCP have admitted that they use a second tool to create the videos (which is also the reason why ships in the trailers always look so dynamic - they turn and twist and move the way they never do in the game). The models of the ships are the same but everything else (textures, effects, filters, lighting, sounds, even the fake cool looking interface in the Butterfly video etc.) are not related to the game you get for your 15$.

Not to mention the actual content they imply exists in the game (which doesn't).

There was a thread around somewhere a while back with a very nice screenshot showing a Rohk in the trailer and the real in-game Rohk - and you could clearly see that it was not taken from the game (not even with a huge resolution and 64x AA). There were countless details on the textures in the trailer that simply do not exist in the game. This shows very well that it's not in-game footage (at least not what I'd call "in-game").

I'll see if I can find the thread.

viuva
Your Mom Is My Epic Mount
Posted - 2010.04.19 17:03:00 - [167]
 

/signed

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2010.04.19 19:11:00 - [168]
 

Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
The expansion looks pretty good to me. Planetary interaction looks awesome, and that alone qualifies for the expansion. Then you get the new web/game integration, graphic update on one of the space ships etc.


Have you actually tried it out on Singularity? If you have and you still think it looks awesome, well, then OK, but I kind of doubt it. There's not really any gameplay--it's just like moon mining. You're just connecting circles. Keeping your population happy, not making your neighbors angry, trading, pollution, government policies, choosing between being benevolent and tyrannical--all things talked about at FanFest and things that would make PI interesting--are all completely absent.

I do agree that EVE Gate looks good and is a perfectly worthy part of the expansion. I just don't think Planetary Interaction even vaguely approaches what they told us to expect at FanFest, and PI is the "flagship" feature of Tyrannis, thus the disappointment.

I hope I'm wrong and that in this last month of development before launch they whip up an amazing, deep strategy game-style experience with population mechanics like they described, and if so I'll formally apologize for doubting CCP. I just think that that's a lot to do in one month.

Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
Posted - 2010.04.19 19:24:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: Kyra Felann
I hope I'm wrong and that in this last month of development before launch they whip up an amazing, deep strategy game-style experience with population mechanics like they described, and if so I'll formally apologize for doubting CCP. I just think that that's a lot to do in one month.
Call me a dreamer but I'm getting this twitch that maybe for this expansion they are not putting all the cards on the table like in previous expansions. Its very possible that the stuff that is getting tested on sisi is simply making sure the overall framework is solid and bugfree so they can install the actual content on tq during the expansion. This wouldn't be the first time they kept mum about stuff all they way up to release. Or otoh it could be all we are really getting for this version and it goes the way of faction warfare and other new content that was left to sink with only token updates. But even if all PI is going to be is moon mining lite then it will have the effect of driving down t2 prices again since the moongate scandal and that can't be a bad thing.(stfu u greedy industrialist u already have enough isk)

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2010.04.19 20:41:00 - [170]
 

Originally by: Zeba
Call me a dreamer but I'm getting this twitch that maybe for this expansion they are not putting all the cards on the table like in previous expansions. Its very possible that the stuff that is getting tested on sisi is simply making sure the overall framework is solid and bugfree so they can install the actual content on tq during the expansion. This wouldn't be the first time they kept mum about stuff all they way up to release.


I've thought pretty much exactly this also, and I very much hope it is the case. It just seems like someone at CCP would have told us that there is stuff coming that won't be shown on Singularity or that it will indeed have population mechanics. So far, the only dev response has been "no comment" on whether or not there will in fact be population mechanics in Tyrannis.

In the face of so much (admittedly premature) disappointment on these forums, surely CCP would say something like "More cool stuff is coming, don't worry".

I really hope you're right, because if Tyrannis comes out with a polished version of what is currently on Singularity, I will be very disappointed, mostly because of how cool Planetary Interaction sounded when described at FanFest and how short the current Singularity version falls from what they described.

Solra Wolfe
GunStars
Posted - 2010.04.19 21:23:00 - [171]
 

This comment made me laugh in a thread about the appropriate naming of PI skills "planetology" or "exoplanetology":

Originally by: Matterick Boon


..either way, does it really matter? It's just about dots and lines on simulated "google earth" anyway...


