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Anaxis Muntaine
Caldari
Blue Republic
Posted - 2010.03.28 14:06:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Anaxis Muntaine on 28/03/2010 20:09:35
When writing fiction for EVE, I've found that my settings really come alive if I can make them as gritty and realistic as possible. I think EVE lends itself well to writing not about the sterile and clean environments we find in much of 2001: A Space Odyssey, or Star Wars (yes, with exceptions such as Mos Eisley, etc.) or other sci fi universes. Certainly, there is equal room at the table for the sterile environments (being a massive fictional universe, there's plenty of room for everything!), but I personally enjoy those environments that are dank, dark, and dystopian.

Anyway, I wanted to recommend some sci-fi movies that are set in just such environments, and hopefully some of you writers can also suggest some films that fit into this genre?

Blade Runner (this being the ultimate, in my opinion, for showing the darker side of life in the future), Outland (an oft overlooked film - though I think it's great for showing an industrial working/mining colony), the Alien trilogy, The Fifth Element (though, yes, it's a bit corny), Soylent Green, Escape from New York, Dark City, the Matrix Trilogy, Pandorum, Serenity (to some extent), District 9 (though perhaps not far enough into the future) and Screamers/Screamers 2. Now, before you comment about how bad some of these movies might be, please remember that I'm not offering them as brilliant sci-fi - rather, I'm just suggesting that they are worth watching for their use of gritty and unromantic settings.

Does anyone have any films they can recommend for this type of film?

Cheers
Tom

Red Arzender
Caldari
Posted - 2010.03.28 14:36:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Red Arzender on 28/03/2010 14:39:28
If you don't mind humour and parody, watch Star Wreck.

For "serious" movies I'd recommend Das Boot. It's not science fiction, but in my opinion it hits you like a an iron bar trough your head for its atmosphere. But for sci-fi I'd just recommend Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow, Dune and Starship Troopers.

And if you're okay with Japanese animations, you should watch The Legend of the Galactic Heroes movies and/or the series.


Akikio Lankinen
Caldari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.03.28 16:53:00 - [3]
 

Space: Above and Beyond, not a movie but I feel you can draw some parallels with the EVE world, specifically Caldari background. For example the tube child program in Caldari State and the "tanks" in S:AAB. Smile

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.03.28 17:23:00 - [4]
 

It has to be your cup of tea, and it may not be as realistic as some of the other sci-fi out there. But I'm a big fan of the Warhammer 40K universe. You can't go any grittier than that. There are no movies, but there are plenty of books set in it.

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2010.03.28 17:38:00 - [5]
 

Babylon 5 should always be mentioned in that list. There story has some light-hearted humour but also several dark story arcs and episodes. Especially from season 2-4.

Elaine Shandrate
Posted - 2010.03.29 13:44:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Elaine Shandrate on 29/03/2010 13:44:57
Any book by Isaac Asimov seems to be gritty. I'd love to see something like the political war of the 50 planets against Earth. And the 'racism' coming with that...

But then again, not many were filmed (yes, Bicentennial Man... AI and I, Robot were just 'set' in an similar universe. Don't know any others.)

Edit: i completely agree with S:AAB Cool

Sinjin Mokk
Stillwater Corporation
Posted - 2010.03.29 14:10:00 - [7]
 

Agreed to all and especially the last two. Bablyon 5 has a lot of similarities with the EVE universe. The new Battlestar Galactica has some good points, so does an old BBC show called "Blake's Seven."

I can't say enough to recommend Asimov, especially the "Foundation" series. Ignore most of the cheesey movie and read Heinlein's "Starship Troopers" (you'll see where Cameron gets his ideas from if you read Heinlein closely).

A "dark" series of books that dovetails very nicely into the EVE universe is Stephen R. Donaldson's "Gap" series. But be warned, those books are not for the faint of heart.


Rosenoern
Posted - 2010.03.31 01:12:00 - [8]
 

Well if you say "Bladerunner" you have to say "Soldier" since they are set in the same universe...

Other than that i think "Terminator" counts and "Cronicles of riddick"/"Pitch Black" have elements of dark sci-fi too.

