open All Channels
seplocked EVE Information Portal
blankseplocked New Blog: Upgrading and Upkeep of Sovereign Solar Systems in Dominion
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: first : previous : ... 53 54 55 56 [57] 58 59 60 61 ... : last (119)

Author Topic

Destrim
Koshaku
Posted - 2009.11.08 05:43:00 - [1681]
 

Originally by: WhiteSavage
My worry is where tf is CCP even coming from? The initial costs were SO horrible... did CCP even think about it? DId they run the numbers? Did they not realize that now players would have had to pay extra to be in 0.0? Lowering the costs is helpfull but now onto the other changes... wtf 2 anomolies... wtf those mining things that nobody does because its not worth the time mining out the veld... IS ccp playing the same EVE we're playing?

And WHERE are these "a single system will support 100-150 players at one time." WHAT happened between that statement and the horrible implementation we're being offered today?!

Which feature does CCP expect will improve 0.0 at all in any way? The higher costs of living or the xtra anomolies?

And of all the upgrade possibilities you give us... nothing to do with belt ratting? The #1 income for the average pilot in 0.0 like me?! wtf dudes. wtf


I feel you, believe me, but enough with the complaints. A certain amount of venting is healthy, but I believe we've done enough to fan the flames, lol!

That being said, and I agree with you that their proposed infrastructure upgrades suck, please put forth what you think should be done instead.

What infrastructure upgrades would you rather have?

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 05:47:00 - [1682]
 

Originally by: Destrim
Originally by: WhiteSavage
My worry is where tf is CCP even coming from? The initial costs were SO horrible... did CCP even think about it? DId they run the numbers? Did they not realize that now players would have had to pay extra to be in 0.0? Lowering the costs is helpfull but now onto the other changes... wtf 2 anomolies... wtf those mining things that nobody does because its not worth the time mining out the veld... IS ccp playing the same EVE we're playing?

And WHERE are these "a single system will support 100-150 players at one time." WHAT happened between that statement and the horrible implementation we're being offered today?!

Which feature does CCP expect will improve 0.0 at all in any way? The higher costs of living or the xtra anomolies?

And of all the upgrade possibilities you give us... nothing to do with belt ratting? The #1 income for the average pilot in 0.0 like me?! wtf dudes. wtf


I feel you, believe me, but enough with the complaints. A certain amount of venting is healthy, but I believe we've done enough to fan the flames, lol!

That being said, and I agree with you that their proposed infrastructure upgrades suck, please put forth what you think should be done instead.

What infrastructure upgrades would you rather have?


NPC agents in space or in stations.
Bonus to rat bounties
Bonus to truesec
Bonus to rock composition
Bonus to rat respawn speed
Bonus to warp speed while in a system you control. (Minor but I can see use for it)
Bonus to production in a system you control.
Ability to tax any income whatsoever earned inside that system.
Ability to send a beacon that decloaks anything in system with less than 0 standings towards owned alliance. Usable once every few hours. (Maybe 4 or 5 so that it cant be spammed on defense ops)

Tesal
Posted - 2009.11.08 05:47:00 - [1683]
 

I propose a new force, left over from the remnants of Goons after they die and most of them give me their stuff. I shall call this force, "the Neckbeards of Motsu". From the shattered remains of CCP and EvE, running my world from a couple of Dell Inspirons in Iceland, I shall be a god.

Qlanth
Caldari
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 05:52:00 - [1684]
 

CCP could easily stop my complaining by making Cosmic Anomalies have belt rats in them instead of the nerfed rats that drop no loot or salvage they have now.

Tesal
Posted - 2009.11.08 05:54:00 - [1685]
 

Trolling is not allowed.Applebabe

Tipz NexAstrum
Celestial Horizon Corp.
United Corporate Ventures
Posted - 2009.11.08 05:58:00 - [1686]
 

Originally by: Vadinho
Welcome to page fifty of the official "CCP doesn't understand that the only motivation for war is valuable and exploitable resources that would otherwise be unobtainable" thread I'm your maitre d' Vadinho I hope you stay is an enjoyable one!


Bobfrommarketing please have this guy kicked for being a moron, he obviously never got the History of the World, Part I joke.

gambrinous
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:02:00 - [1687]
 

Originally by: Yiom
Ok, out of curiousity, how many of you that hold 0.0 can make in 1 month in 0.0 solo.

