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Tagami Wasp
Caldari
Sarz'na Khumatari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.02.20 02:46:00 - [211]
 

Originally by: Hienz Doofenshmirtz
see thats odd the greek I know says it means an agent of an absolute ruler


http://books.google.com/books?id=aKULU8vaD_IC&pg=PA114&lpg=PA114&dq=%CF%84%CF%85%CF%81%CE%B1%CE%BD%CE%BD%CE%AF%CF%82&source=bl&ots=sz9JiQP58W&sig=GlGjpWQAebDYxSbk7uGy86GW3NY&hl=en&ei=TUx_S6f9A4-Ytgf79OGuDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CBIQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=&f=false

Google it, and you shall receive. Sheesh, trying to teach me my own language damn it.



Jackson Taus
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:16:00 - [212]
 

Originally by: Mashie Saldana
Originally by: Facepalm
Relying on 12-year olds playing an entirely different game on an entirely different console to defend your planetary infrastructure in this game is dumb mmkay?

As CCP stated at Fanfest, if there are enough Dust players online they will use the contracts set up by the eve players, if not it will fall back to NPC mercenaries (roll of dice). Same thing the other way around as well, if there are more Dust players than it is EVE contracts they will fight over NPC areas instead. Either game will work just fine without the other.


The problem isn't that no one will show up, it's "my super-expensive planetary installment is in the hands of either a die-roll or 12-year-old l33tsp34k kids". Unlike everything else in EVE, it's completely non-deterministic. No matter how much preparation and strategizing and farming you do, you can't affect the outcome of the DUST 514 fight unless your entire corp/alliance buys consoles and plays DUST 514. 0.0 sov-holders are going to be dissatisfied unless there's a way they can influence the outcome of those land battles from within EVE Online.

Originally by: Windryder
Originally by: Pubsey
How about fixing the crippling fleet lag and complete lack of incentive in owning 0.0 space first?

"Fix fleet lag fix fleet lag!" is all I bloody hear from 0.0 pewpewers but frankly all I ever see is players abhorring a vacuum. Every single time CCP improves fleet lag, what happens? Fleets get bigger and break it again. What the fark do you guys want them to do? Invent quantum computing and replace the worlds' telecommunication network with liquid-helium-cooled superconducting wires so we have infinite processing power and infinite bandwidth?
....
CCP improves performance, YOU overload it again.


The problem is that CCP designed the sov system so that all the action takes place on like 2-3 grids, and made assaulting a system cost like a billion ISK in SBUs. Toss in the fact that defenders only have to win 1:4 fights, and splitting your fleet becomes a very bad strategy. And since we're moving from a dozen POSes being the targets to 2-5 SBUs and an iHub being the battleground, consolidating the grids in the system. It's not players' fault that CCP built their sov system in a way that encourages blobbing.

And that's ignoring the fact that there's been an across-the-board degradation in performance for all fleet sizes. Even where fleet sizes stayed constant, the lag increased.

Ziven0x
Secret Squirrel Readiness Group
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:24:00 - [213]
 

Complete fail. Where is Incarna?

captcommunic
Gallente
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:25:00 - [214]
 

Awesome! A Fail expansion...Cant wait.

You can clearly see they are running out of ideas.

Niccolado Starwalker
Gallente
Shadow Templars
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:43:00 - [215]
 

Looks like a quite impressive expansion. Very Happy

A question though. At what level are we speaking of planetary interaction? Is it just from planetary orbit? Or can we land and walk the "planet Ewok" (I guess we cant land on Planet Hell..)where we operates the machines?

Really looking forward for this expansion! Very Happy




Daedhead
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:47:00 - [216]
 

As long as the expansion makes sense. The only area where you should be able to develop planets is in conq 0.0, not NPC 0.0, not lowsec, not highsec. Sovereignty and planet development should be directly linked. As long as this is the case, it will be a good expansion.

High-sec should never get these type of rewards, they have earned absolutely nothing and don't deserve rewards like afk isk printers.