I don't know if anime counts but "Ghost in the Shell" definitely deserves a mention. That thing simply reeks of cyberpunk.

I know the "Judge Dredd" movie sucked compared to the comic but wth... Let's get it up here anyway. I already posted "Soldier" ffs :)

"Avatar" would also fit well if we had seen it from the humans side and "12 Monkeys" deserves an honorable mention for being gritty as ****. Even though you don't see much of the future world.

Instead of posting all of these i could of course just make a link and be done with it :/

Some of those aren't futuristic/dystopian as we like them though.


Sinjin Mokk
Stillwater Corporation
Posted - 2010.03.31 14:43:00 - [9]
 

That's the problem with Wikipedia. It's always incomplete!

Great list, but they forgot to mention the movie "The Lathe of Heaven," based on the sory by Ursula K. LeGuinn.

Did we mention the short-lived TV series "Dark Angel" or the Robert Heinlein book "Friday" that was Cameron's inspiration?

Oh, and go read the Heinlein book "Time Enough For Love" if you haven't yet.

And Larry Niven's Ringworld.

And Herrison's "Man-Kzin War" series.

And the Stainless Steel Rat series.

And...



GregoriusAtlas
Posted - 2010.04.02 19:37:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
It has to be your cup of tea, and it may not be as realistic as some of the other sci-fi out there. But I'm a big fan of the Warhammer 40K universe. You can't go any grittier than that. There are no movies, but there are plenty of books set in it.


I fully agree . Nothing out there is as dark and yet as hopeful and defiant in the face of insurmountable odds then War 40 K . In other universes humanity finds itself on the brink of annihilation rarely and it is usually a big deal , in War 40 k has already gone through several dark ages and is on th brink of annihilation on a daily basis .

In W 40 k humanity is no pansy ass democratic union like " the Federation " from Star Trek but an Theocratic Empire that makes the Amarr Empire from Eve Universe seem like noble and generous .

Judge Dread would be an ordinary policeman in War 40 k .

Luke Skiwalker would quickly be branded a which and if not burned outright he would be sent as food to the Emperor of Mankind or if luckier be forced to spend his life sending messages across the galaxy eventually having his mind burn out or outright demonic possesion .

I could go on but there is no need , we need more people into War 40 k .

" All those called upon to bear armed who refuse to do so will be shot ! Emperor protects ! "

Autunite
Caldari
Firebird Squadron
Terra-Incognita
Posted - 2010.04.15 05:26:00 - [11]
 

I liked Niven/Pournelle The Mote in Gods Eye
I know ring world was already mentioned but I liked the other books in that series also
Ender's Game

thats all I can think of right now...

Chuck Sands
Posted - 2010.04.15 06:58:00 - [12]
 

Dune.

silentalleycat
Posted - 2010.04.15 07:04:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
It has to be your cup of tea, and it may not be as realistic as some of the other sci-fi out there. But I'm a big fan of the Warhammer 40K universe. You can't go any grittier than that. There are no movies, but there are plenty of books set in it.


Another one who agrees on this point, indeed there are no movies yet but plenty of novels,
Irecomend dan abnets ' Eisenhorn' trilogy, and from the same author the Gaunts ghost series, you can get lower then this in my opinion

Lt Forge
Pilots Of Honour
Aeternus.
Posted - 2010.04.15 10:01:00 - [14]
 

Event Horizon?

Melkath Bandrom
Posted - 2010.04.26 15:39:00 - [15]
 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzBFuRMCoLU

1992 - Split Second

Rutger Hauer and a very Sexy YOUNG Kim Cattrall! (who gets topless!! imagine THAT...lol)
Nice dark gritty dirty futuristic movie. Not the best made or directed but it certainly was gritty. Haven't seen it in 10 years cuz I can't find a DVD copy that dont cost $35US.