Let's pretend for shiz and grinz that the corp/alliance charged ZERO tax. Anything and everything you do costs you nothing towards anyone else but yourself.

So 1 month, how much do you make?

I obviously don't see a problem with the whole bill process. If a corp/alliance wish's, they could ask that all the corp members (lets keep it simple, 10 members) donated 7 million each day. Thats 70 mil per day TOTAL. They then go do whatever they would like to do, tax free, no problems whats so ever, until the next day they are required to donate 7 mil each (10 players, so that makes 70 mil TOTAL)

Until the end of the month, you end up with a whoopin 2.1 billion isk to pay for the rent of the system.

Im not in a corp that owns 0.0 space, but through reading the pages, christ, people are kicking and screaming like a bunch of girls, with no inkling on really reading in to what is required to accomplish the goals of that CCP has set forth. Of course, I could say that 99.9% of the people who are screaming bloody marry are actually trolls. Which in some ways I think I could be right.

TL:DR

If you are in a 10 man corp, donate 7 million to your CEO each day. Have taxes put to 0% or 1% whatever, and go on your jolly way.

p.s. Grow a pair ppl, christ, I hope no one in this whine fest is from the Euro region. Wouldn't expect that... But from lazy americans... perhaps.


Hi stupid person that doesn't know what they are talking about.

Half the point of this patch is to encourage the likes of yourself out into 0.0
So let me ask you this: if what exists currently isn't enough to make you want to venture out there, how will taking what is currently there and slapping a 200mill fee per month on top help the situation.

E: you just made europe look stupid. lazy americans are laughing

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:02:00 - [1688]
 

Originally by: Tipz NexAstrum
Originally by: Vadinho
Welcome to page fifty of the official "CCP doesn't understand that the only motivation for war is valuable and exploitable resources that would otherwise be unobtainable" thread I'm your maitre d' Vadinho I hope you stay is an enjoyable one!


Bobfrommarketing please have this guy kicked for being a moron, he obviously never got the History of the World, Part I joke.


Sorry, the Apocalypse cabaret has room for everyone.

Vadinho
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:03:00 - [1689]
 

Originally by: Tipz NexAstrum
Originally by: Vadinho
Welcome to page fifty of the official "CCP doesn't understand that the only motivation for war is valuable and exploitable resources that would otherwise be unobtainable" thread I'm your maitre d' Vadinho I hope you stay is an enjoyable one!


Bobfrommarketing please have this guy kicked for being a moron, he obviously never got the History of the World, Part I joke.
i wasnt making a history of the world part i reference i was just being a smartass?

Da Maddness
Minmatar
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:04:00 - [1690]
 

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Hrodgar Ortal
Minmatar
Ma'adim Logistics
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:06:00 - [1691]
 

Originally by: Da Maddness
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


I've seen you or someone else ask this every couple of pages. You won't get an answer that way, especially when asking it that often in the middle of the night for Icelanders.

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:07:00 - [1692]
 

Edited by: Korodan on 08/11/2009 06:08:30
Originally by: Hrodgar Ortal
Originally by: Da Maddness
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


I've seen you or someone else ask this every couple of pages. You won't get an answer that way, especially when asking it that often in the middle of the night for Icelanders.


I don't think you "get" goons.

ALSO ALSO

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:07:00 - [1693]
 

Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 08/11/2009 06:07:27
6 AM is not the middle of the night. Nor is the 4pm GMT when we STARTED asking it.

Quote:
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Tesal
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:09:00 - [1694]
 

Edited by: Tesal on 08/11/2009 06:12:20
Edited by: Tesal on 08/11/2009 06:11:50
Originally by: Vadinho
Originally by: Tipz NexAstrum
Originally by: Vadinho
Welcome to page fifty of the official "CCP doesn't understand that the only motivation for war is valuable and exploitable resources that would otherwise be unobtainable" thread I'm your maitre d' Vadinho I hope you stay is an enjoyable one!


Bobfrommarketing please have this guy kicked for being a moron, he obviously never got the History of the World, Part I joke.
i wasnt making a history of the world part i reference i was just being a smartass?


What, you were being a smartass? What?

Try this on for size.

