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Hertford
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:43:00 - [1951]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.

Let us know when you finally get the point, preferably in one or two sentences, not pages.

Destrim
Koshaku
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:47:00 - [1952]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



Some of us are not interested in crying. I personally think the inf.-hub upgrades are simply very disappointing. It has nothing to do with wanting to maintain the "status quo": I'm very happy to see people being forced to use the systems they claim! I'm quite excited to see things change, and watch the influx of people to 0.0

Frankly, even with the very poor rewards, people will probably still try to move to 0.0 because, well, it's there. However, I restate my former point: I was expecting something really nice, a great incentive for holding only a handful of systems and developing them. The inf.-hub upgrades they have posted failed to meet my expectations, I suppose... they are very boring, and utterly useless, except maybe for the finding of hidden belts: it will help those holding lower-quality 0.0 space.

Jovialmadness
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:49:00 - [1953]
 

Quote:
Yes you obviously have no idea how the basics of this game function. Now move alone and leave the discussion to people who actually deal with this **** on a daily basis.


and i guess than makes you probably the smartest dumba$$ to ever play the game to admit to dealing with this ****, which it IS, on a daily basis. I have been playing since 2004 so i don't think i need to hear from you about how the basics are. To actually want to keep sov mechanics the way they are means you are either a big alliance member/leader or an idiot. I have played the 0.0 game for years including being a member of multiple alliances. I still probe into 0.0 and low sec mostly now but as far as the 0.0 game is concerned. If it doesnt change you can keep your 0.0 house you are so experienced in running your mouth over. im done with you guys till tomorrow...dinner time.

Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:50:00 - [1954]
 

Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.



Yes you will need to have a worker-caste alliance peon out in the fields gathering isk to pay your rents that will make pvp content for raiders and defenders (if you intend to defend them). This is far superior to the current model where your income comes from moon pos that are invulnerable to small gang intediction and there is literally no way to scorch the earth on conquest.

If you don't like the new system you are free to go back to empire and run the level4s you are talking about. I'm sure other people will be happy to take your vacated space and actually fight for it.

Will Hunter
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:53:00 - [1955]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



guys guys lets make 0.0 life harder so my empire hooker roleplaying corp can disrupt big alliances easily and without hassle

Hertford
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:54:00 - [1956]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.



Yes you will need to have a worker-caste alliance peon out in the fields gathering isk to pay your rents that will make pvp content for raiders and defenders (if you intend to defend them). This is far superior to the current model where your income comes from moon pos that are invulnerable to small gang intediction and there is literally no way to scorch the earth on conquest.

If you don't like the new system you are free to go back to empire and run the level4s you are talking about. I'm sure other people will be happy to take your vacated space and actually fight for it.



Oh yes, I forgot about your small-gangs-affect-sovereignty agenda. Carry on!

Lucas Pantelis
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:55:00 - [1957]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.



Yes you will need to have a worker-caste alliance peon out in the fields gathering isk to pay your rents that will make pvp content for raiders and defenders (if you intend to defend them). This is far superior to the current model where your income comes from moon pos that are invulnerable to small gang intediction and there is literally no way to scorch the earth on conquest.

If you don't like the new system you are free to go back to empire and run the level4s you are talking about. I'm sure other people will be happy to take your vacated space and actually fight for it.

Why would these "worker-caste alliance peons" want to gather that isk in 0.0 when they can do it faster elsewhere?

Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:56:00 - [1958]
 

Edited by: Jade Constantine on 08/11/2009 19:58:07
Funny how the Goonswarm ability to debate this hits a brick wall and falls down on its face the moment they are actually presented with an alternative viewpoint.

Originally by: Lucas Pantelis


Why would these "worker-caste alliance peons" want to gather that isk in 0.0 when they can do it faster elsewhere?


Let them. 0.0 is conquered for boasting rights. Its supposed to hard, its supposed to be a dog-eat-dog battle for survival. The kind of people who should be claiming space empires are those prepared to fight for them for the glory of fighting and putting their name on the map. Not people who just want better level4 rewards - that leads to the current status quo where there hasn't been a meaningful war in 0.0 for years. (as now).

Misaki Yuuko
Caldari
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:56:00 - [1959]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



Sorry but you are wrong. Most people is not complaining about upkeep and stuff. I couldn't care less, even if they stick to the original prices. Cynojammers and bridges should be awfully expensive upgrades, no problem with that. People who is far away from empire, just conquer a region/constellation closer to empire, it's more valuable (logistically) space, so be it.

I still thing the way to remove others sov is a bit stupid, plain sov (FLAG) should be more easilly disruptible. I still think JB's shouldn't be so safe, a POS with a JB should be able to barelly have some small batteries online and nothing else.