Ben Hilel
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:49:00 - [217]
 


First you said passive income was a problem... Ok it was true. With high passive income there is no need for players to fly up and down to get money resulting in lack of targets in null/low sec. You said you was trying to fix it promoting some sort of symbiotic need between carebears and pvps.

Now you add more passive sources ! ! ! ???

Hard to understand. Could you please give us another (real) dev blog explaining the logic behind the change and how do you expect those changes are going to affect current status quo . If you are changing something in game structure a Dev blog about reasons are much better that one giving a small list of very very poor detailed final decisions.


Originally by: xXxSatsujinxXx
"We ****ed up moons, so we'l make planets minable... Oh, and so they don't realize we're basically giving them moon mining with a different name, we'l add some infrastructure requirements to make it seem new and different."



Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2010.02.20 03:54:00 - [218]
 

Quote:
The problem isn't that no one will show up, it's "my super-expensive planetary installment is in the hands of either a die-roll or 12-year-old l33tsp34k kids". Unlike everything else in EVE, it's completely non-deterministic. No matter how much preparation and strategizing and farming you do, you can't affect the outcome of the DUST 514 fight unless your entire corp/alliance buys consoles and plays DUST 514. 0.0 sov-holders are going to be dissatisfied unless there's a way they can influence the outcome of those land battles from within EVE Online.


Well here's the thing, that's not entirely true. You can affect the outcome of the battle in various ways.

You will be the one deciding whether the contract is open to the DUST player base or you can restrict it to a specific group. That group could be people from your own corp/alliance that play DUST, other EVE players that form DUST Merc groups, or groups of organized players that specialize in DUST and have never played EVE.

Also you will apparently either pay or provide equipment (or both) to these groups, which will have an effect on the battle as well.

This means the average player will likely open it up to the public, and equip his forces according to his means. Players from a large corp/alliance will likely have a fair number of corp/alliance people that are well organized, on voice coms, and dedicated to furthering his aims as a fair percentage of EVE players are going to inevitably get involved in DUST as well.

The only question remains who will be the better choice... the highly organized Merc corps made up of EVE players or the mobs made up of hyperactive twitch jockeys that can do things in a FPS that would make your eyes cross trying to follow. It just might be a damn good fight.

Either way, you will have some control over the broad strokes of the conflict from the start and more as time goes by and the interaction between the two games is strengthened.





Lemming Dugg
Posted - 2010.02.20 04:07:00 - [219]
 

Originally by: captcommunic
Awesome! A Fail expansion...Cant wait.

You can clearly see they are running out of ideas.


stfu u tardMad

Mistrala DeLegra
Caldari
Novus Alba FerrumSus
Posted - 2010.02.20 04:13:00 - [220]
 

Seriously, when i saw this post about this new EP my heart sank, i was expecting some news of Incarna (3 years in the waiting)and yet here we have what seems like another setback.

Im all for more industrial options and expansions to this field, but come on ccp! we all want news of Incarna! its almost like your sidestepping the questions about it and fobbing us off with any old cr*p to avoid the Incarna issue.

Complete fail. Where is Incarna?Evil or Very Mad

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2010.02.20 04:14:00 - [221]
 

Edited by: Ranger 1 on 20/02/2010 04:16:54
Originally by: Daedhead
As long as the expansion makes sense. The only area where you should be able to develop planets is in conq 0.0, not NPC 0.0, not lowsec, not highsec. Sovereignty and planet development should be directly linked. As long as this is the case, it will be a good expansion.

High-sec should never get these type of rewards, they have earned absolutely nothing and don't deserve rewards like afk isk printers.


I see the concern about passive income, but realistically private investors (especially those with the stature and comparatively limitless wealth of pod pilots) would be welcomed anywhere.

I think the key will be just how "passive" this income is, and how great a risk it is to develop an area.

A couple of things to consider:

The closer to heavily populated area's you are (especially in high sec) the more cut throat the competition will be to carve up lucrative planets. At first on an economic level and later on a potentially military level. People in null sec will actually have a much easier time of it, considering the difficulty of moving any kind of goods or merchandise out of a hostile 0.0 alliances territory.

