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Lord Maximullis
Amarr
Stillwater Corporation
Posted - 2010.03.27 05:10:00 - [61]
 

There will be on peace until the Empire is burned to the ground, it's ashes scattered amongst the stars.

Stitcher
Caldari
Posted - 2010.03.27 09:39:00 - [62]
 

Originally by: Lord Maximullis
There will be on peace until the Empire is burned to the ground, it's ashes scattered amongst the stars.


You know, it's actually rather endearing the way you try so hard to fit in with the cool terrorists. Reminds me of this annoying little hanger-on at school who spent all his time desperately imitating the successful kids in the hope that some of it might rub off.

As I recall, he grew up to be an attorney.

Saul Dhampir
Caldari
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.03.27 11:34:00 - [63]
 

Congratulations to the Bloody Hands. Looking forward to more Amarr Facilities going pop.

Jesmine Kyriel
Amarr
House Kyriel Inc.
Posted - 2010.03.27 14:55:00 - [64]
 

Originally by: Lord Maximullis
There will be on peace until the Empire is burned to the ground, it's ashes scattered amongst the stars.


You were a lord once, I am a lord now.

I have responsibility, duty and honor to drive me. I have the needs of the people to drive me.

Their well-being, protection and rights as humans and citizens, indeed even slaves.

Every day when I leave my bed this is what I do – lords exist to serve the people as they in turn serve the lords. Both serve the will of those in higher positions of power. This limits my actual time in my capsule, but I give up much of my time enjoying that privilege because I'm needed elsewhere.

You Maximullis, when you get out of bed, what do you do? Think of how to serve yourself? How to harm the people you profess to hate so much? How to make more silly one-liners to underline how far you have fallen?

You were a lord once. I wonder what happened to you.

Silas Vitalia
Khanid Provincial Vanguard
Vanguard Imperium
Posted - 2010.03.28 23:18:00 - [65]
 

The Amarrian civilian deaths are the real tragedy here. Those expressing concerns for Jamyl's safety should have little to worry about; she has proven to be impervious to explosions in the past.


Leopold Caine
Amarr
Stillwater Corporation
Posted - 2010.03.29 19:02:00 - [66]
 

It is horrible to see certain capsuleers trying to make a tragedy like this into one of their deranged conspiracy theories. I might say a part of me is actually looking forward to one of your engineers messing up a cooling valve and blowing up a minmatar installation.

However, such qualms are under me. I shall pray that you find peace beyond your own blind hatred, and of those who have contaminated you with it.

Vikarion
Caldari
State Trade Consortium
Posted - 2010.03.29 22:04:00 - [67]
 

Originally by: Stitcher
It is equally naive to assume that a head of state will stop at nothing to gather power as it is to assume that they will not.


The greatest quality and the worst quality of Tibus Heth is his uncompromising idealism.

That idealism brought us our return to our homeworld, a great honor. It also brought about the expulsion of ethnic Gallente from the State, a great shame.

The idealism of the Matari is that all of their people should be free: I sympathize with this. But to confuse freeing their people with burning the Amarr Empire to the ground will make such freedom impossible.

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.03.30 12:52:00 - [68]
 

Edited by: Evet Morrel on 31/03/2010 10:33:28

The Bloody Hands of Matar, who, "model [themselves] on the ideals espoused by [their] capsuleer kin," the Ushra'Khan appear to be expressing their dissatisfaction with the progress made so far by Empress Jamyl. Beyond the conspiracy theorists and the ‘irrational hatreds’ argument that seems so prevalent in this thread there are a number of possible explanations for this attack. Certainly the previous acts, including Egbonbet space station effectively imposed significant costs on the then incumbent Midular regime undermining its credibility and forcing capitulation on the most important dimension of cleavage.

