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Mendolus
Aurelius Federation
Posted - 2010.01.23 00:33:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: GrandPa Throttlebottom

I donít think soÖ If your goal is to get more miners (i.e. targets) into low sec just giving them more tank isnít going to help at all. Once pinned itís just a matter of time. What is needed is to fix the risk/reward to encourage miners into taking trips down into lowsec and that means a cheap miner that they can afford to lose, not a more powerful one.



Cheap miner's already exist, Vexor, and Arbitrator.

And I coulda swore I said they needed to add more carrots in low security to make it even worth mining, I musta not read what I wrote very closely... oh wai...

Razz

Dusica
Amarr
Posted - 2010.01.23 09:26:00 - [62]
 

Edited by: Dusica on 23/01/2010 09:28:10
I vote for

Tech3 mining frigate!!! It will not mine more then hulk. But it should mine like retriver.

It can be fitted with covert ops cloak and it is designe to be made to mine in dangerous space like low sec and 0.0! It will have big cargo hold and relativly big drone bay to use 5 mining and 5 small drones to defend and mine! It small size will alowe it to run when needed to and it will provide good defence versus bigger NPC targets in hostile space.

I can already see hordes of cloaky miners go roam in 0.0 and low sec attacking belts and striping them off moving from one to another with lighting speed.

Maeve Kell
Posted - 2010.01.23 09:44:00 - [63]
 

removal of meta 0 loot would make hulks stronger.... somehow x_X

Redbull Snorter
Posted - 2010.01.23 11:42:00 - [64]
 

Remove Plush Compounds from the game

Stop rats from dropping meta 0 items.

Stop asteroids spawning in highsec apart from veld, scord and plag (plag rarely and only small rox in 0.5)

So only trit, pye and a small amount of mex would be minable in highsec. Making lowsec ores more valuable.

Make the lowsec ores (hemorfight, kernite, jaspet and omber) scale up thier lower grade ores. So instead of:
22 zyd
424 nox
212 iso
212 trit
for hermofight, it would become:
22 zyd
424 nox
2120 iso
42400 trit.
(cba to do exact values, but increace the amount of iso and trit so the market value of the trit is as much as the market value of the zyd, currently the trit in all ores bar veldspar is totally worthless).

Veliria
Posted - 2010.01.23 15:48:00 - [65]
 

Edited by: Veliria on 23/01/2010 15:50:01
New Mining ships are needed, but not mining boats that just mine more ore, it would only hurt the market and help the macros.
Instead I'd rather see large barges that have huge cargoholds, range bonuses, drone mining bonuses and such.
A Gas Mining boat would be nice as well.

The low-sec ores aren't crappy due to their composition but because of mission loot refining and the Drone Regions having bottomed out the price of Nocxium. When I joined EVE in 2007, Nocx was at about 300 ISK a unit, the market graph from a year before indicated it was at 600 ISK at one point.
With those prices, low-sec ores would've been worth a lot more to mine back then than they are now.

Nocx needs a fix (Iso as well IMO), not the low-sec ores.

Aurora IV
Posted - 2010.01.23 17:26:00 - [66]
 

What the hell are you all smoking? A 20% increase in supply =/= a 20% drop in prices. For a 20% increase in supply to equal a 20% drop in prices, then the supply and demand curces would both have to be perfect X=Y equations. If the curves are inelastic then a 20% increase in supply would cause a much greater decrease in price. If the curves are elastic, then a 20% increase in supply would casue a much smaller decerase in price.

Economics: Elasticity

TL:DR, only the eve economist would know if 20% more supply = 20% less prices.

tophat reddevil1
Posted - 2010.01.28 19:33:00 - [67]
 

so it seem that most of us agree that a new ships is need for mining and the larger holds and longer ranges would be nice just put on a new platform

Forlani Tristania
Gallente
Feral Tendency
Posted - 2010.01.28 21:15:00 - [68]
 

Originally by: tophat reddevil1
so it seem that most of us agree that a new ships is need for mining and the larger holds and longer ranges would be nice just put on a new platform


Well, I'm a subscriber to the fix loot theory myself. If someone wants to fight the "new mining ship" battle, focus on a gas mining-bonused boat. 5x highs to accommodate Gas Mining level 5 skill, and cargo up the yinyang.

If you want to boost mining a bit, ask for:
1) T2 mining drones able to mine ice and gas.
2) Rigs that improve laser yield, reduce cycle duration, extend range, etc.

Meridius Tyree
Posted - 2010.02.02 19:56:00 - [69]
 

Edited by: Meridius Tyree on 02/02/2010 19:56:52
I still think a mining barge that gives you half a chance in low sec/0.0 space is what is needed. While empire space is saturated with miners, low sec's appeal is the rare ores and that a new exhumer class miner with 3 highs, 2 fitted for strip mining, 1 for cloaking that gives a special "O.R.E." bonus of being able to mine cloaked, with 5 or 6 mids for shield tank (or some other modification for high resistences) and 4 or 5 lows for anti-tackling warp core strength or transport warp core protection would suffice. Align time and warp out would need to be lowered but this would allow your (me) carebear miners to venture out into wild space without the 99.9% certainty of getting ganked. (I also wanted to bring this thread back to the top. CCP...)

