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blankseplocked Shifting system security level
 
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MightyRhinox
Minmatar
Rhinox Heavy Industries
Twilight Military Industrial Complex Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.10 09:34:00 - [1]
 

Okay, just for ****s and giggles, in the real world (yes I am aware this is a game) if an area experiences a surge in crime the police tend to try and crack down by sending more police to that area. If an area has relatively little crime, police resources are redirected to other areas.

Wouldn't it make life interesting if concord would do the same?

Rather than static sec levels, they would be readjusted once a week or once a month based on the number of GCCs occurring in a system during that time period.

I.E. a high sec system with 0 GCCs in the time period would lose 0.1 level of sec status, while a low sec system would gain 0.1 if GCCs are occurring over a certain threshold.

Eventually a high sec system could become low sec and vice versa.

It would certainly keep people on there toes. Carebears would have to watch that their nice safe High sec system doesn't suddenly become a pirate haven over night and pirates would have to watch that undocking after a DT doesn't mean station guns turning on them.

I know it'll neer happen, but I think it would be a fun idea.

StarMarshal Kaltwelle
Caldari
Republic Industry and Logistics for Expatriots
Etherium Cartel
Posted - 2009.11.10 09:52:00 - [2]
 

I love it!

This is how you get people out of their comfort zones!

/signed

Daenosa
Ghost Festival
Posted - 2009.11.10 11:23:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: MightyRhinox
Carebears would have to watch that their nice safe High sec system doesn't suddenly become a pirate haven over night and pirates would have to watch that undocking after a DT doesn't mean station guns turning on them.



So say i log on after a week of not playing, undock and get my ship blow to pieces because the security status has changed?

Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
Posted - 2009.11.10 12:03:00 - [4]
 

What about POSs and corp standings.

Very cool idea but a little difficult to implement.

How about if it just varied Concord response times???
So in a pieceful system the resoponse time got longer.

StarMarshal Kaltwelle
Caldari
Republic Industry and Logistics for Expatriots
Etherium Cartel
Posted - 2009.11.10 12:08:00 - [5]
 

Here's another problem - you're flipping Concord's mission. You're sending Concord into low-sec to fight crime (Limited concord raids as in-game events? Criminals fight Concord like carebears fight rats?) when they're supposed to stay in 0.5+.

I'm torn on this idea. heh

Lindsay Logan
Posted - 2009.11.10 12:33:00 - [6]
 

Sounds wierd, and its not really related to RL at all.

El Liptonez
V0LTA
VOLTA Corp
Posted - 2009.11.10 12:48:00 - [7]
 

There was an idea to apply kind of this to low sec, and I liked the idea.
But high sec should stay high sec. There's a reason for high sec, obviously to keep stuff safe that you want to be safe. I don't want to go on holidays and two weeks later I find my JF in deepest low sec. Also don't forget about all the carriers that will get to high sec. Also if there's no way to get low sec back to high sec (as low sec obviously promotes criminal actions), all of eve will be 0.0 and low sec eventually.

Pantorus Necraliss
Minmatar
Giza'Msafara
Posted - 2009.11.10 13:21:00 - [8]
 

Funny idea indeed

Just limit it a bit :
- it will not affect 1.0 to 0.6 systems (RP, the most used systems by empire howner) but 0.5 to 0.1 systems

- security will grow more faster than decrease in actual 0.6 and 0.5 systems, but egal change in 0.4 to 0.1.

- other different parameter may influence the security changing speed : number of npc station, number of moon, number of belt,...

- security level may vary because of pvp agressions (the biggest parameter) and number of jump


--> problem : it will encourage commercial hubs and player concentration, may cause desertification of some systems... Maybe it can be compensate by increase rats difficulty and increase scannable cosmic signature in new low sec.

MightyRhinox
Minmatar
Rhinox Heavy Industries
Twilight Military Industrial Complex Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.10 13:32:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Daenosa
Originally by: MightyRhinox
Carebears would have to watch that their nice safe High sec system doesn't suddenly become a pirate haven over night and pirates would have to watch that undocking after a DT doesn't mean station guns turning on them.



So say i log on after a week of not playing, undock and get my ship blow to pieces because the security status has changed?


Yes, or you could pay attention to sec status and JC over to that nice quite constellation full of industrial players and missioners in Faction ships which is about to drop to 0.4, and which you have conveniently stock piled ships and mods in, and gank/ransom everyone as they try to run after DT.... YARRRR!!

Or you could busily work away at raising the sec status of a specific system full of nice high end ores (which wouldn't respawn until sec status had dropped again) and jump all the miners rushing in to scoop them up....

But like I said, I think it'd add an interesting new dynamic to Eve, but it'll never happen.

Red zeon
Caldari
Sacred Templars
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2009.11.10 15:38:00 - [10]
 

capitals and supercatitals to hisec?

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2009.11.10 16:43:00 - [11]
 

a) Will get abused.
b) Jita and other markets will turn into low-sec 5 minutes after the patch gets released.
c) Losing sec status when there is 0 GCC is nonsense.

