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Pharaoh XXIII
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2009.10.28 19:27:00 - [1]
 

What are the proper tactics when engaging a target solo? I realize the idea is to stay out of scram/web range but how do i do this? Do I run the MWD the whole time or do I just keep a close watch on range and cycle it on and off? If the latter is the case couldnt a clever pilot simply do some fancy flying to close the distance and get me scrammed as I'm fighting only 1 or 2km outside overloaded web range and the margin for error is so small? Below is my fit...

[Crusader, New Setup 1]
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Overdrive Injector System II
Overdrive Injector System II

Coreli C-Type 1MN MicroWarpdrive
Fleeting Warp Disruptor I

Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Scorch S
Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Scorch S

Small Energy Locus Coordinator I
Small Energy Collision Accelerator I


Suas
Perkone
Posted - 2009.10.28 19:46:00 - [2]
 

You're going to die to anyone competent with a fit like that. Range-saders are a thing of the past, fly a Slicer post-Dominion if you want to fill that role efficiently.

Go for a DCU / HS etc. kinda fit.

Grut
The Protei
Posted - 2009.10.28 20:23:00 - [3]
 

An absaders a better fit solo.

If you really want to go ranged I'd use a beamsader. V poor damage but you get a nice range buffer to plink stuff to death.

The trick is watching your targets speed like a hawk to trigger your mwd to overload at the same time. With the 2km buffer on a pulsesader your never going to react in time to beat an overload.

Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2009.10.28 20:47:00 - [4]
 

Nowadays multiple Sader fits are effective.

You can try your pure MWD speed/range Sader
You can try an AB Sader with tank
Or you can try an hybrid of the two

I prefer the AB one since it gives me the largest range of possible solo targets. It is inferior as a fleet tackler though, but I have Maleds for that role anyway.

Proxyyyy
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2009.10.28 20:54:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Proxyyyy on 28/10/2009 20:56:09
Originally by: Merdaneth
Nowadays multiple Sader fits are effective.

You can try your pure MWD speed/range Sader
You can try an AB Sader with tank
Or you can try an hybrid of the two

I prefer the AB one since it gives me the largest range of possible solo targets. It is inferior as a fleet tackler though, but I have Maleds for that role anyway.



Pretty much this ^
AB sader is your best bet tbh. If your not tanking your interceptors now adays then you will fail. But i have killed an ab sader in a merlin/rifter even with its tank. The scram changes have realy nerfed interceptors.

Pharaoh XXIII
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2009.10.28 21:19:00 - [6]
 

Hmm ok, whats a basic AB Sader fit then?

Grut
The Protei
Posted - 2009.10.28 22:30:00 - [7]
 

4xdlp
ab2
named scram

hs2
dcu2
2xanp2

2x damage rigs

^^ thats a basic one. You use gattlings and plate/rep it depending on your preference.

el Sabor
Posted - 2009.10.28 23:03:00 - [8]
 

In my opinion if you're AB fitting an interceptor you might as well be in an assault frigate...


Draeca
Tharri and Co.
Posted - 2009.10.29 05:55:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: el Sabor
In my opinion if you're AB fitting an interceptor you might as well be in an assault frigate...

Kind of true, but no one wants to engage assault frigs Sad

Vixisti
The Scope
Posted - 2009.10.29 09:06:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Vixisti on 29/10/2009 12:07:25
A Crusader with tracking enhancers and Locus rigs can lay down a lot of dps at range before a ranis pilot can catch it and at that point it's probably too late for the ranis. Of course intie combat can take place in the blink of an eye and one false move can prove fatal.

Also it's increasingly likely you will see an AB, plated or otherwise tanked ceptor for that 1 v 1 surprise factor. How can we forget the 400mm plate claw with a neut.

I know a few pilots who have racked up a massive ammount of kills using the fit similar to the OP. It's not wrong just very tricky to fly correctly.

Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.10.29 09:36:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: Raimo on 29/10/2009 09:37:14
Originally by: Vixisti
A Crusader with tracking enhancers and ambit rigs can lay down a lot of dps at range before a ranis pilot can catch it and at that point it's probably too late for the ranis. Of course intie combat can take place in the blink of an eye and one false move can prove fatal.

Also it's increasingly likely you will see an AB, plated or otherwise tanked ceptor for that 1 v 1 surprise factor. How can we forget the 400mm plate claw with a neut.

I know a few pilots who have racked up a massive ammount of kills using the fit similar to the OP. It's not wrong just very tricky to fly correctly.