But there is one thing, which the majority is complaining about, which is extremelly broken. It has allways been, but with current iteration is going to be even mroe broken, because strategic assets (hi-end moons) are losing a lot of value. And this ssir is the risk-reward balance between null/low/hi-sec space, SPECIALLY for the individual.

SO just keep dreaming, but unless that changes (let's not even talk about, oh hai, I can turn off anomalies by planting a cov-op alt there so they won't respawn, genious CCP Very Happy), 0.0 will be an other low-sec: useless playground where everyone plays CS in space, meaningless combat, and we allready have FW and RvB for that. Fix this and suddenlly stuff makes sense, and half of the game becomes usefull again.


Pointfive
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:57:00 - [1960]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.



Yes you will need to have a worker-caste alliance peon out in the fields gathering isk to pay your rents that will make pvp content for raiders and defenders (if you intend to defend them). This is far superior to the current model where your income comes from moon pos that are invulnerable to small gang intediction and there is literally no way to scorch the earth on conquest.

If you don't like the new system you are free to go back to empire and run the level4s you are talking about. I'm sure other people will be happy to take your vacated space and actually fight for it.



Yeah you dont get it. People are just going to run level 4s on alts to make their money and continue not bothering with trying to make money in tier own space because there is no point. Large alliance will still bow up any small corps that try to get even near them. There will be less fighting over space, because their isnt any new reason to take and it, and it costs more to hold. This patch was touted as making 0.0 worth it, this makes the space less attractive.

Destrim
Koshaku
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:58:00 - [1961]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.



Yes you will need to have a worker-caste alliance peon out in the fields gathering isk to pay your rents that will make pvp content for raiders and defenders (if you intend to defend them). This is far superior to the current model where your income comes from moon pos that are invulnerable to small gang intediction and there is literally no way to scorch the earth on conquest.

If you don't like the new system you are free to go back to empire and run the level4s you are talking about. I'm sure other people will be happy to take your vacated space and actually fight for it.



Be careful with that. One of the stated intentions by CCP for this expansion was to make alliance operations less vulnerable to small gangs, and offer better protection to the sovereign's people from small gangs.

Dharh
Gallente
Ace Adventure Corp
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:58:00 - [1962]
 

Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.

Let us know when you finally get the point, preferably in one or two sentences, not pages.


_YES_. To do ENDGAME PVP you need the freakin resources to back such a campaign up. And that will require a fully capable alliance/corp. One that has income from many different sources, including the carebare stuff pvp always hate.

If you don't like it, tough ****. Obviously changes should be made, to buff the benfits _and_ nerf lvl 4 empire missions. But all the same, hold and maintaining a sov should be _hard_.

Itzena
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:59:00 - [1963]
 

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Please do not feed the Jade Constantine lest he responses with WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT WALL OF TEXT etc.

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 19:59:00 - [1964]
 

Edited by: Korodan on 08/11/2009 19:59:58
Originally by: Jade Constantine
words



Why don't you have cybersex in your e-brothel about it?

And no one will want to fight over space when they can't even pay to take it. Sov will only be claimed in major systems where caps are under construction, where there can be JBs close to empire, or station systems - the rest will be trackless waste because you can mine moons without sov, perhaps with GSCs demarcating where one empire ends and another begins. No one will want to go to 0.0 because it's ****ing worthless.

As usual, you're a whole lotta pretty :words: that mean nothing.

I ALMOST FORGOT

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Zemi Dahut
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:00:00 - [1965]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.



Yes you will need to have a worker-caste alliance peon out in the fields gathering isk to pay your rents that will make pvp content for raiders and defenders (if you intend to defend them). This is far superior to the current model where your income comes from moon pos that are invulnerable to small gang intediction and there is literally no way to scorch the earth on conquest.

If you don't like the new system you are free to go back to empire and run the level4s you are talking about. I'm sure other people will be happy to take your vacated space and actually fight for it.



You really don't understand what the problem is here which is really not surprising. You should probably have stayed out of this thread since all you're doing is reminding everyone why you failed as a CSM.

People are upset that the changes do very little if nothing at all to make 0.0 a better place to live. But keep blindly posting as we'd expect no difference from an online prostitute.

Prognosys
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:01:00 - [1966]
 

Originally by: Dharh
Originally by: Hertford
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Hertford
I like how Jade spews forth a veritable wall of words that is just a rehash of CCPs aims without mentioning any of the issues brought up in the rest of this thread. But then this is a terrible thread; Can you blame Jade for not reading it?