Perhaps the symbolism of the attack is of significance: committed on St. Kuria's day, the Saint to whom St. Kuria the Prophet Cathedral on Amarr prime is dedicated. This cathedral recently witnessed both the state funeral of Emperor Doriam II and Jamyl Sarum's coronation; centre stage for both the alpha and the omega of Amarrian state craft. The attack cannot be explained in a vacuum, no pun intended. Within this context, terrorism is a deliberate choice. I suggest that The Bloody Hands also depend critically on “enabling” or “permissive” factors to create the tactical opportunity they require to conduct operations. So, is it the failure of the Empire to prevent the fall of Providence that is giving The Bloody Hands Matar a new sense of themselves do you think? Or maybe they simply mean that if the Empress wants to avoid floating endlessly in the starry sepulchre of space she should read more St. Kuria,

One can repent and pray for forgiveness.
But true meekness is one that has penetrated and laid its roots in the very heart of a man.
The stars above will not weep for us parting.
The air we breathe won't notice our disappearance.
The dirt of the earth will embrace our decadence.
The Scriptures. Kuria 4:23.


Quite the memento mori, in any case the Bloody Hands have demonstrated they are able to reach out in ways we hadn't thought possible.

Karn Mithralia
Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.03.31 14:28:00 - [69]
 

Edited by: Karn Mithralia on 31/03/2010 14:28:51

Well said Evet, death to Amarr.

Long live the Bloody Hands of Matar.

Rise my brothers, rise!

Anabella Rella
Minmatar
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2010.03.31 17:50:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Vikarion
The idealism of the Matari is that all of their people should be free: I sympathize with this. But to confuse freeing their people with burning the Amarr Empire to the ground will make such freedom impossible.


I don't believe we confuse the two. However, on a practical level, it's nearly impossible to separate them. For the Amarr to release all who are held in captivity and to renounce their "reclaiming" would be the same as asking the State to renounce free market competition, or the Republic to renounce tribalism.

Personally, I'd have no issues with the Empire were they to free all those held in bondage and stop their "reclaiming". Alas, to do so would require they give up several millennia of tradition, theology, culture; in short to give up all that makes them Amarrian. Obviously, that won't ever happen.

Syn Callibri
Minmatar
Swag Co.
Sandbox Bullies
Posted - 2010.03.31 19:50:00 - [71]
 

Edited by: Syn Callibri on 31/03/2010 19:51:47
Originally by: Anabella Rella

I don't believe we confuse the two. However, on a practical level, it's nearly impossible to separate them. For the Amarr to release all who are held in captivity and to renounce their "reclaiming" would be the same as asking the State to renounce free market competition, or the Republic to renounce tribalism.

Personally, I'd have no issues with the Empire were they to free all those held in bondage and stop their "reclaiming". Alas, to do so would require they give up several millennia of tradition, theology, culture; in short to give up all that makes them Amarrian. Obviously, that won't ever happen.


"...give up all that makes them Amarrian." Hmmm...I for one like the sound of that. Isn't that what they tried to do to us afterall...stop being Matari and become domesticated, docile? Personally, I find that individual Amarr can be quite likeable, even loyal companions...its the empire that I dream of in smouldering ashes and bleached bones.

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.03.31 19:55:00 - [72]
 

Originally by: Evet Morrel
Edited by: Evet Morrel on 31/03/2010 10:33:28

Perhaps the symbolism of the attack is of significance: committed on St. Kuria's day, the Saint to whom St. Kuria the Prophet Cathedral on Amarr prime is dedicated. This cathedral recently witnessed both the state funeral of Emperor Doriam II and Jamyl Sarum's coronation; centre stage for both the alpha and the omega of Amarrian state craft.


Or perhaps you attribute too much symbolism to a brutally simple bombing. The great prophet Kuria to us is much more than "some prophet's name" we attached to a holy place. I don't see the connection between a cathedral on Amarr Prime and a bombing lightyears away. There are hundreds of thousands of cathredrals dedicated to the Saint. The terrorists found an opportunity to strike, and they exploited it to deadly effect. That is all they cared about. Moderate Amarrians are once again made to look like fools in front of the extremists who have yet more fuel for their fires.

Originally by: Evet Morrel
it the failure of the Empire to prevent the fall of Providence that is giving The Bloody Hands Matar a new sense of themselves do you think?


How is the fall (premature as you may be in declaring it) of capsuleer Providence a failure on part of the Amarr Empire? What causes you think that the empire ever meddled with the capsuleers living there?

