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Nightsabre
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2009.11.12 02:06:00 - [1]
 

So finally Cidadel Cruise are found on the test server, however!

Citadel Cruise require, Citadel Cruise Missiles Level 1... PreReq of Cruise 5.

Now, I can understand why Citadel cruise would need cruise missiles 5, but this does kinda screw Caldari somewhat.

To use Captital Railguns, or Capital Blasters, you just need Capital Hybrid skill...

So us poor caldari have to train another skill up... joy!

Its Bad enough that our Citadels cant hit for crap, let alone making us train even more to use something no doubt all caldari cap pilots will want!!

Zi'Boo
Posted - 2009.11.12 02:30:00 - [2]
 

If you think this is bad for Caldari, take a look at the Naglfar Confused

Sfynx
Caldari
The Arrow Project
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.11.12 03:04:00 - [3]
 

Edited by: Sfynx on 12/11/2009 03:08:10
I agree it is a bit weird that Caldari needs two skill paths to get their 2 cap weapon variants, vs one skill path for Amarr and Gallente.

And yeh, poor Minmatar souls... :P

Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
Posted - 2009.11.12 03:26:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Nightsabre
So finally Cidadel Cruise are found on the test server, however!

Citadel Cruise require, Citadel Cruise Missiles Level 1... PreReq of Cruise 5.

Now, I can understand why Citadel cruise would need cruise missiles 5, but this does kinda screw Caldari somewhat.

To use Captital Railguns, or Capital Blasters, you just need Capital Hybrid skill...

So us poor caldari have to train another skill up... joy!

Its Bad enough that our Citadels cant hit for crap, let alone making us train even more to use something no doubt all caldari cap pilots will want!!
Yet, Cruise missile Specialisation doesn't require heavy missile specialisation which doesn't require Light missile specialisation...

and torp specialisation doesn't require HAM specialisation which doesn't need rocket specialisation....

William Caldon
Caldari
Golden Cross Enterprises
Posted - 2009.11.12 04:55:00 - [5]
 

This complaint is really minor considering if your flying a raven you should have cruise 5 already......

Fuujin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.12 07:07:00 - [6]
 

I wouldn't worry about the skill prereq--once you see the explosion radius, you'll start cross training into something useful.

Fun fact: small towers don't get full damage from citadels!

Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
Posted - 2009.11.12 08:51:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: William Caldon
This complaint is really minor considering if your flying a raven you should have cruise 5 already......


Why? Cruise is PVE weapon, Citadel Cruise is PVP weapon. Where's the overlap?

Ap0ll0n
Gallente
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.12 09:25:00 - [8]
 

Thats simple.

Train Hybrid weapons 5, and you get equal damage bonus to both T1 rails and T1 blasters.

But you need to train cruisemissiles to use cruise launchers, and torpedo´s to use siege launchers..

Why shouldn´t this apply to capital weapons too?

Xandor M
Posted - 2009.11.18 23:28:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: William Caldon
This complaint is really minor considering if your flying a raven you should have cruise 5 already......
I don't know of anyone that has cruise 5 already, and i know a lot of raven pilots

Love Denied
Gallente
Caldari Stainless Steel industries
Posted - 2009.11.18 23:43:00 - [10]
 

fine .. but then make so all needs a skill of its own .. blasters/rails/pulse/beam/arty/auto/ would mean everyone get hurt the same way .. well not minmatar but who likes those anyway ugh

Yakia TovilToba
Halliburton Inc.
Posted - 2009.11.19 00:36:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Xandor M
Originally by: William Caldon
This complaint is really minor considering if your flying a raven you should have cruise 5 already......
I don't know of anyone that has cruise 5 already, and i know a lot of raven pilots


And this won't change much, after the last missile nerf cruise missiles are useless for everything, even for PVE (torpgolem or drake/nighthawk/tengu are better in every way) so there is no point training cruise missiles at all.
However, the additional skilltraing doesn't matter since only a ****** would use a capital cruise missile phoenix, if the stats remain at the current state.