Sanjorel Artabanus
Posted - 2010.04.27 01:19:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Sanjorel Artabanus on 27/04/2010 01:19:58
I agree with those mentioned above; I'm not super-up on movies, but I read a lot, and would like to add the following books:

* Philip K. ****s' Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? (Blade Runner)
* Ursula K. LeGuin's The Dispossessed and The Lathe of Heaven - I personally love anything by her
* Anything by Isaac Asimov, especially Foundation series
* George Orwell's 1984
* Aldous Huxley's Brave New World
* Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 452
* Larry Niven's and Jerry Pournelle's Lucifer's Hammer
* Richard Matheson's I Am Legend
* P.D.James' Children of Men
* William Gibson's Neuromancer
* Although I haven't read it yet, I've heard that it is very dark: Yevgeny Zamyatin's We - I intend to read it too

Although not technically science fiction, I thought also that the following novels paint a gritty, stark landscape quite effectively:

* Cormac McCarthy's The Road
* Eric Norden's The Ultimate Solution
* Mark Lavorato's Veracity


Also - as horrible as this may sound - reading literature regarding especially the Holocaust and **** Germany, may be helpful. One book that I find particularly dark is The Anthology of Holocaust Literature, published by the Jewish Publication Society of America. It's full of short, true-life accounts and descriptions of life in and under the National Socialist government. The accounts are gritty and gruesome - not for the faint of heart - especially in view of the fact that the stories are true.

These are some movies that are also somewhat dark (mind you, I'm not up on movies):

* I Am Legend
* 28 Days Later
* 28 Weeks Later
* The Matrix Series

These are just some of my humble suggestions. I'm sure I've probably missed some that could have added; maybe someone else will get their memories jogged in order to add some more.

SA

Sanjorel Artabanus
Posted - 2010.04.27 01:30:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Sanjorel Artabanus

* Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 452


Sorry - that should be Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451

Damn keyboard and fat fingers. Lol.

SA

Rail J'kar
Posted - 2010.05.02 06:52:00 - [18]
 

You mentioned that Starwars wasn't gritty with the exception of Mos Eisley, I beg to differ. The only place it wasn't gritty were the scenes inside ships where you would expect it to be clean. That film was originally written and depicted as a dark and gritty "futuristic" universe, which was one of the reasons it stood out.

other movies of note:

Planet of the Apes
Battlefield Earth
Time Machine (i think that's the correct title)
the Alien movies (surprised no one else said this)
Predator (and sequels)
Resident Evil
Virus
Jurassic Park

I agree with many of the other movies people have mentioned, I was just trying to think of movies that hadn't been mentioned as of yet.

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2010.05.02 17:54:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Kyra Felann on 02/05/2010 17:55:00
Originally by: GregoriusAtlas
Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
It has to be your cup of tea, and it may not be as realistic as some of the other sci-fi out there. But I'm a big fan of the Warhammer 40K universe. You can't go any grittier than that. There are no movies, but there are plenty of books set in it.


I fully agree . Nothing out there is as dark and yet as hopeful and defiant in the face of insurmountable odds then War 40 K . In other universes humanity finds itself on the brink of annihilation rarely and it is usually a big deal , in War 40 k has already gone through several dark ages and is on th brink of annihilation on a daily basis.


Confirming that 40k is the darkest, grittiest setting in existence (that I know of). It's really fantasy in space rather than sci-fi, but for darkness, it takes the cake. In some settings, like EVE, everything is shades of gray--in 40k, everything is a shade of black.

Oh, and I'd second Pitch Black and Chronicles of riddick. They're pretty gritty.

Also, Blade Runner is probably my favorite movie ever.

Tyber Zenn
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.06.19 08:25:00 - [20]
 

I must agree with what has been said.

And of course W40k is defidently the darkest/grittiest sci-fi universe iv ever been into...and I have read alot of sci-fi. Heck, even the pansy Eldar could make some of the most corrupted vile scum of many other sci-fi worlds whimper in terror.....and they are just bloody space elves with one hell of an agenda!

Matah Hari
Posted - 2010.06.23 04:33:00 - [21]
 

Someone mentioned P.D.James' Children of Men book. There was a movie made from this book recently (2006) wich I believe is a modern day dystopian masterpiece by Alfonso Cuaron (Great Expectations, Pan's Labyrinth).