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.04.01 00:26:00 - [73]
 

Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
Originally by: Evet Morrel
Perhaps the symbolism of the attack is of significance: committed on St. Kuria's day, the Saint to whom St. Kuria the Prophet Cathedral on Amarr prime is dedicated. This cathedral recently witnessed both the state funeral of Emperor Doriam II and Jamyl Sarum's coronation; centre stage for both the alpha and the omega of Amarrian state craft.

Or perhaps you attribute too much symbolism to a brutally simple bombing. The great prophet Kuria to us is much more than "some prophet's name" we attached to a holy place. I don't see the connection between a cathedral on Amarr Prime and a bombing lightyears away … Moderate Amarrians are once again made to look like fools in front of the extremists who have yet more fuel for their fires.


Well if you don't find that credible then how about this.

Terrorism is propaganda by deed, ultimately it's designed to influence one target by attacking another. It is no doubt a counterterrorist tactic to play down the 'terrifying' reach of The Bloody Hands of Matar. In any case it's a simple link from the saint to the cathedral. Outside of Amarr this fragment of scripture and that fact is about all that's known of the incomparable ascetic St. Kuria. If the strategic goals of The Bloody Hands of Matar are unchanged, and I find this convincing, then they are not in the least interested in Amarrian Moderates, but endogenous Politics.

However, if their focus is not to use violence to provoke the regime into suppression, and by so doing move portions of Matari moderates closer to the their policy perspective which I believe succinctly put is, "Burn Amarr burn" - then they may intent to provoke the Amarr hard-liners into direct attacks upon the Republic itself, but I find this less probable.
Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
Originally by: Evet Morrel
Is it the failure of the Empire to prevent the fall of Providence that is giving The Bloody Hands Matar a new sense of themselves do you think?
How is the fall (premature as you may be in declaring it) of capsuleer Providence a failure on part of the Amarr Empire? What causes you think that the empire ever meddled with the capsuleers living there?

What is not plausible is the notion that the burning of Providence isn't an enduring symbolic humiliation to the Empire and Amarr everywhere in the cluster, and thus galvanising of Matari identity.

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.04.01 01:22:00 - [74]
 

Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 01/04/2010 01:29:04
Originally by: Evet Morrel
Well if you don't find that credible then how about this[...]


I don't need a lot of symbolic references or far-fetched conspiracy theories to see what the bloody hand is after. They simply want to polarise Amarrians and the Minmatar that live in the Republic against eachother by any means. They have bombed on both sides of the border, killing anyone who disagrees with them indiscriminately. All I can say is that they should be careful what they wish for.

Originally by: Evet Morrel
What is not plausible is the notion that the burning of Providence isn't an enduring symbolic humiliation to the Empire and Amarr everywhere in the cluster, and thus galvanising of Matari identity.


Generally it is wiser to wait until the enemy is actually "burned" as you call it before sounding the victory trumpets. But yes, it would certainly be a blow to our morale. I just prefer to separate the triumphs and failings of capsuleers from the fortunes and troubles of the Empire. They are not one and the same, especially when we talk about zero-sec space (which it classified "lawless" for a reason). The Empire is solid where capsuleers are fickle. Who can tell who will be the master of Providence a year from now? I certainly can't.

Gottii
Minmatar
Lutinari Syndicate
Electus Matari
Posted - 2010.04.02 20:13:00 - [75]
 

Edited by: Gottii on 03/04/2010 00:12:20
Edited by: Gottii on 02/04/2010 23:29:31
Originally by: Stitcher




First off, I said it was a "guess", not a claim.

As for the Empress and the Theological Council not being antagonistic, you're at least aware that according to traditional Amarr theological doctrine, Sarum should not be Empress? Would make sense that the Empress would view them as a threat to her power, since her throne rests on shakey theological footing.

And its not necessary for her to have framed tBHM outright. She could have just let slip her "schedule" to the right compromised channels, knowing that the Bloody Hand would find it and act accordingly.

Intentionally leaking information to a hostile entity, knowing it will spur them to a course of action you desire, does not require some vast shadowy conspiracy to carry out. Infact its a tried and true tactic that military and intelligence groups have been using since ancient times.