/not signed

MightyRhinox
Minmatar
Rhinox Heavy Industries
Twilight Military Industrial Complex Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.10 18:41:00 - [12]
 

Caps in hi-sec? They're already there, if you happened to leave a cap sitting in a 0.4 when it rolled over to 0.5, that would be your own fault and you could just jump back into low sec or live with the restrictions placed on high sec caps.

As for markets, I'd say they'd be more likely to end up at 1.0 really quick, not the other way around.

Abuse? I'd prefer the term player manipulation, if someone wanted to run around shooting stations in rookie ships for hours on end to bump sec status up... Well that would be an option for them. Forcing sec status down on the other hand would be pretty difficult....

And sec status dropping when there is no criminal activity makes sense, you don't see hundreds of police patrolling the streets of butt**** nowhere, population 0 do you?

Kell Braugh
Dawn of a new Empire
The Initiative.
Posted - 2009.11.11 21:48:00 - [13]
 

You could put a 72 hour countdown between converting from high <=> low sec.

Would be nice, as you'd have a layer of constant struggle in (over crowded) hubs.

The fact a system is high sec will have to be defended, and no longer just abused by people wishing for a private sandbox in eve.

With that said, I think they should stop CONCORD stopping pirates from entering local and leave it up to the anti-pirate players to stop em and enforce the laws.

CONCORD should still show up and instapwn anyone getting a GCF in high sec, but pirates should be allows to return fire without repercussions like in low sec.

Pupp3tMast3r
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2009.11.11 21:58:00 - [14]
 

This is a really interesting idea and one I have not heard before.

There are some great additions to the idea above, so I don't really have anything else to add.

Unfortunately this will probably never happen but I think with some tinkering it could really work and make the game much more interesting as a whole.

/signed

Bomberlocks
Minmatar
CTRL-Q
Posted - 2009.11.11 23:25:00 - [15]
 

I made this very same proposal a year or so ago, and the arguments for and against were similar:

Pro: It adds some spice to the static system security status and would open the doors to force people to work on keeping/lowering the system status.

Cons: POSes would be in a bad place if the systems were moved to losec after losing sec status, and many, many new players would lose their ships when they unwittingly found themselves in a losec system that was hisec the day before.

Probably, there are solutions to the problems, such as restricting it to 0.5 and .0.4 systems, or making it a part of FW.

However, my gut feeling is that I don't think CCP will ever do this, which is a pity, because it would be nice if the eve universe were a little less static.

Kara Sharalien
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2009.11.12 02:45:00 - [16]
 

This idea is totally original, i can see OP has extensively used the search function to ensure it has not been suggested before.

thats only a fraction of the times i have seen this topic come up, it occurs about twice a week, hell, i didnt even catch any of those.

here is why it is impractical:

1. place a POS in .1 space, minimal grinding needed for standings
2. place a moon mining array
3. do whatever is needed to raise sec status (kill lots of people or w/e)
4. sec status changes, you now have a high sec moon mining POS
5. profit!

also, high sec is supposed to have only veld and scordite because all the good minerals got mined out ages ago, immersion receives hairline fracture when previously mined out asteroids magically reappear.

it also gives a route to get caps into high sec, let people who normally cant enter a high sec system get into it.

its just horribly messy, ok?

yes, you could transport all caps and outlaws to the nearest new low sec system during downtime, and shut off POS's that dont meet standings requirements etc.

but it breaks flow, and makes the game just that little bit harder to get immersed in, and thats a bad thing.

MightyRhinox
Minmatar
Rhinox Heavy Industries
Twilight Military Industrial Complex Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.12 08:02:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Kara Sharalien
This idea is totally original, i can see OP has extensively used the search function to ensure it has not been suggested before.




There's a search function?

On POSes, there aren't a lot of 0.1 systems bordering on 0.5s, so again, if someone wanted to put up a POS in a 0.1, defend it for the weeks it would take to get the sec status up to 0.5 and run around trying to create a high sec corridor for logistics, then spend the time ensuring all those systems keep their sec level up, they deserve to keep their nice shiny moon mining high sec pos...

I don't believe the spawns for for high end ores exist in high sec, so you're not magically going to have high end ores spawning in them when their sec level drops.
And it would be simple enough to make the existing spawns for high end ores in low sec sec dependent. A low system rolls over to 0.5, the miners rush in clear out all the high end ores and they don't respawn until sec status drops again.

Kara Sharalien
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2009.11.12 08:27:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: MightyRhinox

On POSes, there aren't a lot of 0.1 systems bordering on 0.5s, so again, if someone wanted to put up a POS in a 0.1, defend it for the weeks it would take to get the sec status up to 0.5 and run around trying to create a high sec corridor for logistics, then spend the time ensuring all those systems keep their sec level up, they deserve to keep their nice shiny moon mining high sec pos...



there are two things wrong with this statement.

