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Tyrone Bighams
Gallente
Tactical Command Sector
Posted - 2010.04.05 21:47:00 - [1]
 

Gallente


Personally, I feel that the training I put in to fly Gallente the way they were originally intended to be flown has been wasted.

A lack of attention to the problem of Gallente functionality in the wider world of EVE must have been felt keenly by players with big Gallente skillpoint groupings. Sound off. Make CCP hear your pain so they'll boost the unboostable race Wink


Reldor Silverheart
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.05 21:53:00 - [2]
 

Please explain why you think gallente sucks, i'm fairly new but i fly gallente. I like them alot because it offers a nice niche, good looking ships and good to decent combat systems. They do require heavier skill investemnts than otehrs tho. But still i'm interested to hear why you think gallente sucks.

Tyrone Bighams
Gallente
Tactical Command Sector
Posted - 2010.04.05 22:04:00 - [3]
 

An excellent question, and one that most likely cant be fully answered in a hundred forum posts.

fortunately, heading on over to ships and modules to see the massive hue and outcry against a painfully nerfed gallente groupof players, and youll find out why.

and i loved gallente to death when i first started playing them too. they have a charming quality about them, and i wished they worked right. i wish they had functional weapons. i wish they had a tanking style that dosent make them slow as dirt when all they need is speed. i wish they didn't have to rely on webs, which were nerfed as well. i wish lots of things.

find out more in S&M


Reldor Silverheart
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.05 22:17:00 - [4]
 

I can agree that the weapons doesn't allways work perfectly or are as good as matar or amarr in some aspects. True the ships are slow. But on the other hand, unlike say caldari which has to spend mid slots to fit for tanking gallente uses the lowslots instead allowing for plenty of options on that department.

Theese options are
MWD's/Ab's - keep in mind many ships have bonuses for theese, at least for MWD which in a sense nullifies the slowness, and let's be straight, you fit MWD's to all gallente blasterboats.
Web's - never played before the nerf, but they are still very useful
Warp scram/disr - this allows for gallente ships being nice tacklers

I probably missed a few things here aswell, as far as ships go gallente get's the two main niches, droneboats and blasterboats, some are mixed tho. And to be honest both theese do great, droneboats are easier to use, i play mostly blasterboats in pvp tho and i do enjoy it alo, it's abit of a challenge to learn how to get around with it tho. Also, why i don't like the domi bandwagon, it is a great pvp boat for RR and support.

The flaw i can see to gallente is the poor powergrid blasterboats do get and as you say the innate slowness is a downside, but that one can be countered with MWD's. While i do love blasters they could use some help, but even if i'm new i've noticed many people don't learn the blaster properly.

I'll expand on this point, blasters are great and you don't need to orbit at 500 metres around the target to deal ideal damage. For blasters i use the tactical overlay and i love it. Because it does help me see at what range i actually need to orbit to still deal good enough damage. Rails are meh, artillery seems better i agree, but rails are mostly pve either way and most often used on droneboats to draw aggro.

While gallente does have it's downsides, it's also got it's strenghts.


Mashie Saldana
Minmatar
Veto Corp
Posted - 2010.04.05 23:48:00 - [5]
 

My Gallente char is totally upset now that she can't take on three other ships with the same hull size and win.

Oh and un-nurf the Eos now.

Cunane
Posted - 2010.04.06 00:36:00 - [6]
 

Are Gallente bad? No.
Are Gallente bad when compared to Amarr, Caldari and Minmatar? Yes.

The way I see it, when used right, Gallente can do anything the other three can, blasters while taking some pratice to get the hang of, are truely face-meltingly fierce, and Drones are useful in whatever flavour you pick, (though since Sleepers appeared and decided that drones make a nice snack, and players worked out that when fighting Gallente, maybe shooting the drones first is a good idea they have gone downhill)
Railguns are middle of the road, but work well in PvE but Gallente boats are also tight on grid when going for the guns.
They can also tank damn well and make amazing support in the form of the domi, or even a vexor for smaller cheaper PvE.

The main problem is that Amarr can tank better, and lasers are fantastic, Minmatar since the projectile boost have been a solid all round choice (but still take a metric ton of skill training) and Caldari is just PvE king of the hill.

Kalanar
Wrecking Shots
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2010.04.06 00:41:00 - [7]
 

While it is true that there is a definite degree of up and down for the balance of classes, and I would agree that, having a Gallente alt, they have been recently underpowered, I think that compared to many other MMOs, the class and ship balancing is quite good in EVE. I'm sure that, given the nature of the intense development and constant change in EVE, Gallente will soon be back to even.

However, if you can provide statistical proof based on SiSi experimentation, you could probably make a case for getting things changed via CSM faster than normal development would.

foksieloy
Minmatar
Rockets ponies and rainbows
Posted - 2010.04.06 09:48:00 - [8]
 

Who Feels Somewhat Angry Now That OP Sucks?