With Planetary Interaction, and especially with Incarna and DUST coming, we are very likely to see a population explosion in EVE. Those people will need to earn their isk somehow and this offers them (and us) another avenue of income to pursue.

Again, the key will be that income from Planetary Interaction either require some effort to maintain or that it be very, very risky. Preferably both.

Edit: Mistrala DeLegra, they have stated repeatedly that Incarna will come AFTER Planetary Interaction. No mystery there.

Chiralos
Merchant Princes
Posted - 2010.02.20 04:54:00 - [222]
 

Edited by: Chiralos on 20/02/2010 05:36:04
A W E S O M E

This is what I've wanted from EVE for ages. EVE is the best game in the world, but here's the thing: the better it gets, the more it shows you what it could be. Immersion calls to itself. The epic single-world strategic warfare game is fantastic ... but in terms of the world of New Eden its not _about_ anything, except the egos of pod pilots. There's nothing wrong with that so far as it goes, but it should be about the egos of pod pilots _and_ the destinies of the trillions of NPC New Eden citizens.

--

In a slightly less fanboy frame of mind, I wonder how its going to work ? Previous expansions expansions with industrial content have follow the pattern of a new type of resource and production feeding into new space combat additions (moongoo, salvage, gas, w-space -> tech II, rigs, boosters, tech III). I don't think that's going to work anymore because space combat is chock full of complexity, and it would be wrong to make the whole of planetary industry about pod pilot space combat.

I hope its a kind of giant ISK casino mediated by trade goods. You have to keep pouring ISK in as wages, build trade goods, move them, sell them and if all goes well you make slightly more than you put in and keep your population under control. If it goes badly (due to pirates, other players screwing with you economicly, mismanagement,DUST) you lose isk and possibly control. This would be a boundable ISK source, it would push lots of trade goods through space, and control of districts would be a top-level goal worth playing for like sov.

A new in-space interaction would be good too, perhaps rendezvous in orbit with shuttles coming up and down with your trade goods. A window of vulnerability between planet surface and station / outpost.

I think the basic equation EVE is:

pilot time in, fun space combat out (and if you win, sov).

Perhaps a new equation will be:

planetary manager time in, god-game fun out (and if you win, planetary control)

krickettt
Golden Orb Technology inc
EVE Animal Control
Posted - 2010.02.20 05:17:00 - [223]
 

Originally by: Mistrala DeLegra
Seriously, when i saw this post about this new EP my heart sank, i was expecting some news of Incarna (3 years in the waiting)and yet here we have what seems like another setback.

Im all for more industrial options and expansions to this field, but come on ccp! we all want news of Incarna! its almost like your sidestepping the questions about it and fobbing us off with any old cr*p to avoid the Incarna issue.

Complete fail. Where is Incarna?Evil or Very Mad


They said somewhere at Fanfest that planetary interaction would be this expansion, and most likely incarna in the winter expansion. Hopefully they stick with that. I would rather wait and get amazingness, than have them introduce it early and give the whiners an excuse to prove that it was a waste.

captcommunic
Gallente
Association of Commonwealth Enterprises
Posted - 2010.02.20 05:18:00 - [224]
 

Originally by: Lemming Dugg
Originally by: captcommunic
Awesome! A Fail expansion...Cant wait.

You can clearly see they are running out of ideas.


stfu u tardMad


:Troll

Ryhss
Caldari
The Excecutorans
Posted - 2010.02.20 06:05:00 - [225]
 

Eh, Tyrannis sounds dull to me, but I bet it'll be good for those that like that kind of stuff.

Doktor Feeelgoood
Posted - 2010.02.20 06:08:00 - [226]
 

Tyrannis? Hey, I fly one of those! \o/

Kern Hotha
Posted - 2010.02.20 06:25:00 - [227]
 

How can we get excited about more mining? Seriously, who gets excited about mining?

I'd rather see a good UI or fleet battles that don't suck or a sovereignty system that isn't a second job.

