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Pyrhus Taavi
Posted - 2009.11.20 17:34:00 - [1]
 

You know, since the ships featured in it have been cancelled...

murder one
Gallente
Death of Virtue
MeatSausage EXPRESS
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:06:00 - [2]
 

lol...

Aisley Tyrion
Aseveljet
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:13:00 - [3]
 

I was going to troll you but actually you're correct. ugh Good catch, sir!

Marko Riva
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:43:00 - [4]
 

Badum tishhhh

Max Romeo
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:48:00 - [5]
 

Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content, and should be seen as a patch. I guess this covers all post-Trinity 'expansions' too. I remember when expansions were not just improvement sets and actually expanded the game. Improvement should be expected.

El Liptonez
V0LTA
VOLTA Corp
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:51:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content, and should be seen as a patch. I guess this covers all post-Trinity 'expansions' too. I remember when expansions were not just improvement sets and actually expanded the game. Improvement should be expected.

I'd call Apocrypha quite an expansion.

Sin Meng
Gallente
Creative Assembly
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:56:00 - [7]
 

Sorry but, yeah, +1. Neutral

Max Romeo
Posted - 2009.11.20 18:58:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: El Liptonez
Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content, and should be seen as a patch. I guess this covers all post-Trinity 'expansions' too. I remember when expansions were not just improvement sets and actually expanded the game. Improvement should be expected.

I'd call Apocrypha quite an expansion.


Apoc :
Tech 3 cruisers (modular ships) - New Content
New kind of exploration with wormholes - Code/asset refactoring, hardly new content
Trinity II graphics for the remaining objects and effects - The largest change in the patch, which 'should' have come sooner, but acceptably late. Max respect to the artists for the amount of models and textures.
Epic mission arc (long storyline mission with branching) - Code/asset refactoring, hardly anyone cares
Characters can rearrange their base attribute points - Incremental update
24 hour skill queue - Expected improvement
Classic client and Linux client discontinued - Sad but necessary change, not an update or anything
New scanning system - Expected improvement

So, you're telling me besides the art assets there that there was a vast expansion? compare it to say Exodus :
Starbases
Sovereignty
Deadspace complexes
Mining Barges
Strip Miners
Ice Fields
Rogue Drones
Agent Offers
Alliances
Level 4 agents

That, all provided by a VASTLY smaller workforce, a lot of both art and code.

Sgt Napalm
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2009.11.20 19:05:00 - [9]
 

+1

Rex Hargrove
ElitistOps
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2009.11.20 19:31:00 - [10]
 

I'm surprised this post hasn't been deleted yet.

Benedict Carol
Posted - 2009.11.20 19:50:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Rex Hargrove
I'm surprised this post hasn't been deleted yet.


To be fair, though, a lot of things surprise goonswarm Laughing

Captian Conrad
Minmatar
Empyrean Warriors
Posted - 2009.11.20 20:10:00 - [12]
 

This thread is SHOCKING and throws my image of eve into QUESTION! ShockedConfusedNeutralSadSmile

Alaura Aquila
Minmatar
Matari Legion Holding
Matari Legion
Posted - 2009.11.20 20:12:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Alaura Aquila on 20/11/2009 20:12:54
Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content,


What about the planets, kick ass new camo paint and improved stars?

Max Romeo
Posted - 2009.11.20 20:23:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Alaura Aquila
Edited by: Alaura Aquila on 20/11/2009 20:12:54
Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content,


What about the planets, kick ass new camo paint and improved stars?


As I've said in the first comment, if you exclude art assets - the 'feature' list is somewhat extremely short.
Time and time again, its art that is saving a patch, but at the end of the day the art doesnt expand your gameplay options or thinking. Even if you had to accept that perhaps art is a central point of eve - would you say that those changes would take more than a few weeks work? What happened with all the other teams working at the same time? were they held up by waiting for people to get them textures?

New developments should include : game design, code, interaction design, art and quality assurance.

You are a stakeholder in EVE, as the end user. You have the right to question and think about topics like this.

Captian Conrad
Minmatar
Empyrean Warriors
Posted - 2009.11.20 20:27:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Max Romeonew
Rabble Rabble


I sorta agree allthough dommion was announced at fanfest ect, this expantion feels very rushed and last minuite Crying or Very sad, many features droped for time, the features page isnt up yet due to removal/changes ect. Hopefully a seris of "patches" over the next month will bump these in Smile

Btw less we not foget moondoogle/new ingame brower + COSMOS Very Happy

Pyrhus Taavi
Posted - 2009.11.20 20:30:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Captian Conrad
Btw less we not foget moondoogle/new ingame brower + COSMOS Very Happy


Oh man I can't wait for COSMOS! Those missions are going to be so fun, and they're laying the groundwork for future PVE expansion! Maybe it will get people interested in exploration.

Max Romeo
Posted - 2009.11.20 20:35:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Captian Conrad
Originally by: Max Romeonew
Rabble Rabble


I sorta agree allthough dommion was announced at fanfest ect, this expantion feels very rushed and last minuite Crying or Very sad, many features droped for time, the features page isnt up yet due to removal/changes ect. Hopefully a seris of "patches" over the next month will bump these in Smile

Btw less we not foget moondoogle/new ingame brower + COSMOS Very Happy


Yeah, Im not trying to be a massive tool - just to make people think about product development and time. While it may have been announced at FanFest, you would expect almost everything to be ready before then and just have to go through some testing. You are paying people all year round, not for 3 months of the year :)

Everyone has a Windows ME sometime.

