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Siiee
Recycled Heroes
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:18:00 - [361]
 

Edited by: Siiee on 13/04/2010 13:18:41
Originally by: Schmell
Edited by: Schmell on 13/04/2010 13:15:22
Quote:
If you have characters in ships outside this distance, the ship will be destroyed and your capsule will be returned to the station that your clone is set to.


Personally i dont care of this changes, but i see some inconsistence in CCP statements.

Several months ago, CCP were asked (by Aralis) about possibility of outpost destruction. Answer was like:"no way, no plans, because we dont know what to do with logged off players and their stuff"

Good to see, you dont hesitate there. Way to go ccp Laughing


QFT

Mega Docent
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:20:00 - [362]
 

Good devblog. Good idea. I love CCP. =)

Volarus II
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:21:00 - [363]
 

wtf ... Evil or Very Mad

Why are u killing deep space spots?
Why are u killing the possibilities to make 'em?
Whom to they hurt?

Since when is there a limit in space? Stop reading bad science fiction books.

Empress Aurora
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:21:00 - [364]
 

I for one welcome the new 'room-like' solar systems and new pseudo-infinite universe. Crying or Very sad



Inexorably we are pulled...

Bring on the instancing!



A short haiuku:

Spaceship in a room
How can there be walls in space
I am a bit sad

Numerius Valerius
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:23:00 - [365]
 

Originally by: Kayleigh Lothian
Ok, so first of, as many have already said, this will make a president for when CCP kills the T2 BPOs. (haves and have-nots)


As many of you know, president Ttwobpo's term ended abruptly when the now infamous CCP killed it.

I would like now to introduce you to the new president, welcome President Deep Safespot.

(all stand and clap)

greeny knight
Amarr
Solar Storm
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:24:00 - [366]
 

why the hell i traind my but off to use deep scan probes , 10 au is just so rediculus 256 wold be the proper distance alloud to get a deep ss , ccp can't controle the lagg on big fleetfights so they make the space smaller , first they should look into the permacloackers and put a mechanic in that the cloack overheat and they need to decloack for 5 min to disperce of the heat , i see a boom in the selling of cloackin devices , man this is so rediculus for words.

Freyya
Advanced Planetary Exports
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:29:00 - [367]
 


JasonKuehn
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:49:00 - [368]
 

With most dev blog proposals, whether I agree or not, I can at least empathize with both sides of the debate.

Not this one. This is just ******ed. Fix unprobeable ships, fix grid load, fix constant disconnects in laggy system, fix DC ganking. THEN, maybe you can think about dealing with deep safes.

You can't just trash game bug work-arounds without fixing the bugs that necessitate the work-around!

Elvenlord, I hope you and the CSM can help out with this. I can't see why anyone who really understands the 0.0 game would support this change.


Athalwolf
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2010.04.13 13:57:00 - [369]
 

wtf, devs really need to sit down, look around and put back pieces of their brains who have clearly fallen out of their heads.

That you guys would consider even wasting one second of precious dev time on this non-issue makes me completely emorage inside, especially when there are probably a million more important things to fix, grid loading issues anyone?

Just on a side note, why create a big "open" SPACE game which constricts you to using "freeways" and invisble walls which tells you here but no further, the graphics might show you a spaceship when in fact you are in a pickup truck.

Wake up ffs!

Monster Dude
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:06:00 - [370]
 

Originally by: CCP Lemur
Dear players, the blog was published after I left the office and I just finished reading through all 11 pages.

This man posted a picture explaining all of the "but what with spots between two celestials?" concerns.

More changes are in discussion right now and I'll let you know as soon as we reached a decision.


I believe most of players understood the concept even without nice pictue. Thx for it anyway.
Most players trying to say that whole concept is way too wrong to be true!
Instead of making deep space easier available you ban it.
Why should it be easier available? - Because with it players solve problems that you guys gave us. So actually help us to help you! Better return functionality of deep space probes.
----
And that will cause no "unfair" element to anyone. BTW current way of getting you deep safe is aparently ok with players, at least keep it. Once again they WORKING to get it to solve your problems.
----
There been nice reminder - if you want to remove something unfair from game remove t2 BPO or make them inventable (e.g. from t1 BPO) That bring piece to the game. I assume this issue is ignored because many of t2 BPO holders are mmm having hand on control what to change and what not. And they are comfortable with that they have something unique that makes them financial kings.
----
How about reimbursing all loses that happened due to NOT LOADED GRID? Or is it fair to lose ships like that? (I'm not even saying about lost fleets that partually loaded and failed because expected fire power didn't endup in the system - that would be too much)
----
BTW would be fair again to return skillpoints put into useless deep probes.
----
And once again back to the subject.
Being on deep safe you are not 100% safe! You may have filthy feeling of safeness but with distant efforts your enemy may find you! And then you broke. So what is wrong to keep deep safe in game?
If you claim it is too hard to find one on deep safe - solution is simple DOUBLE THE RANGE OF DEEP PROBES!!! That will make them useful again! And everyone is HAPPY!