One of the mechanics that is little noticed now, but will gain notice is the jump bridge change in relation to adjacent Sov. You can take Sov in ANY system deep in enemy territory. Put up a POS with a cyno jammer, and string along a jump bridge and leap frog deep within enemy territory. They will have to kill your cyno jammer and your hub to clean out the system. And even if you succeed, they can just do it again somewhere else. Isn't that hilarious?

*edit
Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
Edited by: EdFromHumanResources on 08/11/2009 06:07:27
6 AM is not the middle of the night. Nor is the 4pm GMT when we STARTED asking it.

Quote:
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.



Well, if you include moon minerals, it is far more income than running level 4 missions with less effort. In addition fat and lazy directors can skim the moon gold and roll around in it.

Da Maddness
Minmatar
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:10:00 - [1695]
 

Originally by: Hrodgar Ortal
I've seen you or someone else ask this every couple of pages. You won't get an answer that way, especially when asking it that often in the middle of the night for Icelanders.


You do realise that the forums are available when people wake up?

Pointfive
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:12:00 - [1696]
 

Honestly i was hoping to see upgrades more along these lines. i always though of 0.0 as being like the wild west. Where you venture out to dangerous lands to get shot at, control some territory make money, and occasionaly find gold.

Concord Bounty Hunter Angent Relay - Allows LP gain for killing pirates in nullsec, create a pvp geared concord lp store

Bounty increase - High activity in your system has driven away all but the most dangerous pirates. 15% bonus to pirate bounty per level

Respawn Speed - High activity in this region has increased pirate activity in the system. 10% bonus to pirate respawn speed per level.

Pirate hideout Locator - Each level increases the chance of locating rare hidden pirate hideout anomalies. These danger pirates do not drop faction items but have significantly increased bounty.

Ship quality increase - Having Faced larger ships constantly, pirates begin to only appear in more difficult ships. Each level reduces the chance of a non battleship spawn by 20%


oh and

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Vadinho
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:14:00 - [1697]
 

Originally by: Tesal
What, you were being a smartass? What?

Try this on for size.

One of the mechanics that is little noticed now, but will gain notice is the jump bridge change in relation to adjacent Sov. You can take Sov in ANY system deep in enemy territory. Put up a POS with a cyno jammer, and string along a jump bridge and leap frog deep within enemy territory. They will have to kill your cyno jammer and your hub to clean out the system. And even if you succeed, they can just do it again somewhere else. Isn't that hilarious?
yes it is and id love someone to try because it would mean war which is preferable to stagnation

itd be like what we did to rise only without taking a month

it would also mean we could reverse the stream by flipping those stations and using the same network against the enemy

actually holy **** thats awesome thanks for bringing it up it makes me think more highly of the expansion!

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:14:00 - [1698]
 

Originally by: Pointfive
Honestly i was hoping to see upgrades more along these lines. i always though of 0.0 as being like the wild west. Where you venture out to dangerous lands to get shot at, control some territory make money, and occasionaly find gold.

Concord Bounty Hunter Angent Relay - Allows LP gain for killing pirates in nullsec, create a pvp geared concord lp store

Bounty increase - High activity in your system has driven away all but the most dangerous pirates. 15% bonus to pirate bounty per level

Respawn Speed - High activity in this region has increased pirate activity in the system. 10% bonus to pirate respawn speed per level.

Pirate hideout Locator - Each level increases the chance of locating rare hidden pirate hideout anomalies. These danger pirates do not drop faction items but have significantly increased bounty.

Ship quality increase - Having Faced larger ships constantly, pirates begin to only appear in more difficult ships. Each level reduces the chance of a non battleship spawn by 20%


oh and

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


They can't implement these because they make too much sense and WE ACTUALLY WANT THESE CHANGES




aaand

Quote:
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:15:00 - [1699]
 

Edited by: Korodan on 08/11/2009 06:15:49
Originally by: Pointfive
Honestly i was hoping to see upgrades more along these lines. i always though of 0.0 as being like the wild west. Where you venture out to dangerous lands to get shot at, control some territory make money, and occasionaly find gold.

Concord Bounty Hunter Angent Relay - Allows LP gain for killing pirates in nullsec, create a pvp geared concord lp store

Bounty increase - High activity in your system has driven away all but the most dangerous pirates. 15% bonus to pirate bounty per level

Respawn Speed - High activity in this region has increased pirate activity in the system. 10% bonus to pirate respawn speed per level.