Induc
Amarr
Posted - 2010.02.02 20:33:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Meridius Tyree
that gives a special "O.R.E." bonus of being able to mine cloaked

sorry, but that must be the dumbest idea I've ever heard...

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2010.02.02 22:36:00 - [71]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 02/02/2010 22:38:10

Better yields than Hulks ? NO WAY.
But yields comparable with Covetors, with cargo spaces far larger than a Hulk and much better tanks, sure, why the heck not.

P.S. Or heck, something with Covetor-like extraction capability *AND* larger-than-Hulk cargo *AND* battlecruiser-class EHP/tank *AND* cruiser-class firepower, that would be awesome.
Of course, it would have to cost at least as much as a battleship plus a hulk put together Twisted Evil

Subject River
Posted - 2010.02.02 23:16:00 - [72]
 

contrary to the believe of most people in this thread, introducing a miner that mines more than a hulk would improve the situation for miners, for 2 reasons:
a) currently 42% of the minerals are produced via mining. as in 42 out of 100. if you introduce a ship with twice the mining yield (just as example), youre at 84 out of 142 minerals (=60%). thus it has the same relative effect as nerfig the other sources of mineral production by about 30%.
b) mineral prices are pretty much capped by t1 insurance costs atm. meaning: they cant really go down, there will just be more people self-destructing battleships.

nevertheless, a solution to prevent macrominers from doing their stuff (or to enable miners to access 0.0 without significant trouble - like t3 cruisers can currently do with 0.0 plexes - would be good. might include some way to make the asteroid belts not so easily warpable as currently (as in: make it just as hard as finding a guy thats plexing in your system, not just warp to all belts and have him 100% within 1 minute).

Bashe Zor
Minmatar
NED-Clan
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.02.02 23:30:00 - [73]
 

I really don't get this rubbish about miners not being able to go to 0.0. Haven't you heard? EVERYONE gets blown up if they're not blue to the natives. If you ARE blue, you can mine just fine.

If you can stand the boredom that is.

Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.03 05:32:00 - [74]
 

Edited by: Cipher Jones on 03/02/2010 05:37:58
Originally by: Marcus Delloro
I'd rather see something that mines less than a Hulk but with a MUCH stronger tank. Might be a way to get carebears like me outta empire.


Wish granted. Go buy a maelstrom.

Quote:
I still think a mining barge that gives you half a chance in low sec/0.0 space is what is needed.


Hmm, it was in this very forum they had so many people crying about the opposition to hulkageddon claiming that it was easy to avoid getting ganked in a hulk. But somehow you can get ganked in lowsec? Wait I'm confused thats total hypocracy...

"welcome to eve online would you like to supersize your griefmeal today?"

Subject River
Posted - 2010.02.03 08:28:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: Cipher Jones
Edited by: Cipher Jones on 03/02/2010 05:37:58
Hmm, it was in this very forum they had so many people crying about the opposition to hulkageddon claiming that it was easy to avoid getting ganked in a hulk. But somehow you can get ganked in lowsec? Wait I'm confused thats total hypocracy...

"welcome to eve online would you like to supersize your griefmeal today?"


ever thought about the difference between avoiding getting ganked by a 5man gang of destroyers in highsec vs a gang of battlecruisers/hacs that doesnt get killed by npcs within 15s of attacking you in lowsec vs bubblecamps in a 80 m/s ship in 0.0? guess not ...

TheMahdi
Posted - 2010.02.03 08:33:00 - [76]
 

I would like to see something with less yield then the current Exhumers but can fit a Covert ops cloak and doesn't have horrific speed/agility. Something rather agile actually.

That should get a lot more carebears into 0.0/low sec looking for the precious ABC roids. Would still need access to outpost/POS/Rorq but atleast with a blockade runner, mining ABC in 0.0 wouldn't be impossible.

Subject River
Posted - 2010.02.03 08:49:00 - [77]
 

Originally by: TheMahdi
I would like to see something with less yield then the current Exhumers but can fit a Covert ops cloak and doesn't have horrific speed/agility. Something rather agile actually.

That should get a lot more carebears into 0.0/low sec looking for the precious ABC roids. Would still need access to outpost/POS/Rorq but atleast with a blockade runner, mining ABC in 0.0 wouldn't be impossible.


well it would actually stil be. some form of onboard ore compression/refining would be needed - considering even Arkonor is only 3.5 times the value in ISK/hour scordite gives you, the extra time/work consumed got to stay low. if youre looking at three quarters the yield of a hulk i doubt a blockade runner could really haul it (several jumps to the closest npc refinery). so youd need 2 blockade runners. meaning: 3 times the workforce for three quarters the yield of a hulk -> 3/4 * 3,5 = 2,625 < 3 -> youre better of mining scordite with 3 hulks in empire. aka: nothing is gonna improve.
thus it is required to have some form of compression/refining onboard - which is unlikely to happen :(

Salmeria
Tovarsky Pharmaceuticals
Posted - 2010.02.03 09:00:00 - [78]
 

How about a type of ship that has a 30km/3 cargo bay but only mines about as much as a covetor.