----
Last question:
Did CCP apply to NASA with demand to destroy Pioner satelite (hope i remember satelite name correct) that is now beoyng our solar system? Ask then to self distruct it, or move back :P Cause it does something unfair.

Trebor Daehdoow
Gallente
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:09:00 - [371]
 

It seems fairly obvious that this change is a lag band-aid. Here's why:

* Deep safes permit blobs to get into systems that are already blobbed, increasing the blobbage.

* The change makes bridging into a blobbed system suicidal.

* Therefore, players will adjust their tactics, you won't see 500+ player fleets bridging into blobbed systems, and the lag is tamed at least temporarily.

The strategic consequences, at first glance, are that if you're willing to tie up 500+ players 24/7, you can make a system close to invulnerable. However, though the castle is invulnerable, the Huns can pillage the countryside with impunity -- and if you leave the castle to chase them, they can now risk cynoing in a blob, which means they're on the inside of the castle looking out, and you're on the outside looking in.

As I said, this is just a band-aid. The blunt reality is that "Fleets expand to fit the lag available". Lag is not going to go away until there are game-design and game-play changes that make blobs a bad tactical option.

As for the "podding your ass if you are at a deep safe", that's a classic red-herring proposal. It isn't going to be implemented. Moving stuff is much easier to implement, and won't it be fun if they move not just the player's ships but all the deepsafed cans and empty ships.


GS Armada
Caldari
Dark-Rising
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:18:00 - [372]
 

Edited by: GS Armada on 13/04/2010 14:25:22
im so sorry that ccp again thinks they are smart again this is total bull**** does this also meen you wont be able to make safe spots between gates that have nothing nearby for more then 10 au.

and yes i got hundreds of those safe spots all over eve mabey even more it just sucks wy dont you guys ad ccp first think about it and then think about it again before even doing something.


SPACE DOES NOT STOP AD 10 AU IT HAS NO BOUNDRY.

Nyu Shin
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:19:00 - [373]
 

CCP: we cannot fix the game so at least let's do something and call it a fix.

fail

Serpents smile
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:22:00 - [374]
 

Guys, lets stay constructive. Calling CCP names won't help. Smile
I'm sure they're trying to find away around it, now.
Lets just brainstorm here and see if we can help find a way together where we end up all being (somewhat) happy in the end.

It is somewhat ironical. Here we are, lots of us yelling at CCP to fix their bugs instead of doing A,B or C, now they are about to fix what they see as a bug-> being able to get off grid and bookmark said spot and we're once again in their hair, but now saying wtf, don't fix this bug, it's a feature! Laughing

Also the nature of EVE is that some of its features hang on together from existing bugs. If they remove one bug another crops up or breaks this or that, which worked properly before they fixed the bug.


Note: I, in no way, condone the way the blog deals with players assets after the wall has brought up, i.o.w. destroy their stuff if its outside the 10 AU border.

CEOcat
Gallente
CAT Corp
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:26:00 - [375]
 

10 AU outside system is obviously way to short a distance.

In alot of systems you can cover that area with regular combat probes. Then there are the deep space probes making you perfectly scannable and no invulnerable at up to 200AU or so at least.

Right now doing anything about this at all is terrible. After you fix the lag issues I understand you might want to make a hard boundary somewhere though. But at least give us a few hundred AU to play with and implement an official method to make deep safes.

There could be special probes that you can warp to or something. Make it complicated and skill intensive though so people don't spam them everywhere. Maybe even a cap on bms you can have outside system if the deep safes really affect performance in some way.

You need to come up with an alternative for parking supercapital too.

Right now there is no other way to stash you supercap when you are taking a break. You need to chance the logging mechanics so it is more difficult to make login/logout traps for supercaps if you wanna do this chance.
That however will most likely cause problems with exploiting logoffs in battle..

Leave this as it is for now cause it ain't broken. Once you have thought about it long and hard present a better solution..

fixmer
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:29:00 - [376]
 

Originally by: PwrPuffGirl
Originally by: Lucian James
Thanks CCP!

Thank you SO MUCH for ignoring the problems you've created and do not fix which causes us to use these deep safes to begin with!

Thank you SO MUCH for ignoring your user community that uses these safes.

Thank you SO MUCH for all the lag and grid load problems to the point where we can no longer enter a system with a large fleet in lag else the entire entering fleet be destroyed without ever activating a module, loading grid OR any means of compensation for your complete inability to handle heavy loads!
"I'm sorry, but our server logs don't point out how badly we've handled our server load capacity and we're not going to refund your loss as a result."

Thank you SO MUCH for being so blatantly aweful in understanding basic customer service that you would destroy any ships including supercaps who don't read your worthless blogs and will lose billions in isk to your petty, selfish desires.

Thank you SO MUCH for devoting another big game expansion to garbage we don't need instead of fixing all the problems that exist in game.

Thank you SO MUCH for your continued arrogance and cruelty.

I sincerely hope that anyone who loses a SC to your wreckless selfishness will sue you in open court.




I have to agree with my Alliance mate here. Way to go CCP. Just another F-up, more problems less solutions.




this!