Nothing sucks in EvE except some players. And that they can fix on their own.

Gneeznow
Minmatar
Ship spinners inc
Posted - 2010.04.06 09:52:00 - [9]
 

just put your blaster skills to good and fly a blaster ferox

da dumm *tiss*

DXYOC
Posted - 2010.04.06 10:08:00 - [10]
 

I agree , Hyrbids need some fixing and some ship bonuses too.

Nina Treml
Posted - 2010.04.06 10:25:00 - [11]
 

I only fly gallente, through the years i specialized in this race, from frigates to carriers, from interceptors to command ships, everything is maxed, but i notice that a way less skilled char can do a lot better with cheap, badly fitted and badly skilled ships. I cannot see how this is fair.

Charles Park
Posted - 2010.04.06 11:19:00 - [12]
 

The problem of course is back in the day (early 2007 at least) Gallente were THE 'pwn' race of eve. Myrm's fielding 5 Ogre II's, instant drone shield repair when they were brought back the drone bay, un-nerfed damps (no scripts yet), and of course pre-speed nerf speeds and webs made blasters king. Gallente were definately overpowered and needed adjustment, but has the nerf bat swung too hard? I don't know, to be honest. I will say that the ships with damp bonuses need to be boosted a bit. Besides that and a fix for blasters I think gallente are fine though.

Nina Treml
Posted - 2010.04.06 11:49:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Charles Park
The problem of course is back in the day (early 2007 at least) Gallente were THE 'pwn' race of eve. Myrm's fielding 5 Ogre II's, instant drone shield repair when they were brought back the drone bay, un-nerfed damps (no scripts yet), and of course pre-speed nerf speeds and webs made blasters king. Gallente were definately overpowered and needed adjustment, but has the nerf bat swung too hard? I don't know, to be honest. I will say that the ships with damp bonuses need to be boosted a bit. Besides that and a fix for blasters I think gallente are fine though.


no, they are not my friend: other turrets track a lot better and have a huge range and falloff compared to blasters.
Yes, blasters have a higher dps, but it's kinda useless if you cannot get in range, it's too short, and web, being less effective, can't help as before.
Fixing blasters or fixing ships? I'd say ships, a lot of gallente ships have wrong bonuses, some are very useless, so fixing them would have 2 benefits: make gallente ships usefull again (not OP, but neither CRAP please) AND will not make blasters OP on caldari ships (with the range bonus on those ships, could be simply too much).

Venetta
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2010.04.06 12:15:00 - [14]
 

Every race has had its nerf in the past. Back in 2004/2005 Ravens were the be all and end all in PvP as were Tempests with their insane sniping. Two nerfs later and then it moved onto the Gallente instaganks...and so on and so on...

Reldor Silverheart
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.06 12:35:00 - [15]
 



no, they are not my friend: other turrets track a lot better and have a huge range and falloff compared to blasters.
Yes, blasters have a higher dps, but it's kinda useless if you cannot get in range, it's too short, and web, being less effective, can't help as before.
Fixing blasters or fixing ships? I'd say ships, a lot of gallente ships have wrong bonuses, some are very useless, so fixing them would have 2 benefits: make gallente ships usefull again (not OP, but neither CRAP please) AND will not make blasters OP on caldari ships (with the range bonus on those ships, could be simply too much).



Elaborate which bonuses are wrong and useless please, if you're saying the active armor rep bonus is useless or wrong i don't kmow what to say. It is not the best but it fits very well as far as gallente goes. On top of that gallente ships has enough capacitor to fit dual reppers on those ships designed for reppers. Many people complain about hype being hard to dual rep but looking around and tweaking it's even possible to get a massive tank out of that without gimping the dps to much. Drone bonuses are pretty much perfect for the droneboats.

True, blaster tracking is far from ideal and could use a boost, but for blasters you need to understand that ytou can't orbit at 500 o 1000 around the target. For blasters it's actually very useful to utilize the falloff as far as possible. But the main thing i and many others think about what gallente ships need, at least some of them is more speed and a larger powergrid. And that would do much without making them overpowered.

Yarinor
Capital Construction Research
Pioneer Alliance
Posted - 2010.04.06 12:37:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Nina Treml
I only fly gallente, through the years i specialized in this race, from frigates to carriers, from interceptors to command ships, everything is maxed, but i notice that a way less skilled char can do a lot better with cheap, badly fitted and badly skilled ships. I cannot see how this is fair.


Crosstrain then, it's only 4 months or so to get Large T2 guns and Frig, Cruiser, BS V.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2010.04.06 12:48:00 - [17]
 

Ok, yes, Gallente are rather sad, but what the hell is with the blaster tracking comments?