Killing the clergy doesn't really do much for tBHM or for captive slaves. The clergy has long been the check against Holder abuse of power, against both lower class Amarr and slaves.

But, as I stated above, the Empress has very real reasons to want a cowed and meek Theological Council, one that would be reluctant to raise objection to either her rule or her policies. So, the Empress generally benefits from this, and the Matari generally dont.

That makes me suspicious, as it should you.

And if you think all terrorists are irrational and drooling monsters, then you've been watching too many holovids. Being a terrorist doesnt mean you're insane or irrational, it just means that you're willing to use whatever means necessary to achieve those goals. They're simply immoral, not irrational.

And besides, making blanket statements about all "terrorists" is ridiculous, simply because that word rarely has one meaning. According to Amarr loyalists, me and every other member of EM is a terrorist. Whatever you think of me, calling EM as a whole irrational is a mistake.

As for your read of the Ammar propaganda, its only partially right. A better summation of their party line is "God is on our side, we cannot hope but to correct the heathen....but there are many trials and setbacks we must overcome before we can bring God's glory".

They choose that line because its easier to control a fearful population than an over-confidant one, and its a party line that better stands up to set backs like Jovian fleets and Republic rebellions.

As for your belief that the Empress, or any of the other nations leaders, refusing to carry out an operation like this on some kind of moral or utilitarian grounds...are you crazy?

This is a woman who presides over the enslavement of billions of men, women, and children, who has flaunted the laws of her empire and religion in the past, and who came to power by annilating an enemy fleet singlehandedly....and you think shes going to suddenly balk at domestic assassination?

Are you really this painfully naive?

Shes an empress, not a politican. Its a mistake to confuse the two. There is an ancient expression about autocrats being better off feared than loved, and the Empress no doubt knows this.

Nor do I think a glorified thug like Heth would shy away from such tactics. And there are plenty of stone cold killers in the Black Eagles who would similar operations without blinking. And yes, the Republic has its own people willing to murder or worse to benefit a cause they see as benefiting the Matari.

As for me not being able to confront the evils the Matari commit, Ive been fighting groups like the Ammatar and Angels long before I was even in a pod. Im well aware many Matari have evil in their hearts. Its why I joined the corp I did.

And, with all due respect Verin, Im not going to look to you when it comes to lessons on how to confront the evil his people commit.


Archbishop
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2010.04.02 21:24:00 - [76]
 


Cowardly actions such as this by those who slink around in the dark plotting murder and mayhem are no surprise. The Bloody Hand family of murderers and their supporters seem to revel in this kind of chaos and despair. The truth is the genetic disposition to violence these Minmatar terrorists have leads them to actions such as this regardless of the reason.

I would dare say if every slave were freed today, every Minmatar returned to Matari space, every Amarrian slaver found guilty of crimes the Bloody Hand would still be out commiting acts such as this. It is in their blood and they would just find another excuse for these acts of murder and mayhem.

If they can't find a legitimate excuse they would just invent one as the anarchists often do. Truth means little to people such as these.

Archbishop

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.04.02 22:46:00 - [77]
 

Edited by: Evet Morrel on 02/04/2010 22:48:02

Originally by: powdered prelate
The truth is the genetic disposition to violence these Minmatar terrorists have leads them to actions such as this regardless of the reason.
Racist drivel from the rosy lipped, powdered prelate himself. What delightful hypocracy, materialism and determinism from the 'spiritual man' who preaches a devotional life of service, the cretin?

Archbishop
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2010.04.03 02:19:00 - [78]
 

Originally by: Evet Morrel

Racist drivel from the rosy lipped, powdered prelate himself. What delightful hypocracy, materialism and determinism from the 'spiritual man' who preaches a devotional life of service, the cretin?


Racist drivel would be saying all Matari are violent. Clearly some are not and are capable of achieving an existence of peace and faith as proven by the Ammatar. Some Matari obviously though are unable to control their instincts and instead lash out at everyone around them as we've seen here. Just as the mental illness of the anarchist has been well documented so is the ingrained trait of violence in the Matari. An entire culture built on war and violence without God is doomed to eventually fall.