Silverlinings
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:30:00 - [377]
 

Originally by: Serpents smile
Guys, lets stay constructive. Calling CCP names won't help. Smile

It is somewhat ironical. Here we are, lots of us yelling at CCP to fix their bugs instead of doing A,B or C, now they are about to fix what they see as a bug-> being able to get off grid and bookmark said spot and we're once again in their hair, but now saying wtf, don't fix this bug, it's a feature! Laughing



Its also somewhat ironical that the things we do not whine about get fixed, and the things we whine about a lot, get the shhh button.

I know some ppl love whining, and some dont. I usualy dont bother, unless someone comes up with "a workaround for lag that gets nerfed instaid of the lag itsself" I am so sorry, that my puny little peanut brain can not cope with Digital Illusions like that. Sory, just frustrating to pay for a priority list that a custoumer doesnt agree with...

TheBlueMonkey
Gallente
Fags R Us
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:33:00 - [378]
 

Can I have all the safespaced stuff?

ElvenLord
4S Corporation
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:33:00 - [379]
 

Originally by: JasonKuehn
You can't just trash game bug work-arounds without fixing the bugs that necessitate the work-around!


exactly

Originally by: JasonKuehn
Elvenlord, I hope you and the CSM can help out with this. I can't see why anyone who really understands the 0.0 game would support this change.


We are trying. Official mail has been send to CCP by CSM yesterday. Hopefully they wont ignore it like they did the discussion we had during summit.

Originally by: Serpents smile
Calling CCP names won't help.


Calling someone intellectually challenged in this case is just stating the obvious Razz

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see
Chained Reactions
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:36:00 - [380]
 


BeanBagKing
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:40:00 - [381]
 

Originally by: CCP Lemur
Dear players, the blog was published after I left the office and I just finished reading through all 11 pages.

This man posted a picture explaining all of the "but what with spots between two celestials?" concerns.

More changes are in discussion right now and I'll let you know as soon as we reached a decision.


Confirming that I understood this correctly from the beginning and still think this is a horrible idea.

Putting walls on space removes the sandbox, and putting 10AU walls on space removes any reason to train for deep space probes.

Catari Taga
Centre Of Attention
Middle of Nowhere
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:41:00 - [382]
 

Edited by: Catari Taga on 13/04/2010 14:43:13
nvm

Xtover
Suicide Kings
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:44:00 - [383]
 

So, with the current fixes for:

LAG
Assault frigs
Dual prop ships
Hybrids
LOLrockets

And suggested changes of

Sov
POSs
T2 destroyers
Capital Cyno effect


You decide the most pressing issue right now is a need to put invisible walls in space?

Elzon1
Caldari
Shadow Boys Corp
Bloodbound.
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:44:00 - [384]
 

Edited by: Elzon1 on 13/04/2010 14:46:09
Remeber everyone... this is all due to a bug. In no way is this a game mechanic, it is an exploit. All the exploit users should be happy CCP is giving them some time to recover their assets. They could have just banned those who had such bookmarks.

It was nice of them to give you a warning, wasn't it? Very Happy

Edit: spelling Laughing

Htrag
The Carebear Stare
Hydroponic Zone
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:45:00 - [385]
 

10 measly AU?

Weak.

Space Wanderer
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:53:00 - [386]
 


I am not against removing deep safes.

However... what's the point of having astrometrics at 5, now? The point of deep space probes?

So, why not adopting a looser range, like a 200AU from celestialsor something of that kind? This still gives meaning to the deep space probes, but does not allow the existance of super safes.

Or if you don't feel like it just bump combat probes prereqs at astrometrics 5. Or introduce t2 probes. Or just give SOME meaning to those who max out the skill.

Lucian Stratos
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:53:00 - [387]
 

After a long thought it has been decided that this new 'fix' from CCP is worse than JedwardShockedShockedShockedShocked

Berzerkergang
Caldari
Heretic Academy
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:54:00 - [388]
 

It's too bad everyone is crying again about fixes in-game that have nothing to do with this topic. CCP is banning out an exploit, good for them, makes the game harder but requires players to actually think and do their best to actually get something done in-game, instead of just using this exploit.

My oppinion? I have never used safespots sofar in deepspace. Cloaking and using my head while in space and planning out stuff in advance works fine to my oppinion.

Would love to see the list of stuff that gets destroyed during the sweep.
*grabs popcorn for emorage below*

Pbs
Pumpkin Scissors
Evi1 Empire
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:54:00 - [389]
 

I have several question about "clean sweep":
- If you destroy (by accident) all ships in sysetem - they will be returned after petition or your logs will show nothing?
- Selling all ship and stuff - this is good idea? Or wallet can be deleted during this "clean sweep" too?
- Is there some way to protect our stuff? Make screenshots? Or send to GM list of most valuable stuff? Which category i should use? You can guarantee that all stuff from list will be returned after patch deploying?

Gunnanmon
Gallente
PURPLE.
Posted - 2010.04.13 14:55:00 - [390]
 

ibtl


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