LOL.. OMG.

HMSBlueprint
Two Maidens One Chalice
Posted - 2010.04.20 12:59:00 - [172]
 

Originally by: Xtover
Originally by: Gil Danastre
I think part of it is that there's only so much to add. Back when EVE launched there were no cap ships, tech 2, etc. So it was easy to add in gaps. Now though we have ships for nearly every role, so adding in new ones is a lot harder.

Though I would have liked the ship revamp to be more than ONE ship. One down, 52+ to go!



Check this out:

Hey players, for Tyrannis we've added in many new and exciting features, and here they are, patch notes style!


Arrow Introducing Planetary Interaction, where anyone can harvest resources from a planet, including POS fuel which can not only provide another source of income but also make soverign space even more independent!

Arrow We've had to reduce the system size to help combat lag, and since beyond 20AU (originally was to be 10AU but that was just stupid) is not warpable, we decided to make an exception of deep space probes.. you can scan out deep anomolies (just not bookmark them) that include a new feature:

Arrow fleet graveyards! a new salvage opportunity when you discover the ghostly remains of an aincent fleet battle. Who knows what wonders you will find?

Arrow Supercapital Anchors, miss flying those assault frigates because you've been trapped in an undockable supercap? Now, you can anchor (if you have roles) your supercapital and even set a password to board the ship. Be careful though, because the ship can be unanchored if someone has roles to do so (starbase config) or if the POS is put into reinforced!

Arrow speaking of assault ships, we have provided a 5th bonusto each ship, making them a formidible class of ship yet again

Arrow rockets have been tweaked to do damage on par with other light weapons

Arrow We've brought back the old cynosural jump effect, due to very popular demand!

Arrow destroyers have been modified to be escort ships for large fleets, with increased PG, tracking, and a slight HP buff

Arrow agression timers on station have been modified according to the mass of the ship, the larger the ship the longer after the last shot fired will the station wait for things to cool down. So if you undock to fight your enemy be prepared to be in the fight to the finish!

Arrow a few exploits and bugs have been removed making eve a better place. a list of fixed bugs/exploits can be found HERE


That is epic,

Beachura
Exiled.
The Kadeshi
Posted - 2010.04.20 13:21:00 - [173]
 

Even with these isses, it's still worth the 12 a month, easy, Eve is great :)

thatbloke
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.20 13:52:00 - [174]
 

Alot of you moaning about the perceived "lack" of new content are missing something - there is already a metric f**kton of content in EVE. All I see is people moaning that there is no new content for them, becuase maybe they don't do industrial type stuff, which is, as some people have put it already, a whole load of BBBAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW. EVE has evolved into an absolutely massive game, and adding content patches of the scale that may have been done previously is just not as easy to do now as it was then precisely because of all of the previous content additions - you now have many more players with many more ship varieties and many more manufacturing options, etc. Balancing all of this stuff will take a much longer amount of time, regardless of how easy it has been achieved in the past.

The other thing to point out, is that while CCP have not officially stated "We've fixed the lag" - were they to say that, they would likely be lying to say it is gone entirely - the expansion is very likely to contain various updates/fixes/optimizations on both the client and server side of things that will help with these things. While it may not be perfect, I would certainly expect it to be better.

tribalfreak
Posted - 2010.04.20 14:03:00 - [175]
 

i like the idea of planetarty interaction altho it's not what i expected based on what i seen in the trailer. when i saw the "will you rule with benevolence or tyranny" i was under the impression that you'd be able to have cities with an actual population to manage along with the planet mining buildings, after all you need people to run them right? i also wasn't expecting those little holograms of the buildings on the planet i was kind of expecting to be able to zoom right in and seen the building itself and maybe tweak it a bit more. however i never got too pumped up about this expansion simply because it's adding something new>_> i can't very well expect all the bells and whistles right off the bat when CCP is making another game. i believe (and hope) CCP will expand on the planetary interaction in future expansions.

come on people i think some of us expected too much too fast. personally i think they rushed and slapped the planetary interaction on to ensure DUST has a setting to be played on. further enforcing my believe that they will improve on PI later down the road. if all else fails PI is optional if it sucks just carry on as you always did

Droog 1
Posted - 2010.04.20 15:21:00 - [176]
 

I like the losec boost that this brings.