A life of devotion, servitude and giving to your fellow man is something I realize a selfish violence prone anarchist such as yourself could never understand. In many ways the mental illness of the anarchist is similar to the ingrained illness of the Matari in that you both exhibit the same "symptoms". Violence, mistruths, criminal acts and an ignorance to the truth. This similarity is what has made it possible for you to so closely tie yourselves to the Minmatar in Providence despite the fact they're clearly commiting acts of violence against the innocent. I'm sure in your own deluded mind you'll come up with some "excuse" to justify your actions of violence and hate. Rest assured though the rest of us see you for what you are and your illness is apparent to all.

Perhaps you would do well to read my sermons on the anarchist mental illness? They are sermons #0015 through #0019 here on IGS. You will see alot of similarity between the violent actions of the Bloody Hand and the excuses they use.

Archbishop

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.04.03 10:06:00 - [79]
 

Edited by: Evet Morrel on 03/04/2010 15:24:49

The racism evident in your statement is not in the least modified by your qualification.
Originally by: Archbishop
Perhaps you would do well to read my sermons on the anarchist mental illness?
I've read your sermons, incompetent, it's clear that you haven't the first idea about the diagnoses of 'narcissism' and confuse the personality disorder with the vulgar usage of the word. While it’s true that secret organisations are attractive to the narcissistically wounded, that's also true of the priesthood.

Now coming back to you, and your profession; that thin mask behind which you appear so gnomic. Whenever you open you mouth you are betrayed. From your argumentation it’s clear that you’re either a dyed in the wool materialist or disingenuous, neither are attractive qualities in clergy. Your arguments confuse the anarchist political perspective with the vulgar usage of that word also, and rely not on a religious examination of any matter, instead you peddle pop-psychology. Where is your supernatural in that explination, you fraud? You preach abnegation, and surrender to those you regard as beneath you – which I imagine, to you, is everyone. You would have all humiliated, because of your own fear of intimacy.
Originally by: Archbishop
Some Matari obviously though are unable to control their instincts and instead lash out at everyone around them as we've seen here. Just as the mental illness of the anarchist has been well documented so is the ingrained trait of violence in the Matari. An entire culture built on war and violence without God is doomed to eventually fall.
Your claimed religion has a spiritual perspective which is profoundly narcissistic, in both the vulgar sense, and psychological sense …
Originally by: Evet Morrel
[the] Amarr civiliser … is ideological in the sense that its a mystification of the real power relations that obtain in the conquered society. If it defines human beings as possessing a defective nature, it does so in order that their wildness will both require and justify their subjugation at the hands of the Amarr. The assumed inadequacies of the conquered render the Amarr indispensable and make their activities appear to be an unmitigated blessing.
… it would deny the autonomy and privacy of others. The narcissistically wounded are so overwhelmed so ‘mortified’ by their sense of shame, which is so persistent that the shame disappears (– re information theory when there is nochange there is no information) along with the departing affect goes all emotional comprehension of privacy, for without shame there can be no privacy, this is a defence against rejection, against re-experiencing the all pervasive shame. Shame in meaning is related to sham, to disappearance, I belive your fear is that if you (and the Amarr) were 'you' to acknowlege your shame your fear is that you would disappear - you wouldn't you would change - for gods sake change!

What you need to understand is that what you stand for, and are prepared to die for, is hated, hated by U’K hated by the Bloody Hands hated by SF – IT’S HATED … and that this hate is a strong true and pure one:
Originally by: Evet Morrel
If we hate hypocrisy, insincerity, and mendacity, and we grant ourselves the right to fight them wherever we can this will likely end the hate. Hatred is a strong assertive feeling, and like any other feeling, it is a sign of vitality. Hatred tells us something about the injuries we have been subjected to, but also about ourselves, our values, and our specific sensitivity.

continued...

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.04.03 10:08:00 - [80]
 

Edited by: Evet Morrel on 03/04/2010 15:24:28
… you Amarr are so deadened, you’re so bloody polite. But inwardly you're all in such pain and it’s expressed as sado-masochistic envy (often coinciding with narcissism, one only has to read about conservative politicians to know that). This is the Amarr armature, your attempt to rise above your feelings of inferiority – your moral iniquity.