Pirate hideout Locator - Each level increases the chance of locating rare hidden pirate hideout anomalies. These danger pirates do not drop faction items but have significantly increased bounty.

Ship quality increase - Having Faced larger ships constantly, pirates begin to only appear in more difficult ships. Each level reduces the chance of a non battleship spawn by 20%


oh and

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


This, these upgrades are pretty nice.

also I almost forgot

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.

Eventually, this phrase will become bannable, I'm calling it now.

Tesal
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:17:00 - [1700]
 

Originally by: EdFromHumanResources
aaand

Quote:
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.



Big alliances already make more than level 4 missions with their moon gold alone.

Bobby Atlas
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:18:00 - [1701]
 

Edited by: Bobby Atlas on 08/11/2009 05:22:58
Originally by: Pointfive
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


As CCP Chronitus pointed out, the amount of reward to offset a small amount of risk is allot but I also think that is a matter of perception, in either case it is not in of itself the argument being made. The actual argument being made by allot of people is the fact that 0.0 is less profitable than running LVL4 missions in empire and these upgrades in dominion do little if anything to change that situation.

I personally have been playing eve for some 6 years now and I remember when I first came to 0.0 it was a niche idea that you came out here to make money, however that is something that quickly evaporated and has been the consensus for a long time that you do not come out to 0.0 to make money. This should not be the case, 0.0 should not be unprofitable or certainly not less profitable than empire - please do not counter about pvp risks etc.. as we all accept those risks and costs but that is not what we are talking about.

The simple point is that 0.0 life is less profitable than LVL4 missions when in reality it should at very least be equal to or greater than.

Allot of this boils down to lazy development work, I remember 2-3 years ago when the concept of touching the POS code was a nightmare to CCP, you said it wouldn't happen and were admit that it was a monumental challenge. This is the very same situation we see at the moment regarding making true sec values dynamic, belt numbers, the npc spawn density/value within and astroid types/density, all dynamic. This is something CCP needs to tackle head on, the proposed system we have in front of us now is the most indirect method possible of actually fixing the economic inadequacies of 0.0 and it is frankly very lazy way.

I personally have never run a wormhole, never run an anomaly and I know for a fact I am not the only person, there is a large player base that is just not interested in it - we rather fight NPC's in belts in a far more straight forward fashion. So please, get off your collective behindes and rethink the implementation of dominion and actually addressing the economic issues and more importantly the short comings of the code base.

EdFromHumanResources
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:20:00 - [1702]
 

Originally by: Bobby Atlas
Edited by: Bobby Atlas on 08/11/2009 05:22:58
Originally by: Pointfive
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


As CCP Chronitus pointed out, the amount of reward to offset a small amount of risk is allot but I also think that is a matter of perception, in either case it is not in of itself the argument being made. The actual argument being made by allot of people is the fact that 0.0 is less profitable than running LVL4 missions in empire and these upgrades in dominion do little if anything to change that situation.

I personally have been playing eve for some 6 years now and I remember when I first came to 0.0 it was a niche idea that you came out here to make money, however that is something that quickly evaporated and has been the consensus for a long time that you do not come out to 0.0 to make money. This should not be the case, 0.0 should not be unprofitable or certainly not less profitable than empire - please do not counter about pvp risks etc.. as we all accept those risks and costs but that is not what we are talking about.

The simple point is that 0.0 life is less profitable than LVL4 missions when in reality it should at very least be equal to or greater than.

Allot of this boils down to lazy development work, I remember 2-3 years ago when the concept of touching the POS code was a nightmare to CCP, you said it wouldn't happen and were admit that it was a monumental challenge. This is the very same situation we see at the moment regarding making true sec values dynamic, belt numbers, the npc spawn density/value within and astroid types/density, all dynamic. This is something CCP needs to tackle head on, the proposed system we have in front of us now is the most indirect method possible of actually fixing the economic inadequacies of 0.0 and it is frankly very lazy way.

I personally have never run a wormhole, never run an anomaly and I know for a fact I am not the only person, there is a large player base that is just not interested in it - we rather fight NPC's in belts in a far more straight forward fashion. So please, get off your collective behindes and rethink the implementation of dominion and actually addressing the economic issues and more importantly the short comings of the code base.


I scrolled up and down like 3 times to make sure we didn't get lotka'ed to ****.

