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blankseplocked Invention BPC runs with decryptors - can anybody explain my error?
 
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Benjamin Despereaux
Posted - 2010.02.18 13:15:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Benjamin Despereaux on 18/02/2010 13:15:57
Hi,
I just ran some invention jobs. I put in the datacores, a Retriever blueprint and an "Engagement Plan" decryptor.

For the two jobs that came out successful, I had Mackinaw blueprints with 2 Runs and ME -2.

Why did I get runs, when I expected to get 3 (1 base run for ships + 2 from the decryptor bonus) ?

I have found the decryptor description here and here.

Can somebody please explain to me what I am doing wrong?

Thanks,
Benjamin

Jokiller Gerius
Gallente
Posted - 2010.02.18 13:26:00 - [2]
 

where you using a max run retriever bpc or a one run copy

Benjamin Despereaux
Posted - 2010.02.18 13:38:00 - [3]
 

I didn't check, because I thought that for ship the maximum value was always 1 run before decryptors.

I think it was an 1 run copy. Does this affect the final number of runs? and if it does, in what way?

Thanks,
Benjamin

Millimage
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2010.02.18 13:52:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Millimage on 18/02/2010 13:55:05
You only get the full runs if you're using max run BPC to invent from. If not, you'll lose a run from the resulting BPC but since there is a minimum of 1 run this doesn't matter UNLESS you're using run bonus decryptors.

So my guess is you were inventing from a BPC that was a one run (well, not max runs anyway) copy.

Ninjaedit: I think the complete formula is:

Output Runs = min(max( round down ( (InputBPCRuns / T1MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy) * (T2MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy / 10) + DecryptorRuns ), 1), T2MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy)

Faranti Centro
Caldari
Genesis Rising
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2010.02.18 14:16:00 - [5]
 

I thought the Max Run applied only to ammo and modules. Invented T2 BPC's would turn out the same regardless of max run or 1 run bpc.

I believe back in December I ran a batch of Invention jobs on Max Run Rifter bpc's looking for better than 1 run bpc's of Wolf and Jaguar bpc's and got only the 1 run bpc.

If anyone has recently run Max Run ship bpc's for Invention I'd like to know.

Jack Sabastian
Posted - 2010.02.18 14:42:00 - [6]
 

If you are using a decrptor that gives bonus runs then you also need a Max run BPC or you lose a run.

The Important part in the formula Millimage posted is:
(InputBPCRuns / T1MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy) * (T2MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy / 10)
(lets call that baseT2runs)

For rigs and ships this can be at most 1 since T2MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy is 10
For Ammo, Drones and Modules this can be 10 since T2MaxRunsPerBlueprintCopy 100

So for rigs and ships if you use a 1 run T1 BPC, then 0<baseT2runs <1 which rounds down to 0. But we are guaranteed 1 run so we get a 1 run T2 BPC. If you use a max run T1 bpc then baseT2runs = 1... and you get a 1 run T2 BPC.

Now if we use a decrptor with a one 1 run T1 BPC, then 0<baseT2runs <1. Add the DecryptorRuns then you get:
"DecryptorRuns <baseT2runs+DecryptorRuns <1+baseT2runs <1"
which rounds down to DecryptorRuns.

With a max run T1 BPC then baseT2runs = 1 add the DecryptorRuns and you get a T2 BPC with DecryptorRuns+1 runs on it.

So the ONLY time you should use a 1 run T1 BPC is when you are inventing a ship or a rig WITHOUT a decryptor, or you lose a run.

Benjamin Despereaux
Posted - 2010.02.18 14:45:00 - [7]
 

I understand, next time I will use a max run bpc. Thanks for taking the time to explain to me.

Benjamin

Ruziel
Minmatar
Twilight Military Industrial Complex
Posted - 2010.02.18 17:40:00 - [8]
 

For a breakdown on the math on this, see my post here:
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1205778&page=1#6

Dafydd ab'Rhys
Caldari
Quantum Horizons
Art of War Alliance
Posted - 2010.02.18 22:50:00 - [9]
 

Hi there

I think your problem is that you installed (either by error or Eve doing silly buggers) the wrong decryptor

The galante ME -2 decryptor is Test Reports, which will give you +1 to the runs (for a total of -2)

Engagement plan will give you 3 runs at -3 ME

So if you do have the BPCs at -2 ME, then Test reports have been used and the 2 runs is correct

Cheers
Dafydd

Benjamin Despereaux
Posted - 2010.02.19 11:09:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Dafydd ab'Rhys
Hi there

I think your problem is that you installed (either by error or Eve doing silly buggers) the wrong decryptor

The galante ME -2 decryptor is Test Reports, which will give you +1 to the runs (for a total of -2)

Engagement plan will give you 3 runs at -3 ME

So if you do have the BPCs at -2 ME, then Test reports have been used and the 2 runs is correct

Cheers
Dafydd


Erm... You are right, but I have typed it wrong here on the forums, the actual ME is -3 and not -2.

So I think the posters above have the truth of it, I probably didn't use a full run BPC, because I didn't know it would make any difference. Now I know it does, so when using decryptors I will use only full runs BPC's.

Thanks anyway,
Benjamin


 

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