-> One of those pilots he's talking about. I do lose a ton of them as well, mostly when I suicide into a blob of scramblers but also when I meet a "competent" pilot (but it involves luck, I've killed many "competent" ranises and tanked saders in the nano/ range fit as well if they don't manage to get a scramble in time.) Speed implants help, also geting more range than the OP's fit helps. All in all it's probably the hardest piloting I know of and that's exactly why I like it despite the high change of a crash and burn :P (It's also the best combination of gang tackler and competent dogfighter I know of, not optimal as a pure tackler and debatable as a dogfighter but a great combination nevertheless)

Also, Vixi meant Locus rigs I'm sure...

Oh and yes suas is right, the postpatch Slicer will most certainly obsolete my current "obsolete" nano/ locus Sader. :)

Suas
Perkone
Posted - 2009.10.29 09:39:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Raimo
Oh and yes suas is right, the postpatch Slicer will most certainly obsolete my current "obsolete" nano/ locus Sader. :)


I only say that because no one can do it except you! <3

Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.10.29 09:46:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Suas
Originally by: Raimo
Oh and yes suas is right, the postpatch Slicer will most certainly obsolete my current "obsolete" nano/ locus Sader. :)


I only say that because no one can do it except you! <3


lol :P

To be fair I can name 3-4 other people right away who have been quite succesful with nano/ range post QR, but I agree that the tank/ gank fits are surely easier to get into as far as manual piloting goes.

Vixisti
The Scope
Posted - 2009.10.29 12:12:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: Vixisti on 29/10/2009 12:13:34
Originally by: Raimo


-> One of those pilots he's talking about.


Actually I was thinking of Ark and Val Twisted Evil Ok I may have thought of you briefly as well but you lost too many 'pre small' T2 rigs hehe.


Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.10.29 17:22:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: Raimo on 29/10/2009 18:23:34
Originally by: Vixisti

Actually I was thinking of Ark and Val Twisted Evil Ok I may have thought of you briefly as well but you lost too many 'pre small' T2 rigs hehe.




lol

I'd add Doktor Soet and Vanden to the list as well, I've seen great nanosader piloting from them.

- Hehe I had to check kb stats actually, Val has an impressive amount of kills in a Sader! But I have more than Ark ;) (He always changes his ships tho, and both of those guys are rather amazing whatever they are flying anyway)

Suas
Perkone
Posted - 2009.10.29 18:36:00 - [16]
 

Posting to say I'm ranked higher on Battleclinic.

That's all.

Doktor Soet
Wrath of Fenris
Posted - 2009.10.30 10:16:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Raimo

I'd add Doktor Soet and Vanden to the list as well, I've seen great nanosader piloting from them.



oh thx for the flowers mate ;)

i love flying the sader when i know theres a gang/blob out and i try to play a little with them solo. so against a blob the range+speed is the most important thing. add some of the rly cheap imps to the range setup (not useing them currently) and its perfect for what i use the sader. sidenote: i r a bit depressed that no wt tacklers try to kill me off the gate anymore, even when theres 2 or more.

the ab fit, "tanked" or not and such things ... funny thing is that i never died to one of those ever (at least not in a 1 vs 1 situation). a bydi pilot in an ab fit died to my setup even when i bumped of the gate and was in his scram range.

oh and if u ever have the joy to see raimo piloting and engaging multiple targets in his sader, relax and enjoy the show. its worth it ;)

Suas
Perkone
Posted - 2009.10.30 10:34:00 - [18]
 

The reason you never died to a tanked Crusader is because you've never fought anyone competent flying one.

Doktor Soet
Wrath of Fenris
Posted - 2009.10.30 10:42:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Suas
The reason you never died to a tanked Crusader is because you've never fought anyone competent flying one.


might be true or not. but would be fun to meet one that shows me how its rly done. i love surprises ... until that day i`ll stick to the range setup ugh

Suas
Perkone
Posted - 2009.10.30 10:51:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Suas on 30/10/2009 10:51:12
Originally by: Doktor Soet
Originally by: Suas
The reason you never died to a tanked Crusader is because you've never fought anyone competent flying one.


might be true or not. but would be fun to meet one that shows me how its rly done. i love surprises ... until that day i`ll stick to the range setup ugh


Bring it to GE-8, I think I have a Crusader set up ;)

Doktor Soet
Wrath of Fenris
Posted - 2009.10.30 10:55:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Suas

Bring it to GE-8, I think I have a Crusader set up ;)


dude now its getting boring. i have fun where i am so why should i? just for some epeen thing? nope.

Echo Degnar
Posted - 2009.10.30 16:45:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Doktor Soet
dude now its getting boring. i have fun where i am so why should i? just for some epeen thing? nope.


But Saus is ranked higher on BattleClinic! That's like the... the eyes of god! Nothing counts unless it's on BattleClinic, and you do want the biggest, hugest, most veiny e-peen, don't you?