Rawk Awn
Minmatar
Ek'u Tan
Namtz' aar K'in
Posted - 2010.02.20 06:43:00 - [228]
 

*begin generic post*

blah blah blah fix old stuff blah blah blah why does CCP waste time making new content? blah blah blah make artists code the fix for massive blob fleet battles only 10% of the players participate in blah blah blah I want my mommie blah blah blah emo quit

*end generic post*

More content is more content. If you don't like it, by all means go play STO or something...please.


Kile Kitmoore
Posted - 2010.02.20 06:47:00 - [229]
 

Edited by: Kile Kitmoore on 20/02/2010 07:53:26
Go big or go home.

God I hope I am wrong. We now have these really nice planet graphics, which are meaningless because we can't really interact with the planets. Now, your adding that interaction on an industrial level, fine. My question, what level of interaction are you offering? I have a feeling players will fly to these planets, right click them and open some boring interface and that is your level of interaction. No, atmospheric flight, hovering the surface and dropping structures. That is my fear, planet interaction is simply another UI screen and the only interaction is between you and this UI.

Why is actually interacting with the planet from a ship important? You can still get PVP out of these industrial sites because people can shoot down these ships that are trying to establish these structures. Later, players can bomb the hell out of these structures and create planetary defenses. Wrapping planet interaction into some UI your going to have a tough time developing any of those things. Unfortunately if players only interaction is fumbling around in yet another obscure UI window you lost two big things, fun and PVP.

Hope I am wrong, good luck with the expansion.

Kolya Medz
Gallente
PyroStorm Enforcers
STR8NGE BREW
Posted - 2010.02.20 06:51:00 - [230]
 

Ooh im looking forward to this expansion. However, the guy above me has a good point, it shouldnt just be another UI screen, it needs to be tangible.



Also, no more tech 3? I want a tech 3 battleship already hahaha.

Zemkhoff
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:01:00 - [231]
 

Edited by: Zemkhoff on 20/02/2010 07:01:31
Projected casualties:

dramiel
lasers
amarr recons

Deviana Sevidon
Gallente
Panta-Rhei
Butterfly Effect Alliance
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:30:00 - [232]
 

Originally by: captcommunic
Originally by: Lemming Dugg
Originally by: captcommunic
Awesome! A Fail expansion...Cant wait.

You can clearly see they are running out of ideas.


stfu u tardMad


:Troll


Not really, he is right. EVERY Expansion so far was about fixing lag. Sure we got a bit of new content but nearly everything the developers produced went directly into 0.0 sovereignity blobfests.

Sorry but lag cannot be fixed because because if CCP would indeed fix lag and allow 2k players to fight in the same system without difficulty, then players would start to throw 5k into a system in an attempt to get the advantage by crashing a node and then there would be even more whining. Lag might indeed be fixed indirectly with planetary interaction when players can spread out and get something other to do then just waiting for a grid to load.

Quit whining and HTFU.

Cracker Miner
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:30:00 - [233]
 

when do we get another epic trailer, the dominion one was awsome, (even if fleet battle usually dont look like that)

Carniflex
StarHunt
Fallout Project
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:36:00 - [234]
 

Planterary physics

There is little issue with new planetary skins. They are often in places where that type of planet is impossible. Like terran worlds 64 AU from dwarf star showing you near absolute zero temperatures and no atmosphere if you do show info. Please do something about it before or when you put out this tyrannis expansion.

St0rmcrow
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:37:00 - [235]
 

That looks great and all and I'm all for it as long as it includes W-Space, and does not require Sovergenty. W-space is getting less and less valuable. Soon it will be nothing more than a shortcut.

With that in mind, there are many of us that live in W-Space and that has revealed some problems that impact those in low/null sec as well.

First, we need to have a "Person Hanger Array" as a storage space for our individule corp members. A place where the CEO and/or directors can access as well, but otherwise is unique to each corporate member. Much like in a station. Or, at the least, make an option to allocate a number of space in the normal Corporate Hanger Array for individule corporate members. As it stands now, they have to store things in CANS, and they can't open the can directly, they have to get a industrial, move the can into it, and open it from there. What a pain in the ass.