To be brutal. This thread is pretty much the same 20 people repeating "waaa-waaaa-it's-not-fair-waaaaa!" again and again and again interspaced with some more spam. As I said earlier - you guys are missing the point with Dominion. Its not about preserving the status quo its about blowing the status quo into a thousand little pieces and seeing what happens to 0.0 without an omni cyno-jammer security blanket for its current occupants.

You will need to struggle to pay upkeeps in Dominion. Thats the point. You will need to retract the size of your claims and focus to keep your head above water. You will need to adapt or die and if you can't survive there will be other players and player entities that can.

The status quo is boring and deeply unattractive. Eve 0.0 endgame needs to change.

Not sure how I can explain that any better for you.



In other words, to engage in Eve's "endgame pvp experience", you need to grind PvE content. Yes, that's going to really improve things. I can see the queues of Empire dwellers lining up at 0.0 chokepoints already ready to move into 0.0.

Let us know when you finally get the point, preferably in one or two sentences, not pages.


_YES_. To do ENDGAME PVP you need the freakin resources to back such a campaign up. And that will require a fully capable alliance/corp. One that has income from many different sources, including the carebare stuff pvp always hate.

If you don't like it, tough ****. Obviously changes should be made, to buff the benfits _and_ nerf lvl 4 empire missions. But all the same, hold and maintaining a sov should be _hard_.


That's the entire ****ing point of this debate. We're saying that the benefits, especially compared to L4s, are too low. You're basically saying 'well if we ignore the bad thing you're complaining about, everything's fine!'

Bonefish O'Hallahan
Gallente
Infinity Guitars
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:01:00 - [1967]
 

Originally by: Vadinho
Originally by: Zahorite
Table for 300,000 subscribers soon to be 100,000 please.
Right sir. You have your choice of two seating areas. The tables next to the kitchen are free and can support several hundred guests who may never talk to or even see one another as they eat. We also have seating much further from the kitchen, and those tables can only support one or two people, are much more expensive, and everyone has to fight over the same basket of bread and glass of water.

Which will your party prefer?


boosh

Lev Aeris
United Amarr Templar Legion
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:06:00 - [1968]
 

CCP spends '2 years' thinking this up, and this is the best you can come up with? Epic Fail!

Adding irrelevant upgrades and new costs, making 0.0 even more worthless...this is a bad joke.

If you want a system to support 50-100 people then this **** sandwich isn't going to do it.

Think up some relevant upgrades, hell maybe play the game for a month without your dev tools and you might see how utterly stupid this proposal is.

Relevant upgrades would be:

-*- Adding more belts and NPC spawns to a system (more rats = more income = more taxes)
-*- Add the ability to upgrade TrueSec.
-*- Add the ability to put NPC mission agents in Outposts.

The upgrade of adding DED to a system was the only non-******ed idea I saw. Even so, having 50-100 people fighting over the scraps from one DED is going to suck. Might as well go to empire and grind level 4s all day.

Everything you proposed will only make 0.0 a monotonous grindfest, ala 'WOW'

Do Not Pass Go, Do Not Collect $200. Sober up, play your game, and try again CCP.Rolling Eyes

Mkiaki
Gallente
Progressive Business Solutions
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:06:00 - [1969]
 

Originally by: Bonefish O'Hallahan
Originally by: Vadinho
Originally by: Zahorite
Table for 300,000 subscribers soon to be 100,000 please.
Right sir. You have your choice of two seating areas. The tables next to the kitchen are free and can support several hundred guests who may never talk to or even see one another as they eat. We also have seating much further from the kitchen, and those tables can only support one or two people, are much more expensive, and everyone has to fight over the same basket of bread and glass of water.

Which will your party prefer?


boosh


Goons tears are the best tears

riverini
Gallente
Reliables Inc
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:08:00 - [1970]
 

Posting in this threadnaught....


Bonefish O'Hallahan
Gallente
Infinity Guitars
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:09:00 - [1971]
 

Edited by: Bonefish O''Hallahan on 08/11/2009 20:09:31
Originally by: Mkiaki
Originally by: Bonefish O'Hallahan
Originally by: Vadinho
Originally by: Zahorite
Table for 300,000 subscribers soon to be 100,000 please.
Right sir. You have your choice of two seating areas. The tables next to the kitchen are free and can support several hundred guests who may never talk to or even see one another as they eat. We also have seating much further from the kitchen, and those tables can only support one or two people, are much more expensive, and everyone has to fight over the same basket of bread and glass of water.

Which will your party prefer?


boosh


Goons tears are the best tears


Do you want me to quote all the well-reasoned arguments that are the baseline for the clever and relevant metaphor I helpfully quoted for you? Because that would take a while, what with quoting the whole thread, including representatives from every one of our enemies that isn't desperately hoping to steal our space regardless of its loss of value following the patch.