Impolite Andevil
New Dawn Corporation
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2009.11.19 00:53:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Yakia TovilToba
Originally by: Xandor M
Originally by: William Caldon
This complaint is really minor considering if your flying a raven you should have cruise 5 already......
I don't know of anyone that has cruise 5 already, and i know a lot of raven pilots


And this won't change much, after the last missile nerf cruise missiles are useless for everything, even for PVE (torpgolem or drake/nighthawk/tengu are better in every way) so there is no point training cruise missiles at all.
However, the additional skilltraing doesn't matter since only a ****** would use a capital cruise missile phoenix, if the stats remain at the current state.


Unfortunately, the new range of citadel torps means that most pilots will have to use capital cruise missiles.

Dallas23
Posted - 2009.11.19 01:44:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Dallas23 on 19/11/2009 01:56:36
I have had cruise missile 5 for a over a year now so that is not an issue. How ever what I do see a probem is explosion sig raidus of the citadel cruis and torps as they are on sisi. And even then I am not sure how this even translates to the compact citadel torps that the new fighter bombers use.

At his point I would rather just seem them leave citadel torps as they are on TQ and just discard this whole idea of changing them and adding citadel cruise till they can add something that is so far off scale that it is can only be considered a joke or that CCP just hates missiles altogether.

Edit: Also another alternative I may ask for is do not change the bonuses on the phoenix but add turret slot so that I could use guns which will prove more usefull than the citadel missiles with bonuses.

General Meridus
Minmatar
Posted - 2009.11.19 02:49:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Xandor M quote
I don't know of anyone that has cruise 5 already, and i know a lot of raven pilots


Well I have cruise V, so now you know at least one. On the other hand I hate Ravens and fly mostly Minmatar. (Which means you basically have to have level V everything.)

Arra Lith
HUSARIA
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.19 09:41:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: Arra Lith on 19/11/2009 09:50:12
I'm sure about 1 thing: if CCP would ever add railgun slots for Phoenix I would go for 3x Capital Hybrid Turrets - even without bonuses. Kinetic damage missile bonus is useless anyway (unless you shoot this rare minmatar POS as everything else has nice kinetic resists, caps included - especially with knowledge that x Phoenixes is at opponent disposal).
Im sure Naglfar pilots with 4x turret slots and 4x missile slots would fit only 4x projectiles platforms.

So why screwing missiles even more ? 2x longer train time for something worse than turrets seems strange.
Delayed damage is high enough penalty I think. Advantages?
- Selection of damage type nullified by losing kinetic-only damage bonus (25% lower DPS).
- Slightly higher base damage (comparing to guns) nullified by lower skill bonuses:
*missile warhead upgrades = 10% damage bonus / gunnery surgical strike = 15% damage bonus
*missile rapid launch = 15% better ROF / gunnery rapid firing = 20% better ROF
*not really used by capitals (as they shoot usually stationary objects): target navigation prediction +50% explosion velocity (damage reduced by x% because of high target velocity) / motion prediction = 25% better tracking
other bonus skills: guided missile precision skill = dont work for capital weapons / controlled bursts = -25% capacitor usage (useless for projectiles)

-slightly better damage at higher range at cost of lower damage at close range (comparing to turrets - as gunnery users can adjust ammo by range)

I dont have cruise missiles, as they are useless (crappy damage, long travel time) - Im much better with smaller ship and heavy missiles (only slightly damage difference vs cruises) or turret platform (rokh) for high range combat or torpedos on battleship for close range fights.
Will I train Cruises V just to use Phoenix? I dont think so. Propably better to just train for Moros (as it uses already hybrid weapons - only need to train gallente bs V).

Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2009.11.19 10:08:00 - [16]
 

What are the range, speed and dps stats for capital cruise and torps on sisi now?


 

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