… you Amarr love to see the slaves in the fields, you find it so reassuring to your poor repressed infantile sexuality. Do you need slaves? Of course you don't, but emotionally you might - you're such emotional infants, unable to own your own experience, without the Minmatar you might not even be able to feed yourselves, but you'll have to learn or burn.

… you Amarr self-flagellate and pray, desperate for penitence, desperate to annihilate the last vestiges of your shame, your guilt, for transgressions, both real and imagined, produced by the sublimation of the very natural desire to have what 'we' all have: freedom. Renouce your false God and your slavery. That is the hopeful message of the Bloody Hands, they care enough to tell you this. Have no doubt, priest, this is the struggle between instincts. You are life unlived, unloved, we, (the sisters and brothers of U’K) are on the side of life, the Amarrian faith is the death instinct.

The Amarr are a fascinating cultural response to, from an anthropological perspective, the traumatic effect of being hoodwinked by a couple of dilettante alien squatters (whether it's true or not is irrelvant of course it's their cultural myth). Dilettante alien squatters who left the Amarr, as a parting gift, such anxiety, on the one hand, and such grandiosity, on the other, as to be unable to face their future without absolute certainty, a titanic musclebound certainty, indeed, even to the point of reversing the evident state of nature, shame! Yes indeed it is shame, unbearable shame, that is the affect underling narcissism. Never before have a people been so narcissistically wounded as the Amarr. Look at their gaudy, indeed gilt, cultural remonstrations to the contrary, it all seems to bellow "we are superior". Look at their need to enslave - what brassy insincerity; how breathtakingly unconvincing are the Amarr. One simply must see this as proof of a profound underlying inferiority complex or be mocked by Minmatar children.
Originally by: Archbish
A life of devotion, servitude and giving to your fellow man is something I realize a selfish violence prone anarchist such as yourself could never understand.
I have answered this …
Originally by: Evet Morrel
However, our position is also structural and intimately connected to freedom. Freedom can not be absolute; we may rush toward it, accelerating forever, but never reach it. For the simple reason that absolute freedom has no content, it is an attractor only. If it has a shape, a shape implies an end, and from a shape you can infer a constraint. This is also, of course, a good argument for the non-existance of a God that has any shape or any end, in short, that requires anything from anyone. This provides us with a new structural approach to our investigation and practice of freedom, if freedom's limits are therefore self limiting and internal, then freedom must assert the existence of the freedoms of others as constitutive of its own freedom.
"We [the Star Fraction], for our part, are motivated, to quote an ancient revolutionary, “... by great feelings of love” for freedom, for our fellows, for life."

Archbishop
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2010.04.03 19:10:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: Evet Morrel

The racism evident in your statement is not in the least modified by your qualification.
Originally by: Archbishop
Perhaps you would do well to read my sermons on the anarchist mental illness?
I've read your sermons, incompetent, it's clear that you haven't the first idea about the diagnoses of 'narcissism' and confuse the personality disorder with the vulgar usage of the word. While it’s true that secret organisations are attractive to the narcissistically wounded, that's also true of the priesthood.


The narcisist focuses on ME ME ME whereas the Amarrian priest focuses on God and Duty not himself. For example I do not believe myself a "God" nor do I believe I know what is best for everyone myself. I do know that God is best for all but that is hardly narcisistic as it shows complete subserviance to the will and order of God.

Quote:
Your claimed religion has a spiritual perspective which is profoundly narcissistic, in both the vulgar sense, and psychological sense.


God is an absolute thus no narcisism is necessary. God is... well... God. Some pilot with a ship and a gun using cloning technology to cheat death is hardly a "God" himself.