Qlanth
Caldari
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:10:00 - [1972]
 

Edited by: Qlanth on 08/11/2009 20:11:27
Originally by: Mkiaki
Originally by: Bonefish O'Hallahan
Originally by: Vadinho
Originally by: Zahorite
Table for 300,000 subscribers soon to be 100,000 please.
Right sir. You have your choice of two seating areas. The tables next to the kitchen are free and can support several hundred guests who may never talk to or even see one another as they eat. We also have seating much further from the kitchen, and those tables can only support one or two people, are much more expensive, and everyone has to fight over the same basket of bread and glass of water.

Which will your party prefer?


boosh


Goons tears are the best tears


Ahh yes eve online player "Mkiaki" from the great Center For Advanced Studies enjoys the feeble cries of a crushed GoonSwarm

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:10:00 - [1973]
 

Edited by: Korodan on 08/11/2009 20:13:24
Edited by: Korodan on 08/11/2009 20:11:23
Originally by: riverini
Posting in this threadnaught....




Son, this ain't no threadnaught. If it was it would have bloated to over 300 pages by this point.

ALSO: CANT STOP WONT STOP

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Another Edit:

Bonerfish I saw a clown complain about the changes a few pages back too, so even people who want to invade our space are agreeing with us at this point.

Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:12:00 - [1974]
 

Originally by: Zemi Dahut

You really don't understand what the problem is here which is really not surprising. You should probably have stayed out of this thread since all you're doing is reminding everyone why you failed as a CSM.


Actually Dominion is looking like a pretty good success for my time on the CSM right now Cool

Arkady Sadik
Minmatar
Electus Matari
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:12:00 - [1975]
 

6m ISK / day seems a bit low, really. With such a low cost, Goons might not collectively quit EVE, thus invalidating the most looked-forward-to feature of Dominion. :-|

On a more serious note, I'm not sure 180m ISK / month is high enough to encourage alliances to focus their pilots on fewer systems. Maybe increase the IH cost to 10m per day or similar, thus focusing the actually useful systems more, but still allow for the dot on the map?

Antir
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:13:00 - [1976]
 

Originally by: Dharh

Obviously changes should be made, to buff the benfits _and_ nerf lvl 4 empire missions. But all the same, hold and maintaining a sov should be _hard_.


Exactly, it should be difficult to maintain an empire and the rewards should justify it (basically the risk v reward of 0.0 should be balanced), that might make more people come to 0.0 and possibly shake everything up.

Dharh
Gallente
Ace Adventure Corp
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:14:00 - [1977]
 

Originally by: Prognosys
Originally by: Dharh
_YES_. To do ENDGAME PVP you need the freakin resources to back such a campaign up. And that will require a fully capable alliance/corp. One that has income from many different sources, including the carebare stuff pvp always hate.

If you don't like it, tough ****. Obviously changes should be made, to buff the benfits _and_ nerf lvl 4 empire missions. But all the same, hold and maintaining a sov should be _hard_.


That's the entire ****ing point of this debate. We're saying that the benefits, especially compared to L4s, are too low. You're basically saying 'well if we ignore the bad thing you're complaining about, everything's fine!'


Because for all intents and purposes _nothing_ they do will probably work out of the gate. They need to see the ISK flows of Dominion and then tweak it. I do not support making it uber now, and then nerfing it later. If the income is not high enough buff it after the fact.

They can also deal with lvl 4 missions later. Or maybe don't have to at all, if equilibrium can be made with 0.0.

Zemi Dahut
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:14:00 - [1978]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Zemi Dahut

You really don't understand what the problem is here which is really not surprising. You should probably have stayed out of this thread since all you're doing is reminding everyone why you failed as a CSM.


Actually Dominion is looking like a pretty good success for my time on the CSM right now Cool



What, making 0.0 less accessible to small alliances and gangs? You're really this delusional?

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:17:00 - [1979]
 

Originally by: Jade Constantine
Originally by: Zemi Dahut

You really don't understand what the problem is here which is really not surprising. You should probably have stayed out of this thread since all you're doing is reminding everyone why you failed as a CSM.


Actually Dominion is looking like a pretty good success for my time on the CSM right now Cool



Hon, put that mouth back to it's proper use - sucking ****s on a seedy corner in Jita 4-4.

Ivanna Nuke
Gallente
Holders Of The Cowbell
Posted - 2009.11.08 20:17:00 - [1980]
 

I love how silent CCP has become over this. Rolling Eyes


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