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:21:00 - [1703]
 

Originally by: Bobby Atlas
Edited by: Bobby Atlas on 08/11/2009 05:22:58
Originally by: Pointfive
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.




haha oh god even bobby atlas is using a goon catchphrase at this point, what has the world come to.


Jack Gates
Gallente
GoonWaffe
SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:33:00 - [1704]
 

Originally by: Brennah
Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Originally by: Salsbury
Y'know, I have to admit that watching all this smack-talk about CCP from the people who don't like the changes is pretty funny. Epic pwnage by CCP! Very Happy

It seems to me that the whole intent of CCP was to stir things up, reduce unused system sprawl, and make alliances really consider whether a system will be profitable to keep around. In this regard, I think they've already succeeded admirably.

In the 100+ posts I've read on this thread, one striking deficiency that I've noticed is the lack of almost any mention of cooperation, banding together, and INCREASING alliance inter-operation. This is, in fact, core to the design of what CCP is trying to accomplish. Getting more people out to 0.0, building new relationships between corps, encouraging renting out of sub-systems in alliance space, etc.

I've seen lots of people saying "small alliances won't be able to survive!" Well, start banding together with other smaller alliances, and become larger.

I've seen LOTS AND LOTS of funny PvP'ers whining that they simply won't be able to shoot enough stuff to pay the bills, while at the same time saying "mining is a **** profession" and the like. Well, it's time for you to learn how to cooperate with other players. You need to start getting some mining & industry going in your systems, to leverage those belts, rather than simply ignoring them, or ratting, then flying away. (You might even want to train some new skills, so you can produce some wealth in ways other than simply shooting stuff. You might be surprised.)

If it helps you to reframe the idea of cooperation, think of it as different strategic wings of a fleet. You've got some who are doing PvE ratting, protecting those who are helping to harvest those rocks and provide you with resources to build with/sell. You need to balance your skills & strengths to achieve the larger objective. One person can't do it all. That's the whole point of having fleets, corps, and alliances.

Think bigger than what you can do alone. Think about what you can accomplish together.




excellent clarity of vision I must say!

It is true and something we said from outset that unbalanced alliances who are 95% PvP/Fleet and 5% industry will be most affected by this as we are reducing their dependency on passive point sources and introducing greater active resource density to allow for passive income to take over.

The alliances who will benefit most are those who have or aim to have balanced compositions of people with different playstyles or even act as enforcers or protectors of the space with multiple rental agreements if they wish and we will add tools as we call the treaty system to help facilitate that.



Basically what I'm taking away from the fact that you're trolling your customers is that you as a company are emotionally/egotistically invested in these changes and are hellbent on making them happen despite 40+ pages of people telling you why this is horrible. You should probably ask Sony how well this worked for SWG and NGE. Since you are so determined to force this down our throats I suggest two new names for this expansion

Eve Online: NGE
Eve Online: Exodus II


Originally by: Mrs Trzzbk
Originally by: Treji
If Goonies are whining, new expansion must be good Very Happy

Or are they a little miffed due to new changes hampering their system of play?


All of you idiots saying "lol look at the goonies and cva whine" realize we're both in really good shape for this patch, right? We just think it's objectively crap.


this needed to be said again

Clansworth
Good Rock Materials
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:34:00 - [1705]
 

Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Originally by: Salsbury
Y'know, I have to admit that watching all this smack-talk about CCP from the people who don't like the changes is pretty funny. Epic pwnage by CCP! Very Happy

It seems to me that the whole intent of CCP was to stir things up, reduce unused system sprawl, and make alliances really consider whether a system will be profitable to keep around. In this regard, I think they've already succeeded admirably.

In the 100+ posts I've read on this thread, one striking deficiency that I've noticed is the lack of almost any mention of cooperation, banding together, and INCREASING alliance inter-operation. This is, in fact, core to the design of what CCP is trying to accomplish. Getting more people out to 0.0, building new relationships between corps, encouraging renting out of sub-systems in alliance space, etc.

I've seen lots of people saying "small alliances won't be able to survive!" Well, start banding together with other smaller alliances, and become larger.