...I bet you're asking yourself what this has to do with the OP. Well, I'll tell you. This is a forum, and everything on a forum is all about e-peen. So the OP doesn't actually matter. Holy ****.

Doktor Soet
Wrath of Fenris
Posted - 2009.10.30 17:54:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Echo Degnar

But Saus is ranked higher on BattleClinic!


then pls forgive me. my fault then. i`m wrong, i`m nothing, i`m not worthy...

Trellish
Blackwater USA Inc.
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2009.10.30 19:12:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Draeca
Originally by: el Sabor
In my opinion if you're AB fitting an interceptor you might as well be in an assault frigate...

Kind of true, but no one wants to engage assault frigs Sad


plus, if you want to be firing lasers and flying solo, CCP has decided that your out of luck in the AF department, by screwing amarr's mid slot layout on the retribution. Crusader is sorta your only option unless you faction it up.

Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2009.10.30 19:24:00 - [25]
 

AB tanked Crusaders can easily die to MWD ranged Crusaders and the reverse as well.

When both are properly flown however, neither will be able to kill the other. When I meet hostiles in an MWD Crusader that know I'm flying AB, they know to stay at least 14km away from me and keep their speed going. Of course, at those and ranges most of their shots will miss, allowing them to be tanked indefinetely with my repairer if I so choose. Additionally, I never fire my guns until I got an MWD Sader in scram, meaning 'no catch = no agression', so I can always move back to gate or station and get out if I so chose.

What a tanked AB Crusader can do to aMWD Crusaders is clear in this fight.

However, I'm actually kinda sad the AB Sader has become so popular, it was my first choice of ship since 16 months, but the surprise effect has sort of worn off with lots of people flying them now.

Vincent Gaines
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2009.10.30 19:52:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Merdaneth
AB tanked Crusaders can easily die to MWD ranged Crusaders and the reverse as well.

When both are properly flown however, neither will be able to kill the other. When I meet hostiles in an MWD Crusader that know I'm flying AB, they know to stay at least 14km away from me and keep their speed going. Of course, at those and ranges most of their shots will miss, allowing them to be tanked indefinetely with my repairer if I so choose. Additionally, I never fire my guns until I got an MWD Sader in scram, meaning 'no catch = no agression', so I can always move back to gate or station and get out if I so chose.

What a tanked AB Crusader can do to aMWD Crusaders is clear in this fight.

However, I'm actually kinda sad the AB Sader has become so popular, it was my first choice of ship since 16 months, but the surprise effect has sort of worn off with lots of people flying them now.


when I clicked on this link I just scrolled looking for this man's reply.

take his advice above all others.

Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.10.30 21:47:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Raimo on 30/10/2009 22:09:45

Originally by: Vincent Gaines


when I clicked on this link I just scrolled looking for this man's reply.

take his advice above all others.


But I am ranked higher on BC than he is! YARRRR!! Razz

oh and Cool


Doktor Soet
Wrath of Fenris
Posted - 2009.10.31 01:57:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Raimo

oh and Cool




see thats why i said just enjoy the show when u see raimo in action :D

Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2009.10.31 05:37:00 - [29]
 

Edited by: Raimo on 31/10/2009 05:40:22

Originally by: Doktor Soet
Originally by: Raimo

oh and Cool




see thats why i said just enjoy the show when u see raimo in action :D


To be fair it's mostly just a series of 1v1's... Granted in some of them I was dodging a gang of 5+ at the same time as well IIRC. Wink

Beltantis Torrence
Wolfsbrigade
ShadowWolves.net
Posted - 2009.11.02 10:53:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Beltantis Torrence on 02/11/2009 10:54:18
Originally by: Raimo
Edited by: Raimo on 31/10/2009 05:40:22

Originally by: Doktor Soet
Originally by: Raimo

oh and Cool




see thats why i said just enjoy the show when u see raimo in action :D


To be fair it's mostly just a series of 1v1's... Granted in some of them I was dodging a gang of 5+ at the same time as well IIRC. Wink


Yeah, that's a fantastic sader fit, if its the same as the last loss mail you have has. 4700m/s, 15km optimal with scorch, faster than a blaster ranis and hits far enough to hit a rail ranis and obviously outclasses a claw and a crow. Only thing I could see taking it is fits that are stupid for general purpose fighting (like a blaster ranis with two nanos and no mag stabs, etc). Well, that or people with faction webs and possibly a sentinel flown extremely well. Edited to add : Then again you're using a t2 rig to get that range, so maybe to be fair I'd have to put it against a ship with a similar isk investment - ie a rail ranis with a faction web or something.


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