Seth Ruin
Minmatar
Ominous Corp
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2010.04.20 15:36:00 - [177]
 

Originally by: Droog 1
I like the losec boost that this brings.

Just like the lowsec boost that FW and L5s brought.

Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
Posted - 2010.04.20 15:58:00 - [178]
 

thatbloke said "Alot of you moaning about the perceived "lack" of new content are missing something - there is already a metric f**kton of content in EVE."
Not for some of us older players there isn't. I do PvP, PvE, industrial the lot and am completely bored of doing the same thing constantly. Eve needs more new content. It also needs more goals and things to spend isk on.
I don't find Eve massive I find it pretty tiny with not enough to do that's not been done to death already.

Sure Eve appears massive and is great for new players. But it's the old players that get bored of the old content.

Captain Futur3
Posted - 2010.04.20 17:46:00 - [179]
 

Originally by: Pottsey
thatbloke said "Alot of you moaning about the perceived "lack" of new content are missing something - there is already a metric f**kton of content in EVE."
Not for some of us older players there isn't. I do PvP, PvE, industrial the lot and am completely bored of doing the same thing constantly. Eve needs more new content. It also needs more goals and things to spend isk on.
I don't find Eve massive I find it pretty tiny with not enough to do that's not been done to death already.

Sure Eve appears massive and is great for new players. But it's the old players that get bored of the old content.



No, it does not need NEW content. It finally must IMPROVE the existing content. I am not an old player, but missions for example got boring like hell after one single month. They are always the same, no cool random events, no great battles with fleets fighting each other. No great AI, no beautyful events. They are pure ISK generators and feel way more like work than something i would like to do.
This is just one example. WHs could also need some love and so on.
The game could be so awesome if CCP would put more love into the existing things. PI is the best example for what they should NOT do. Put unfinished, boring content into the game that will get boring short after launch too. People will only do it because of ISK, thats it :(.

Praesentius
Posted - 2010.04.20 18:00:00 - [180]
 

Originally by: Xtover
Originally by: Gil Danastre
I think part of it is that there's only so much to add. Back when EVE launched there were no cap ships, tech 2, etc. So it was easy to add in gaps. Now though we have ships for nearly every role, so adding in new ones is a lot harder.

Though I would have liked the ship revamp to be more than ONE ship. One down, 52+ to go!


Check this out:

Hey players, for Tyrannis we've added in many new and exciting features, and here they are, patch notes style!


Arrow Introducing Planetary Interaction, where anyone can harvest resources from a planet, including POS fuel which can not only provide another source of income but also make soverign space even more independent!

Arrow We've had to reduce the system size to help combat lag, and since beyond 20AU (originally was to be 10AU but that was just stupid) is not warpable, we decided to make an exception of deep space probes.. you can scan out deep anomolies (just not bookmark them) that include a new feature:

Arrow fleet graveyards! a new salvage opportunity when you discover the ghostly remains of an aincent fleet battle. Who knows what wonders you will find?

Arrow Supercapital Anchors, miss flying those assault frigates because you've been trapped in an undockable supercap? Now, you can anchor (if you have roles) your supercapital and even set a password to board the ship. Be careful though, because the ship can be unanchored if someone has roles to do so (starbase config) or if the POS is put into reinforced!

Arrow speaking of assault ships, we have provided a 5th bonusto each ship, making them a formidible class of ship yet again

Arrow rockets have been tweaked to do damage on par with other light weapons

Arrow We've brought back the old cynosural jump effect, due to very popular demand!

Arrow destroyers have been modified to be escort ships for large fleets, with increased PG, tracking, and a slight HP buff

Arrow agression timers on station have been modified according to the mass of the ship, the larger the ship the longer after the last shot fired will the station wait for things to cool down. So if you undock to fight your enemy be prepared to be in the fight to the finish!

Arrow a few exploits and bugs have been removed making eve a better place. a list of fixed bugs/exploits can be found HERE


OMG! This^^^^^^^^^^^^!!!
One of the best posts to ever grace this forum.


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