I mean, what do you people do with your ships? If you're experiencing tracking issues firing on same sized hulls, then you're simply put doing something wrong.

Are you hitting orbit at 500m with MWD on? Please help me understand what it is you do to make blasters miss as much as they allegedly do.

Nina Treml
Posted - 2010.04.06 13:12:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Yarinor
it's only 4 months or so to get Large T2 guns and Frig, Cruiser, BS V.


are you kidding me?
years of training and specializing, just to get to this point where i need to crosstrain to be at least as effective as a new char with just few months of training?

NoLimit Soldier
Posted - 2010.04.06 13:51:00 - [19]
 

I am kinda new so bear with me, but what (besides blasters) sucks about the Gallente?

It is my understanding that they have some amazing drone boats.

Ishtar,Ishkur, hell even the Vexor are debated as being the best in their class.

Maybe you picked the wrong race for the type of flying you do. I did something similar as I prefer to be in your face damage but went caldari. All I have is the torp raven that fills this role, otherwise I play them as they are supposed to be played (Fleet Support).

**I'm still kinda new so take everything I Just said with a grain of salt.

Mona X
Caldari
Missions Mining and Mayhem
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2010.04.06 14:53:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Mona X on 06/04/2010 14:54:13
Originally by: Reldor Silverheart
But still i'm interested to hear why you think gallente sucks.



It's catch 22: Gallente have very powerful, but very short range guns or very weak, but very long range guns. Now, in order to use their powerful, yet short range guns, they have to close to the enemy. And while doing this, the enemy have few free shots at Gallente ships. Now, to offset this, the must fit tank, that will let them survive both the closing nad raeping phase. To do this they fit armor tank which slows them (which gives enemy some aditional free shots), possibility to outmanu... outmaneur... outmaver... sit further than 11-13km from Gallente ship (forcing him waste to much capacitor on MWD or to overheat his tackling equipment and hopefully burn his middle slots) or time to GTFO entiely.

DXYOC
Posted - 2010.04.06 15:32:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko
Ok, yes, Gallente are rather sad, but what the hell is with the blaster tracking comments?

I mean, what do you people do with your ships? If you're experiencing tracking issues firing on same sized hulls, then you're simply put doing something wrong.

Are you hitting orbit at 500m with MWD on? Please help me understand what it is you do to make blasters miss as much as they allegedly do.


Why do AC's have the same or even better tracking than blasters?AC's have a higher range.
Run some DPS graphs and you will see why they need a tracking boost.

Ran Khanon
Amarr
Swords Horses and Heavy Metal
Posted - 2010.04.06 15:51:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Mona X
possibility to outmanu... outmaneur... outmaver... sit further than 11-13km from Gallente ship


:D

That was cute.

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2010.04.06 21:40:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: DXYOC
Originally by: Cpt Branko
Ok, yes, Gallente are rather sad, but what the hell is with the blaster tracking comments?

I mean, what do you people do with your ships? If you're experiencing tracking issues firing on same sized hulls, then you're simply put doing something wrong.

Are you hitting orbit at 500m with MWD on? Please help me understand what it is you do to make blasters miss as much as they allegedly do.


Why do AC's have the same or even better tracking than blasters?AC's have a higher range.
Run some DPS graphs and you will see why they need a tracking boost.


Generally because they've got the same optimal (or less actually), although it's rather true that most people don't use them in optimal but somewhere in falloff.

However. Sure, it would not hurt Gallente to have somewhat better tracking, but it's not really the problem. Lack of substantial enough DPS advantage up close largely is.

The only time you should be having tracking issues is shooting smaller ships or on the initial approach. Or if you're just doing something idiotic with your ship.

I remember using old Hail just fine with 60% webs on old 425s and the thing had about a bit above half the range and half the tracking of neutrons, and then someone comes and tells me he can't track with CN AM.


Jotobar
Posted - 2010.04.07 00:44:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Jotobar on 07/04/2010 00:44:38
Originally by: Nina Treml
Originally by: Yarinor
it's only 4 months or so to get Large T2 guns and Frig, Cruiser, BS V.


are you kidding me?
years of training and specializing, just to get to this point where i need to crosstrain to be at least as effective as a new char with just few months of training?


The gunnery support skills are shared, all your armor skills are shared, all your support skills are shared, you have it easy. It's not that far fetched..

/55mil pure caldari, 40days until t2 large lazor.

Grayclay
Caldari
The Arrow Project
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.04.07 05:26:00 - [25]
 

At least you didn't start the game as Caldari. Thats a bigger setback than specializing in Gallente will ever be.

Have you ever heard any of the following?
-Caldari ROCK at PvP man! I solo in my Drake all the time!
-Dude, I'm so glad I rolled Caldari, their capital ships are amazing.
-Thank GOD I have a shield tank!