Gemini Andromedae
Posted - 2009.11.20 21:31:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content, and should be seen as a patch. I guess this covers all post-Trinity 'expansions' too. I remember when expansions were not just improvement sets and actually expanded the game. Improvement should be expected.
2500 new solarsystems, t3 cruisers etc etc in Apocrypha...

CCP is doing damn fine job, stop crying kiddo.

Lazarann
Ideal Machine
Posted - 2009.11.20 21:36:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Gemini Andromedae
Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content, and should be seen as a patch. I guess this covers all post-Trinity 'expansions' too. I remember when expansions were not just improvement sets and actually expanded the game. Improvement should be expected.
2500 new solarsystems, t3 cruisers etc etc in Apocrypha...

CCP is doing damn fine job, stop crying kiddo.

People only care about new stuff if it has something to do with their day to day eve-life.

Gemini Andromedae
Posted - 2009.11.20 21:46:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Lazarann
Originally by: Gemini Andromedae
Originally by: Max Romeo
Can you guys also stop calling it an expansion - there is pretty much no new content, and should be seen as a patch. I guess this covers all post-Trinity 'expansions' too. I remember when expansions were not just improvement sets and actually expanded the game. Improvement should be expected.
2500 new solarsystems, t3 cruisers etc etc in Apocrypha...

CCP is doing damn fine job, stop crying kiddo.

People only care about new stuff if it has something to do with their day to day eve-life.
True. Everyone are flying motherships now. Everyone is flying Titans. Sure. Laughing

Most funniest thing is that people are selling their assets based on information in SISI, wich is completely test server. Just wait untill the release day.

Remember Marauders? Wink

mechtech
SRS Industries
SRS.
Posted - 2009.11.20 21:53:00 - [21]
 

Expansion have major and minor releases.

Apocrypha was the biggest expansion ever to hit Eve, Dominion will therefore probably be smaller, with less new content and more fixing current systems. The expansion after Dominion will probably be another big content release, ect ect, see the pattern?

Max Romeo
Posted - 2009.11.20 21:59:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Gemini Andromedae

People only care about new stuff if it has something to do with their day to day eve-life.
True. Everyone are flying motherships now. Everyone is flying Titans. Sure. Laughing

Most funniest thing is that people are selling their assets based on information in SISI, wich is completely test server. Just wait untill the release day.

Remember Marauders? Wink


I think you are missing the point of this whole thing. The topic is that of development, while the testserver is part of that, it is a prime example of the problem. SiSi is not used for actual testing, they never throw completely broken or conceptual changes onto it, there is always a 'good' chance that changes seen on SiSi will closely/exactly match what is being deployed. As such its more a fitting test server and a 'lets prospect' data dump. Seldom do we see cool ideas that are just roughed out or heavily in work, and when we do it often gives us a good indication, such as "storefronts".

At the end of the day, thinking that it takes a few months of effort (of a hundred or so people) to randomly generate 2500 systems and throw in 4 ships 60 odd mods only leads to stagnation.

While CCP tout being 'AGILE' compliant and using SCRUM etc - they seem to see EVE as a mature product that just requires small fixes and maybe a new feature here or there, instead that the methods they employ are meant for, such as a dynamic market where you need to implement new things and fixes to keep the stakeholders and gain new ones. At the end of the day, some strive for mediocrity, but CCP used to be the underdog, fighting with the big boys and winning, small numbers and big results.

When Trinity came out, I remember people being all 'Oh, who wants Ambulation - its going to be of no point', I was one of those people. But now, the idea of 'new' and expanding options makes it seem quite awesome and indeed worthy of development - but just like the backgrounds etc that people have considered features, it has been continually pushed back and almost fallen off the radar.

Jalif
Minmatar
Snuff Box
Posted - 2009.11.20 22:38:00 - [23]
 

owned ccp lol

Artassaut
Minmatar
Shadow Striders
Property Management Solutions
Posted - 2009.11.20 23:44:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Artassaut on 20/11/2009 23:47:54
I just don't get why they decided to change the first revision, which was what most people thought was a good Mothership change.

Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2009.11.21 00:43:00 - [25]
 

Edited by: Emperor Cheney on 21/11/2009 00:43:07
I'd like to flip all this negativity and compliment the CCP art department for actually delivering content. Not too sure what everyone else does

Carver DiGriz
Agony Unleashed
Posted - 2009.11.21 05:46:00 - [26]
 

Well at least we'll get walking in station, right?

Malande
Amarr
Galactic Express
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2009.11.21 06:32:00 - [27]
 

I get the feeling that theres a fair bit "going on" behind the scene in this expansion that may not seem to introduce many new toys now but is laying the foundation for future development.

The main examples of this in the up coming expansion are moondoggy and the new sov system.

Sure their not complete now and we're likely only to be seeing the initial implementation in this expansion but to say CCP are doing nothing except tweek a few odds and ends and add some new art is a little unfair on them.

Striping out all the old code and getting the new systems to work with what we currently have is a pretty big job! and more importantly getting it done now means more new toys in the near future :)

Agent Known
Posted - 2009.11.21 06:42:00 - [28]
 

I think the overall UI overhaul is quite a change...don't you think? Shocked

CCP Applebabe

Posted - 2009.11.21 08:34:00 - [29]
 

Troll.

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