Pretty much it would be a large mining ship with a good cargo bay. However it would be very slow and have less mining capabilities then a hulk. Maybe have the skill at V make it mine the same as a hulk but have it be like a rank 9 skill to make it something that players really want to earn.

This would give players something to train for after a hulk and eliminate the need to jetcan mine. However the ship would still be slow and ponderous and would be better used for empire mining. However it would not be as effective at mining as a hulk, which would still make hulks the better ship to use if you are in a mining gang with a dedicated hauler!

It would eliminate the need for jetcan mining and make it easier to mine in highsec while giving people a ship that can easily hold large amounts of highend ore.

You could call them the 'Behemoth'

Veldsparmonster
Posted - 2010.02.03 09:47:00 - [79]
 

Originally by: Salmeria
How about a type of ship that has a 30km/3 cargo bay but only mines about as much as a covetor.

Pretty much it would be a large mining ship with a good cargo bay. However it would be very slow and have less mining capabilities then a hulk. Maybe have the skill at V make it mine the same as a hulk but have it be like a rank 9 skill to make it something that players really want to earn.

This would give players something to train for after a hulk and eliminate the need to jetcan mine. However the ship would still be slow and ponderous and would be better used for empire mining. However it would not be as effective at mining as a hulk, which would still make hulks the better ship to use if you are in a mining gang with a dedicated hauler!

It would eliminate the need for jetcan mining and make it easier to mine in highsec while giving people a ship that can easily hold large amounts of highend ore.

You could call them the 'Behemoth'


Ummm... no... Highsec doesn't need a buff, (if anything) it needs a nerf.

What we need (IF ANY) is some super mining capital thing that can only be used in low sec/0.0, which would mean that people would be encouraged to mine there, as opposed to in highsec.

We could call them the 'Beluga'.

Omar Khayyam
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.03 09:54:00 - [80]
 

we need pirate faction miner ships !!!!YARRRR!!

Pandares
Gallente
hindsight is 20-20
Carebears 'R Us
Posted - 2010.02.03 09:58:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: Cipher Jones
Hmm, it was in this very forum they had so many people crying about the opposition to hulkageddon claiming that it was easy to avoid getting ganked in a hulk. But somehow you can get ganked in lowsec? Wait I'm confused thats total hypocracy...


ehm no.
- avoiding getting ganked in hi-sec only requires you to survive till Concord arrives
- it's only hypocracy if it's the same people making both arguments

TheMahdi
Posted - 2010.02.03 10:19:00 - [82]
 

Originally by: Subject River

well it would actually stil be. some form of onboard ore compression/refining would be needed - considering even Arkonor is only 3.5 times the value in ISK/hour scordite gives you, the extra time/work consumed got to stay low. if youre looking at three quarters the yield of a hulk i doubt a blockade runner could really haul it (several jumps to the closest npc refinery). so youd need 2 blockade runners. meaning: 3 times the workforce for three quarters the yield of a hulk -> 3/4 * 3,5 = 2,625 < 3 -> youre better of mining scordite with 3 hulks in empire. aka: nothing is gonna improve.
thus it is required to have some form of compression/refining onboard - which is unlikely to happen :(


Like I said, you will ultimately need a POS, station/outpost or Rorqual. This is a multiplayer game afterall but you could always get a Roruqal alt. Even if you have a blockade runner alt, all you need is some blue space and you could easily pack a medium POS + medium intensive refinery, tiny bit of fuel and stront into a blockade runner. But your right high sec mining is profitable, personally I think it's too profitable.

But should such easy ISK be soloable? Definetly not. The covert ops mining barge would just give you an easier way to get access to it and move around without the need of a Rorq to jump you around.

It's not like there aren't hundreds of corps and alliances with POSes/outposts/stations.

Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.02.03 11:47:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Subject River
Originally by: Cipher Jones
Edited by: Cipher Jones on 03/02/2010 05:37:58
Hmm, it was in this very forum they had so many people crying about the opposition to hulkageddon claiming that it was easy to avoid getting ganked in a hulk. But somehow you can get ganked in lowsec? Wait I'm confused thats total hypocracy...

"welcome to eve online would you like to supersize your griefmeal today?"


ever thought about the difference between avoiding getting ganked by a 5man gang of destroyers in highsec vs a gang of battlecruisers/hacs that doesnt get killed by npcs within 15s of attacking you in lowsec vs bubblecamps in a 80 m/s ship in 0.0? guess not ...


I was being sarcastic my friend. theres nothing you can do to avoid being ganked.


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