No.

Nico Terces
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.07 08:22:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Nico Terces on 07/04/2010 08:25:58
Gallente doesnt "Suck balls", it just has some faults at the moment.

First of all, the local armorrepair bonus of 7.5% is simply inferior to the resistance bonusses that some amarr ships get. I think there were some threads going around suggesting to change the 7.5% armor bonus to 10%.

Furthermore blasters either lack range or tracking. They can't hit well up close, but they can't reach very far either. This used to be okay when webs slowed for 90%, but as this isnt the case, blasters need some extra tracking or an increase in optimal.

Next up is railguns. Being the longrange guns they are, they don't do a lot of damage. I think there was also a thread up on this system, asking for a small increase in base damage, and change their tech 2 ammunition. I'd also like to see the hardwired max targeting cap of 250km removed or changed to 1000 km. This would improve some of the sniper-setups as well. Furthermore powergrid seems to be an issue for some ships in terms of fitting their (intended?) role.

One of the last problems is speed. Because you have to be in range to shoot with blasters, you have to be able to take a few hits to get up close. The problem is that your tank suffers from speed and visa-versa. If you don't tank you won't make it to your target as you'll die. If you tank, you simply won't make it to your target. In fleet warfare this isn't that much of an issue as you'll probably just die while approaching your target, regardless of speed or tank. (However, IF you play well and coordinated with a few fellows, blasters can be really devastating!)

My Postman
Posted - 2010.04.07 12:37:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Reldor Silverheart
Please explain why you think gallente sucks, i'm fairly new but i fly gallente. I like them alot because it offers a nice niche, good looking ships and good to decent combat systems. They do require heavier skill investemnts than otehrs tho. But still i'm interested to hear why you think gallente sucks.


Blasters - They only do damage when you stick them up somebodys a**.
Rails - More range - no damage.
Wormholes - Try a droneboat in a wormhole, sleepers "love" drones.
CPU - Gallente boats are tricky on cpu.
CPU - Armortankers need CPU
CPU - Blasters and Rails need CPU
CPU and Powergrid - Plates need A LOT.
CCP - hates gallente.

My main is gallente. I know what im talking about.

Hope it helps.

Reldor Silverheart
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.07 13:16:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: My Postman
Originally by: Reldor Silverheart
Please explain why you think gallente sucks, i'm fairly new but i fly gallente. I like them alot because it offers a nice niche, good looking ships and good to decent combat systems. They do require heavier skill investemnts than otehrs tho. But still i'm interested to hear why you think gallente sucks.


Blasters - They only do damage when you stick them up somebodys a**.
Rails - More range - no damage.
Wormholes - Try a droneboat in a wormhole, sleepers "love" drones.
CPU - Gallente boats are tricky on cpu. - wrong, they are tricky on powergrid on the other hand
CPU - Armortankers need CPU - wrong again - armor tanking such as reppers/plates eat alot of powergrid. Large reppers take 2000 or 2300 grid i think. Thye are low on the cpu cost on teh other hand.
CPU - Blasters and Rails need CPU - Also wrong, blasters and rails are ridicously grid heavy, which is the main issue.
CPU and Powergrid - Plates need A LOT. - CPU, no, powergrid yes. IIRC shield are cpu heavy why a domi fits shields instead of armor when it wants to pew pew.
CCP - hates gallente.

My main is gallente. I know what im talking about.

Hope it helps.


Cpu? i've only flown gallente for a month and a half, and i've not had cpu issues with with my gallente yet? youtrying to fit shields and armor tankign at the same time or something? Heck i even have plenty of cpu left when i have evrything fit. Had you said Powergrid i'd agreed. Gallente ships are low on powergrid, at leaat blasterboats and could use some help there. But CPU, no bloody way.

Again, the issue for gallente is the powergrid and the speed of the blasterboats in my experience, and the repping bonus could use some help aswell i admit.

I may be new but this is what i have found out so far, and CCP hates gallente? Well that's your personal opinion.

Nico Terces
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.07 14:02:00 - [29]
 

Start fitting shieldtanks or trackingcomputers, and you'll understand where the CPU problems come from.

Reldor Silverheart
Gallente
Posted - 2010.04.07 14:13:00 - [30]
 

Gallente isn't meant to shieldtank thos by design, thereby the CPU on teh ships. And frankly how many gallente ships do you actually shield tank as gallente? myrm, domi, any i am missing but those are the main i think.

When it comes to design gallente is nicely designed when it comes to armor tanking, if you want CPU heavy ships i'd roll caldari, they got the CPU to shield tank, and they got the mid slots for it aswell. Not neglecting that gallente can't shield tank but that's not what they are designed for.

Tracking computers on the other hand i can understand and makes a more valid point, but the main issue is not cpu for gallente, it's in the powergrid and the speed.


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