Second thing that needs fixed is the naming of the hangers. Being forced to use the smae set of names in all hangers and offices means we cant really associate a specific use. For example, I have a corporate hanger array above a POS which is for fuel only, and nothing else. I need to be able to name the hangers in each one uniquely.

Third is the naming of POS structures. Some things like the tower can be renamed, and some labs, but what happens when you have corporate hangers used for specific functions. I need to be able to rename them as well. Also, what about POS defenses? If I could rename them, I could tell a team that gun 1B needs ammo, instead of trying to describe the exact location.

Finally, what about expanded fuel bays on the tower. We need the option to expand them more. so they hold more fuel.

Okay, thats my 2 ISK worth.

Axexut
Caldari
AWE Corporation
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:50:00 - [236]
 

Edited by: Axexut on 20/02/2010 08:07:03
Edited by: Axexut on 20/02/2010 08:03:48


Great! More stuff that we didn't ask for.

You still haven't fixed the basics:

- ALLIANCE hangers in 0.0 space - not just Corp hangers
- ALLIANCE POS gunners in 0.0 space - not just Corp gunners
- TRUE BLUE settings for POSs (no need to share with Blue alliances POS PWs if they themselves are Blue, they can just warp and in the shield)
- REAL penalties for leaving an Alliance (kicking reds out of your station even if they have JCs there after some reasonable period of time)
- Destructable Stations - Why did you make them permanent?
- MULTIPLE stations in 0.0 sec systems - You have them in High-sec. Why not here? Mechanics reasons my arse!
- DIRECTABLE Stations - When putting down a Station, let us allign it where we want!
- Non-Drone Rat Anomolaies in Drone Space (You get Drone Anomolaies in bounty space no? Consider it an incursion and let us play too!)
- Allow Comms officers to post but not delete mails (a separate entitlement for Comms Offiers to be able to delete Corp / Alliance mails)
- Allow Alliance Director level mails on Corp level Structure Events (OUR Corp X is being attacked - let ALLIANCE level Directors get the mail)
- A better Anchoring interface for all POS Mods.
- "Smart Warp Bubbles" what trap reds but not blues
- Allow Alliances ro reset the payment dates for Sov Bills rather then based off claiming (prepays - thought you would like that no?)
- Fix the mechanic that if a red / blue POS set up ON Dominion is gone / destroyed / removed that Alliances owning a system can reestablish a blue POS below a moon-anchred TCU.
- And more

Before you continue to add content - FIX what already is broken!

See you in Iceland this next FanFest and I hope you can drink!

Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
Posted - 2010.02.20 07:57:00 - [237]
 

Originally by: Carniflex
Planterary physics

There is little issue with new planetary skins. They are often in places where that type of planet is impossible. Like terran worlds 64 AU from dwarf star showing you near absolute zero temperatures and no atmosphere if you do show info. Please do something about it before or when you put out this tyrannis expansion.


While this is legitimate gripe it is a secondary concern at best. If it gets in, good job. if it gets left out, not a big deal. It will not make or break this expansion. I'll add my thumbs up for the suggestion too, though.

CCP should focus on getting a good and working system in place, that doesn't screw over existing industry and is more than just another un-interesting and un-immersive info screen. We have these in game already to last for a lifetime, so I don't want to see all the potential go wasted like that. Even if it is just 'gardening' it has to have clear visual indicators(not another exel sheet) and proper gameplay. There are enough good gardening and empire controlling games in the world to steal ideas from, so they don't have excuses if they produce another dull and un-immersive spread sheet from all this. They should focus on doing something impressive with this or just not bother doing anything at all with it at this time.

Direct Funebru
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.02.20 08:09:00 - [238]
 

oh the gold rush will be epic on this one, as well as the bugs

159Pinky
Trans-Solar Works
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2010.02.20 08:17:00 - [239]
 

So, no fighting on planets, doest his mean: first come = first serve?
So if someone builds factories, mining installations on a planet it cannot be taken away from him? Sounds pretty stupid if this is the case

Triss S'Jet
Gallente
Posted - 2010.02.20 08:21:00 - [240]
 

AWESOME

Just fix the bugs on the way, please.


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