I've seen LOTS AND LOTS of funny PvP'ers whining that they simply won't be able to shoot enough stuff to pay the bills, while at the same time saying "mining is a **** profession" and the like. Well, it's time for you to learn how to cooperate with other players. You need to start getting some mining & industry going in your systems, to leverage those belts, rather than simply ignoring them, or ratting, then flying away. (You might even want to train some new skills, so you can produce some wealth in ways other than simply shooting stuff. You might be surprised.)

If it helps you to reframe the idea of cooperation, think of it as different strategic wings of a fleet. You've got some who are doing PvE ratting, protecting those who are helping to harvest those rocks and provide you with resources to build with/sell. You need to balance your skills & strengths to achieve the larger objective. One person can't do it all. That's the whole point of having fleets, corps, and alliances.

Think bigger than what you can do alone. Think about what you can accomplish together.




excellent clarity of vision I must say!

It is true and something we said from outset that unbalanced alliances who are 95% PvP/Fleet and 5% industry will be most affected by this as we are reducing their dependency on passive point sources and introducing greater active resource density to allow for passive income to take over.

The alliances who will benefit most are those who have or aim to have balanced compositions of people with different playstyles or even act as enforcers or protectors of the space with multiple rental agreements if they wish and we will add tools as we call the treaty system to help facilitate that.



As a long-time miner, who has spent plenty of time in/out of alliances, I can definitely attest to the LACK of desire for most alliances to 'support' a carebear unit. What I am seeing here is that it will instead be a much more mutual arrangement, where the shooters will co-depend on the carebears in a much more significant way. This, combined with the anti-sprawl effects this will have make it a win in my book.

I do think the taxation issue needs to be addressed. Perhaps not so much as a tax on more activities, but instead perhaps some sort of 'free-form' billing could be implemented. Have the ability to set up recurring bills to/from parties. This would ease the 'renting of space' arrangement, by removing the tedious billing aspect. This certainly seems the natural progression of the auto-pay features being added to the wallet.

Johnster
Caldari
Resurrection
Gentlemen's Club
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:35:00 - [1706]
 

Edited by: Johnster on 08/11/2009 06:38:07
Originally by: Pointfive
Honestly i was hoping to see upgrades more along these lines. i always though of 0.0 as being like the wild west. Where you venture out to dangerous lands to get shot at, control some territory make money, and occasionaly find gold.

Concord Bounty Hunter Angent Relay - Allows LP gain for killing pirates in nullsec, create a pvp geared concord lp store

Bounty increase - High activity in your system has driven away all but the most dangerous pirates. 15% bonus to pirate bounty per level

Respawn Speed - High activity in this region has increased pirate activity in the system. 10% bonus to pirate respawn speed per level.

Pirate hideout Locator - Each level increases the chance of locating rare hidden pirate hideout anomalies. These danger pirates do not drop faction items but have significantly increased bounty.

Ship quality increase - Having Faced larger ships constantly, pirates begin to only appear in more difficult ships. Each level reduces the chance of a non battleship spawn by 20%


oh and

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


This is what we all expected really... The bounty hunter bonus should be anyone neut/hostile to owning alliance though, not based on their sec status, and possibly also give bounties to encourage players to defend against raiders in their home systems.

Maybe also add another bonus that gives an *extra* percentage bonus of all bounties to alliance wallet (not taking from what the player normally would receive at all).

/signed

Korodan
GoonWaffe
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:37:00 - [1707]
 

Originally by: Johnster
Originally by: Pointfive
Honestly i was hoping to see upgrades more along these lines. i always though of 0.0 as being like the wild west. Where you venture out to dangerous lands to get shot at, control some territory make money, and occasionaly find gold.

Concord Bounty Hunter Angent Relay - Allows LP gain for killing pirates in nullsec, create a pvp geared concord lp store

Bounty increase - High activity in your system has driven away all but the most dangerous pirates. 15% bonus to pirate bounty per level

Respawn Speed - High activity in this region has increased pirate activity in the system. 10% bonus to pirate respawn speed per level.

Pirate hideout Locator - Each level increases the chance of locating rare hidden pirate hideout anomalies. These danger pirates do not drop faction items but have significantly increased bounty.

Ship quality increase - Having Faced larger ships constantly, pirates begin to only appear in more difficult ships. Each level reduces the chance of a non battleship spawn by 20%


oh and

YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


This is what we all expected really... The bounty hunter bonus should be anyone neut/hostile to owning alliance though, not based on their sec status, and possibly also give bounties to encourage players to defend against raiders in their home systems.