Archbishop

Andreus LeHane
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
Posted - 2010.04.03 21:43:00 - [82]
 

Au contraire, Archblowhard. The Amarrian version of narcissism is simply more complex - you invent, from whole cloth, a fictional omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent force of nature that you claim is ineffable, unknowable, beyond comprehension, and having already reached the towering heights of hubris necessary to claim to understand the true nature of the universe, you then not only claim that you know the mind of this (ineffable, unknowable) entity but that you and your kind, insignificant specks of carbon-based dust against the dozens of billions of light years of space around us, are its favoured creations. This claim you make entirely upon the words of texts so ancient, translated and re-translated so many times by so many different translators with so many different personal agendas that any original meaning was lost aeons ago. And in this grand pinnacle of self-love, higher than the heavens themselves, where you place yourself, you claim dominion over the entire universe.

Perhaps you are right - perhaps narcissism is an inaccurate description of the Amarrian condition. A better word would be megalomania.

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.04.03 22:28:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Evet Morrel
I know fancy words! Listen to this one: Narcissism.... [...]


Originally by: Andreus LeHane
Perhaps you are right - perhaps narcissism is an inaccurate description of the Amarrian condition.


For once I agree. Amarrians are many things, but narcissist isn't one of them. Mock us all you like, your pitiful attempts at trying to look educated are ruined by your own insults. Your ignorance and disrespect say more about you lot than they ever could about us.

Narcissism is a condition that sums up the Gallente mindset. You pretend to be your own gods and must love yourselves to fill the voids where your souls should have been. Where Archbisshop tries to save you, I say you aren't worth it until you make the slightest effort towards your own enlightenment first. I won't hold my breath though.

Maybe you will one day realize your folly on your deathbed when God rejects you and your only companion will be cold oblivion. Or not... who but God can say really? And I don't think I'm god, because that would be narcissist, wouldn't it?

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.04.03 22:59:00 - [84]
 

lol … you have a problem with m’fancy words *beaming smile* is that all. It’s nice that you’ve responded to your critics, reverted to type, and retreated up your own fundaments (i.e. the fleshy part of the human body that you sit on).

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.04.03 23:23:00 - [85]
 

Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 04/04/2010 18:23:35
No problem what so ever. I'm merely enthralled by your style of writing, I didn't say that I find anything wrong with it. Though I tried to hint (a bit more snidely than I meant to convey perhaps) at the fact that I thought you tried too hard, there is something to be said for variety on this channel.

Andreus LeHane
Gallente
Mixed Metaphor
Posted - 2010.04.04 01:10:00 - [86]
 

Originally by: Lucius Vindictus
As usual, I don't actually have any counterarguments to what you said, so I'll just throw invective instead!


Right, I said you weren't narcissistic, but I said you were megalomaniacal. You chose to fixate on one statement and completely ignore the other, and then go off on a (mostly incorrect) tirade about Gallenteans. Certainly narcissism is not an uncommon trait among Gallenteans but certainly the idea that they're gods is not - and by the way, I know that you're chronically unobservant, so I feel it relevant to point out that I'm Intaki, not a Gallente. My flaws - and I consider it a virtue that I am able to recognise them - generally lie in anger management and inability to keep my mouth shut.

You, sir, however, have evidenced yourself to be narcissistic, megalomaniacal, at times monomaniacal and generally a bit of a ponce.

Also, I have it on good authority that you're not a particularly good fighter.

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.04.04 02:41:00 - [87]
 

Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 04/04/2010 18:19:57
Originally by: Andreus LeHane
Right, I said you weren't narcissistic, but I said you were megalomaniacal. You chose to fixate on one statement and completely ignore the other, and then go off on a (mostly incorrect) tirade about Gallenteans. Certainly narcissism is not an uncommon trait among Gallenteans but certainly the idea that they're gods is not


Narcissism, Megalomania, it all depends on from who's perspective you look at it. From mine Gallenteans are narcissistic, from yours I'm megalomaniacal among other things. Who cares? I think we can both live on with that knowledge perfectly fine. I see nothing to be gained by childishly bickering with you on a public channel.

Originally by: Andreus LeHane
I know that you're chronically unobservant, so I feel it relevant to point out that I'm Intaki, not a Gallente. My flaws - and I consider it a virtue that I am able to recognise them - generally lie in anger management and inability to keep my mouth shut.