Citizen Yang
Posted - 2010.06.25 21:46:00 - [22]
 

Forever War by Joe Haldeman. The Human Wheel keeps turning...like a mandala, strangely.
The Parafaith War, Ethos Effect, and Forever Hero trilogy by L.E. Modesitt Jr., black versus white..or is it?
Snowcrash by Neal Stephenson, cyberpunk by any other name.
Berserker by Fred Saberhagen, gritty machine versus man battle for survival.
Andromeda Strain by Michael Crichton, can we kill IT before it kills all of us?


Allant Doran
Amarr
Locus Industries
Posted - 2010.06.27 15:41:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Lt Forge
Event Horizon?


Beat me to it, but yes i second this suggestion. It's a horror movie but at the same time really feels like they've treated the spaceships involved as 'Real things. You could see it happening one day as far as the technology is concerned.

Crewman Jenkins
Caldari
Malicious Demi-Lancers
Posted - 2010.06.27 16:48:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Crewman Jenkins on 27/06/2010 16:52:28
I know this is a films thread, but...

Since I just played Metro 2033 and I'm looking for the book, I'll put it in the ring. It's not very futuristic, but it's dark and spooky.

Some of the battletech books could be looked at.

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2010.06.27 17:55:00 - [25]
 

I personally dislike the Warhammer 40k universe, even if it is often quoted because, like others said, it is not Sci-Fi but fantasy in space.

While I accept some technological fantasies like warp drive for storytelling or gameplay reasons, I mostly enjoy Sci-Fi because of the questions they ask. Even EVE raises some questions, about transhumanism, clones, immortality, greed, powerr, corruption, comparisons between re-emerging civilisations and history and so on.

The beauty of EVE is, that it does all these things on a daily basis. There is so much more here then just spaceships and pew pew. ugh

Harima sama
Posted - 2010.06.28 08:14:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: silentalleycat
Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
It has to be your cup of tea, and it may not be as realistic as some of the other sci-fi out there. But I'm a big fan of the Warhammer 40K universe. You can't go any grittier than that. There are no movies, but there are plenty of books set in it.


Another one who agrees on this point, indeed there are no movies yet but plenty of novels,
Irecomend dan abnets ' Eisenhorn' trilogy, and from the same author the Gaunts ghost series, you can get lower then this in my opinion


I thought this as well, though it's now set to change sometime in the future:

http://ultramarinesthemovie.com/

<3 40k

Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
Posted - 2010.06.28 09:53:00 - [27]
 

How has no one mentioned David Brin's Earthclan series?
Or LeGuin's The Dispossessed?

How? HOW?

Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
Posted - 2010.06.28 10:11:00 - [28]
 

Oh, and another thing, all science fiction is a fantasy, so the fact that 40k is a space fantasy is of little import. It is teh grimdarks, that's what's important.

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2010.06.28 12:07:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Halcyon Ingenium
Oh, and another thing, all science fiction is a fantasy, so the fact that 40k is a space fantasy is of little import. It is teh grimdarks, that's what's important.


It is Science Fiction without Science, thats why I dislike it.

Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
Posted - 2010.06.28 13:10:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Deviana Sevidon
Originally by: Halcyon Ingenium
Oh, and another thing, all science fiction is a fantasy, so the fact that 40k is a space fantasy is of little import. It is teh grimdarks, that's what's important.


It is Science Fiction without Science, thats why I dislike it.


Yes, physically modified warriors using artificially created organs has nothing to do with science. A race whose technology is an extended phenotypic effect like a caddis house has nothing to do with science. Ancient civilizations which dead ended with killer robots has nothing to do with science. Faster than light travel, fantasy, totally no basis in science. A hive species from another galaxy that absorbs genetic material as it feasts on worlds, another total fantasy like LotR.

But I don't need the sarcasm, you just defeated your whole argument.

Quote:
It is Science Fiction without Science, thats why I dislike it.


Science fiction has just as much to do with real science as fantasy, nothing. If it was a equivalent comparison then it would be just fiction, set in the world we all already live in. But it isn't, it is a fantasy based on what we wish was true, or hope won't happen. You're splitting hairs, and because of that I suspect you of trolling the 40k nerds.


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