/signed



Yes, this would be the **** if you'd let us collect bounties by just blowing up ships. Killing pods in 0.0 is still pretty damn hard if you don't have a bubble.

Kraken Kill
Menace ll Society
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:38:00 - [1708]
 

What is the incentive for a 0.0 alliance with space to attack another 0.0 alliance with space?

A smaller 0.0 alliance, 500 people maybe holding a constellation with 3 stations in, 8billion a month paid out. Thats without any Bridges to empire, so if they try to take some space thats fairly deep in 0.0 its even worse.
8billion for a 500man alliance with little to no moongood to hold a constellation.

rly?


Originally by: Bobby Atlas
Edited by: Bobby Atlas on 08/11/2009 05:22:58
Originally by: Pointfive
YES OR NO: Due to the increased risk and logistics effort required, 0.0 should be more - not as - profitable (in raw isk/h) than highsec L4 mission running.


As CCP Chronitus pointed out, the amount of reward to offset a small amount of risk is allot but I also think that is a matter of perception, in either case it is not in of itself the argument being made. The actual argument being made by allot of people is the fact that 0.0 is less profitable than running LVL4 missions in empire and these upgrades in dominion do little if anything to change that situation.

I personally have been playing eve for some 6 years now and I remember when I first came to 0.0 it was a niche idea that you came out here to make money, however that is something that quickly evaporated and has been the consensus for a long time that you do not come out to 0.0 to make money. This should not be the case, 0.0 should not be unprofitable or certainly not less profitable than empire - please do not counter about pvp risks etc.. as we all accept those risks and costs but that is not what we are talking about.

The simple point is that 0.0 life is less profitable than LVL4 missions when in reality it should at very least be equal to or greater than.

Allot of this boils down to lazy development work, I remember 2-3 years ago when the concept of touching the POS code was a nightmare to CCP, you said it wouldn't happen and were admit that it was a monumental challenge. This is the very same situation we see at the moment regarding making true sec values dynamic, belt numbers, the npc spawn density/value within and astroid types/density, all dynamic. This is something CCP needs to tackle head on, the proposed system we have in front of us now is the most indirect method possible of actually fixing the economic inadequacies of 0.0 and it is frankly very lazy way.

I personally have never run a wormhole, never run an anomaly and I know for a fact I am not the only person, there is a large player base that is just not interested in it - we rather fight NPC's in belts in a far more straight forward fashion. So please, get off your collective behindes and rethink the implementation of dominion and actually addressing the economic issues and more importantly the short comings of the code base.

Jack Gates
Gallente
GoonWaffe
SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:39:00 - [1709]
 

Originally by: Lockefox
Late to the thread as usual, but going to throw my two isk into the pile.

Though the system looks very good (and a welcome change to the way things are) looking at it from my alliance's perspective, the cost of entry is much higher than I expected. We were anticipating a significant forward investment, but this seems a little absurd.

30-50m (basically) per system? On top of the other costs already associated with the move (base towers, defenses, etc) to then slap on another "5 towers of fuel" cost seems a little high.

If it were my call, I'd make the system 10% or 20% of the originally stated costs (maybe boost upgrade costs) and instead make holding more systems multiply that cost (similar to war mechanics). Or some sort of exponential curve along those lines.

In sum, please don't lock us smaller guys out of 0.0. We want to rat and pvp and get blown up as much as anyone else!
~Locke


thanks for keeping the fresh blood out of 0.0 because you can't figure out how your own game works, ccp.

Comunique
Initiative Mercenaries
Posted - 2009.11.08 06:40:00 - [1710]
 

Originally by: Bobby Atlas

A lot of this boils down to lazy development work, I remember 2-3 years ago when the concept of touching the POS code was a nightmare to CCP, you said it wouldn't happen and were admit that it was a monumental challenge. This is the very same situation we see at the moment regarding making true sec values dynamic, belt numbers, the npc spawn density/value within and astroid types/density, all dynamic. This is something CCP needs to tackle head on, the proposed system we have in front of us now is the most indirect method possible of actually fixing the economic inadequacies of 0.0 and it is frankly very lazy way.



Just going to leave this here...


Pages: first : previous : ... 53 54 55 56 [57] 58 59 60 61 ... : last (119)

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only