Ever wondered why you never hear a Khanid of a Ni-Kunni complain when they are collectively grouped as Amarrians? Why a Brutor doesn't get offended when you don't refer to his tribe specifically and call him Minmatar instead? Very well... Intaki... I could argue with you about how you don't strike me as someone who is capable of healthy self-criticism... but what is the point? I didn't come here to talk about you... I don't even know you. In fact, what's so interesting about you anyway? I came here to talk about the tragic events in Pashanai.

Originally by: Andreus LeHane
You, sir, however, have evidenced yourself to be narcissistic, megalomaniacal, at times monomaniacal and generally a bit of a ponce.


Sticks and stones, Intaki. Like I said: I care nothing for your opinion about me and while I like to engage in some debate (sometimes ill-adviced, but entertaining none the less) on this channel, I don't usually partake in public mud-slinging matches with the likes of you. They tend to make both sides look like fools, and I'll not have it said that I'm like you in that regard. Either you debate with me on something that interests me, or I'll just shrug and move on. The only thing I'll add is that the more you disapprove of me, the more I must be doing something right. I'm not exactly striving to get the praises of one such as you. In fact, the day you have something nice to say about me will be a cause of shame to me.

Originally by: Andreus LeHane
Also, I have it on good authority that you're not a particularly good fighter.


That's a peculiar statement... I'm also not a particularly good gardener either, which is why I didn't become one and instead leave any of my gardening to the gardeners. I have it on good authority that you are a terrible cook. Yet I don't see how my fighting skills or your ability to produce a decent meal is relevant to a ****ing bomb exploding in Pashanai, do you? Now, if you have nothing interesting or relevant to say, I'll just move on if you don't mind.

Veronique Devereaux
Posted - 2010.04.04 07:13:00 - [88]
 

I for one think bombs are bad! They kill people and that just isn't nice.
Make love, not war!

Evet Morrel
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2010.04.04 07:22:00 - [89]
 

Edited by: Evet Morrel on 04/04/2010 13:46:24

Thanks Lucius I enjoy your writing style too. Andreus, I know it's a sackcloth and ashes kind of me me me, and of course not all Amarr are narcistic, but plenty are don't let the robes fool you. The important thing to understand about nacissim (the Archbish brought this all up, by the way - and has written a couple of sermons on it) is that they're incapable of empathy.

"Lacking empathy is a profound disturbance to the narcissist's thinking (cognition) and feeling (affectivity)... They don't understand the meaning of what people say and they don't grasp the meaning of the written word either -- because so much of the meaning of anything we say depends on context and affect, narcissists (lacking empathy and thus lacking both context and affect) hear only the words."

There is so much that we would comunicate but all they hear are the words.

Lucius Vindictus
Amarr
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2010.04.04 13:56:00 - [90]
 

Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 04/04/2010 17:13:28
Originally by: Evet Morrel
Thanks Lucius I enjoy your writting style too. Andreus, I know it's a sackcloth and ashes kind of me me me, and of course not all Amarr are narcistic, but plenty are don't let the robes fool you. The important thing to understand about nacissim (the Archbish brought this all up, by the way - and has written a couple of sermons on it) is that they're incapable of empathy.

"Lacking empathy is a profound disturbance to the narcissist's thinking (cognition) and feeling (affectivity)... They don't understand the meaning of what people say and they don't grasp the meaning of the written word either -- because so much of the meaning of anything we say depends on context and affect, narcissists (lacking empathy and thus lacking both context and affect) hear only the words."

There is so much that we would comunicate but all they hear are the words.


Exactly! It's like talking to a brick wall. It can be infuriating. I generally take issue with people stereotyping a whole race based only on their own biases (a.k.a. "All Amarrians are X-Y-Z"), but I'm glad to see that you look it at more realistically. There are those who fit your description among all races. I have personal experience with peers among the local nobility where I grew up that have a quite inflated sense of their own ability and place in the world. I admit that I can at times be accused of similar behavior, and that is when I need to be humbled. But not too much, of course. Because I can't give the lowers the wrong picture. It would however go a little far to paint everyone with the same brush, because I also know of some nobles that give away their whole fortunes to aid the needy.

If there is one thing I have learned over the years (and had to get used to a lot) it's that the galaxy isn't ever black and white. Those who can't recognize the shades of grey live in a small and frightening world.


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