1. there are people who would do this.

goonswarm would, for lulz, encircle an emeies space with high sec. while that would be funny, it would also be gamebreaking.

which brings me to

2. once they have them, its not a matter of deserving to keep them any more, they will be invulnerable.

place carriers, motherships and a few dreads for good measure in the system, anchor an array for producing said ships, then convert to high sec over a few weeks.

POS now invulnerable, since enemies cant get dreads into system, and you can keep replenishing your supply of high sec caps as necessary.

make titans, for victory.

MightyRhinox
Minmatar
Rhinox Heavy Industries
Twilight Military Industrial Complex Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.12 09:01:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: MightyRhinox on 12/11/2009 09:01:19
I don't doubt people would do, the nice thing is, they'd have the option
That and you need Sov to build super caps....

Ovous
Posted - 2009.11.12 10:12:00 - [20]
 

nice idea but i think it would make more sence like this, CONCORD are not a police force, they only effect us pod pilots, they're here because of the unique threat us immortals pose, the little people are protected and kept in line by their own respective corporations and police/military forces

i propose that if players ignore systems, and stop running missions or hunting rats, these systems become lower in security rating every down time that goes by, and im talking a very very small amount like 0.01 per week, gradually speeding up to about 0.10 per week in systems with practically no activity. so that per week it drops a rating, as the pirates, and mission enemy's get more established, increasing the mission level of the local agents and increasing station guns

the speed up rate would be like, no missions run for majority of week (4 dys) when the system looses its 0.01 point at the end of this week, next weeks amount will be 0.02 and the following week 0.03

and likewise, if a corporation bust into a system with low rating and spend days mission running, hunting rats or fleets in deadspace complexes that would gather about then the systems rating would rise,

this could be kept realistic by having convoys of factional police or militia missions to take out leaders or small npc runs of ships moving or roaming about to tackle the problem, or defend it

this offers a free form play area for all players, carebare or pirates alike, where the systems people want are kept safe and the game rewards continued play. im all up for a break but if you leave the game for a month i expect you to be a little worse for wear, that's a long shore leave, game or not ;P

basically i agree it could do with some spicing up with my way above you would find more drug labs or slave pens in missions in areas deteriorating, and you would find more mining colonies, ammo dumps etc in upcoming systems.

it allows factional warfare missions that reflect the gaming board so to speak in that every few downtimes the systems are logged and remapped according to security status as it currently stands, and the missions are redistributed to suit reality, so instead of one agent giving you the same missions to infinity, with similar locations, you get ones saying that those despicable sanchas followers have set up shop in (name) star system and are trashing the place, go get em

it wouldn't change it drastically, with the mission hubs remaining high, and the deep deep 0.0 space remaining low because having it only affect it by weekly means it will take months for any kind of change, hell if you did it this way on the fly noone would even notice it happening

Jazz Ark
Omega Essence Mining and Shipping
Posted - 2009.11.12 10:51:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Lindsay Logan
Sounds wierd, and its not really related to RL at all.


Very true - Rhinox's system is not how the real world works. Police forces aren't just shifted to bad areas, leaving the good areas defenseless.

To make it realistic, the CONCORD security levels should be based on which systems have the most financial transactions and the most people. Policing is usually best in highly populated areas with lots of tax money.

Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2009.11.12 10:53:00 - [22]
 

It sounds cool but it would be impossible to implement without upsetting 95% of the playerbase.

MightyRhinox
Minmatar
Rhinox Heavy Industries
Twilight Military Industrial Complex Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.12 11:20:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Jazz Ark
Originally by: Lindsay Logan
Sounds wierd, and its not really related to RL at all.


Very true - Rhinox's system is not how the real world works. Police forces aren't just shifted to bad areas, leaving the good areas defenseless.

To make it realistic, the CONCORD security levels should be based on which systems have the most financial transactions and the most people. Policing is usually best in highly populated areas with lots of tax money.


Yeah, that's why wallstreet just be crawling with fuzz.

Ovous
Posted - 2009.11.12 12:50:00 - [24]
 

if that was sarcastic it was misplaced, if not you need some better grammar :P

however relying on sarcasm,

its true, high populated areas with the biggest tax bands may not have the highest visible police forces, but they do have the fastest response times, a gun man in wall street will be cordoned of i a matter of minuets, with full news and police coverage within an hour, elsewhere say a ghetto it can take days for me to hear about it here in London say, and they may get away first before being apprehended because the area has a low police/criminal ratio,

also did noone read my Berlin wall?

Mr Yarrr
Black Rise Angels
Posted - 2009.11.12 13:20:00 - [25]
 

interesting idea, I think some people are too quick to write it off;

The number of police ships should be fixed, or maybe increase slowly as the playerbase grows, and therefore the total security status for all systems added together should be constant, to reflect the police forces being shifted around.

it should be a slow process, and players should be given maybe a weeks notice if the sec status is changing to give people chance to move things about, and the more populated a system is the longer in should take.

The system would be harder to abuse than some people think; a place like jita would increase in sec status due to all the suicide ganking. gankers would have to activly work together and stop ganking for a while to decrease the sec status of a system (unlikley to happen in a place like jita, i know :))

It would add something to the game :D


 

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